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Clix Pix

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The BCN Awards are released annually, and one important thing to note is that they are based on sales in Japan only, so may not be as accurate when it comes to worldwide sales for any camera manufacturer. Nonetheless it's interesting to see how this year's awards have played out:


In a nutshell:

Compacts: #1 Canon, #2 Sony, #3 Fujifilm
DSLR: #1 Canon, #2 Nikon, #3 Pentax
Mirrorless: #1 Sony, #2 Canon, #3 OM Digital Solutions [Olympus]
Action: #1 GoPro, #2 Sony, #3 DJI
Lenses: #1 Canon, #2 Sony, #3 Sigma


There are several articles online about this, I just happened to go with the Petapixel one. Nikon fans may want to check out what Thom Hogan has to say about this, which may reassure them that the overall picture is not as grim as it seems at first glance on here.
 
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kenoh

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It is great to see Olympus there. There was concern about them when they were sold off.

I was surprised to see Pentax but it makes sense in the DSLR market.

No concern over Nikon here, They wont be going anywhere soon and if they did get into real difficulties, they will be bought by someone as a minimum for their industrial optics business. We aren’t really concerned about Panasonic yet they are absent from the lists here too.

What is interesting is that people feared for Canon’s future yet we see them in all categories here except action cameras.

Also, Fuji is interesting, I would have thought the XT line would be bringing them to the podium too in more categories. I think they are playing a master stroke right now in bringing Medium Format to the masses. Full Frame is a viper pit and very hard to differentiate. By bringing MF into the reach of prosumers and the way they are loaning out GF systems to those we love to watch on YouTube, they are getting that message out there quite well.

Also playing the adapter game - adapting lenses to the GF from full frame is good too because we now have a slew of reports from people saying the image circle on the FF lenses is big enough to cover a lot of the MF sensor. So again MF isnt as big an investment to enter into.

Interesting times.
 
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r.harris1

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Thom’s article is great at keeping the BCN numbers in perspective relative to the petapixels of the world. Japan is a very unique market, of course. BCN is representative of volume sales of mostly lower cost, lower margin products. In Japan. In big box stores. Nikon fans aren’t worried :cool:.
 
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mollyc

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I honestly don't even understand why this is a yearly report. Less than half of sales from one country isn't particularly indicative of anything, in my opinion.
 

Darmok N Jalad

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Seems like a strange set of conditions for data. It’s top sales in one country, but based only on what is reported by participating retailers. Raw data is paywalled, so beyond that, it’s hard to know what you’ve got. I’ve done benchmark surveys for my work, and they always seem kinda dodgy to me. When we get the results, it becomes apparent that every company seems to report their numbers somewhat differently. For example, for mirrorless, Panasonic falls off after 2013, Nikon and Fuji aren’t even on there, and the data only adds up to about 75% each year.
 

Clix Pix

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Original poster
The impression I've gotten after reading a couple of articles, including Thom's, is that the Japanese market is also a little different than other markets and that smaller, lightweight cameras are popular there -- which is going to skew the numbers if more consumers in that country are buying compact and lighter-weight cameras as opposed to DSLRs and ILC with larger, heavier bodies and lenses.

I suppose since most of the top manufacturers are based in Japan that this may be one reason the BCN focuses strictly on Japan for its statistics and reports, but I agree that it is not truly reflective of worldwide sales or even comparisons of sales between say, a country in Europe and a country in North America. Also, as noted, not all of the manufacturers are represented in each category. I don't think Canon makes "action" gear, Sony no longer does DSLRs.

Yep, statistics can be slanted to be interpreted in many ways, and definitely these need to be taken with a few good-sized grains of salt....
 

r.harris1

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It is great to see Olympus there. There was concern about them when they were sold off.

I was surprised to see Pentax but it makes sense in the DSLR market.

No concern over Nikon here, They wont be going anywhere soon and if they did get into real difficulties, they will be bought by someone as a minimum for their industrial optics business. We aren’t really concerned about Panasonic yet they are absent from the lists here too.

What is interesting is that people feared for Canon’s future yet we see them in all categories here except action cameras.

Also, Fuji is interesting, I would have thought the XT line would be bringing them to the podium too in more categories. I think they are playing a master stroke right now in bringing Medium Format to the masses. Full Frame is a viper pit and very hard to differentiate. By bringing MF into the reach of prosumers and the way they are loaning out GF systems to those we love to watch on YouTube, they are getting that message out there quite well.

Also playing the adapter game - adapting lenses to the GF from full frame is good too because we now have a slew of reports from people saying the image circle on the FF lenses is big enough to cover a lot of the MF sensor. So again MF isnt as big an investment to enter into.

Interesting times.
I agree, interesting times. And Fuji are really an interesting player - APS-C and Medium Format. It would be interesting to see more information about the global market and how they do, rather than the big-box-store Japanese market. The work they've done to bring IBIS to 44x33 MF plus the amazing work they do with color science (Woof!) is fantastic. They are great at optical science and their lenses are superb. I love that Cambo has spent some love/time on being able to add them to their Actus view camera line. Love can be described as "attention to".
 
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r.harris1

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The impression I've gotten after reading a couple of articles, including Thom's, is that the Japanese market is also a little different than other markets and that smaller, lightweight cameras are popular there -- which is going to skew the numbers if more consumers in that country are buying compact and lighter-weight cameras as opposed to DSLRs and ILC with larger, heavier bodies and lenses.

I suppose since most of the top manufacturers are based in Japan that this may be one reason the BCN focuses strictly on Japan for its statistics and reports, but I agree that it is not truly reflective of worldwide sales or even comparisons of sales between say, a country in Europe and a country in North America. Also, as noted, not all of the manufacturers are represented in each category. I don't think Canon makes "action" gear, Sony no longer does DSLRs.

Yep, statistics can be slanted to be interpreted in many ways, and definitely these need to be taken with a few good-sized grains of salt....
I agree, statistics can be interpreted in interesting ways. I don't mean to imply that petapixel are just shills - they have some interesting writers, it's just how they write their headlines. They make their money from "clicks" (not Clix :)) so they do their thing with hyperbole. What I hope from most of us - and I think this is the case - is that we are all educated enough to separate the hyperbole out from reality. Each camera company is an interesting state, for sure. Nikon make a lot of money from a diverse set of circumstances (including setting up fab equipment for Sony Semiconductor, for example), so just keeping that balanced view of the world is important, especially right now.
 
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Clix Pix

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That is exactly why it is important to read more than one article from any source because then things may become clearer as the overall picture is presented from different viewpoints. Everyone writing articles on this has their own particular vantage point and "angle" from which to present it. The reader needs to be able to sort through all of it by reading more than one article and figure things out in a way which is meaningful for him or her.
 
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mollyc

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also probably important not to use petapixel as a primary source. or even, as in this case, a secondary source.
 
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Darmok N Jalad

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I agree, interesting times. And Fuji are really an interesting player - APS-C and Medium Format. It would be interesting to see more information about the global market and how they do, rather than the big-box-store Japanese market. The work they've done to bring IBIS to 44x33 MF plus the amazing work they do with color science (Woof!) is fantastic. They are great at optical science and their lenses are superb. I love that Cambo has spent some love/time on being able to add them to their Actus view camera line. Love can be described as "attention to".
If I ever moved away from M43, it would be to Fuji X. I like a lot of what they are doing there. I might even get a used X-T-something and a lens to scratch the itch.
 
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Clix Pix

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also probably important not to use petapixel as a primary source. or even, as in this case, a secondary source.
Agreed! Due to my professional training and general inclinations anyway, I don't use any one source as a primary source; I read something in one place which catches my interest, and then look around to see what other sources have to say about the same situation. It really does pay off in the long run.
 
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Clix Pix

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If I ever moved away from M43, it would be to Fuji X. I like a lot of what they are doing there. I might even get a used X-T-something and a lens to scratch the itch.

A few years ago a friend made the switch from Nikon to Fuji, and she has been more than happy with her choice ever since. At the time, though, Fuji wasn't as well known or their reputation with regard to the digital realm as well established so that some of us wondered why she had gone in that direction. It worked out very well for her and in the end that's what really counts, eh?
 
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Darmok N Jalad

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Fuji was always a curiosity, but they didn’t have a reasonably-light long lens…until they came out with the 70-300. Only problem is availability. Seems like you can’t find it anywhere, and it’s a long wait to order one. I’d like to see more hands-on reviews from everyday folks before going I would want to go all-in.
 

Clix Pix

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That is a wise decision, to want to read more hands-on comments from actual users as opposed to professional reviewers or gawd forbid, those so-called "Influencers." I spent well over a year in doing research and eventually making my decision about the switch from Nikon to Sony, and only after I was really, really sure that this is what I wanted to do did I take the final steps. Since I don't bother with YT "reviews" or "influencers" -- never have wasted time on that dreck! -- they had nothing to do with my decision, I was going on what I considered to be far more reputable sources plus my own experiences to date and my own gut-level feelings.

Reading comments from actual users on various websites, reading reviews from trusted reviewers is the way to go and in most cases there is not a rush to hurry into a decision, either. Any sort of system switch like this is something which deserves some time spent on analysis and decision-making.
 

Darmok N Jalad

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What can be really bad with the professional sites is that they often get pre-production models to review, or hand-picked samples. Sometimes the final product is even manufactured in a different country. You get no idea of sample variation until people start buying them up. I’ve read more than once where someone had to exchange/rebuy a lens to get better results. I’m not super-picky, but I also don’t want a lemon!
 

Clix Pix

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Yes! I've noticed that, too, that reviewers get pre-production models or "perfect" hand-picked samples, and make their recommendations based on those and then there may be changes when the actual final models are rolled out on the production lines..... NOT cool!
 

AlaskaMoose

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In reality the global market share is what is most important to any camera manufacturer. Sony has done quite well in recent years, and while Nikon lags behind it continues being a market player. In my view Nikon will continue doing well at what it does, even if taken over by another company. Then the other camera manufacturers can still survive just the same by producing good quality cameras and lenses that are reasonably priced. All they do is to target the range of consumers that exist between the major players.
 
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kenoh

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If I ever moved away from M43, it would be to Fuji X. I like a lot of what they are doing there. I might even get a used X-T-something and a lens to scratch the itch.

Be careful. That’s how they got me. I found an X-Pro2 used I wanted to find out what the fuss was about…. Aesthetically they nail it in their X series cameras. As we know friends amongst us like @Mark0 make amazing images with them and their lenses are fantastic. I was taking a wander through my past images yesterday and was blown away again by the 56mm f1.2 - a stunning lens. I am not aware of them having made a rubbish lens in a while.
 

kenoh

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Yes! I've noticed that, too, that reviewers get pre-production models or "perfect" hand-picked samples, and make their recommendations based on those and then there may be changes when the actual final models are rolled out on the production lines..... NOT cool!

Ah but that door swings both ways. They also get buggy software versions and are tied into NDAs to tell the manufacturer of anything they find. As the software people on here know, they pre-production version is typically flaky and needs a last round of polishing before release.

In the case of the pre-production models, they need to so that on release day, they have a slew of people ready to do their advertising for them because of the way we make purchasing decisions now. An advert on TV doesn’t influence us as much as our favourite YouTuber waxing lyrical about the latest shiny thing.

It is quite interesting the way we work now.
 

kenoh

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What can be really bad with the professional sites is that they often get pre-production models to review, or hand-picked samples. Sometimes the final product is even manufactured in a different country. You get no idea of sample variation until people start buying them up. I’ve read more than once where someone had to exchange/rebuy a lens to get better results. I’m not super-picky, but I also don’t want a lemon!

They only get one shot at first impression remember. Recall that first date with your other half, you made an effort to clean up as best you could…. Fast forward a few months and you had some manufacturing tolerance in that your weren’t as perfectly preened as you could be.

Mass production is a game of tolerances so you will always get a lemon coming through. The alternative is to get hand made optics as per you know who in Germany but then you have a hefty price tag on it to ensure the only lemon is in your tea in the bohemian hipster cafe you frequent. :)
 

r.harris1

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????? Are you trying to make a point here?
While I can't speak for Molly, last year at roughly this time we were talking about poor Nikon dying based on a click-bait titled and speculation-focused article from petapixel. This year, there still seems to be some of that talk from the very same website - not quite the death march from last year but it's still there. Nikon Imaging wasn't in danger of dying then and it's certainly not in danger of that happening now. BCN isn't really a bellwether of the global camera industry, at least anymore. Too, it's only a snapshot of the big-box camera sales in Japan, a notoriously unique market. It generally doesn't reflect medium to higher end equipment for example. Most of us aren't walking into BestBuy to pickup a Sony A1 or Nikon Z9 or a new 400mm lens.

Volume sales are only a piece of the puzzle. If you're selling a lot of low-end, low margin gear, it means less than selling higher-end, higher-profit gear. Nikon did a tremendous amount right in 2021, not least of which is producing what people are calling their best camera ever in the Z9, which is (I hear) selling really well. My local camera store says they've never seen this volume of sales on a flagship camera by any company ever - by a long way (apparently). There are anecdotes like that from around the US. They've delivered an innovative, professional camera that has desirable features that set them apart from competitors. They continue to put out superb optics. They're working more with third-party vendors such a Profoto and (apparently) with Tamron on options for their customers.

Nikon Imaging isn't about to die and they aren't currently in danger of doing so. Sony and Canon are doing great. Fuji is doing great in its market sector (APS-C and 44x33 MF), we'll see how the new incarnation of OM does. Panasonic seems to be holding its own. The biggest challenge right now facing all manufacturers is supply chain logistics to meet demand.
 

mollyc

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????? Are you trying to make a point here?

While I can't speak for Molly, last year at roughly this time we were talking about poor Nikon dying based on a click-bait titled and speculation-focused article from petapixel. This year, there still seems to be some of that talk from the very same website - not quite the death march from last year but it's still there. Nikon Imaging wasn't in danger of dying then and it's certainly not in danger of that happening now. BCN isn't really a bellwether of the global camera industry, at least anymore. Too, it's only a snapshot of the big-box camera sales in Japan, a notoriously unique market. It generally doesn't reflect medium to higher end equipment for example. Most of us aren't walking into BestBuy to pickup a Sony A1 or Nikon Z9 or a new 400mm lens.

Volume sales are only a piece of the puzzle. If you're selling a lot of low-end, low margin gear, it means less than selling higher-end, higher-profit gear. Nikon did a tremendous amount right in 2021, not least of which is producing what people are calling their best camera ever in the Z9, which is (I hear) selling really well. My local camera store says they've never seen this volume of sales on a flagship camera by any company ever - by a long way (apparently). There are anecdotes like that from around the US. They've delivered an innovative, professional camera that has desirable features that set them apart from competitors. They continue to put out superb optics. They're working more with third-party vendors such a Profoto and (apparently) with Tamron on options for their customers.

Nikon Imaging isn't about to die and they aren't currently in danger of doing so. Sony and Canon are doing great. Fuji is doing great in its market sector (APS-C and 44x33 MF), we'll see how the new incarnation of OM does. Panasonic seems to be holding its own. The biggest challenge right now facing all manufacturers is supply chain logistics to meet demand.


Yes, @r.harris1 has written a response so much more polite than I can, so I will just let his post speak for me.
 
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