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2024 Formula 1 Season thread
- Thread starter Apple fanboy
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No cars=no action, that is what Liberty want? At some point the bean counters are going to run out of beans, and then? Already we are seeing crappy cars running on razor thin budgets, and for what? Truly awful seasons, when the action is all in F2/F3...
I cannot see zero point to Sprints, the risk is stupid high, for the pathetic number of points, and there will be crashes, and costly crashes, what if Max is out for 10 races? Or a season? We have seen this before, 1 silly little accident, and well season over red rover...
2 weeks in a row, 1 team is paying mega for mistakes, could be Max or Checo in the hedge.. ok, when Max was out, and that bloke in a red car won, everyone was happy.. But then mr lost his appendix, comes back and is taught lessons.. It is a 2 level championship, Max in 1, and 19 drivers in the other.. Given double points, and $20m bonuses for 2 to 10th for Sprints, maybe, take points away from 1st place, that makes sense.. But Sprints as they are now, with the damage to the Williams, make that make sense.. The math is not mathing very well..
I cannot see zero point to Sprints, the risk is stupid high, for the pathetic number of points, and there will be crashes, and costly crashes, what if Max is out for 10 races? Or a season? We have seen this before, 1 silly little accident, and well season over red rover...
2 weeks in a row, 1 team is paying mega for mistakes, could be Max or Checo in the hedge.. ok, when Max was out, and that bloke in a red car won, everyone was happy.. But then mr lost his appendix, comes back and is taught lessons.. It is a 2 level championship, Max in 1, and 19 drivers in the other.. Given double points, and $20m bonuses for 2 to 10th for Sprints, maybe, take points away from 1st place, that makes sense.. But Sprints as they are now, with the damage to the Williams, make that make sense.. The math is not mathing very well..
2026 shaping up in typical fashion.
www.motorsport.com
F1’s 2026 active aero plan set for change after alarming simulator findings
Ooops, maybe a bit of radio silence would have been better on that one, but no, FAI is happy to have egg on it's face..Gee, did not see that coming... A long time ago, I read a wonderful way to describe F1, that is it is like the Concorde, the plane...
You see, in physics there is only 1 right answer, if you want the plane to travel at a certain speed, you need a certain wing design...
F1 is the same, because all the cars drive on the same track at the same time, the physics will work out to be the same, in other words, 10 teams will design the same car from an aero point, from a power point, every car will be the same design, and there will be no copying, each team coming to the same design independently.. This is the end result of design, if you want a certain answer, you will get to the same answer no matter the route taken...
So it is a pointless exercise design aero packages for cars, F1 will arrive at the same point at which F2/F3 is, every car on the grid exactly the same design as there can only 1 design that is perfect, it is fractions of fractions of a percent how close each team gets..
So just have 1 design, 1 company makes the chassis, one team brakes, 1 team aero, 1 team seats, 1 team the telemetery.. it is about the meat in the seat, and nothing to do with the geeks with the linux laptops..
You see, in physics there is only 1 right answer, if you want the plane to travel at a certain speed, you need a certain wing design...
F1 is the same, because all the cars drive on the same track at the same time, the physics will work out to be the same, in other words, 10 teams will design the same car from an aero point, from a power point, every car will be the same design, and there will be no copying, each team coming to the same design independently.. This is the end result of design, if you want a certain answer, you will get to the same answer no matter the route taken...
So it is a pointless exercise design aero packages for cars, F1 will arrive at the same point at which F2/F3 is, every car on the grid exactly the same design as there can only 1 design that is perfect, it is fractions of fractions of a percent how close each team gets..
So just have 1 design, 1 company makes the chassis, one team brakes, 1 team aero, 1 team seats, 1 team the telemetery.. it is about the meat in the seat, and nothing to do with the geeks with the linux laptops..
The entire basis of Formula One is that each team makes their own car. If it turns into a "spec" series, then it is just a more-expensive version of F2 or IndyCar and I would lose all interest in watching it.
Exactly, Formula One is an R&D series where different teams and manufacturers test technologies. It would be pointless as a spec series and against the essence of the sport.
As much as we hate one team dominating, those teams have done the best job as a collective. That is Formula One.
I agree that an interesting aspect of F1 is the technical development. But I also find it absurd that F1 is used to crown the World Driver Champion in open wheel racing. The inter-team competition is exciting, but in terms of actual racing F1 is pretty awful most of the time.
WDC
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Clearly I failed to explain, F1 by design of the cars is a 1 spec series, it is not a hard concept, if you want the car to do something, you use your brain, education, and computers, and if everyone at all 10 teams does the same research, they will all arrive at the same answer, for planes to go fast, delta wing, regardless if you are educated in Spain, Russia. Mongolia, China, Rwanda, you will figure out that delta wing is the best design for fast planes...Physics is why...
You could put 10 teams on 10 large islands and they have no idea each other exists, and ask them to design the perfect car, from a physics point, you will have 10 cars identical as this is what physics is on this planet...
So we are heading towards the apex of the design, right now Red Bull are winning the race towards the answer, Williams the backmarkers, but within a few years, with the power of computers and salaries, everyone will arrive at the same answer.. then what??
That is what F1 is today, it is a 2 championship event, one for the geeks with the best linux install, and one about the meat in the seat.. We have no way to know if Max is the best, or as a result of the geeks with the best linux install.. A one spec series actually determines the apex driver, the best of the best, aka Top Gun, the top 1% of naval aviators, in the same planes, who is the top dog...
So to end the question, who is world drivers champion, maybe have a spec car for sprints, the top 5 drivers, from last season, they compete in special F1 cars, same spec, for a championship...
Right now, the way it is, F1 is a mess, as it migrates towards being a 1 spec series through design and physics..
You could put 10 teams on 10 large islands and they have no idea each other exists, and ask them to design the perfect car, from a physics point, you will have 10 cars identical as this is what physics is on this planet...
So we are heading towards the apex of the design, right now Red Bull are winning the race towards the answer, Williams the backmarkers, but within a few years, with the power of computers and salaries, everyone will arrive at the same answer.. then what??
That is what F1 is today, it is a 2 championship event, one for the geeks with the best linux install, and one about the meat in the seat.. We have no way to know if Max is the best, or as a result of the geeks with the best linux install.. A one spec series actually determines the apex driver, the best of the best, aka Top Gun, the top 1% of naval aviators, in the same planes, who is the top dog...
So to end the question, who is world drivers champion, maybe have a spec car for sprints, the top 5 drivers, from last season, they compete in special F1 cars, same spec, for a championship...
Right now, the way it is, F1 is a mess, as it migrates towards being a 1 spec series through design and physics..
Luckily there have always been people in every field who think they can do better and arrive at a different answer by that kind of thinking. It’s why we have inventors amongst us. People like that, we can change the rules, we can change the world.
F1 is a great example of that in a smaller way. But not everyone can see that, even fewer type 1% of 5% can comprehend it, the majority just enjoy it, and some don’t know what they don’t know and are negative against it.
Formula One is a set of engineering rules that ten teams take their best attempts at maximizing their performance within those rules. Even if there is one "perfect answer", it is clear that not even one team has ever found it, much less all ten, over the decades.
One team often gets closer to "perfection" than the others, but even in the past decade of "single team dominance" by AMG and RBR, we saw other teams win every year and not just because the "dominant" team failed to finish.
And even when they drive the best car, I believe it is not difficult to determine who is the best driver in a season by comparing them to their teammate. Max almost always dominated Daniel and Checco. Lewis almost always dominated Nico and Valteri.
One team often gets closer to "perfection" than the others, but even in the past decade of "single team dominance" by AMG and RBR, we saw other teams win every year and not just because the "dominant" team failed to finish.
And even when they drive the best car, I believe it is not difficult to determine who is the best driver in a season by comparing them to their teammate. Max almost always dominated Daniel and Checco. Lewis almost always dominated Nico and Valteri.
Overall the reliability of the cars has gotten better with time, so there are fewer races with unexpected outcomes. This is partially due to rules where engines are required to last longer than ever before. Up until the 90s teams really pushed the engines to the limit which would cause many of them fail during a race, often in a dramatic way.
It would've been fun to see the best drivers race with equal equipment from time to time though. Now we always end up with discussions about if drivers only look dominant because they're in the right car. It's pretty obvious that a driver needs the best car to stand a good chance of winning the WDC, but there's just so much tribalism about who became champion on their own merit and who just lucked out with a dominant car. If we had a level playing field, I'm pretty sure there would be a at least a handful of drivers that would be competitive with Max.
I miss the times of radical car solutions, Lotus 80, Lotus 88, Brabham BT46-B, Tyrrell Project 34, Brabham BT49 and BT55, etc, cars that shocked everyone. Then when turbos reached their most violent in 1986.
And then the later peak V10 era and the few V12s before it. Just awesome for spectators.
I stopped watching when the 2.4L V8s went.
Even though they were denied a 2025 entry spot, Andretti Global and GM continue to advance their plans for landing an eventual spot on the F1 grid.
To that end, they opened their new facility near Silverstone to support their Formula E program and have announced that if they are granted an F1 entry, they will also enter F2 and F3.
To that end, they opened their new facility near Silverstone to support their Formula E program and have announced that if they are granted an F1 entry, they will also enter F2 and F3.
The V-10 era still resonates most prominently with me. Nothing comes close.
The McLaren MP4/4 was violent indeed. Senna still made it sing.
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I agree. I would love to see some type of event where they race in some type of cars that are equal. I remember the old IROC races. There were always big surprises as drivers from other series would perform far above expectations.
While they were not very technical race cars, they were equal. It’s unfortunate F1 is so cost prohibitive toward something like this.
I get that prior to the rampant abuse of linux installs in F1, when real drivers got real blisters from doing really hard things like changing gears manually, it was the man controlling the car, there was little to no geeks involved, now since the 2000's, it is 80% linux administration, remote control of the car, and 20% the driver of the car, you can tune the car to the track to within .0001 of second of an ideal perfect lap... I hate it when someone pulls into the pit, and suddenly you see the laptop man come out with the cord and plugs in...
F1 should ban laptops from the pit.. You set the car up before race1, and that is the car you race all season, during the season, say 2024, the PHD's with the expensive gaming laptops are plotting the gear changes for 2025..We should see at every track a couple of chefs, 6 guys to change tyres, 4 on wheels, 2 to jack up the car.. 1 mechanic on the wall.. Strategy should be done remotely.. Give the cars back to the drivers, if not then name every PHD as part of the Drivers World ChampionShip, as equal to the winner.. Max would not have won titles without the PHD's..and their laptops..
I think social media and Netflix making dramatised soap operas of the sport has pushed things to be a lot more tribal than they used to be. I’ve been discussing F1 on forums since the late 1990’s and people have always been passionate about preferred drivers and bias has always been present, but these days it’s just abusive and lacks any depth whatsoever. People aren’t interested in discussing the technical stuff or debating the reasons drivers are good, bad, struggling, they just want to mock and leave empty statements about them being lucky or crap.
I also think the FIA damaged the sport more than many realise and the fallout is still resonating through many of the discussions into driver performance. We are in a very boring era for the sport but it’s been building up to this for years. Engines are super reliable and the majority of the grid are within a few tenths of each other. 2026 can’t come soon enough and hopefully a mix up in the order will demonstrate that great drivers have also been waiting for that chance to have a great car. Max is enjoying a more privileged version of what Lewis and Mercedes had a few years ago, but nothing lasts forever and I think many of his new fans are in for a shock once another team builds a better car. Talent is only one part of it, ask Lewis.
The principles are the same, instead of a wrench and hammer, a laptop can be used. What is the big deal? It doesn't change the principles, welcome to the 21st century. This has been happening since the 1980s that I can remember.
OOPS!
Sorry, I posted the results before you'd been able to see the race.
I just assumed we all had seen it by the time I posted.
Indycar and NASCAR are just as boring. And they use "equal" equipment.
For better or worse I prefer the F1 format.
No worries I didn't read this thread till after I watched it. The winner wasn't a shock lol... nice to see Ferrari battling with one RB at least. Some wicked overtakes in this race though!
Yes, NASCAR is a snooze. Always has been. I will disagree somewhat on Indy Car. While I only watch the road circuits I have found it to be very racy last year and so far in 2024. I am also a huge IMSA. Especially LMP3 and GTLM.
It's good to have a variety of motorsports to follow.