30W USB‑C Power Adapter rage

[deeddawg]

Thanks so much! So the MBP+charger is 0.4 lbs heavier than MBA+charger (3.45 vs. 3.03 lb).

*If* you stick with the OEM power adapter, then yes.

... however you needn't necessarily do that. Battery life is amazing, so a lot of times where you might previously have carried a charger you might not need to now.

Speaking for myself, I'd carry a multiport charger instead of the single-port OEM one since I'll likely have other stuff to charge too.

Also remember -- these will charge from lower output USB-PD sources too, albeit more slowly. A powerbank providing 18W USBC would slow the battery discharge during active usage at least, and may even top it up while the system is idle/asleep - albeit less quickly than the original adapter. (While I've not yet specifically tested this on my M1 MBP, it definitely worked this way with my Intel MBA and the rMB12 before it).

 

[ChrisA]

Annoyed to realise that my M1 Air only comes with a 30W charger instead of the 61W that comes with the Pro.

Should I be?

And does anyone have recommendations for third-party higher wattage chargers I should purchase as I'm not paying the ludicrous Apple tax for their proprietary 61W plug.

Battery life is determined partially by the charge rate. Fast charging will kill the battery sooner than slow charging.

What Apple should do is offer an option. Maybe you tell the computer, fast/medium/slow. Many people would pick "slow" and maybe double the battery life and use "fast" only if it was needed.

 

[1BadManVan]

You do see the irony in your comment, yes? Criticizing a post.... because it was criticizing a post... LOL

Even more amusing since you've made zero positive contributions to the thread, whereas I've made two helpful contributions within the six posts before yours.

Cheers. Have a nice day.

Cya troll

 

[acidfast7_redux]

is this ******** of a thread still going?

 

[milehigh7]

Noticed a distinct lack of numbers in this thread, so posting from the Non-Apple-Silicon forum:
30W that came in the box: Charged from 10 % to 66 % in 60 mins.
61W Apple power adapter: Charged from 10 % to 78 % in 60 mins.
(M1 Macbook Air shut down while charging.)

 

[TrueBlou]

To be honest, I’ve not really noticed a massive difference when I’ve been using it. Though I will freely admit, I’ve not been paying attention.

I have (obviously) the 30W which came in the box though I’ve not used it yet as I have another Apple 30W one, 30W Anker PD, 85W PD from my TB3 dock and the Apple 96W USB-C charger. I also have a USB-C meter to monitor the exact charging performance, so I’ll dig that out.

I’ll start recording some actual numbers between each of the chargers and I’ll post my findings.

 

[coorsleftfield]

I'm happy that the air has a smaller / lighter charger for travel. It was one of the pros for me in picking the air over the pro.

 

[Zazoh]

I'm happy that the air has a smaller / lighter charger for travel. It was one of the pros for me in picking the air over the pro.

Exactly this. The primary design is portability. Battery last all day. Charge at end of day. so many, so many try to make the laptop their desktop.

“I need 4 ports
I need support for dual monitors
I need a charger that will also charge my car
I need an ethernet port!“

Nope, you need a desktop.

 

[coorsleftfield]

Yep.. After living the Digital nomad life and lugging a 2014 MPB 15 all over the world in a backpack, I can tell you that the larger power supply really made the 15" package a lot heavier over the 13 due to that 87W power supply.

I travel full time in a van now, and my charger for the Air is a 12V USB-C charger. This one has been working great with the air, charges it fairly quickly as it delivers 30W.

Anker USB C Car Charger, 49.5W PowerDrive Speed+ 2 Adapter, 30W PD Port for iPhone 15 14 13 12 11 Series, Compatible with S10/S9, MacBook Air, iPad Pro, 19.5W Fast Charge Port for S8 and More

Model Number: A2229

www.amazon.com

 

[TrueBlou]

I'm happy that the air has a smaller / lighter charger for travel. It was one of the pros for me in picking the air over the pro.

It’s a definite bonus, to be sure. My 96W Apple charger never leaves the house, too big and bulky for mobility for me. Likewise with most of my other chargers.

If I’m going out, and coming home the same day.... well, when we’re allowed to go out again I’ll mostly just take one of my many, many, many battery packs. Which would allow me almost two full recharges of my MBA M1. That’s plenty to get through most days.

If I think there’s even a remote chance that I’ll need to use the mains, I generally make sure I have my RavPower MiniX, which, being GaN, is pretty tiny for a 3 port 65W PD charger. It’s almost permanently stored in my bag anyway.

The size of any peripheral I would possibly need to lug around with me is important. I want to keep space - and being an auld cripple, weight to a minimum. That’s why I’m glad of things like the Samsung T7, which is tiny compared to drives I used to haul around with me in the past.

That, the RavPower charger, sometimes a battery pack, Apple USB-C to SD, USB-C to USB-A and the USB-C to AV Adapter, a couple of memory cards and a thumb drive or two, along with a couple of cables is pretty much what I’ll take with me when I go mobile as my basic bag. Well, and the MacBook of course. Covers me for most situations and the weight is negligible.

 

[Fred Zed]

After watching this video, it appears to be wiser to use genuine Apple chargers?

 

[deeddawg]

After watching this video, it appears to be wiser to use genuine Apple chargers?

I'm probably not alone in having no interest in watching an hour long video to be able to comment on your question.

Perhaps you might summarize the video in two or three bullet points and ask your question?

All I know is that in ~5 years owning USBC powered mac laptops of different flavors, I've used genuine Apple USBC chargers but a small percentage of the time. Rest of the time I'm using different well known name power adapters or my Caldigit TS3+ dock.

 

[dmccloud]

After watching this video, it appears to be wiser to use genuine Apple chargers?

That video is not even remotely accurate. USB-C chargers all use USB power delivery (USB-PD) to automatically regulate the level of charge the machines are receiving. That's why you can use an Apple charger on a HP Spectre, Dell XPS (or higher Inspiron), or some of the newer Lenovo Yogas, and you can use a third party USB-C charger such as the Insignia or Platinum chargers sold at Best Buy or the Anker charger on both Windows and Mac machines. USB-PD is actually part of the USB-C and Thunderbolt 3 specs, so it's not exactly an "optional" thing.

 

[Fred Zed]

That video is not even remotely accurate. USB-C chargers all use USB power delivery (USB-PD) to automatically regulate the level of charge the machines are receiving. That's why you can use an Apple charger on a HP Spectre, Dell XPS (or higher Inspiron), or some of the newer Lenovo Yogas, and you can use a third party USB-C charger such as the Insignia or Platinum chargers sold at Best Buy or the Anker charger on both Windows and Mac machines. USB-PD is actually part of the USB-C and Thunderbolt 3 specs, so it's not exactly an "optional" thing.

So you explained what USB-PD is supposed to do, thanks. How Is that relevant to the video?

 

[xraydoc]

I'm probably not alone in having no interest in watching an hour long video to be able to comment on your question.

Perhaps you might summarize the video in two or three bullet points and ask your question?

All I know is that in ~5 years owning USBC powered mac laptops of different flavors, I've used genuine Apple USBC chargers but a small percentage of the time. Rest of the time I'm using different well known name power adapters or my Caldigit TS3+ dock.

I skimmed though the video. He was ultimately able to take an M1 MBP with a blown IC (charge controller or something like that) and some collateral downstream damage to a couple other ICs and resistors (nothing custom apparently), replace them all and get the machine to boot correctly.

The chip that blew (literally a hole was blown through the top) looked like a Texas Instruments IC. I wonder if there's a bad batch of them floating around though Apple's supply chain and they're going bad. May not have anything to do with 3rd party chargers necessarily, or they may be susceptible to slightly off-spec voltage or current.

I'm going to guess that, presuming my theory is correct, if your machine has one of these ICs, it's a time bomb waiting to go off. Hopefully they either all go bad quickly so they get taken care of promptly by Apple, or everyone should be encouraged to make frequent quality backups of your data until there's some kind of statement from Apple.

 

[deeddawg]

I skimmed though the video. He was ultimately able to take an M1 MBP with a blown IC (charge controller or something like that) and some collateral downstream damage to a couple other ICs and resistors (nothing custom apparently), replace them all and get the machine to boot correctly.

The chip that blew (literally a hole was blown through the top) looked like a Texas Instruments IC. I wonder if there's a bad batch of them floating around though Apple's supply chain and they're going bad. May not have anything to do with 3rd party chargers necessarily, or they may be susceptible to slightly off-spec voltage or current.

I'm going to guess that, presuming my theory is correct, if your machine has one of these ICs, it's a time bomb waiting to go off. Hopefully they either all go bad quickly so they get taken care of promptly by Apple, or everyone should be encouraged to make frequent quality backups of your data until there's some kind of statement from Apple.

Thanks for the synopsis.

I’ve seen references to the power related system failures on earlier usbc intel models. The bad components / bad batch theory seems like a good explanation.

Honestly any first gen system is a bit of a risk, M1 no different. A
proper multi tiered versioning backup scheme should be in place, as well as a well thought out business continuity plan if the computer is the basis of your livelihood

 

[Mistborn15]

The M1 in the Air is a lower wattage chip than the M1 in the Pro.

is this true?

 

[flopticalcube]

is this true?

Yes and no ... but mostly no.

The Air can be configured with a 7 core GPU or an 8 core. The MBP only has an 8 core. The difference between them is minimal.

 

[deeddawg]

is this true?

Not as far as I've seen.

However, since the cooling systems are different between the M1 MBA and MBP, the MBA will tend to throttle sooner/more than the MBP. Others have quantified these differences, I'd suggest looking for those threads For many people the differences won't make a discernible difference in their usage.

 

[dmccloud]

So you explained what USB-PD is supposed to do, thanks. How Is that relevant to the video?

Because it doesn't matter if you're using an Apple-branded charger or some other brand. You're the one who said "After watching this video, it appears to be wiser to use genuine Apple chargers?", I was pointing out that with USB-PD, it doesn't matter what brand you are using.

is this true?

No. While the base MBA has a 7-core GPU instead of an 8-core version, it's actually the same processor. Like Intel and AMD, Apple is using binning to separate M1s with all 8 GPU cores working from those with only 7 working GPU cores. The wattage is the same across both variants, and the only variables between the Air and 13" Pro in terms of battery consumption are the touchbar and fan, neither of which actually have a significant impact on battery life.

 

[Fred Zed]

Thanks for the synopsis.

I’ve seen references to the power related system failures on earlier usbc intel models. The bad components / bad batch theory seems like a good explanation.

Honestly any first gen system is a bit of a risk, M1 no different. A
proper multi tiered versioning backup scheme should be in place, as well as a well thought out business continuity plan if the computer is the basis of your livelihood

There's been a good few posts on here as well as other forums and pages, the consensus was it mainly effected those that used USB hubs to charge their M1 Macbook.

Because it doesn't matter if you're using an Apple-branded charger or some other brand. You're the one who said "After watching this video, it appears to be wiser to use genuine Apple chargers?", I was pointing out that with USB-PD, it doesn't matter what brand you are using.



No. While the base MBA has a 7-core GPU instead of an 8-core version, it's actually the same processor. Like Intel and AMD, Apple is using binning to separate M1s with all 8 GPU cores working from those with only 7 working GPU cores. The wattage is the same across both variants, and the only variables between the Air and 13" Pro in terms of battery consumption are the touchbar and fan, neither of which actually have a significant impact on battery life.

I think not all PD chargers are created equal. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[deeddawg]

There's been a good few posts on here as well as other forums and pages, the consensus was it mainly effected those that used USB hubs to charge their M1 Macbook.

Which the bad-batch / some weak parts passing QC theory fits.

Seems like there was a flurry of reports at one time that's mostly settled down. While perhaps some portion of folks are eschewing non-namebrand chargers having read the thread, MR tends to attract outside folks who seek help with an issue and I don't think we've seen a constant influx of such. I also really haven't been paying it attention so maybe missed something.

I think not all PD chargers are created equal. Thanks for the clarification.

A PD charger should follow spec - though as you mention it's quite possible some do not.

 

[abhi182]

For what it’s worth - I had built up a motley collection of PD chargers comprising of a mostly certified devices - few Apple (18/20/30/65W), Lenovo (65W) but also a bunch of generic ones purchased off amazon.
I had been using all of them interchangeably to charge everything from iphones /iPads/ Cameras/ Macs and other laptops for the past few years with no ill effects on anything.

I had been thinking of getting rid of the generic ones for quite a while now but had never really gotten around to it.
As a side effect of the mild paranoia induced by the M1 PD death posts, I finally got around to it and replaced them with a bunch of Ikea Askstorm 30W PD chargers. (PSA: Great chargers that are priced very low for properly certified devices)

While I am almost certain that the generic ones would also have continued to work fine but again, given the complexity of PD negotiation, I swapped them out for the Ikea Ones.

What i do find surprising is this :
The worst case possibility with PD is a charger switching to a higher voltage that the max supported on the connected device (e.g. supplying 15V to a device that can take 9V max)
But the max V on PD chargers is 20.1V - a voltage profile that all laptops (including M1) are compliant with.
Makes it all the more odd why such reported failures would have occurred.