Any compelling reason to change to Ventura on 2017 iMac?

[SalisburySam]

I have the same 2017 27" iMac and I've left it on Monterey because I have no real reason to update.

That’s a bit like where I am, and why I created this thread to see what I’m missing if anything. So far, my take is that Ventura is not catastrophic on a machine like mine, there will be a learning curve for System Preferences changes, and likely not much to be gained and certainly no killer “gotta haves” with my 2017 iMac.

 

[SalisburySam]

I like the pieces but I find that Finder is overloaded these days. I think that they should have a separate program like iOSSync.

I tried to find “iOSSync” in the App Store but didn’t. Also didn’t find “iOS Sync” either. Would like to better understand the advantages you see. What am I doing wrong?

 

[pshufd]

I tried to find “iOSSync” in the App Store but didn’t. Also didn’t find “iOS Sync” either. Would like to better understand the advantages you see. What am I doing wrong?

I was proposing a name for a program to sync things from macOS to iOS devices. No such product actually exists.

Finder also has screen sharing which is something else that I think should be a separate program.

 

[SalisburySam]

I was proposing a name for a program to sync things from macOS to iOS devices. No such product actually exists.

Finder also has screen sharing which is something else that I think should be a separate program.

Got it, regret the misunderstanding.

 

[ThunderSkunk]

After spending some months on Big Sewer & Monterey, I went back to Mojave on my 2019 iMac & decided that’s where it’s staying, bc it’s the last OS Apple made in which everything works (except screen sharing of course, bc that was broken after High Sierra & Apple just can’t afford to fix things like that with its limited resources.). Mojave runs fast and powerful, works with 32bit apps and more importantly drivers, so any piece of hardware on earth will work with it. It’s pretty much perfect. The iMac also stays offline so I don’t worry about security updates, like a working time capsule of peak Apple.

It does however mean that I have to/get to keep a 2015 MBP as its dedicated portable side, to complete its own ecosystem. Since Apple’s planned obsolescence model includes breaking file format compatibility between versions of their own software, it was a decision to use the pair of machines together locked in the Mojave era. The limitations are that I don’t use them for work or school things, just personal & home. Work requires online access, up to date security & software to be compat w everyone else, so I use a dedicated new machine for that. I questioned if it were really worth having an old outdated system when I need a new one anyway. But it’s very good to keep the personal separate from professional, and while the new machines are built to fail and disposable with their soldiered in SSD’s, the old will run indefinitely. 20 years from now I’ll have thrown half a dozen new computers in the landfill, while my 2 old personal machines, on their 4th SSDs & RAM will do everything as reliably as they ever did, and my 3d models & all their linked parameter databases and everything else I’ve ever made will all still work and work together. Mojave or bust.

 

[ThunderSkunk]

I was proposing a name for a program to sync things from macOS to iOS devices. No such product actually exists.

Finder also has screen sharing which is something else that I think should be a separate program.

If you guys go back far enough, you’ll find Apple made an app in Utilities called “Sync”. I can’t even remember what the ui looks like, but it had a nice icon. There really should just be an app called that which handles syncing whatever you have to sync, whether it’s phones, iPads, iPods, or any two directories on your local machine or across a network. Once upon a time, I guess.

 

[pshufd]

After spending some months on Big Sewer & Monterey, I went back to Mojave on my 2019 iMac & decided that’s where it’s staying, bc it’s the last OS Apple made in which everything works (except screen sharing of course, bc that was broken after High Sierra & Apple just can’t afford to fix things like that with its limited resources.). Mojave runs fast and powerful, works with 32bit apps and more importantly drivers, so any piece of hardware on earth will work with it. It’s pretty much perfect. The iMac also stays offline so I don’t worry about security updates, like a working time capsule of peak Apple.

It does however mean that I have to/get to keep a 2015 MBP as its dedicated portable side, to complete its own ecosystem. Since Apple’s planned obsolescence model includes breaking file format compatibility between versions of their own software, it was a decision to use the pair of machines together locked in the Mojave era. The limitations are that I don’t use them for work or school things, just personal & home. Work requires online access, up to date security & software to be compat w everyone else, so I use a dedicated new machine for that. I questioned if it were really worth having an old outdated system when I need a new one anyway. But it’s very good to keep the personal separate from professional, and while the new machines are built to fail and disposable with their soldiered in SSD’s, the old will run indefinitely. 20 years from now I’ll have thrown half a dozen new computers in the landfill, while my 2 old personal machines, on their 4th SSDs & RAM will do everything as reliably as they ever did, and my 3d models & all their linked parameter databases and everything else I’ve ever made will all still work and work together. Mojave or bust.

I've used screen sharing on very old to new macOS operating systems without problems.

 

[SalisburySam]

After spending some months on Big Sewer & Monterey, I went back to Mojave on my 2019 iMac & decided that’s where it’s staying, bc it’s the last OS Apple made in which everything works (except screen sharing of course, bc that was broken after High Sierra & Apple just can’t afford to fix things like that with its limited resources.). Mojave runs fast and powerful, works with 32bit apps and more importantly drivers, so any piece of hardware on earth will work with it. It’s pretty much perfect. The iMac also stays offline so I don’t worry about security updates, like a working time capsule of peak Apple.

It does however mean that I have to/get to keep a 2015 MBP as its dedicated portable side, to complete its own ecosystem. Since Apple’s planned obsolescence model includes breaking file format compatibility between versions of their own software, it was a decision to use the pair of machines together locked in the Mojave era. The limitations are that I don’t use them for work or school things, just personal & home. Work requires online access, up to date security & software to be compat w everyone else, so I use a dedicated new machine for that. I questioned if it were really worth having an old outdated system when I need a new one anyway. But it’s very good to keep the personal separate from professional, and while the new machines are built to fail and disposable with their soldiered in SSD’s, the old will run indefinitely. 20 years from now I’ll have thrown half a dozen new computers in the landfill, while my 2 old personal machines, on their 4th SSDs & RAM will do everything as reliably as they ever did, and my 3d models & all their linked parameter databases and everything else I’ve ever made will all still work and work together. Mojave or bust.

I agree that Mojave was excellent on my 2017 iMac, but staying on that was not an option for me. I needed a newer macOS for software I use that no longer ran under Mojave, and I'm not in a multi-desktop situation. But your point is taken certainly and thanks for replying.

 

[orionquest]

My 2017 iMac came with Mojave. I changed to Monterey when some software, especially TurboTax, would no longer run on Mojave. I’ve gotten used to the differences such as the change from iTunes to Monterey equivalents but my iMac does seem a bit slower under Monterey sadly.

Now I’m getting update suggestions to go to Ventura. I’m asking folks here what I might expect to see that’s better than Monterey, and what might be worse on my iMac. I don’t envision changing out the iMac anytime soon…I really, really like the 27” all-in-one physical format. Just to set the environment, my iMac has 16GB RAM, 512GB SSD, Intel 4.2GHz i7 “Kaby Lake” processor, AMD Radeon Pro 580 with 8GB VRAM, and is Ethernet connected to my home’s 300mbps synchronous Internet service. I have three external hard drives for file storage and TimeMachine backups, one is 4TB and two others are 8TB each.

So for my hunk of hardware, what would Ventura add and what might I regret?

Thanks for any input.

IF you can't see a benefit then there isn't one. Just look at your experience going from Mojave to Monterey, other then updated OS for newer software you didn't even list any benefit.

I also recently updated from Mojave to Monterey, yeah it is a bit slower, mostly from the more locked down security features they have implemented. Otherwise I use the OS the same as I always have for many versions, by turning off all the extra junk they keep including/gets in the way. Basically the only benefit is a newer OS, maybe some prettier or uglier UI stuff, depending what works for you.

Don't get caught up in the new shiny. There is always another yearly update around the corner anyway...

 

[SalisburySam]

IF you can't see a benefit then there isn't one. Just look at your experience going from Mojave to Monterey, other then updated OS for newer software you didn't even list any benefit.

I also recently updated from Mojave to Monterey, yeah it is a bit slower, mostly from the more locked down security features they have implemented. Otherwise I use the OS the same as I always have for many versions, by turning off all the extra junk they keep including/gets in the way. Basically the only benefit is a newer OS, maybe some prettier or uglier UI stuff, depending what works for you.

Don't get caught up in the new shiny. There is always another yearly update around the corner anyway...

But for me the HUGE benefit going to Monterey was compatibility with software I use and want. No major macOS benefit but I had to upgrade nonetheless. I'm less dazzled by the new shiny than I am "it just works."

 

[orionquest]

But for me the HUGE benefit going to Monterey was compatibility with software I use and want. No major macOS benefit but I had to upgrade nonetheless. I'm less dazzled by the new shiny than I am "it just works."

Totally agree, I'm well past any shiny in my greybeard days, I just want to do my chit and be done with it, not fiddle around with dumb new features.

 

[Lloigorr]

Ventura has several bug fixes that didn’t make it to Monterey, and that I cared about: it fixes several memory leaks in Finder and Spotlight

This is why I upgraded my Mac Mini to Ventura, though Monterey is a fine OS most of the time

 

[ignatius345]

I may get over my avoidance of the smaller 24” iMacs

I migrated from a 5K 27" iMac down to the 24". I think it's big enough for a lot of work, but I miss being able to truly sprawl out my stuff the way I used to. And no matter what Apple marketing says, the speakers aren't as good as the ones on the 5K either.

Other than that, it's a huge win. Even with just 16GB of RAM (coming from the 32GB I had on my 5K) it's just SO much quicker in every way. And while the screen is smaller, it's every bit got the same quality as the 5K, if not better.

 

[Viking1983]

Helpful to me, thanks. Hadn’t thought to run First Aid on external disks but will try that. So in your case, the move to Ventura added an undesired change to System Preferences but all else is decent if I’m catching your drift.

Yes, that's correct. There's been a minor "file not found error," which occurs sometimes on Ventura. It happens the first time you click on a new or moved file. BUT, I've read that seems to have been fixed in the next beta-so regular release should follow soon.

Overall no problems, and I haven't noticed any slowdowns or problems after my initial slow disk read/write speeds (which I was able to fix).

 

[dazey]

I have most of my machines on Mojave and a new mac mini on Ventura. I wouldn't recomend updating if you dont have to. Ventura is a memory hog, on an 8GB RAM mac mini M2, I often get out of memory warnings. I never get them on an 8GB 2017 Macbook running the same apps on Mojave. There are also some apps that won't run (may be a mac silicon issue). Its also a lot more locked down, so trying to do things like remove apple apps is harder. The only kindof cool thing is the ability to share a mouse and keyboard across ipad and Mac, but to be honest, more times than not its more annoying than helpful and I have to keep turning it off

 

[pshufd]

I have most of my machines on Mojave and a new mac mini on Ventura. I wouldn't recomend updating if you dont have to. Ventura is a memory hog, on an 8GB RAM mac mini M2, I often get out of memory warnings. I never get them on an 8GB 2017 Macbook running the same apps on Mojave. There are also some apps that won't run (may be a mac silicon issue). Its also a lot more locked down, so trying to do things like remove apple apps is harder. The only kindof cool thing is the ability to share a mouse and keyboard across ipad and Mac, but to be honest, more times than not its more annoying than helpful and I have to keep turning it off

I've run into memory leaks in Big Sur, Monterey and Ventura but they've been resolved now. Memory leaks are always going to be a problem in new operating systems and should decline, at least the worst of them, as they mature. These days I get a minimum of 32 GB of RAM on my systems.

 

[orionquest]

I've run into memory leaks in Big Sur, Monterey and Ventura but they've been resolved now. Memory leaks are always going to be a problem in new operating systems and should decline, at least the worst of them, as they mature. These days I get a minimum of 32 GB of RAM on my systems.

That is some bad advice there, memory leaks are a software issue, not from a lack of hardware.

 

[pshufd]

That is some bad advice there, memory leaks are a software issue, not from a lack of hardware.

Having more RAM allows you to tolerate memory leaks better.

I spent many years fixing memory leak issues and it's one of the more unpleasant tasks as a software engineer. At least in the 1990s. Maybe the tools are better today.

 

[TriciaMacMillan]

I wouldn't recomend updating if you dont have to. Ventura is a memory hog, on an 8GB RAM mac mini M2, I often get out of memory warnings. I never get them on an 8GB 2017 Macbook running the same apps on Mojave.

My experience is just the opposite. Especially the Mail app would eat up tons of memory under Mojave unless restarted every 1-2 days. No such problems under Ventura any more.