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Anyone here try an MS Surface Pro/Book?
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Wanted to bump this and give some feedback in regards to the Surface Book.
More and more, I'm being torn between my rMBP and the SB. When it comes to hardware, the SB is more enjoyable to use to me. I love the design of the SB and it's just a joy to use. I find that the keyboard is a bit nicer than the one on my rMBP as the keys have a little more tactile stick to them.
However, when it comes to actual use and software, the rMBP is what I end up on the most. OS X is still better than Windows 10 for me. The big detractor for Windows 10 on the SB is the lack of good support for high DPI screens within Windows apps. Things like Netbeans are unusable because they have yet to be scalable for high DPI screens within Windows whereas it looks great on OS X. Windows 10 is still a work in progress.
All in all, I get more excitement out of the SB but the software side is lacking enough that I usually fall back to the MBP for most tasks.
IF you are Windows friendly or find Windows more in your workflow, the SB is rock solid and a beautiful device.
More and more, I'm being torn between my rMBP and the SB. When it comes to hardware, the SB is more enjoyable to use to me. I love the design of the SB and it's just a joy to use. I find that the keyboard is a bit nicer than the one on my rMBP as the keys have a little more tactile stick to them.
However, when it comes to actual use and software, the rMBP is what I end up on the most. OS X is still better than Windows 10 for me. The big detractor for Windows 10 on the SB is the lack of good support for high DPI screens within Windows apps. Things like Netbeans are unusable because they have yet to be scalable for high DPI screens within Windows whereas it looks great on OS X. Windows 10 is still a work in progress.
All in all, I get more excitement out of the SB but the software side is lacking enough that I usually fall back to the MBP for most tasks.
IF you are Windows friendly or find Windows more in your workflow, the SB is rock solid and a beautiful device.
Thanks for the feedback. For info, I played with an HP Z27S high DPI screen recently and installed the driver for it on my S3Pro. It scaled acceptably with the apps I was using between the S3Pro and the external display.
Without it I needed a telescope to read the monitor display... so make sure you use the right drivers as it may fix this for you is my rather subtle point... hope it helps.
I saw an SB in the wild yesterday and it looks lovely but yes, OSX has features that just work better with me than Windows - for my personal stuff.
This has become less and less of an issue lately - most apps now scale perfectly well, but if the one you use most isn't among them, this is of little consolation I guess.
I have a Surface Book incoming this Wednesday. On my second 12" Macbook right now and have to say, the 2016 version still doesn't cut it. It's just too darn slow. It'll do MS Office (athough I have to say that battery life with Word just idling in the background is absolutely terrible - I barely got 3 hours out of it last Friday during a conference), and that's about it. I installed Lightroom on it today to check whether it'd be good enough as my main machine (was planning on selling my 15" rMBP in time before the new models come out and it won't be worth much anymore), but no cigar - LR absolutely kills the processor on the MB. I admittedly have a fairly large library, but still - this thing just slows down to a crawl as soon as LR is running. Have decided to replace the Macbook with the i5 256gb SB with the dedicated CPU - will report back once I've run it through its paces.
Great to hear! I really love my Surface Book still after a few months and will normally gravitate towards that as opposed to my rMBP.
As for apps that don't scale well, the big one for me is NetBeans. That's the main IDE my work uses so not having it scale properly is a bit difficult to work with. I find myself in other IDEs that scale fine like Atom or Visual Studio but I'm trying to get myself more familiar with NetBeans. Also ironically enough, even iTunes on Windows doesn't have high DPI support...
You're basically getting the same Surface Book as me. Install updates right away. That'll help solve any of the bugs I've seen along the way specifically with Windows Hello. It's been a rock solid machine with minimal issues. Very happy with it and it's a joy to use. Hoping that the Windows 10 Anniversary Update coming up has been fun features to play with.
I totally agree with you - the MacBook is slower than everyone seems to lead on. It's great if you're using your rMB as an iPad and only using it for basic tasks but anything else, it's noticeably slow. I had one for a while and 100% agree with everything you said. For the price, there's simply too many compromises. It's a status symbol.
One side note: I'm hoping and waiting for Ubuntu to support the SB. Running Linux on it is possible right now but not without custom work behind the scenes.
Your MacBook experience is disappointing to hear, but helpful nonetheless, especially since many of the reviews I have read don't provide adequate "real world" usage scenarios. I'll look forward to hearing your impressions with the Surface Book. It's rather amazing to me how quickly Microsoft and Apple seem to have switched places on the innovation and bureaucracy fronts.
I recently got a Surface Book (i7/512/16) and absolutely love it: In fact, it's so good that I gave my rMB to my daughter.
The fit and finish of the device is easily as good as anything Apple produce and the flexibility of being able to detach the screen (while not being something I do very often) is great as is the ability to flip the screen round so the keyboard is behind it (makes it much neater when using it on my desk).
I decided on a Surface Book because I wanted a laptop that could occasionally be used as a tablet in specific apps (such as OneNote) rather than a tablet that can be used as a Laptop (I've got my iPad Pro for that
) and it fits that use case perfectly.
It's not perfect yet and I still have occasional issues with the NVidia drivers, but the minor issues aren't enough to detract from what, for me, is the best laptop out there at the moment
The fit and finish of the device is easily as good as anything Apple produce and the flexibility of being able to detach the screen (while not being something I do very often) is great as is the ability to flip the screen round so the keyboard is behind it (makes it much neater when using it on my desk).
I decided on a Surface Book because I wanted a laptop that could occasionally be used as a tablet in specific apps (such as OneNote) rather than a tablet that can be used as a Laptop (I've got my iPad Pro for that
) and it fits that use case perfectly. It's not perfect yet and I still have occasional issues with the NVidia drivers, but the minor issues aren't enough to detract from what, for me, is the best laptop out there at the moment
I was considering going for the top version (at least for Europe - the 1tb version doesn't seem to be available here), but chickened out and went with the i5 256gb with dedicated GPU instead - mainly to check it out and make sure I don't have any serious problems with it. If it turns out to be able to replace my 15" rMBP as well, that's even better. I'll pass the i5 on to my wife (who's currently on a Surface Pro 3 but doesn't like the small screen) and get the i7 512 in a few months. I played with one for a while and absolutely loved the touchpad (just as good as on the rMB), the screen, everything. Can't wait for Wednesday
(ordered it yesterday, but it's a public holiday here today, so they won't ship it until Tuesday).[doublepost=1463411166][/doublepost]
The Macbook can be a great machine, but it's not a great allround computer. It's fantastic as a second computer that's mainly used on the go. It's also great for students etc. But if you do some serious work on it (apart from the MS Office Suite that is), it's likely too slow. I have the 1.2ghz 512gb 2016 version. It's noticably snappier than the previous version, but only as far as OS X goes - as soon as Adobe applications come into play, it's just too slow for my taste. I'm sure some people will be able to put up with it, but I hate lag.
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I think that configuration offers the best value - the i7 256gb isn't worth it IMHO (it's only about 10-15% faster - not really noticeable). The only other version I was considereing was the top model with 512gb SSD. If the 256gb turns out as great as I'm excpecting it to, I'll likely save up for the 512 and make it my only computer. For now, I just ordered a 200gb MicroSD and an adpater that sits flush and I'll just put my Spotify library, iTunes etc. on the SD card. That way, the 256 gb should get me quite far. And yes, the first thing I'll be doing is installing all the patches and firmware updates.
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I was considering going for the top version (at least for Europe - the 1tb version doesn't seem to be available here), but chickened out and went with the i5 256gb with dedicated GPU instead - mainly to check it out and make sure I don't have any serious problems with it. If it turns out to be able to replace my 15" rMBP as well, that's even better. I'll pass the i5 on to my wife (who's currently on a Surface Pro 3 but doesn't like the small screen) and get the i7 512 in a few months. I played with one for a while and absolutely loved the touchpad (just as good as on the rMB), the screen, everything. Can't wait for Wednesday
I thought long and hard before dropping the best part of £2,500 on the Surface Book and Dock but I really needed the 16GB of RAM and 512GB SSD (I run a lot of VMs for support purposes) so finally gave in and ordered one and couldn't be happier: It's incredibly fast, absolutely gorgeous and a pleasure to work on
Today is Wednesday! How's the Surface Book, kis!?
Wasn't able to pick it up until the evening - set it up (more or less) and except for some minor issues (Lightroom has some scrolling problems on Windows 10), it's absolutely fantastic. Installed all the updates and so far haven't experienced any erratic behavior. The touchpad is great - still not as good as that on the Macbook, but for a strange reason: it takes a millisecond or so to activate once you touch it, which I first need to get used it. Once it's activated it's every bit as accruate as the one on the Macbook line. The keyboard is FANTASTIC. So is the screen.
So after roughly two days with the device I have to say: holy crap, one hell of a laptop. I've yet to see any major issues - so far, everything has worked more or less perfectly. Once it turned itself off after a while in standby, but that's about it. The Surface Book is pure innovation - I love the tablet mode, they keyboard is absolutely fantastic, the screen is to die for and the performance is excellent as well. Battery life exceeded 10 hours yesterday (actually, I had almost 2 hours of juice left after the day, but I wasn't using it too heavily) in my first real-life test during a long work day.
Only downside: the touchpad still isn't 100% there. There seems to be some sort of energy-saving thing going on: if you don't touch it for a while, it seems to turn itself off. It'll spring to action almost immediately after you touch it - but there's a very brief delay, which can be slightly annoying at times. That said: once it's enabled, it's every bit as accurate as the one on Macbooks.
This is where innovation lives today, apparently. Apple: watch out.
Only downside: the touchpad still isn't 100% there. There seems to be some sort of energy-saving thing going on: if you don't touch it for a while, it seems to turn itself off. It'll spring to action almost immediately after you touch it - but there's a very brief delay, which can be slightly annoying at times. That said: once it's enabled, it's every bit as accurate as the one on Macbooks.
This is where innovation lives today, apparently. Apple: watch out.
I have the SP4 M3 4GB, and I can say it's a surprisingly stout machine, considering the stats. Though I'd say it's strengths rely mostly upon how you intend to use it.
If you're looking for a thin, lightweight laptop primarily that can leverage the strengths of a tablet, it's an excellent buy. But if you want a pure tablet, get an iPad.
The only thing asides from price that is really preventing me from truely picking the Surface Pro over the iPad Pro is the smaller screen size and the widescreen aspect ratio. I want a 15" or bigger, at a ratio closer to 4:3 like the iPad. It's a really dumb reason, but it's my reason.
I can't argue the smaller screen size, but the aspect ration isn't that much different in practice. I also think the iPad 4:3 screen is the best aspect ratio for tablets, but really, the difference between it and the SP4's 3:2 is fairly small. When I measured it awhile back, I think shaving about a 3rd of an inch off the left and right side of the screen while in landscape would give you a proper 4:3 aspect ratio. Not a big deal at all.
It's a small difference, and I think it's only more noticeable when held in portrait mode, which I prefer to work in with tablets. I did admit it was a dumb reason, though :)I can't argue the smaller screen size, but the aspect ration isn't that much different in practice. I also think the iPad 4:3 screen is the best aspect ratio for tablets, but really, the difference between it and the SP4's 3:2 is fairly small. When I measured it awhile back, I think shaving about a 3rd of an inch off the left and right side of the screen while in landscape would give you a proper 4:3 aspect ratio. Not a big deal at all.
It's a small difference, and I think it's only more noticeable when held in portrait mode, which I prefer to work in with tablets. I did admit it was a dumb reason, though
Yeah, I can understand where you're coming from. The SP does look weirdly tall when held up in portrait, especially when you're used to an iPad.
Though it is something you get used to fairly quick. Unlike those old 16:9/16:10 tablets, it's not awkward at all.
Yeah, my Surface clone is 16:9 and I'm not a fan of the ratio - not tall enough in landscape, and too thin in portrait! 3:2/4:3 is sufficiently close to not be a big issue though.
HP offer alternatives to the Surface Pro (their Spectre and Elite ranges), as do Samsung with their Galaxy TabPro S, and Huawei MateBook. They all have different solutions, prices, pros and cons (ie none are perfect imo) but they are all pushing the boundaries of the mobile computing workspace, which is a good thing.
BTW - I found that the slight delay in touchpad activation is a feature, not a bug. It's put there to avoid accidental mouse movement while you're typing. It can be disabled and then the touchpad is almost exactly like that on Macbooks. I even slightly prefer it because it has a physical clicking mechanism. Never loved Force Touch. It's not bad by any means, but it's worse than the previous touchpads in my opinion.
i have a fully maxed surface book with dock. I like the hardware and the feel of it, but the software(win10) is buggy at best in my experience. just a bunch of minor gripes (touchpad iffy, screen scaling/font scaling messed up often when connecting to two monitors via the docking station. scroll wheel once in a while stops working in apps like Chrome or Edge. random reboots at times, when the device goes to sleep. I use a lot of older application mixed in with newer application which might explain some of my issues (especially scaling). but all in all i think Microsoft still needs to fix it's software to make this laptop a pleasure to use for my case (ymmv). It also annoys me that i can't do two finger swipes with the touchpad in the web browser ( at least i couldn't find a way)
Hmmm, I'm not sure what is happening on your machine but two finger swipes/scrolling is definitely possible.
I wasn't clear on that, i meant two finger touchpad swipe to the left or right to go previous/next website like i can do it on the mac. up/down two finger scroll works. Cheers
Lenovo's Yoga touchscreen laptops are pretty nifty. I hope Apple makes something with that design.
Been wanting a Surface Pro but not sure how much I would use it as I already have an iMac and a Windows 10 machine (though it sucks and hardly works) in the family room. I want one for work but I also have access to work laptops so I technically don't really need one. I just want one.
Though using it for photography and editing would be cool. I just wish Apple included a USB port to iPads from the get go and not an attachment.
Though using it for photography and editing would be cool. I just wish Apple included a USB port to iPads from the get go and not an attachment.