Apple contract with AT&T

[kdarling]

I don't think it's that simple as just slaping a CDMA chip. Not only they would need to make the iPhone fatter/bigger but would have to redo the whole OS to handle CDMA and it's only talk and no data limitations and many other things.

Nope.

The OS already handles situations without simultaneous data+voice. Remember the first iPhone? Not to mention the current model outside of 3G coverage.

As far as size goes, there are CDMA+GSM phones that are pretty slim. However, I agree with those who doubt that Apple would manufacture a single worldwide model with both. Not cost effective enough for them.

Is it worth it for them to make their device compatible to an old, soon to be retired system for a year or 2 span? Maybe, maybe not.

Apple obviously doesn't care about model longevity, as their first EDGE only model was practically useless in much of the non-EDGE-supporting world.

CDMA is not going to be retired anytime soon. Not sure what you're talking about there.

Apple already redesigns their iPhone circuit boards once a year. Technical reasons aren't a blocking point.

The better arguments against a Verizon iPhone are the ones about branding, money, insurance availability and other business decisions.

This 100 times and more. I even lol'd hard at the Verizon tweet that said big announcement the same week the iPad was announced. I bet it wa sa bucket of cold water to know AT&T was going to carry it again.

Only clueless web "reporters" thought the Verizon tweet about their annually scheduled employee meeting had anything to do with the iPad.

 

[jman240]

I don't think it's about the technical challenges. I'll bet that's a pretty simple fix compared to getting Verizon to giving Apple a favorable marketing agreement. They both have a lot at stake - Verizon with other phone mfgrs and Apple with AT&T and anything they negotiate now has to fit somehow with deals they've negotiated previously.

The original iPhone, as in the metal back one, cost Apple a lot to make. I would imagine R&D for adding a new chip for a US only carrier would be completely cost prohibitive. They don't just slap one in and call it a day. You have to make the software work with it, you have to radio test it for signal strength and reliability. They spent the first few months with the 3g iPhone sending software updates since their version of 3G drivers or whatever they are were crashing ATT towers.

"One insider estimates that Apple spent roughly $150 million building the iPhone."
source: http://www.wired.com/gadgets/wireless/magazine/16-02/ff_iphone?currentPage=1

 

[jav6454]

Only clueless web "reporters" thought the Verizon tweet about their annually scheduled employee meeting had anything to do with the iPad.

Well then, it was the entire blogsphere and vast majority of users here that thought that.

 

[kdarling]

The original iPhone, as in the metal back one, cost Apple a lot to make. I would imagine R&D for adding a new chip for a US only carrier would be completely cost prohibitive.

Arguments like these make no sense for several reasons:

1) Every other phone maker, even cash-strapped Palm, has both GSM and CDMA versions... and makes money from them. Are you claiming that Apple is incapable of doing the same, especially with a popular model?

2) Apple already went through a large transition when they added a WCDMA capable chipset in order to get 3G with the second iPhone model.

3) It's really not that hard. Chipmakers provide sample code and assistance.

They spent the first few months with the 3g iPhone sending software updates since their version of 3G drivers or whatever they are were crashing ATT towers.

True, the 3G had a power control bug at first. That just means that ATT didn't do complete testing. I'd hate to have been part of their test team when this incredibly primary CDMA functionality turned out to not have been tested.

"One insider estimates that Apple spent roughly $150 million building the iPhone."

I'd be surprised if it was even that much, but it's still chump change for Apple.

Well then, it was the entire blogsphere and vast majority of users here that thought that.

The entire blogosphere and vast majority here also thought that simple scrolling patent was a major multi-touch coup, when a few of us engineers were saying otherwise. I agree that people are often misled, especially with today's bloggers and reporters who don't take the time to do basic research.

 

[icyfire]

All things considered, CDMA isn't going away anytime soon. Verizon has said that CDMA will be around until at least 2018 to function as voice and backup while LTE will handle data. So if Apple were to ever release a Verizon iPhone it would most definitely have to include a CDMA chip. That is unless Apple releases an LTE only iPhone which will work on Verizon's LTE network solely (but may run into reliability problems since there will be no CDMA fallback). And we still don't know whether Verizon will run voice on LTE so an LTE iPhone without a CDMA radio may not be able to do voice on Verizon.

Eh, at this point, I'm hoping that android starts taking over some serious market share in order to push Apple into releasing the iPhone more competitively in the US. I think Apple has gotten an easy ride with their AT&T exclusivity contract and frankly, Apple and AT&T have gotten pretty lazy as a result and the consumer is suffering. The fact that AT&T is releasing a few Android sets and WebOS sets is a good start.

 

[Applejuiced]

All things considered, CDMA isn't going away anytime soon. Verizon has said that CDMA will be around until at least 2018 to function as voice and backup while LTE will handle data. So if Apple were to ever release a Verizon iPhone it would most definitely have to include a CDMA chip. That is unless Apple releases an LTE only iPhone which will work on Verizon's LTE network solely (but may run into reliability problems since there will be no CDMA fallback). And we still don't know whether Verizon will run voice on LTE so an LTE iPhone without a CDMA radio may not be able to do voice on Verizon.

2018?
Thats a very long time to still support LTE, I think they should scrap it and switch to GSM/LTE.

 

[Applejuiced]

Nope.

The OS already handles situations without simultaneous data+voice. Remember the first iPhone? Not to mention the current model outside of 3G coverage.

As far as size goes, there are CDMA+GSM phones that are pretty slim. However, I agree with those who doubt that Apple would manufacture a single worldwide model with both. Not cost effective enough for them.



Apple obviously doesn't care about model longevity, as their first EDGE only model was practically useless in much of the non-EDGE-supporting world.

CDMA is not going to be retired anytime soon. Not sure what you're talking about there.

Apple already redesigns their iPhone circuit boards once a year. Technical reasons aren't a blocking point.

The better arguments against a Verizon iPhone are the ones about branding, money, insurance availability and other business decisions.



Only clueless web "reporters" thought the Verizon tweet about their annually scheduled employee meeting had anything to do with the iPad.

Yes, but a potential CDMA iphone will not function the same way the GSM 2G or 3G part would and so proper OS would need to be rewritten.
I agree about the dual mode thing would not be cost effective to Apple and obviously the current model would have no place to fit such a configuration.
It would need a redesign to accomodate a two version board like other manufacturer phones.
About the model longevity on the first 2G iphone IMO it was just to test out the waters. Also AT&T didnt seem really commited to it before release thats why they didnt subsidize it like other phones they offered. I had to pay $599 for it and still be tied to a 2 year contract.
Like you said the CDMA part of the US is not going to retire soon but alot of international CDMA providers have been jumping ship to the GSM standard. I also dont think Verizon would bother updating/upgrading their CDMA network soon and will focus on 4G tech and will leave CDMA as a fallback like Edge and GPRS is to GSM networks.
I understand they have invested so much money and tech on CDMA over the past decade or more so its not an easy or cost effective alternative to completelly scrap it all and start clean with GSM/4G.
Alot easier for a smaller country the size of 1 or 2 US states to switch but not for a giant provider like Verizon.

 

[icyfire]

2018?
Thats a very long time to still support LTE, I think they should scrap it and switch to GSM/LTE.

Hey, I'd love it if Verizon switched to GSM. Maybe then we could actually have a proper GSM network in the US that functions in such remote places as NYC and San Fransisco . But at this point of the game, I hope they go all out with LTE. That way we can have a 4G network that's up to international standards and we can have a much wider assortment of phones.

 

[Applejuiced]

Hey, I'd love it if Verizon switched to GSM. Maybe then we could actually have a proper GSM network in the US that functions in such remote places as NYC and San Fransisco . But at this point of the game, I hope they go all out with LTE. That way we can have a 4G network that's up to international standards and we can have a much wider assortment of phones.

True.
It would cost in the billions for a CDMA total rehaul to GSM probably.
Maybe Barrack can pitch in

 

[blubyu]

And we still don't know whether Verizon will run voice on LTE so an LTE iPhone without a CDMA radio may not be able to do voice on Verizon..

They will be VOIP'ing the voice so it will all be data on their LTE network.

Eh, at this point, I'm hoping that android starts taking over some serious market share in order to push Apple into releasing the iPhone more competitively in the US. I think Apple has gotten an easy ride with their AT&T exclusivity contract and frankly, Apple and AT&T have gotten pretty lazy as a result and the consumer is suffering. The fact that AT&T is releasing a few Android sets and WebOS sets is a good start.

Apple doesn't care about market share. As long as they keep putting out a phone that they are proud of, and that keeps selling like hotcakes, they will continue to do what they are doing.