Apple is Robbing People with SSD Upgrade Prices...

[dylanthomas]

@dylanthomas

So you like their products, but want to somehow “change their nasty capitalist ways”. Which basically means for Apple to make cheaper computers and upgrades just for you. Fascinating…

Honestly, I’ve heard that Huawei makes really nice laptops which ape Apple products really well for a fraction of price. Perhaps check there 😏

Weird how you're so personally offended by people suggesting they charge less of a artificial markup on upgrades that you resort to implying people are poor. I'm assuming you're the one person who bought the $700 Mac Pro wheels?

Sorry that I didn't know we weren't allowed to mildly criticize a trillion dollar corporation who makes a big deal about the right to repair and environmental friendliness but doesn't put their money where their mouth is. But luckily you're here to blindly defend them for free, I bet they're very grateful.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

Weird how you're so personally offended by people suggesting they charge less of a artificial markup on upgrades that you resort to implying people are poor. I'm assuming you're the one person who bought the $700 Mac Pro wheels?

Sorry that I didn't know we weren't allowed to mildly criticize a trillion dollar corporation who makes a big deal about the right to repair and environmental friendliness but doesn't put their money where their mouth is. But luckily you're here to blindly defend them for free, I bet they're very grateful.

I’m not offended and Apple doesn’t need defending. I’m amused that people want to somehow influence capitalist company to charge less for their products. I actually find it hilarious. Apple was always boutique upmarket company with high prices, nothing has changed in that regard. This thread will not change anything either.

I don’t know about you, but if I can’t afford something - I buy cheaper product. Nothing to do with being poor or not - just common sense. I can’t afford Ferrari, therefore I buy lovely Volkswagen.

By your logic, I should go to Ferrari dealership, stomp my leg and say “you have to lower the price of your ridiculous overpriced car, because other cars are cheaper”. Buy a cheaper car, simples. 👍

 

[dylanthomas]

I’m not offended and Apple doesn’t need defending. I’m amused that people want to somehow influence capitalist company to charge less for their products. I actually find it hilarious. Apple was always boutique upmarket company with high prices, nothing has changed in that regard. This thread will not change anything either.

I don’t know about you, but if I can’t afford something - I buy cheaper product. Nothing to do with being poor or not - just common sense. I can’t afford Ferrari, therefore I buy lovely Volkswagen.

By your logic, I should go to Ferrari dealership, stomp my leg and say “you have to lower the price of your ridiculous overpriced car, because other cars are cheaper”. Buy a cheaper car, simples. 👍

And yet you're here defending them.

That's also not an accurate analogy at all. It's like going to buy a Ferrari but they put cheap tires on that wear out extremely quickly, but to upgrade the tires to ones that will last you have to buy it through them and they charge way higher than they should because you have no other option.

 

[colinsky]

I don't think of the internal SSD being "storage" these days. Sure, you can buy storage that's lots cheaper, but with Apple Silicon's unified memory, the SSD is more of an operational part of the computer. I have four storage SSDs draped from my m1 Mini and I try to keep as little as possible on the internal SSD so there's plenty of vacant space for swapping.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

And yet you're here defending them.

That's also not an accurate analogy at all. It's like going to buy a Ferrari but they put cheap tires on that wear out extremely quickly, but to upgrade the tires to ones that will last you have to buy it through them and they charge way higher than they should because you have no other option.

I’m defending common sense and practicality 😏

If you ever looked at the prices of any new cars, you’ll notice that they always list the price of basic version. No aircon, no parking sensors, no fancy electronics. All the (one would think basic) options are charged extra and through the nose. What an unusual coincidence with what Apple is doing for last 20 years or so…

Anyway, I’ve had my say, I’ll leave you to your grievances and sorrows for now 😉

 

[dylanthomas]

I’m defending common sense and practicality 😏

If you ever looked at the prices of any new cars, you’ll notice that they always list the price of basic version. No aircon, no parking sensors, no fancy electronics. All the (one would think basic) options are charged extra and through the nose. What an unusual coincidence with what Apple is doing for last 20 years or so…

Anyway, I’ve had my say, I’ll leave you to your grievances and sorrows for now 😉

And here are you making another poor analogy, comparing add-ons like parking sensors with upgrades of essential things like SSDs and RAM. But at least you remained consistently condescending about it.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

And here are you making another poor analogy, comparing add-ons like parking sensors with upgrades of essential things like SSDs and RAM. But at least you remained consistently condescending about it.

I consider parking sensors and aircon essential items, otherwise the car smells and bumps into things. It's not my fault that I fart a lot and can't drive. 😉

They should be added for free because I need them !!! I really feel I am being robbed because the dealer asks me to pay a lot for those. 😤

Or maybe, just maybe, I should have checked what I will get with basic version, then check the price of necessary add-ons and THEN make informed decision whether to buy this particular car or not. Nah, too simple… 🤣

 

[theluggage]

If you ever looked at the prices of any new cars, you’ll notice that they always list the price of basic version. No aircon, no parking sensors, no fancy electronics. All the (one would think basic) options are charged extra and through the nose.

...and if they push it too far (e.g. basic version is badly underpowered without the engine upgrade, competing models have AC as standard, wind-up windows in 2022, floor mats cost $2000) they will get roundly - and rightly - criticised in reviews and online forums.

Doubtless there are BMW fanbois on the car forums telling people that Bugatti charge even more for floor mats, that they are special high-speed floor mats which can't be compared to the £7.99 floor mats from Amazon (yup, stick with that straw man and don't talk about the £30 floor mats that really are just as good) and that if you don't like it you should buy a Kia.

The only thing you can really say more about the luxury car market is that they're the only people who charge more for a set of wheels than Apple.

I'm not sure what your point is - it's OK for Apple to do it because car makers do it? I'll remember that defence if I get caught with my hands in the cookie jar.

Also, Apple have an additional lock-in that car makers don't have: most people don't bat an eyelid at getting into a different brand of car and driving away once they've worked out where the headlight and wiper controls have been hidden. Now, I've used Windows extensively in the past and wouldn't have too much trouble, and I've even tended to stick to cross-platform software - but I'd still have at least one major Mac-only software package that would (a) cost me hundreds of pounds to replace (b) take me hours to re-learn and (c) leave me with a bunch of old files that I couldn't open. So switching back to Windows wouldn't be a free decision for most Mac users - and Apple know that darn well, and exploit it. They don't get a pat on the head and a lollipop for that.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

...and if they push it too far (e.g. basic version is badly underpowered without the engine upgrade, competing models have AC as standard, wind-up windows in 2022, floor mats cost $2000) they will get roundly - and rightly - criticised in reviews and online forums.

Doubtless there are BMW fanbois on the car forums telling people that Bugatti charge even more for floor mats, that they are special high-speed floor mats which can't be compared to the £7.99 floor mats from Amazon (yup, stick with that straw man and don't talk about the £30 floor mats that really are just as good) and that if you don't like it you should buy a Kia.

The only thing you can really say more about the luxury car market is that they're the only people who charge more for a set of wheels than Apple.

I'm not sure what your point is - it's OK for Apple to do it because car makers do it? I'll remember that defence if I get caught with my hands in the cookie jar.

Also, Apple have an additional lock-in that car makers don't have: most people don't bat an eyelid at getting into a different brand of car and driving away once they've worked out where the headlight and wiper controls have been hidden. Now, I've used Windows extensively in the past and wouldn't have too much trouble, and I've even tended to stick to cross-platform software - but I'd still have at least one major Mac-only software package that would (a) cost me hundreds of pounds to replace (b) take me hours to re-learn and (c) leave me with a bunch of old files that I couldn't open. So switching back to Windows wouldn't be a free decision for most Mac users - and Apple know that darn well, and exploit it. They don't get a pat on the head and a lollipop for that.

Thank you for constructive and insightful post.

My point is that this is common practice with upmarket brands and that Apple has been doing it for ages. They set the prices as high as people are willing to pay.

Nothing we do here (and yes, Mac Pro wheels are ridiculously expensive and silly) will change it. I wish Apple products and upgrades were cheaper, but short of having the whole IT business pricing regulated by some government body (which smells like communism to me) nothing else will change. That’s why I said to vote with one’s wallet and choose other products and upgrades if Apple ones are too expensive.

 

[eltoslightfoot]

And yet you're here defending them.

That's also not an accurate analogy at all. It's like going to buy a Ferrari but they put cheap tires on that wear out extremely quickly, but to upgrade the tires to ones that will last you have to buy it through them and they charge way higher than they should because you have no other option.

I have to ask, is your signature sarcasm? I mean:

🥾 Apple Bootlicker 🥵 Hate Unions 😈 99.98% Loyal to  Apple Inc 🍑👄 I would pay Apple MORE if I could 🤑

Yet you talk of others defending Apple?

 

[kpluck]

Dell charges $100 to go from 8 GB to 16 RAM, $100 to go from 512 GB to 1 TB storage, and $200 to go from 1 TB to 2 TB storage, in its consumer laptops.
Apple charges $200 to go from 8 GB to 16 RAM, $200 to go from 512 GB to 1 TB storage, and $400 to go from 1 TB to 2 TB storage, in its consumer laptops.

So Apple is not like the rest of the industry in this key sense when it comes to RAM and storage. Nor do I expect it to be. I accept that I pay more for an Apple product, in order to get the vastly better OS and customer service.

This, so much this.

If paying a premium price for a premium product is "robbing people" there is a lot of unreported crime going on in the world. 😜

-kp

 

[eltoslightfoot]

This, so much this.

If paying a premium price for a premium product is "robbing people" there is a lot of unreported crime going on in the world. 😜

-kp

What’s also interesting is if you look at any other Windows laptop vendor (and you make sure the RAM and SSD speeds and specs are comparable), Dell is the only one that is cheaper. Everyone else is the same or slightly more (reference that youtube video from Maxtech).

And that is okay too. Everyone can get what they want. (I choose Gaming PC with Ryzen and nVidia 3060Ti, M1 MBA 512GB and 16GB (used to save $$) and go with that.

 

[dandeco]

Yeah, I suspect it's because with the newer Apple Silicon Macs, the internal storage works somewhat differently than an average SSD, besides being soldered onto the logic board. So it would be pricier, along with the whole general idea of soldered-on SSDs. Regular SSDs are getting gradually cheaper; these days you can get a good 1-TB SATA SSD for around $100. But Apple's soldered-on SSDs are a different story altogether.

As for the price, this is why when buying an M1 MacBook Air, I got the 512 GB SSD model, figuring that would be enough when on the go and also using external storage solutions (as the late 2009 MacBook it was replacing as my main laptop had a 256 GB SSD), but I did configure it to have 16 GB of unified memory, and that did bring the price up to $1500. Also, should I choose to get a Mac Studio to replace my 2012 i7 Mac Mini, I'd want one with a 1 TB SSD; add that to the base-configuration M1 Max model (with 32 GB of unified memory) and it'd run me up to $2200. Unless they make a new Mac Mini with an M2 Pro chip (to sell alongside the new M2 Mac Mini and replace the higher-end Intel model), then I'd want to configure it with 32 GB of unified memory and a 1 TB SSD; hypothetically the M2 Pro Mini is priced the same as it's Intel predecessor, this would end up costing me around $1500, about as much as I paid for my M1 MacBook Air, but would be perfectly fine for my tastes.

 

[dylanthomas]

I have to ask, is your signature sarcasm? I mean:


Yet you talk of others defending Apple?

You and @AlphaCentauri must not be as intelligent as you think if you can't realize it's satirizing most of the signatures on here.

Or I guess it seems normal for the guy who's clearly 40+ in his profile picture to add emojis at the end of every smug sentence. 😉

I wish Apple products and upgrades were cheaper

Gee that only contradicts every single other post you made critizing people saying the same thing. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

 

[eltoslightfoot]

You and @AlphaCentauri must not be as intelligent as you think if you can't realize it's satirizing most of the signatures on here.

Or I guess it seems normal for the guy who's clearly 40+ in his profile picture to add emojis at the end of every smug sentence. 😉


Gee that only contradicts every single other post you made critizing people saying the same thing. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Well good news there, I definitely do not classify myself as intelligent. But you also left out the part where I ask exactly that question. And I quote, "I have to ask, is your signature sarcasm? I mean..."

Good to know it is. Oh, I forgot to add a single emoji so you can be happy.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

You and @AlphaCentauri must not be as intelligent as you think if you can't realize it's satirizing most of the signatures on here.

Or I guess it seems normal for the guy who's clearly 40+ in his profile picture to add emojis at the end of every smug sentence. 😉


Gee that only contradicts every single other post you made critizing people saying the same thing. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

What I wish for, will never happen. The difference between us is that I’m aware of the fact and do not moan about it for 13 pages like a merry-go-round. And an emoji for you, my friend: 😎

 

[Radiomarko]

I was delighted to buy microscopic capacity cutting edge HDs at high prices for my Apples & Amigas many decades ago, I still am.

Standard advice from the dawn of the connected world is "don't feed the troll", they are still breeding.

I'm near 70 yrs old - here's an emoji for the serial moaner 🙄

 

[hans1972]

Weird how you're so personally offended by people suggesting they charge less of a artificial markup on upgrades that you resort to implying people are poor. I'm assuming you're the one person who bought the $700 Mac Pro wheels?

Sorry that I didn't know we weren't allowed to mildly criticize a trillion dollar corporation who makes a big deal about the right to repair and environmental friendliness but doesn't put their money where their mouth is. But luckily you're here to blindly defend them for free, I bet they're very grateful.

We're offended by people who don't support a free market for non-essential goods and services and in addition markets were there are heavy competition.

You should never complain about a non-essential Apple product is expensive. Just buy something else or don't buy at all.

 

[ForkHandles]

The fact that none of Apples current laptops are SSD upgradable, still ship with a measly 256GB on base configs in 2022, and force 200 dollars for a 250gb upgrade is ridiculous.

1TB drives go for under 100 bucks now, there is no way apple is not getting 1TB chips for over 50 USD. They are literally robbing people with these upgrades.

I would understand a 1TB base config and then charge 200 per extra terabyte. But 200 for an extra 256?? Seriously??

Kingston A400 240GB M.2 2280 SSD | HDD Replacement$27.99$35Kingston Shop - US

Dont understand how more people are not up in arms about Apples storage policy.

The word 'Robbing' does not mean what I think you think it means!

Robbery

1. The act or an instance of unlawfully taking the property of another by the use of violence or intimidation.
2. The act or practice of robbing; a plundering; a pillaging; a taking away by violence, wrong, or oppression; the act of unjustly and forcibly depriving one of anything; specifically, in law, the felonious and forcible taking of the property of another from his person, or in his presence, against his will, by violence or by putting him in fear.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

It’s a modern communism in action: how dare they charge more than others - everyone should be charging the same 🤣

There were also voices about EU or “government” stepping in and “regulating” Apple’s prices - again, communism.

If you can’t afford it - don’t buy it. Problem sorted.

 

[theluggage]

There were also voices about EU or “government” stepping in and “regulating” Apple’s prices - again, communism.

Bit of perspective maybe? “communism” would be the government forcibly taking over all the computer manufacturers and merging them into a single National Computer Collective and ruthlessly silencing anybody who dared to criticise their products - which would soon regress to shoddy, archaic rubbish due to the lack of criticism or competition.

Whereas a truly “free market” would end up with one of the big corporations buying up as many of their competitors as they could and leveraging their market share to ruthlessly suppress the rest, and probably buying up the media outlets as well to silence any negative comments about their products (hmm…) - which would soon regress to shoddy, archaic expensive rubbish due to the lack of criticism or nin-fake competition.

The latter almost happened with the MS/Intel juggernaut during the 80s/90s, but for various governments ”interfering in the free market” with anti-trust laws, enforced browser choice screens etc. Free markets degrade into uncompetitive monopolies just as easily as communist utopias degrade into totalitarian police states. That’s why successful “capitalist” states still have volume upon volume of trade laws.

That said, there has been approximately 1 post here suggesting government intervention in Apple pricing (on environmental grounds - which I think is a bit of a reach, although the invisible hand ain’t gonna look out for the environment when the invisible eye can’t see beyond the next fiscal year). Everybody else is just having a vent.

If there was an argument for intervention it would have to be that low base specs and expensive upgrades is a form of “bait and switch” that disguises the true costs of the goods and unfairly competes with sellers with more “honest” prices. Can’t have a free market if buyers can’t get accurate pricing information (for a more obvious example look at mobile phone tariffs which are a transparent exercise in making it difficult to compare prices).

 

[Satjiv's one click]

That said, there has been approximately 1 post here suggesting government intervention in Apple pricing (on environmental grounds - which I think is a bit of a reach, although the invisible hand ain’t gonna look out for the environment when the invisible eye can’t see beyond the next fiscal year). Everybody else is just having a vent.

If there was an argument for intervention it would have to be that low base specs and expensive upgrades is a form of “bait and switch” that disguises the true costs of the goods and unfairly competes with sellers with more “honest” prices. Can’t have a free market if buyers can’t get accurate pricing information (for a more obvious example look at mobile phone tariffs which are a transparent exercise in making it difficult to compare prices).

Not a reach at all. Apple abuses its BTO policy by purposely making the base models severely crippled. They are creating artificial scarcity rather than making sure the base models don't have any gotchas. It's malicious and deliberate and has nothing to do with them making money fair and square. People buy what they need, they'll make their money anyway if the product is good. In fact they'll make even more because they won't alienate people that don't fall for their BS.

I don't want to be forced into Apple's BTO scheme. I just want proper base models with wider availability because wider availability means better prices. Bargaining is essential in capitalism. Profit and savings come from bargaining. Consumer leverage can be very powerful.

The intervention for environmental concerns is a necessary evil. They make unrepairable computers at least force them to make them properly and not waste resources. Resources that Apple doesn't own. They excavate rare metals that belong to the Earth. Apple gets tasked to produce computers. If they fail at that they need to be regulated as there can not be any real competition and thus the resources get wasted.

 

[AlphaCentauri]

Not a reach at all. Apple abuses its BTO policy by purposely making the base models severely crippled. They are creating artificial scarcity rather than making sure the base models don't have any gotchas. It's malicious and deliberate and has nothing to do with them making money fair and square. People buy what they need, they'll make their money anyway if the product is good. In fact they'll make even more because they won't alienate people that don't fall for their BS.

I don't want to be forced into Apple's BTO scheme. I just want proper base models with wider availability because wider availability means better prices. Bargaining is essential in capitalism. Profit and savings come from bargaining. Consumer leverage can be very powerful.

The intervention for environmental concerns is a necessary evil. They make unrepairable computers at least force them to make them properly and not waste resources. Resources that Apple doesn't own. They excavate rare metals that belong to the Earth. Apple gets tasked to produce computers. If they fail at that they need to be regulated as there can not be any real competition and thus the resources get wasted.

So basically to force them to provide computers configured the way you think is right at the price you are ready to pay?

And you need legislation at the government level for that?

 

[Boyd01]

Locking this thread, it has really run its course and it's time to move on....