Exactly my observation; Apple is looking to sell an aesthetically pleasing, high margin product, not the best notebook it can produce, happily sacrificing usability, features and stability for the Wow factor...
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Are MacBook Pros Obsolete?
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Exactly my observation; Apple is looking to sell an aesthetically pleasing, high margin product, not the best notebook it can produce, happily sacrificing usability, features and stability for the Wow factor...
Q-6
And have the GPU performance cut in half? Not sure that users will appreciate it...
In 2013/14/15, I always felt the MacBooks were well ahead of the game and were worth the slight price premium - and it wasn’t just “well it has MacOS”. Now that premium has become much greater, but the former no longer holds true
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But you have to admit that the:
- Announcement of a new modular Mac Pro
- Announcement of the iMac Pro
- Modernization of the file system with an actual upgrade path that allows Users to not have to nuke & pave and to continue to use 32 bit Apps (this is quite an accomplishment that few are giving Apple credit for - an in-place filesystem update is IMO hugely impressive.)
- Fast addressing of security/graphical glitches
- Fast addressing of battery issues of macOS Sierra (even though they should not have happened in the first place)
- Support of eGPUs/VR dev kit after years of remaining silent on the issue
- Willingness to upgrade Skylake to Kaby Lake at such a fast pace
- Revamping of the retina MacBook's keyboard to a much more user-friendly design
- Making rapid changes to the MacBook Pro keyboard after shortcomings were found
In 2013/14/15, I always felt the MacBooks were well ahead of the game to the competitors and were worth the slight price premium - and it wasn’t just “well it has MacOS”. Now that premium has become much greater, but the former no longer holds true
Personally I vote with my $$$$ no longer using Apple professionally, as the Mac is fast becoming a joke. For revenue delivering hardware I expect more than just slick designs. Both on the hardware & software side Apple simply comes up lacking, nor am I alone with this conclusion...
Q-6
But you have to admit that the:
All show a revived commitment to the Mac platform and all Mac Users ranging from the average User to the prosumer to the "professional user". I dont agree with every decision Apple makes, and, like yourself, I would have preferred the MacBook Pro keep one legacy USB port and microSD card (even if that came at an expense of size.) I'd also like to see non-touchbar options in the 15-inch and more powerful 13-inch size (even though I've taken a recent liking to the TB, personally, as I realize it doesn't benefit everyone.) But I have no control over Apple's decisions here. And truthfully, the most recent MacBook I've purchased has had as good of quality control & operational predictability/reliability as any Apple product I've ever purchased, with what I consider to be significant improvements over the prior generation. So I don't think it's all doom & gloom
- Announcement of a new modular Mac Pro
- Announcement of the iMac Pro
- Modernization of the file system with an actual upgrade path that allows Users to not have to nuke & pave and to continue to use 32 bit Apps (this is quite an accomplishment that few are giving Apple credit for - an in-place filesystem update is IMO hugely impressive.)
- Fast addressing of security/graphical glitches
- Fast addressing of battery issues of macOS Sierra (even though they should not have happened in the first place)
- Support of eGPUs/VR dev kit after years of remaining silent on the issue
- Willingness to upgrade Skylake to Kaby Lake at such a fast pace
- Revamping of the retina MacBook's keyboard to a much more user-friendly design
- Making rapid changes to the MacBook Pro keyboard after shortcomings were found
Personally I believe that Apple is finally reacting to the highly negative tech press and the hostility of it's professional users, with the usual accompanying stage play. Apple desperately seeks the "halo effect" professional users bring, yet it churns out ever more stylised consumer based hardware. On the software side Apple needs to get beyond patches & fixes, also needing to focus on stability & productivity not solely social media. QC also concerns given the upsurge in keyboard issues.
Time will tell if Apple delivers on the upcoming hardware, and they need to do a lot more to regain the trust it's lost. As Apple could all too conveniently decide to forget about the Mac again once the heat is off, and that's a real concern...
Bottom line is Apple is a phone company, that has a healthy consumer based computer business, resultantly the Mac will never be a the forefront of Apple's focus, well unless the tech press lambast it once again
On a more positive note it's encouraging that Apple is at least doing something, equally Apple will solidify it's locked down, locked in approach so those hoping for user upgradability are highly likely to be disappointed.For me the reduced stability of the OS and the lacklustre hardware offerings have directly resulted in ceasing to use the Mac professionally. Dealing with application and OS crashes gets old fast, the inability to connect to external display devices consistently a joke, thx to the near mandatory use of dongles.
Q-6
Apple builds the best personal computers in the world. Nothing else compares - at any budget.
Get back to me when any other company can build a machine that won't fall apart due to lousy construction. Apple's build quality is second to none, and has been since the introduction of the unibody.
Get back to me when anyone else can deliver real world battery life figures comparable with the Mac, lower powered i5 7200U machines will last as long when they're idle, but open up even something as novel as Word and it'll drain away like nothing normal.
Get back to me when these 'cheaper and more powerful' Windows machines are able to finally start up and be ready to go as quick as my MBP 13" 2017 model... Yes.. this is what matters to 99% of people in the real world. And also, when these machines with almost double the power, on the latest gen processors can finally export quicker real world tests..
Get back to me when HP or Dell ever releases a new model and can actually explain 1) why they've made certain decisions in aid of the user. 2) what they've done to address issues of older models. 3) they express the slightest pride in what they produce... seriously, some of even their premium products today.. if the people who designed them used them for more than 45 minutes they'd be kicking themselves. Say what you want about the cheesy Jony Ive white background marketing videos, but any damn design issue in any Mac I've ever used was addressed by the next model. The HP Spectre still has hinges that'll barely last a year even at Mac+ prices.
Get back to me when Windows ditches it's Neanderthal technical platform dating back from the 90s. Apple's new filesystem is evidence that they're thinking forward and actually adapting the system for the hardware of the future. What's that? Your 2009 MacBook Pro is no longer supported? Waaah, waahhh "PLANNED OBSOLESCENCE" wahhh.. It's been 8 years. Why don't you see how your 2009 Windows Vista laptop is holding up? Oh yeah, it was discontinued years ago. Quite a few years ago. Same applies to your 2012 Samsung Galaxy... Probably lost support in 2013. The iPhone 5, 5 years of support. Second to none in the industry.
Get back to me when OEM's of Windows machines could provide even the slightest hint about caring about repairing peoples machines. Seriously, though all OEM's today constrict part sales to try improve sales of new machines at least Apple actually offers an in-store repair system and authorised sourcing of parts.
In conclusion: Apple's Hardware & Software: Second. To. None.
Sorry fans of Windows, though Microsoft and <insert machine maker here> has long forgotten about your specific machine and concerns about privacy and what have you.. I haven't. Here's a virtual tissue. And I'll gladly be reading through any responses but I won't be replying to you because I think I've clearly made my contribution to the topic of 'Are Macs Obsolete?"
[doublepost=1508108819][/doublepost]Little challenge, can anyone here show me a Windows laptop starting quicker, and more reliably than this old, outdated June 2017 Kaby Lake MacBook Pro?
View My Video
Get back to me when any other company can build a machine that won't fall apart due to lousy construction. Apple's build quality is second to none, and has been since the introduction of the unibody.
Get back to me when anyone else can deliver real world battery life figures comparable with the Mac, lower powered i5 7200U machines will last as long when they're idle, but open up even something as novel as Word and it'll drain away like nothing normal.
Get back to me when these 'cheaper and more powerful' Windows machines are able to finally start up and be ready to go as quick as my MBP 13" 2017 model... Yes.. this is what matters to 99% of people in the real world. And also, when these machines with almost double the power, on the latest gen processors can finally export quicker real world tests..
Get back to me when HP or Dell ever releases a new model and can actually explain 1) why they've made certain decisions in aid of the user. 2) what they've done to address issues of older models. 3) they express the slightest pride in what they produce... seriously, some of even their premium products today.. if the people who designed them used them for more than 45 minutes they'd be kicking themselves. Say what you want about the cheesy Jony Ive white background marketing videos, but any damn design issue in any Mac I've ever used was addressed by the next model. The HP Spectre still has hinges that'll barely last a year even at Mac+ prices.
Get back to me when Windows ditches it's Neanderthal technical platform dating back from the 90s. Apple's new filesystem is evidence that they're thinking forward and actually adapting the system for the hardware of the future. What's that? Your 2009 MacBook Pro is no longer supported? Waaah, waahhh "PLANNED OBSOLESCENCE" wahhh.. It's been 8 years. Why don't you see how your 2009 Windows Vista laptop is holding up? Oh yeah, it was discontinued years ago. Quite a few years ago. Same applies to your 2012 Samsung Galaxy... Probably lost support in 2013. The iPhone 5, 5 years of support. Second to none in the industry.
Get back to me when OEM's of Windows machines could provide even the slightest hint about caring about repairing peoples machines. Seriously, though all OEM's today constrict part sales to try improve sales of new machines at least Apple actually offers an in-store repair system and authorised sourcing of parts.
In conclusion: Apple's Hardware & Software: Second. To. None.
Sorry fans of Windows, though Microsoft and <insert machine maker here> has long forgotten about your specific machine and concerns about privacy and what have you.. I haven't. Here's a virtual tissue. And I'll gladly be reading through any responses but I won't be replying to you because I think I've clearly made my contribution to the topic of 'Are Macs Obsolete?"
[doublepost=1508108819][/doublepost]Little challenge, can anyone here show me a Windows laptop starting quicker, and more reliably than this old, outdated June 2017 Kaby Lake MacBook Pro?
View My Video
Amen on the trackpad..
I just sold my 2015 15" MBP and am upgrading to the 2017 15".. I actually bought a Dell XPS 15" to see if I could switch. I'm actually okay using Windows 10 since I use bootcamp quite regularly. However, that trackpad.. Nothing can compare to the MacBook trackpad!
When I bought my early 2011 MBP 15, it was the best laptop on the market. Nothing came close in terms of the overall package. To this day, the best laptop I ever owned.
When I bought my 2015 MBP 15, it was fine. Took most of the positives of the 2011 MBP and improved upon them, but the PC laptop market has come a lot closer.
I bought the 2017 MBP 15 not long ago. I enjoy the new keyboard unlike many others, after an adjustment period, and the build quality is great. However, in no way is this a perfect laptop in the way that the 2011 was. Especially considering the price, there are so many other choices out there. The other difference is, in 2011 Windows Vista/7 was a far cry compared to the MacOS. Right now, Windows 10 is a viable alternative.
You can be an Apple fanboy, apologist, whatever. I've been with Apple since Apple II days. The fact is, Apple used to be miles ahead of everyone. Now it's just another player. Unless something changes, this is probably the last time I'm spending $3k on a Mac laptop. I've already crossed over to Windows 10 for my heavy-duty ML and development, and I'm not the only one - I see this all around me in my industry and company. Apple is loosing pro users.
Maybe it doesn't matter, as the future is in iPad Pro, as Tim is trying so hard to have us convinced. From pure profit and short-term vision perspectives, I'm sure Apple knows what they are doing - they are no longer a computer company, and most of their profit is from iPhone and Apple Music. That's great, so please stop pretending that you care about the Mac, and just kill it. Use some of that special courage.
When I bought my 2015 MBP 15, it was fine. Took most of the positives of the 2011 MBP and improved upon them, but the PC laptop market has come a lot closer.
I bought the 2017 MBP 15 not long ago. I enjoy the new keyboard unlike many others, after an adjustment period, and the build quality is great. However, in no way is this a perfect laptop in the way that the 2011 was. Especially considering the price, there are so many other choices out there. The other difference is, in 2011 Windows Vista/7 was a far cry compared to the MacOS. Right now, Windows 10 is a viable alternative.
You can be an Apple fanboy, apologist, whatever. I've been with Apple since Apple II days. The fact is, Apple used to be miles ahead of everyone. Now it's just another player. Unless something changes, this is probably the last time I'm spending $3k on a Mac laptop. I've already crossed over to Windows 10 for my heavy-duty ML and development, and I'm not the only one - I see this all around me in my industry and company. Apple is loosing pro users.
Maybe it doesn't matter, as the future is in iPad Pro, as Tim is trying so hard to have us convinced. From pure profit and short-term vision perspectives, I'm sure Apple knows what they are doing - they are no longer a computer company, and most of their profit is from iPhone and Apple Music. That's great, so please stop pretending that you care about the Mac, and just kill it. Use some of that special courage.
Yes, Macbook Pro's are obsolete!
They have some of the fastest ssd's on the market.
Bar none the best track pad.
One of the best screens to ever be introduced to a portable device.
The best operating system.
The best design while also maintaining incredible durability.
I get +11 hours of battery life on my nTB.
The best support of any manufacturer.
These computers last FOREVER.
They support the best speakers on the market.
They're very, very, fast machines.
And you can configure one however you want.
Please, for the love of god tell me how these machines are obsolete?
you guys are a bunch of spoiled babies.
tell me why you're on a mac forum and not a dell forum or any other forum for laptops...
ohhhh thats right, because these computers are amazing pieces of machinery!!!
Could there be improvements? YES. Are there strategies employed by apple to upsell you and to squeeze every last dollar out of you? YES. It's because comparatively speaking, they sell wonderful devices. How bout you stop complaining or buy an XPS!
You won't because the overall package isn't as enticing, and Apple knows that.
They have some of the fastest ssd's on the market.
Bar none the best track pad.
One of the best screens to ever be introduced to a portable device.
The best operating system.
The best design while also maintaining incredible durability.
I get +11 hours of battery life on my nTB.
The best support of any manufacturer.
These computers last FOREVER.
They support the best speakers on the market.
They're very, very, fast machines.
And you can configure one however you want.
Please, for the love of god tell me how these machines are obsolete?
you guys are a bunch of spoiled babies.
tell me why you're on a mac forum and not a dell forum or any other forum for laptops...
ohhhh thats right, because these computers are amazing pieces of machinery!!!
Could there be improvements? YES. Are there strategies employed by apple to upsell you and to squeeze every last dollar out of you? YES. It's because comparatively speaking, they sell wonderful devices. How bout you stop complaining or buy an XPS!
You won't because the overall package isn't as enticing, and Apple knows that.
Point it out all you like, my 2011 13" is still perfectly suited for the business & leisure purposes I put it to. Neither of those machines is needed by me so both, and their comparison, is irrelevant.
Playing Top Trumps with machine specs is just that, a playground game, it has little to do with the real world.
Think about it, if only the fastest/biggest/latest machine was acceptable to everyone's use cases, we would all have that machine...and no doubt live in the same house design, drive the same car model...not sure why some people struggle to comprehend that different computers fit different users use cases in a similar way.
No. You don't seem to understand what the word means. Differentials in specs and pricing are not the same thing as obsolete. Stop spec sheet racing and, instead, buy whatever solution works best for you.
Exactly. Apple engineers prefer to ship machines with certain balance of CPU and GPU power instead of instantly jumping on board when a new CPU with cut-down GPU core is released. So indeed, Apple seems to prioritise brains here.