AT&T's iPhone pricing plans.

[ikarus79m]

Actually, it does. If I pay X dollars for a service, and an identical customer pays half that for the exact same service, a case could be made for antitrust.

I really don't think you could make a case. When I first signed up with T-Mobile, they had a special, 39.99 a month for 1000 minutes, but only for new subscribers. If you already had a T-Mobile plan you were out of luck.

So I don't see any reason, why AT&T couldn't offer a special iPhone plan for new customers. None at all. That's the risk of signing a 2 year contract. It's a give and take.

That's the reason why I would not sign up with AT&T until the iPhone is out and all the details are clear. I want to be able to participate in whatever "get new customers" program they might offer.

And again, i think this article got it right. I think AT&T might be up to something....

 

[MovieCutter]

Actually, it does. If I pay X dollars for a service, and an identical customer pays half that for the exact same service, a case could be made for antitrust.

You're full of crap, the airlines do this ALL the time. Airline tickets for the SAME flight can range over hundreds of dollars.

 

[sportsfanMAW]

Actually, it does. If I pay X dollars for a service, and an identical customer pays half that for the exact same service, a case could be made for antitrust. It's not legal to monopolize a service for a particular product by vastly undercutting the price of other available service providers. If they can't legitimately match that price without losing money, then a case could be made.

If it costs $50 to serve another PDA handheld with internet service, having another handheld recieving the same data service for only $20 could absolutely be considered illegal.

Just because you bought the expensive cable box doesn't mean your cable is cheaper, does it? Is TiVo cheaper if you get the newer one? nope. Because a) it makes terrible business sense and b) it's not legal to distinguish between customers like that.

But my service costs in the range you posted, for unlimited data, 1500 text messages, and 900 phone minutes, so I guess I shouldn't complain all that much. Discounts are your friend.

Haha no way man, you signed a contract saying you would pay that for 2 yrs. If you want to leave ur contract and get an iphone contract for that price. It's not like they're restricting you to stay with that plan.

 

[xfiftyfour]

There aren't any rebates on the iPhone, so throw those out of the picture...If you walk into a cingular store today and try to buy an 8525, you will walk out of the store having paid $450 for it (2 yr contract price). The rebates aren't instant deductions, it takes 180 days before you're generally eligible.

Why throw rebates out of the picture? I KNOW the iPhone won't have any - that's my point exactly. AT&T offers discounts on the other phones, which, from what we know now, they won't be able to do for the iPhone. That's a valid point, and should be considered when discussing the potential pricing of accompanying plans.

Let's all just be honest here. There isn't 1.2 million Apple fanboys willing to dish out $500 or $600 for the phone and then $100+ a month for a plan. It simply won't happen. Therefore, for Cingular to come out successful and Apple to meet their 1% goal, they're going to have to attract some of those Palm/Blackberry users. How are they going to do this? They either have to offer rebates/discounts alongside contracts to bring the price down to be comparable to those other PDA phones, or they have to offer a nice plan package.

 

[feelthefire]

Let's all just be honest here. There isn't 1.2 million Apple fanboys willing to dish out $500 or $600 for the phone and then $100+ a month for a plan. It simply won't happen. Therefore, for Cingular to come out successful and Apple to meet their 1% goal, they're going to have to attract some of those Palm/Blackberry users. How are they going to do this? They either have to offer rebates/discounts alongside contracts to bring the price down to be comparable to those other PDA phones, or they have to offer a nice plan package.

well, they could have started by adding some MS office apps...or, come to think of it, any productivity tools at all...

this thing isn't a business tool. it doesn't work with corporate email, it doesn't sync with any windows based programs, you can't expand its services since it's locked to third party applications.

It is, at best, a fancy toy for people who want to browse the internet and listen to music. But as a business tool? not something I'd even attempt to use.

with the exception of the iPod feature, my blackberry can do all the same things, and it was a lot cheaper, and it's expandable.

 

[neven]

this thing isn't a business tool. it doesn't work with corporate email, it doesn't sync with any windows based programs, you can't expand its services since it's locked to third party applications.

I love the assumption of people who work in Microsoft-based offices that the only way to do business is the Microsoft (plus Dockers) way. Have you ever been to a music or video studio, a design firm, a web startup, a small store...? They have no need of "corporate email", or Windows, or even Excel.

I've worked in a completely Microsoft-centric office for years, and I don't remember ever having to actually use any Office program on a PDA/phone. Email and IM, certainly, but working in Excel or PowerPoint on a 3" screen? You gotta be kidding me.

If it makes phone calls, manages my calendar, lets me email and IM, and browses the web comfortably, it's a business tool. That it also does that and more in a fun, easy way is a plus since I prefer my work to be easy and fun.

 

[nutmac]

Funny, I just bought a blackberry pearl and an 8525 from cingular and they will not sell you the 8525 without a data plan. The blackberry, well, they'll let you, but they don't give you the rebates. Considering the 8525 is the closest thing they currently have to the iPhone, I can't imagine how that would be different.

I am not saying you are wrong, because my friends have experienced the same. But contrary to what AT&T reps say, you are not required to get data plan with PDA/smartphone/Blackberry phones. Some of the mail-in-rebates do require data plan, however (but you can always choose to not redeem the rebate and opt out of the data plan). Many of my friends and colleagues have Blackberry and Nokia smartphones from Cingular/AT&T without data plan. Perhaps AT&T will make an exception with iPhone, but I certainly hope not.

I live about 10 miles away from Apple HQ and a large percentage of areas within 20 mile radius is covered with free WiFi hot spots. Even outside this radius, many cafes and hotels offer free WiFi -- AT&T's data plan is not at all necessary for me. It's simply unethical for AT&T to force shove porky EDGE service with iPhone when some free WiFi hot spots exceed 1 Mbps (e.g., Google WiFi which covers large percentage of Mountain View).

 

[zap2]

it doesn't sync with any windows based programs, .

iTunes?!

with the exception of the iPod feature, my blackberry can do all the same things, and it was a lot cheaper, and it's expandable.

Your Blackberry has multitouch screen? Thats a HUGE part of the iPhone...the internet on the iPhone is will far better then anthing Blackberry has...

 

[feelthefire]

I love the assumption of people who work in Microsoft-based offices that the only way to do business is the Microsoft (plus Dockers) way. Have you ever been to a music or video studio, a design firm, a web startup, a small store...? They have no need of "corporate email", or Windows, or even Excel.

I've worked in a completely Microsoft-centric office for years, and I don't remember ever having to actually use any Office program on a PDA/phone. Email and IM, certainly, but working in Excel or PowerPoint on a 3" screen? You gotta be kidding me.

If it makes phone calls, manages my calendar, lets me email and IM, and browses the web comfortably, it's a business tool. That it also does that and more in a fun, easy way is a plus since I prefer my work to be easy and fun.

The vast majority of smartphone users are CORPORATE users w/ blackberry enterprise, good messaging, etc. They're not freelancers doing design work, because they don't sit in meetings and take conference calls and constantly wander around large corporate offices. That's what smartphones were originally for and the vast majority of contracts are with corporations or corporate users.

So if they want to target that, it at the very least needs to accept outlook/groupwise/exchange push email and work with basic productivity applications. It just doesn't make sense as a CORPORATE business tool otherwise.

But it's going to be a hard sell on that front anyway, as corporations aren't really keen to stick primarily entertainment devices in the hands of their employees.

 

[neven]

The vast majority of smartphone users are CORPORATE users w/ blackberry enterprise (...)

So if they want to target that, it at the very least needs to accept outlook/groupwise/exchange push email and work with basic productivity applications.

They don't want to target them - Apple will instead change the enlightened American gadget consumer's idea of what to expect from their phone.

That aside, I believe that Exchange functionality has been confirmed, and I have yet to run into a Blackberry user who uses much more than email, IM, and the web on their phone.

 

[nutmac]

They don't want to target them - Apple will instead change the enlightened American gadget consumer's idea of what to expect from their phone.

That aside, I believe that Exchange functionality has been confirmed, and I have yet to run into a Blackberry user who uses much more than email, IM, and the web on their phone.

Exactly. Similar to Macs not trying to be the best computer for running Microsoft Office or video games, iPhone is going after different market. Initially, that market is affluent folks looking for stylish phone with equally sharp user interface to match. Thinking that market isn't big enough? I am willing to bet that on the launch date, lines will form outside many of AT&T and Apple stores.

In time, iPhone will become more mature, more versatile, and most importantly, cheaper.

 

[feelthefire]

Initially, that market is affluent folks looking for stylish phone with equally sharp user interface to match.

That's a pretty niche market- the people who have to have the latest, greatest thing and can afford to pay for it. In terms of the real cell phone market, the vast majority own the phones that are free after contract. Lines will form, but they will only be technophiles and apple fans. It's too much device for the average consumer market, and the price is way too high. So this will be their niche market until they can find a way to bring the cost down. $499 AFTER carrier subsidy? That's an insane price. And yes, it is AFTER ATT pays a subsidy on the phone, as Jobs stated in the keynote.

 

[MovieCutter]

$499 AFTER carrier subsidy? That's an insane price. And yes, it is AFTER ATT pays a subsidy on the phone, as Jobs stated in the keynote.

Where in his keynote does he say ANYTHING about a subsidy...do you normally pull this stuff out of your ass?

He said "What should we price this thing at? Well, for a 4GB model, we're gonna price it at the same $499...no premium whatsoever. And we're gonna have an 8GB model at just $599."

Now when Apple says they're going to sell something at $499/599, I expect to pay $499/599 whether I'm in contract or not. But we'll see what happens. My guess is Apple has ATT in a headlock on this one.

 

[nutmac]

Where in his keynote does he say ANYTHING about a subsidy...do you normally pull this stuff out of your ass?

He said "What should we price this thing at? Well, for a 4GB model, we're gonna price it at the same $499...no premium whatsoever. And we're gonna have an 8GB model at just $599."

Now when Apple says they're going to sell something at $499/599, I expect to pay $499/599 whether I'm in contract or not. But we'll see what happens. My guess is Apple has ATT in a headlock on this one.

It seems feelthefire is pulling random tidbits to keep his argument going. No one is saying $499 for 4 GB iPhone is cheap. No one is saying iPhone is the best phone for opening Word documents and Excel spreadsheets nor exchanging emails with Microsoft Exchange or Blackberry. Then again, no other phones on the market have visual voice mail and Yahoo!'s free push email either.

Here are the facts. iPhone's initial prices ($499 for 4 GB and $599 for 8 GB) are before any sort of AT&T subsidy or mail-in-rebate. AT&T may not offer any subsidy or mail-in-rebate (especially initially), but eventually it could, especially mail-in-rebates it currently offers to many phones for adding optional data plan. (Not a single phone on AT&T's lineup has ever required data plan.)

Although iPhone is missing few high-end features (most notably, GPS and UMTS/HSDPA), it has features many other phones do not have, such as 320x480 touch screen, WiFi, 4 to 8 GB storage, spiffy UI and applications, rich web browser, and rich email client. For some, these features and stylish design, along with "built-in next generation iPod nano", are more than enough to validate $499 starting price.

 

[feelthefire]

Where in his keynote does he say ANYTHING about a subsidy...do you normally pull this stuff out of your ass?

He said "What should we price this thing at? Well, for a 4GB model, we're gonna price it at the same $499...no premium whatsoever. And we're gonna have an 8GB model at just $599."

Now when Apple says they're going to sell something at $499/599, I expect to pay $499/599 whether I'm in contract or not. But we'll see what happens. My guess is Apple has ATT in a headlock on this one.

It says right on the slide behind him "2 year contract" which indicates the price is AFTER subsidy. There would be no reason to sign a 2 year contract (and it would be to cingular's benefit to sell more of these things by not requiring a NEW 2 year contract) but the only reason it would be is to recoup a subsidy.

I bet you anything the real retail price of these things is $699/$799 and I can in fact confirm that with an apple director if it will really make you that much happier.

 

[JNB]

It says right on the slide behind him "2 year contract" which indicates the price is AFTER subsidy. There would be no reason to sign a 2 year contract (and it would be to cingular's benefit to sell more of these things by not requiring a NEW 2 year contract) but the only reason it would be is to recoup a subsidy.

I'm not stating that there isn't one, but I fail to see how the "2-year contract" slide is positive evidence of any subsidy. To date, nobody has stated or proven conclusively, either on this forum or by statements made by either Apple or AT&T that the price of the iPhone is anything other than $499/$599, 2-year contract (new or extended, take your pick), no subsidies.

If, however, they can purchase one through Apple or AT&T at a different price and without a contract, they should feel free to do so, and post both their receipt and month-to-month service agreement as indisputable proof.

 

[zap2]

and it would be to cingular's benefit to sell more of these things by not requiring a NEW 2 year contract)\

Why AT+T isn't making $ off the phone...their making it off the 2 year contract..why would they let people get the coolest phone, for nothing in return(mins the contact, which they already signed)

I bet you anything the real retail price of these things is $699/$799 and I can in fact confirm that with an apple director if it will really make you that much happier.

Do it.....but I really doubt "An Apple director" knows anything offical...if they did, the public would know too.

And I don't care what you'd bet that the price of the phones are 700-800...their not. Did u just make those prices up, or do you have a source for them?

 

[MovieCutter]

I bet you anything the real retail price of these things is $699/$799 and I can in fact confirm that with an apple director if it will really make you that much happier.

I'm still calling bullsh**. And yes, it REALLY would make me that much happier if you can in fact confirm that with an "apple director". Let's hear it.

As far as the slide behind him, that indicated NOTHING. The price is $499/$599, the only thing the 2 year contract gets you is the ABILITY to buy the iPhone. They are requiring a 2 year contract just to get your hands on the thing. The price stays the same.