Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.

Scepticalscribe

macrumors Haswell
Jul 29, 2008
65,199
47,583
In a coffee shop.
I remember the F100 well, and the F90s that preceded it. Great cameras.

This is just to show you how out of shape the Leica M now is:

Nikon F100 weight: 879g
Leica M6 weight: 560g
Leica M240 weight: 677g

Just for comparison, Fuji X100t (including lens, obviously!): 440g

It's dimensions have also increased. I think these are weights with batteries etc. Of course there is lens weight to be added too (except for the Fuji; I included the Fuji because it's a very popular choice for those who want a rangefinder style digital camera - though it's not actually a rangefinder, and has a fixed lens).

Interesting comparisons, and thanks for posting them.

I really liked the F100, but I did find it rather heavy to lug around if I was walking a city centre for an entire day; it took terrific photographs, and was a wonderful - and forgiving - camera, but physically - I did feel its weight after a while.

Re the M6, - leaving aside the Summilux lenses, (I have two, the 35mm and the 50mm, which are a pleasure to use), I love the weight, the size, the solidity, and the ergonomics; the thing is a pleasure to hold. It also sits - extremely comfortably - around my neck, and is very nicely balanced.

When my F100 was feloniously removed from my suitcase after several delayed flights, and a very delayed return of my suitcase - en route back after leave while I was working abroad some years ago, I had a choice of going digital or going retro, as I had always wanted to try out Leica.

Anyway, I went the retro route, deciding to defer any sort of switch to digital, as - at the time, digital SLRs were monstrous door-stopppers, and I didn't know the first thing about them, and - not least - the standard of picture taken by digital cameras still fell quite a bit short of what a good film camera could do.

So, - after some time - I bought a M6 and have slowly added a few lenses, enjoying the whole process.

The irony is that time expands as well as contracts. While I have some stunning lenses - and they are superb for low light - and also can obtain very good quality film (the rubbish that was so readily available 20 years ago has all but disappeared and the only film available nowadays is more or less of professional standard), it is becoming an increasing challenge 1) to find places which will develop the film for me, and 2) to manage to get that done in less than a week.

I won't say that it makes me nostalgic for the old 'One-Hour' photo turnarounds - I never availed of them, but to be able to develop film in a time of faster than a week would sometimes be rather nice.

 

MacCruiskeen

macrumors 6502
Nov 9, 2011
321
5
Just for comparison, Fuji X100t (including lens, obviously!): 440g

I included the Fuji because it's a very popular choice for those who want a rangefinder style digital camera - though it's not actually a rangefinder, and has a fixed lens).

I wonder if the Fuji would hold up to 30 years of use by Garry Winograd. Do you think Robert Capa would have chosen to hop off the back of a troop carrier on D Day with one? I'm not especially a Leica fanboy (mostly a Mamiya guy these days) but there's more to a camera than weight spec.
 

Attonine

macrumors 6502a
Feb 15, 2006
744
58
Kent. UK
I wonder if the Fuji would hold up to 30 years of use by Garry Winograd. Do you think Robert Capa would have chosen to hop off the back of a troop carrier on D Day with one? I'm not especially a Leica fanboy (mostly a Mamiya guy these days) but there's more to a camera than weight spec.

Exactly. And you can see the weight spec was in response to a specific post above, and I have also mentioned issues regarding low light photography and the digital M cameras in response to another poster who said the M (presumably a digital version M) is "exceptional" - which clearly it is not.

Who knows what Capa et al would have gone for if digital had been around in their time. He certainly wouldn't have been able to do his D-Day work with the current M240 (or Fuji) that's for sure - the water would have killed the cameras before he even got a chance to take a shot, if they didn't lock up anyway of course!!!! I imagine very few of todays digital cameras will be in existence in 30 years time, a few may make it to museums, the rest to the landfill I'd imagine.
 

ChrisA

macrumors G5
Jan 5, 2006
12,919
2,173
Redondo Beach, California
The vast majority of my photography is in very dark places where using a tripod or flash isn't an option.

I currently have a Sony RX100 which is ok in low light, but does anyone know of or have any advice on a truly exceptional low light camera?

You say "best" as in you don't have a budget. Look at getting the largest sensor you can get and a lens that opens up to f/1.4

But if you don't have a budget why got with 35mm size SLR. Medium format can give you an even larger format and also the sensor back is interchangeable so you can just keep upgrading as the technology improves by changing out the back.

OK if staying in the 35mm SLR world you really need to pick a brand and stay with it. If one is best at low light today then the other will be better tomorrow. Just go "full frame" and shoot with an f/1.4 lens.
 

Attonine

macrumors 6502a
Feb 15, 2006
744
58
Kent. UK
You say "best" as in you don't have a budget. Look at getting the largest sensor you can get and a lens that opens up to f/1.4

But if you don't have a budget why got with 35mm size SLR. Medium format can give you an even larger format and also the sensor back is interchangeable so you can just keep upgrading as the technology improves by changing out the back.

OK if staying in the 35mm SLR world you really need to pick a brand and stay with it. If one is best at low light today then the other will be better tomorrow. Just go "full frame" and shoot with an f/1.4 lens.

Nowadays, do you really need a 1.4 lens for low light work? High ISO has got so good on modern cameras you can almost shoot in pitch darkness and still get a clean file. The necessity for 1.4 apertures is really now for artistic purposes rather than light gathering.
 

Mildredop

macrumors 68020
Original poster
Oct 14, 2013
2,478
1,510
I didn't think anyone had actually replied to this thread.

You're all suggesting SLRs and even medium format. I thought my mention of the Sony RX100 would have been enough but clearly I wasn't clear - I'm looking for a compact camera. SLRs are just to bulky.
 

Attonine

macrumors 6502a
Feb 15, 2006
744
58
Kent. UK
I didn't think anyone had actually replied to this thread.

You're all suggesting SLRs and even medium format. I thought my mention of the Sony RX100 would have been enough but clearly I wasn't clear - I'm looking for a compact camera. SLRs are just to bulky.

Your question has been answered; Sony A7, Nikon Df, D4 etc. Remember you asked for a truly exceptional low light camera.

For a truly exceptional low light COMPACT camera, are you prepared to go for a system camera, something Like m4/3, or do you want a true, all in one compact?
 

Meister

Suspended
Oct 10, 2013
5,456
4,310
I didn't think anyone had actually replied to this thread.

You're all suggesting SLRs and even medium format. I thought my mention of the Sony RX100 would have been enough but clearly I wasn't clear - I'm looking for a compact camera. SLRs are just to bulky.
I don't think anyone suggested medium format.
The larger the sensor, the better the lowlight perfomance, the bigger the camera and lens.
 

paolo-

macrumors 6502a
Aug 24, 2008
831
1
I didn't think anyone had actually replied to this thread.

You're all suggesting SLRs and even medium format. I thought my mention of the Sony RX100 would have been enough but clearly I wasn't clear - I'm looking for a compact camera. SLRs are just to bulky.

In terms of compact zoom cameras, the RX100 is among the top contenders for low light. The fixed lens Fuji x100t and Sony rx1 (second one being very expensive) would perform better in low light but are slightly larger. MILC cameras like micro 4/3, Sony e-mount (a6000), and Fuji X-e2 are fairly small and would also perform better in low light. The Sony a7s is arguably the best low-light performing camera but is a bit larger, though still smaller than a DSLR.
 

kenoh

macrumors 604
Jul 18, 2008
6,507
10,850
Glasgow, UK
I got to play with an A7s in Dixon's at Heathrow tonight. Popped my adapted 35mm Summilux on it and tried some small aperture shots and high shutter speeds to see how clean it really is and yes, it is very capable at high ISO. So capable I am considering it as a second camera
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.