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Best Office Suite? (MS Office vs iWork)

I've got a love hate relationship with Office. I love to hate it.? Seriously, though, I have little choice in the matter because I absolutely cannot function without Excel.

If I can eliminate the need for Excel, I would drop MS Office.
 
I really only said Excel seemed buggy because I have heard stories of the formulas and calculations and such not working properly and messing up equations and spreadsheets. But then again, this could all be hearsay since they're stories I've heard from people around me or articles on the internet.
 
As a professional marketing copywriter, I find that neither of them really works best. For writing I use Scrivener since it allows me to keep everything for a client in one simple project. I "compile" the document to Word and then preview it in Pages. If I have to share, I upload to Google Docs.

Don't be afraid to experiment to find the right tool for yourself. I am constantly looking for things that help my workflow and am ready to jump ship whenever a better product comes along.
 
AdrianCobon said:
As a professional marketing copywriter, I find that neither of them really works best. For writing I use Scrivener since it allows me to keep everything for a client in one simple project. I "compile" the document to Word and then preview it in Pages. If I have to share, I upload to Google Docs.

Don't be afraid to experiment to find the right tool for yourself. I am constantly looking for things that help my workflow and am ready to jump ship whenever a better product comes along.
Click to expand...
To be fair, I should address you as a student. Microsoft Excel is perfect for spreadsheet work if you need the advanced features. Numbers works for anything smaller. I used Pages back when I was in college a decade back, but that was before online collaboration. I would use whatever cloud platform your school prefers for shared work. Pages works for most single-person endeavors.

However, if you are looking for something that will enable you to collect school notes, quotes from materials studied, and all of your previous work, then Scrivener will work best. It cost roughly $50, but it is worth every penny. You can even set it up to export using specific formatting options, making it easy to write however you feel works best for you and then just press a single button in order to get it ready for your professor. The export tool works perfectly for every use case I have thrown at it, though you will have to read the manual to get the most benefit out of the program.
 
Having nothing to do with the pros/cons, it's interesting that the iWork brand name persists in common usage when Apple stopped bundling Pages, Numbers, and Keynote as a suite named "iWork" in 2013. It's true that apple.com/iwork still exists, but the emphasis there is on the individual apps, not a bundle. If you don't search for "iWork" at apple.com you won't find your way to the iWork page. At apple.com/mac the various bundled free apps (Safari, Photos, iMovie, GarageBand, Pages, Numbers, and Keynote) are listed co-equally, with no sub-categorization into Work or Play. You won't find an "iWork" category in the various App Stores (although, again, the search word works fine), the web app versions at iCloud.com are freestanding...

Bundling makes sense when there's money to be made. Microsoft sells businesses on buying a bundle for every employee, regardless of whether their particular job role actually requires it. Equip employees with only those apps they need? Sacrilege! The same used to hold true for Apple - if Microsoft had a bundle, Apple needed to offer one, too. But once Apple went to the free software model, there was nothing to gain by bundling. Let folks download only what they need, especially if storage space is at a premium (this switch happened at just around the time 128 GB SSDs started replacing 500 GB spinning HDDs in laptops). When software was distributed on DVD there were good reasons to have a single SKU at a higher price rather than multiple shrink-wraps for lower-priced products, but when you switch to download-only, those considerations go out the window.

From a functional standpoint, suites are rarely necessary. Sure, it's nice to have a consistent UI across commonly-used apps - if you're using Word on a constant basis but need a spreadsheet or presentation app rarely, there will be a comforting familiarity to Excel and PowerPoint compared to Pages or Keynote. But I'd wager the vast majority of users do not use the multi-app interoperability capabilities at all (eg. embedding an Excel spreadsheet into a Word doc or PowerPoint presentation).

I converted from Office to Apple's apps around 15 years ago. That's about the time I was able to quit being the only Windows user in an otherwise all-Mac shop (a suitable financial management app was finally available for Mac). It's also around the time we stopped subcontracting for a major publishing house (all those manuscripts needed to be produced in Word, of course). From then on, interoperability with the Microsoft world ended as a significant consideration.

I tried Pages - it did everything I needed, with a much cleaner UI. I converted one of my "monster" spreadsheets to Numbers - nothing was lost in translation and again, I ended up preferring the UI and workflow. So, no need to pay for another Office upgrade.

I'm not quite a Power User, so for my relatively mundane needs there's been nothing I've wanted them to do that Apple's apps haven't been able to deliver. Anything that I share with others these days is non-collaborative, so it all goes out as PDF - nobody gets to mess with my content or layout! Export as PDF works like a charm.

Altogether, Apple's free apps have saved my a nice chunk of change without a negative trade-off. It just adds to the Apple Value Proposition - initial cost of the hardware is higher, but the free OS, free productivity and creativity apps, ecosystem, etc. turns Apple into a long-term bargain.
 
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ApfelKuchen said:
Having nothing to do with the pros/cons, it's interesting that the iWork brand name persists in common usage when Apple stopped bundling Pages, Numbers, and Keynote as a suite named "iWork" in 2013. It's true that apple.com/iwork still exists, but the emphasis there is on the individual apps, not a bundle. If you don't search for "iWork" at apple.com you won't find your way to the iWork page. At apple.com/mac the various bundled free apps (Safari, Photos, iMovie, GarageBand, Pages, Numbers, and Keynote) are listed co-equally, with no sub-categorization into Work or Play. You won't find an "iWork" category in the various App Stores (although, again, the search word works fine), the web app versions at iCloud.com are freestanding...

Bundling makes sense when there's money to be made. Microsoft sells businesses on buying a bundle for every employee, regardless of whether their particular job role actually requires it. Equip employees with only those apps they need? Sacrilege! The same used to hold true for Apple - if Microsoft had a bundle, Apple needed to offer one, too. But once Apple went to the free software model, there was nothing to gain by bundling. Let folks download only what they need, especially if storage space is at a premium (this switch happened at just around the time 128 GB SSDs started replacing 500 GB spinning HDDs in laptops). When software was distributed on DVD there were good reasons to have a single SKU at a higher price rather than multiple shrink-wraps for lower-priced products, but when you switch to download-only, those considerations go out the window.

From a functional standpoint, suites are rarely necessary. Sure, it's nice to have a consistent UI across commonly-used apps - if you're using Word on a constant basis but need a spreadsheet or presentation app rarely, there will be a comforting familiarity to Excel and PowerPoint compared to Pages or Keynote. But I'd wager the vast majority of users do not use the multi-app interoperability capabilities at all (eg. embedding an Excel spreadsheet into a Word doc or PowerPoint presentation).

I converted from Office to Apple's apps around 15 years ago. That's about the time I was able to quit being the only Windows user in an otherwise all-Mac shop (a suitable financial management app was finally available for Mac). It's also around the time we stopped subcontracting for a major publishing house (all those manuscripts needed to be produced in Word, of course). From then on, interoperability with the Microsoft world ended as a significant consideration.

I tried Pages - it did everything I needed, with a much cleaner UI. I converted one of my "monster" spreadsheets to Numbers - nothing was lost in translation and again, I ended up preferring the UI and workflow. So, no need to pay for another Office upgrade.

I'm not quite a Power User, so for my relatively mundane needs there's been nothing I've wanted them to do that Apple's apps haven't been able to deliver. Anything that I share with others these days is non-collaborative, so it all goes out as PDF - nobody gets to mess with my content or layout! Export as PDF works like a charm.

Altogether, Apple's free apps have saved my a nice chunk of change without a negative trade-off. It just adds to the Apple Value Proposition - initial cost of the hardware is higher, but the free OS, free productivity and creativity apps, ecosystem, etc. turns Apple into a long-term bargain.
Click to expand...
I had to smile when you mentioned being a Windows person in a Mac shop due to a particular app. Years ago I worked within a computer tech support company and often we had to put "cards" within Apple computers that hosted a CPU and drive that would run Windows and of course the app (almost always accounting). We will probably not agree on Numbers but very glad you find it works for you. I admit all the years I have used Windows, I never liked Microsoft and more so the Gates tactics of ruthless trampling of other companies.
 
Quick note about the cost as that was one of OPs points. Office Home & Student 2021 is on sale for $99 for the next week or so on the Microsoft site. I was about to pull the trigger a couple days ago for the full $150 but was waffling back and forth between this or the Microsoft 365 subscription. I think this sale made up my mind.
 
ApfelKuchen said:
Having nothing to do with the pros/cons, it's interesting that the iWork brand name persists in common usage when Apple stopped bundling Pages, Numbers, and Keynote as a suite named "iWork" in 2013. It's true that apple.com/iwork still exists, but the emphasis there is on the individual apps, not a bundle. If you don't search for "iWork" at apple.com you won't find your way to the iWork page. At apple.com/mac the various bundled free apps (Safari, Photos, iMovie, GarageBand, Pages, Numbers, and Keynote) are listed co-equally, with no sub-categorization into Work or Play. You won't find an "iWork" category in the various App Stores (although, again, the search word works fine), the web app versions at iCloud.com are freestanding...

Bundling makes sense when there's money to be made. Microsoft sells businesses on buying a bundle for every employee, regardless of whether their particular job role actually requires it. Equip employees with only those apps they need? Sacrilege! The same used to hold true for Apple - if Microsoft had a bundle, Apple needed to offer one, too. But once Apple went to the free software model, there was nothing to gain by bundling. Let folks download only what they need, especially if storage space is at a premium (this switch happened at just around the time 128 GB SSDs started replacing 500 GB spinning HDDs in laptops). When software was distributed on DVD there were good reasons to have a single SKU at a higher price rather than multiple shrink-wraps for lower-priced products, but when you switch to download-only, those considerations go out the window.

From a functional standpoint, suites are rarely necessary. Sure, it's nice to have a consistent UI across commonly-used apps - if you're using Word on a constant basis but need a spreadsheet or presentation app rarely, there will be a comforting familiarity to Excel and PowerPoint compared to Pages or Keynote. But I'd wager the vast majority of users do not use the multi-app interoperability capabilities at all (eg. embedding an Excel spreadsheet into a Word doc or PowerPoint presentation).

I converted from Office to Apple's apps around 15 years ago. That's about the time I was able to quit being the only Windows user in an otherwise all-Mac shop (a suitable financial management app was finally available for Mac). It's also around the time we stopped subcontracting for a major publishing house (all those manuscripts needed to be produced in Word, of course). From then on, interoperability with the Microsoft world ended as a significant consideration.

I tried Pages - it did everything I needed, with a much cleaner UI. I converted one of my "monster" spreadsheets to Numbers - nothing was lost in translation and again, I ended up preferring the UI and workflow. So, no need to pay for another Office upgrade.

I'm not quite a Power User, so for my relatively mundane needs there's been nothing I've wanted them to do that Apple's apps haven't been able to deliver. Anything that I share with others these days is non-collaborative, so it all goes out as PDF - nobody gets to mess with my content or layout! Export as PDF works like a charm.

Altogether, Apple's free apps have saved my a nice chunk of change without a negative trade-off. It just adds to the Apple Value Proposition - initial cost of the hardware is higher, but the free OS, free productivity and creativity apps, ecosystem, etc. turns Apple into a long-term bargain.
Click to expand...
Very good. I may give Numbers another look, it's been a very long time since I tried working with it. . .
 
The Pivot Table function that came with Numbers' latest update really adds great value to the app IMHO.
 
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If you can make iWork work for you, go for it.

However, if you need to interact with MS office users with your work, just use office. It will be far, far less trouble.

Also, excel is far more capable than numbers. Less friendly to use perhaps, but it can do things numbers just can't.


That said, PowerPoint can die in a fire, Keynote is so much nicer.
 
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throAU said:
If you can make iWork work for you, go for it.

However, if you need to interact with MS office users with your work, just use office. It will be far, far less trouble.

Also, excel is far more capable than numbers. Less friendly to use perhaps, but it can do things numbers just can't.


That said, PowerPoint can die in a fire, Keynote is so much nicer.
Click to expand...
I did some slides for a presentation in Keynote. It works well, and it can be remote-controlled from the phone without any third party stuff (just by installing Keynote on the phone too).

The people I'm working with all use Powerpoint, so I had to export my slides as pptx and import them into their deck. What a mess. I've never really had to use Powerpoint before, but all this weirdness around trying to change even simple things like font sizes in what it calls a Master Slide proved difficult. Sometimes the size just refused to change. If I had a choice, I'd ditch my collaborators rather than Keynote ...
 
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While I do agree with a lot of the stuff everyone is saying here, and have been informed of a lot of pros and cons, there is one thing I wanna mention that is kind of a deal breaker in this situation: cloud storage.

I work and school and just generally do a lot of my life stuff on different devices, mainly my phone. Since I have an Android, it's much harder to get iCloud to properly work when it comes to the iWork stuff. And since I paid to have iCloud+ for extra storage, I would rather to put it to good use rather than having it be only on my MacBook. And while up to this point I've been using Word on Android for a lot of writing, OneDrive has been screwing up so much that I'd rather just save my stuff to iCloud instead.

Is there any viable way of using iWork on Android?
 
Open-Source-Norange said:
While I do agree with a lot of the stuff everyone is saying here, and have been informed of a lot of pros and cons, there is one thing I wanna mention that is kind of a deal breaker in this situation: cloud storage.

I work and school and just generally do a lot of my life stuff on different devices, mainly my phone. Since I have an Android, it's much harder to get iCloud to properly work when it comes to the iWork stuff. And since I paid to have iCloud+ for extra storage, I would rather to put it to good use rather than having it be only on my MacBook. And while up to this point I've been using Word on Android for a lot of writing, OneDrive has been screwing up so much that I'd rather just save my stuff to iCloud instead.

Is there any viable way of using iWork on Android?
Click to expand...
The only "supported" way of using iCloud on an Android is through the web interface. There are some third-party tools, but they tend to be from fly-by-night companies that can easily turn malicious vis-a-vis your personal data.
 
Open-Source-Norange said:
While I do agree with a lot of the stuff everyone is saying here, and have been informed of a lot of pros and cons, there is one thing I wanna mention that is kind of a deal breaker in this situation: cloud storage.

I work and school and just generally do a lot of my life stuff on different devices, mainly my phone. Since I have an Android, it's much harder to get iCloud to properly work when it comes to the iWork stuff. And since I paid to have iCloud+ for extra storage, I would rather to put it to good use rather than having it be only on my MacBook. And while up to this point I've been using Word on Android for a lot of writing, OneDrive has been screwing up so much that I'd rather just save my stuff to iCloud instead.

Is there any viable way of using iWork on Android?
Click to expand...
I too work on a lot of stuff and a multitude of devices (Windows, Mac OS, iPad OS, Android, Chrome OS, and Linux) and rely on cloud storage. One of my many Android devices is a smartphone.

Sorry to say that, IMO, you've boxed yourself in by using iCloud. That is the most restrictive component in the tech you use. You may find a way to get a workflow or two going using it, but in the end, it'll cause you headaches if you plan to continue with Android in the mix.
 
AdrianCobon said:
The only "supported" way of using iCloud on an Android is through the web interface. There are some third-party tools, but they tend to be from fly-by-night companies that can easily turn malicious vis-a-vis your personal data.
Click to expand...
Yeah, you got a point :( I've looked into quite a few dubious "apps" and none of them either work or are even trust worthy enough for me to download.
sracer said:
I too work on a lot of stuff and a multitude of devices (Windows, Mac OS, iPad OS, Android, Chrome OS, and Linux) and rely on cloud storage. One of my many Android devices is a smartphone.

Sorry to say that, IMO, you've boxed yourself in by using iCloud. That is the most restrictive component in the tech you use. You may find a way to get a workflow or two going using it, but in the end, it'll cause you headaches if you plan to continue with Android in the mix.
Click to expand...
Good point, sad to say. I keep forgetting that Apple has quite a tightly knit ecosystem with some really high walls. I mean, I'd still trust Apple a little more over Google in some respects, but the walling off can be real annoying, especially for someone like me who has specialized needs and interests that the iOS end cannot provide.
 
Open-Source-Norange said:
While I do agree with a lot of the stuff everyone is saying here, and have been informed of a lot of pros and cons, there is one thing I wanna mention that is kind of a deal breaker in this situation: cloud storage.

I work and school and just generally do a lot of my life stuff on different devices, mainly my phone. Since I have an Android, it's much harder to get iCloud to properly work when it comes to the iWork stuff. And since I paid to have iCloud+ for extra storage, I would rather to put it to good use rather than having it be only on my MacBook. And while up to this point I've been using Word on Android for a lot of writing, OneDrive has been screwing up so much that I'd rather just save my stuff to iCloud instead.

Is there any viable way of using iWork on Android?
Click to expand...

iWork is garbage. Especially for you since you’re a student and hope to get a real job eventually. Don’t waste your time with it.
 
I was the only Mac user in our large group for along time. I mostly used Pages, Keynote and Numbers. Importing and exporting Word docs was fine. I don’t recall any problems. The thing was, there were so many versions of Word on different PCs in the organization that they had plenty of problems on their own.

Keynote has really become an awesome tool. I use it now mostly for creating PDF files with lots of images and drawings. I can import a few pictures, add some shapes and lines and arrows and such and export to PDF really quickly. The new feature to make shapes editable really added a lot of power.

I recently did a quick mockup of several versions of an open tread staircase we are building and passed the PDF around to the wife and architect and contractor. My wife was surprised that I made it. She thought it came from the vendors 3D CAD tool.

I like iCloud. It works well for me. I can create something on the iMac and then open it almost immediately on my iPhone or iPad.
 
neutrino23 said:
. . . there were so many versions of Word on different PCs in the organization that they had plenty of problems on their own . . .
Click to expand...
Great point. I've ran into that issue myself from time to time when using Office products. But I don't think it has resulted in any loss of formatting or anything noticeable in documents, at least not that I'm aware of.

I have to admit that I'm heavily influenced by the difficulties that were common many years ago when the Apple applications were much less developed, and also when Office products did not work as well on a Mac. These days everything is much more compatible and working from one platform to another is far easier and less troublesome.
 
neutrino23 said:
The thing was, there were so many versions of Word on different PCs in the organization that they had plenty of problems on their own.
Click to expand...

I’m guessing this is becoming less of an issue, as companies standardize on Microsoft 365.
 
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