Boot Camp on nMP only supports Windows 8

[MH01]

I think a lot of comments are based on just loud perceptions.

Windows 8.1 is easy to use, you can have it boot directly to desktop and you can work in it all day without even touching the Start Screen, just pin all your favorite apps to the Taskbar. In fact, you can configure the Start Screen to make it display all apps like the All Programs menu by default. Just think of it as a full screen Start menu with more details.

Also, just learn these couple keyboard shortcuts and you are good to go:
Windows key + X
Windows key + 'i' (without quotes of course)

If you complain about learning keyboard shortcuts, then you are seriously not a OS X user either since that's part of what makes using OS X fun. File Explorer in Windows 8/8.1 is way more powerful than the dumbed down experience in Vista/Windows 7 and if you don't like it, you can always customize it and pin your favorite commands, you can copy file paths, better ways to manage file I/O operations such as copy and paste multiple files, you can even pause one or more copy operations, in addition to that you can easily mount .ISO images, easily add storage to your system, better backup of files using File History.

Its a great OS once you settle down, give it a week instead of listening to dumb@$$ critics who are solely OS X users and are simply reviewing for the sake of reviewing instead of learning the operating system. It s no different from a Windows user going to OS X for the first time, you are gonna have to familiarize yourself with it. Besides, Windows 8 is still familiarly Windows, in addition to the fact that if you can point and click you have already learned most of the OS.

Spot on.

I suspect most of the moaning is from users who had a very short time using it. And then the is the prisoners of Microsoft that probably have not used a windows so since windows 95 but have been bagging every version.

Personally weather it's Microsoft or Apple releasing a new so, I give it 6 months before jumping on board. That is usually enough to get a stable os.

 

[tdar]

For those who must run Windows 8.1 but haven't or can't get used to the new way....$5 to Stardock for Start 8 and your right back at Windows 7 only better. Add $5 more for Modern Mix and run your Win 8 apps on the desktop.

 

[awarlock]

This is exactly the problem that I ran into as well. I have Windows 7 installed on an internal hard drive so I purchased an enclosure when I bought the 2013 nMP moved my internal hard drive to the new enclosure and now the nMP sees the hard drive but won't boot to it.

So, I was trying to use Bootcamp and it says it only works with Windows 8 so, now what . . . ? I guess maybe move my Windows 7 hard drive back into my old Mac Pro, upgrade Windows 7 to Windows 8.0/8.1 and then move the hard drive back into the enclosure and see if the nMP will boot to it using Bootcamp? That's only another $120 or $200. Stupid Microsoft website . . . I go there trying to figure out what and where I need to buy it and it is like tromping around in a maze.

Yeesh . . .

 

[theSeb]

This is exactly the problem that I ran into as well. I have Windows 7 installed on an internal hard drive so I purchased an enclosure when I bought the 2013 nMP moved my internal hard drive to the new enclosure and now the nMP sees the hard drive but won't boot to it.

So, I was trying to use Bootcamp and it says it only works with Windows 8 so, now what . . . ? I guess maybe move my Windows 7 hard drive back into my old Mac Pro, upgrade Windows 7 to Windows 8.0/8.1 and then move the hard drive back into the enclosure and see if the nMP will boot to it using Bootcamp? That's only another $120 or $200. Stupid Microsoft website . . . I go there trying to figure out what and where I need to buy it and it is like tromping around in a maze.

Yeesh . . .

Go to Amazon. The upgrade is relatively cheap (for Windows)

 

[Beta Particle]

I guess maybe move my Windows 7 hard drive back into my old Mac Pro, upgrade Windows 7 to Windows 8.0/8.1 and then move the hard drive back into the enclosure and see if the nMP will boot to it using Bootcamp?

I'm not sure that this will work. Older Intel Macs did not support UEFI and had to boot into a "legacy" install of Windows.
The new Mac Pro should have proper UEFI support and install directly without requiring Boot Camp.
It probably actually works fine with Windows 7 if you do a UEFI install.

It's also not a good idea to move an OS install between machines - that's a recipe for disaster whether you're using OS X or Windows.

 

[monkeybagel]

Windows 8 comes with Hyper-V, there's no need for third-party VM software any more.

Have you used and compared Hyper-V against VMware Workstation? There is really no comparison. You can't even drag and drop a file from host to guest in Hyper-V. Nor can you easily NAT your local network connection without going through hoops. Particularly a wireless connection.

Hyper-V might be acceptable for a server OS where the console would not need to be used or interacted with directly. It falls way short for a good lab environment.

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For those who must run Windows 8.1 but haven't or can't get used to the new way....$5 to Stardock for Start 8 and your right back at Windows 7 only better. Add $5 more for Modern Mix and run your Win 8 apps on the desktop.

I will add to this. I have pretty much detested Windows 8 and 8.1 since release due to the inefficiencies with the Start screen. However, I do have Windows 8 and subsequently 8.1 on my Mac Pro 5,1 booting pure EFI and am using Start8. I normally look at applications like this as a "crutch" and embrace the future, but for a desktop with a mouse and keyboard with no touchscreen I just could not use it as efficiently. I could use it and get around, but it just felt like the "long" way for too many tasks.

Start8 is an excellent piece of software and honestly provides the level of integration and polish one would expect to find on a shipping version of Windows. I highly recommend it.

With this combination, I get pure EFI booting which provides TRIM support for the primary SSD as well as AHCI access to all SATA ports. It is very stable and runs very well.

With Windows 7 with the MBR patch, I could get AHCI with TRIM on SATA sleds 1 and 2 and the optical drives, but not sleds 3 and 4 which contain hard disks. These need to run in RAID 0 so it was not a very good option to have them running IDE. There are supposed to be some workarounds to get Windows 7 running in EFI on a 5,1 but I never had any luck with it running GRUB as a bootloader. The MBR patch also slowed down the boot process on "Starting Windows" to be probably 20-30 seconds or so which was not normal. Windows 8/8.1 does not exhibit this behavior.

The only thing that I have noticed that does not work as expected is resume from hibernation. Not sure if that is because I have so much RAM (128GB) or if it is a Windows on Apple bug in EFI, but I don't use it normally anyway and since it is a desktop it does not affect me. Saves the 128GB hibernate file from the SSD by disabling it as well.

 

[Nugget]

Is it possible to do Boot Camp reliably with the Apple wireless keyboard and trackpad now? The last time I tried (circa Windows Vista, so it's been aeons) it was a disaster and I ended up having to have a wired keyboard and mouse to plug in when it came time to boot into Windows. I'd really love to avoid that hassle this time around when I set up Boot Camp on my nMP.

 

[monkeybagel]

I only use a wired Apple keyboard as I need the Numerical Keypad.

I would think they have that sorted out by now as new Macintoshes have good low level wireless support so Windows should see it as a standard input device while installing.

 

[Derpage]

Have you used and compared Hyper-V against VMware Workstation? There is really no comparison. You can't even drag and drop a file from host to guest in Hyper-V. Nor can you easily NAT your local network connection without going through hoops. Particularly a wireless connection.

Hyper-V might be acceptable for a server OS where the console would not need to be used or interacted with directly. It falls way short for a good lab environment.

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I will add to this. I have pretty much detested Windows 8 and 8.1 since release due to the inefficiencies with the Start screen. However, I do have Windows 8 and subsequently 8.1 on my Mac Pro 5,1 booting pure EFI and am using Start8. I normally look at applications like this as a "crutch" and embrace the future, but for a desktop with a mouse and keyboard with no touchscreen I just could not use it as efficiently. I could use it and get around, but it just felt like the "long" way for too many tasks.

Start8 is an excellent piece of software and honestly provides the level of integration and polish one would expect to find on a shipping version of Windows. I highly recommend it.

With this combination, I get pure EFI booting which provides TRIM support for the primary SSD as well as AHCI access to all SATA ports. It is very stable and runs very well.

With Windows 7 with the MBR patch, I could get AHCI with TRIM on SATA sleds 1 and 2 and the optical drives, but not sleds 3 and 4 which contain hard disks. These need to run in RAID 0 so it was not a very good option to have them running IDE. There are supposed to be some workarounds to get Windows 7 running in EFI on a 5,1 but I never had any luck with it running GRUB as a bootloader. The MBR patch also slowed down the boot process on "Starting Windows" to be probably 20-30 seconds or so which was not normal. Windows 8/8.1 does not exhibit this behavior.

The only thing that I have noticed that does not work as expected is resume from hibernation. Not sure if that is because I have so much RAM (128GB) or if it is a Windows on Apple bug in EFI, but I don't use it normally anyway and since it is a desktop it does not affect me. Saves the 128GB hibernate file from the SSD by disabling it as well.

Another solution is Classic Shell. It's free and uses up less resources. http://www.classicshell.net/

 

[Munc]

wrong thread

 

[monkeybagel]

Another solution is Classic Shell. It's free and uses up less resources. http://www.classicshell.net/

I will give it a shot. Thank you.

 

[tony1208]

I tried installing win 7 and 8 on bootcamp on a new mac mini I bought but I had issues so I just installed both running off vmware. ..not feeling 8 at all but I like vmware becuase I can test out os with out ****ing my main setup

 

[meta-ghost]

Virtual PC 7...

So, while I wait for my nMP I'm going thru all of my (old) software. I hadn't even thought of installing VPC7 as I am going to need Bootcamp (at some point but not right away).

Am I correct in thinking that for low intensity PC programs they might just run fine in VPC? I didn't have success with it years ago and it has sat on a shelf. I think I have a copy of XP as well.

 

[Nugget]

You must have been sitting on that disc for a long time -- Virtual PC 7 will only run on PowerPC Macs. You'll need either Parallels or VMware Fusion if you want to do virtualized Windows on the new machine. There's also VirtualBox (free) for extremely casual use. Can't beat the price, but it's nowhere near as good as the commercial options.

 

[meta-ghost]

The Sawtooth G4

You must have been sitting on that disc for a long time --

Thanks Nugget. It's not just the disc that's old, the computer (and user) have been around awhile as well. The nMP will be replacing....<drumroll> a 1998 Sawtooth G4. Believe it or not it's still operational - sort of. Over the years I've replaced nearly every single component in it (processor, graphics card, ram, hd, RW-dvd....). I like to hang onto things...

Originally bought it when I lived in Hong Kong and the G4's were fresh off the boat. Orignial configuration was a 450 mhz processor and it came with all sorts of U.S. State Department warnings that I was not to take it across the border as this was considered leading American technology that was not to be given to the Chinese....

Anyway, work has been giving me laptops and I haven't had the need to upgrade untill now.

 

[ytoyoda]

I realized that the two copies of unused Windows Pro 8 I have are actually upgrade package. It is OK to install on VMWare, but to install on bootcamp, I need a full version.
I end up with buying a Windows pro 8.1 full version.

I installed 8.1 on my wife's iMac and started familiarizing myself on Windows 8.1.

 

[Killerbob]

You say it is necessary to have Win8/8.1 to install in nMP Bootcamp, but I only have the upgrade disc, and can upgrade my existing Bootcamp Win7 installation with it.

I have this Bootcamp installation on a Samsung 840 SSD, which I can install into a TB/USB housing and use for Bootcamp.

That would work wouldn't it?

 

[ytoyoda]

It is OK to install on VMWare, but to install on bootcamp, I need a full version.
I end up with buying a Windows pro 8.1 full version.

I was wrong. I found that I don't need to buy Win 8.1 full version.
Bootcamp assistant states that I can't install from upgrade versions of Windows, but I tried.
I tried to install Win 8 in iMac boot camp partition from Win 8 "Upgrade" disk.
I assumed that either bootcamp assistant refuse to use that version of disk, or I encounter some trouble during installation, but installation went smooth and I finished installation.

I think, the trick is Windows 8 "Upgrade" version. When MS introduced Win 8, they only sell upgrade version of "Win 8" other than DSP/OEM. And mine is not DSP/OEM version. On the disk, small message is printed "You need to have a windows to be upgraded".
However, this can be installed to empty NTFS partition and does not require to insert CD of previous version of Windows as old windows upgrade version requested to do. So, I think, it is equivalent to full version.