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MP All Models Bootable PCI SSD Cards/Drives for Mac Pro (NVMe M.2, U.2, EDSFF E3.S, etc.)

ZombiePhysicist

ZombiePhysicist

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moab1 said:
Will this work in the J2I?? How does it connect then?
Click to expand...

The idea is to use some kind of 2.5" to 3.5" mounting bracket adapter like this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TQ3Q5L5/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1HMXMVDPNMLUC&psc=1
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moab1 said:
Will this work in the J2I?? How does it connect then?
Click to expand...

I dont know for sure. My hope is a bracket like this would work to secure it:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TQ3Q5L5/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1HMXMVDPNMLUC&psc=1
 
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moab1

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deconstruct60

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Mar 10, 2009
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ZombiePhysicist said:
The idea is to use some kind of 2.5" to 3.5" mounting bracket adapter like this:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07TQ3Q5L5/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A1HMXMVDPNMLUC&psc=1
....
Click to expand...

The 2.5" to 3.5" is utterly immaterial to the connection question. This is a NVMe U.2 drive ( NVMe U.2 9500 ) That means it uses a x4 PCI-e connection. Not a SATA one. Putting it into the 3.5" drive bracket is rather pointless if don't have a connector for the data port on the drive.

I think this has been trotted out in some other thread before that U.2 means it is somehow compatible with SATA. Many aren't. The word "SATA" appears no where in this product's pdf briefing materials at the product's web page. ( the top end sequential read speeds are in the 3,100-3,500 MB/s which blows past SATA III speeds. )

P.S. something like this is more relevant in the U.2 context.

https://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-U-2-PCIe-Adapter-PEX4SFF8639/dp/B072JK2XLC
 
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deconstruct60

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ZombiePhysicist said:
...
So from another thread, the Highpoint SSD7120 http://highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series-ssd7120-overview.htm seems to be a good choice for the 5,1 Mac Pro. I wonder if it's also a good choice for the 7,1?
Click to expand...

The Mac Pro 2019 isn't designed for long cable management. The nominal Apple set up is cableless. Once start throwing lots of cables inside it isn't necessarily going to work well. Especially if have to go more than halfway across the box with other cards present.
 
ZombiePhysicist

ZombiePhysicist

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AidenShaw said:
'b' is bits, 'B' is bytes. Capitalization matters.

15.36 tb is 1.92 TB.

/pedantic

But anyway, it's incompatible with the Apple pro.
Click to expand...

Why do you say that. And thanks for the capitlization lesson! ;p

BTW I think this is the cabel you would need to connect the card to the drive:

https://www.amazon.com/10Gtek-Inter...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01AOS4NE6

I also think the web site has a driver for 10.12 or higher, and I think I read reports that you dont need any driver anymore since NVME support was added to the firmware.

http://highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series-ssd7120-download.htm
 
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deconstruct60

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AidenShaw said:
Will we get a "dog ate my homework" mea culpa on this next year?
Click to expand...

No. Tons of folks aren't going to run off and buy lots of U.2 drives.

The fact that they have a W5700X lined up for a "coming soon" ( which won't be a 'dog ate my homework' if they deliver before March timeframe. if they roll into July and still haven't delivered then they are back in the non execution pit. ). But day 1 on new Mac Pro they rolled out two new build to order options. ( that GPU and 8TB ). Which is something.

HDD form factors aren't a primary objective. they probably aren't going to loose much on that as long as the other SSD Add-in-Card options grow over the next 12 months.

Even if there was a substantively large enough multiple U.2 market out there an MPX module could do that same thing with now cables for most users. ( a derivative of what Promise already did with the R4i. With a space and U.2 drives that could be 6-8 drives. )
 
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moab1

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Dec 12, 2019
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deconstruct60 said:
No. Tons of folks aren't going to run off and buy lots of U.2 drives.

The fact that they have a W5700X lined up for a "coming soon" ( which won't be a 'dog ate my homework' if they deliver before March timeframe. if they roll into July and still haven't delivered then they are back in the non execution pit. ). But day 1 on new Mac Pro they rolled out two new build to order options. ( that GPU and 8TB ). Which is something.

HDD form factors aren't a primary objective. they probably aren't going to loose much on that as long as the other SSD Add-in-Card options grow over the next 12 months.

Even if there was a substantively large enough multiple U.2 market out there an MPX module could do that same thing with now cables for most users. ( a derivative of what Promise already did with the R4i. With a space and U.2 drives that could be 6-8 drives. )
Click to expand...

Are there disadvantages of U.2 drives? I was looking for a solution for video editing in the 12-20TB range.
 
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deconstruct60

macrumors G5
Mar 10, 2009
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ZombiePhysicist said:
Why do you say that. And thanks for the capitlization lesson! ;p

BTW I think this is the cabel you would need to connect the card to the drive:

https://www.amazon.com/10Gtek-Inter...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01AOS4NE6
Click to expand...

are you just trying to be purposely wrong? From the 7120 webpage

"... In addition, the industry standard SFF-8639 connectors accept cables of varying length, which allow the SSD7120 RAID controller to be easily integrated into custom chassis designs. ..."
http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series-ssd7120-overview.htm

8639 not equal 8643 .
 
ZombiePhysicist

ZombiePhysicist

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deconstruct60 said:
are you just trying to be purposely wrong? From the 7120 webpage

"... In addition, the industry standard SFF-8639 connectors accept cables of varying length, which allow the SSD7120 RAID controller to be easily integrated into custom chassis designs. ..."
http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA_new/series-ssd7120-overview.htm

8639 not equal 8643 .
Click to expand...

Sorry, no, I'm just trying to figure things out. From the user manual <http://www.highpoint-tech.com/PDF/NVMe/SSD7120/SSD7120_Manual_v1.00_17_09_29.pdf> it says:

System Requirements
  •  System with an empty PCIe 3.0 x16 slot
  • SSF-8643 to U.2 Cable or SFF-8643 cable with NVMe backplane
Click to expand...
Screen Shot 2019-12-13 at 12.34.44 AM.png

Screen Shot 2019-12-13 at 12.34.51 AM.png


I'm not trying to argue, I'm far from an expert on NVME/U.2 format stuff. But it seems to me the webpage notes the SFF-8639 is the connector type which I guess accepts the SFF-8643 and other types of cables per the manual noted above? However the manual refers to them as SFF-8643 connectors. Perhaps there are variants of the card with different connectors?

Anyway, so I can easily have this stuff wrong. Always appreciate guidance, and advance apologies on my ignorance (hence why I started the thread to help me figure things out).
 
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Parzival

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May 12, 2013
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What about using a cheap PCIe card that holds an M.2 drive? You can find them on newegg etc. for under 40 dollars.
Would those work? I think they work on the older cheesegraters...
 
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bsbeamer

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Sep 19, 2012
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Parzival said:
What about using a cheap PCIe card that holds an M.2 drive? You can find them on newegg etc. for under 40 dollars.
Would those work? I think they work on the older cheesegraters...
Click to expand...

Take a look at the specs on many of them. Many (most) are PCIe 2.0 speeds. You can likely get better read/write through a USB 3.1 10Gbps device like the Mobius Pro 5C. See this thread:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/4-bay-enclosure-with-quick-hot-plugging.2192090/

Also have a list compiled here that also may be helpful for PCIe SATA adapters:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/macos-pcie-sata-ssd-adapters-mp5-1.2208623/
 
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Parzival

macrumors regular
May 12, 2013
153
353
bsbeamer said:
Take a look at the specs on many of them. Many (most) are PCIe 2.0 speeds. You can likely get better read/write through a USB 3.1 10Gbps device like the Mobius Pro 5C. See this thread:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/4-bay-enclosure-with-quick-hot-plugging.2192090/

Also have a list compiled here that also may be helpful for PCIe SATA adapters:
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/macos-pcie-sata-ssd-adapters-mp5-1.2208623/
Click to expand...


What about something like this?

https://www.newegg.com/global/nl-en...cm_re=pcie_m.2_adapter-_-15-287-035-_-Product

Seems to be PCIe v3.0
 
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giggles

macrumors 65816
Dec 15, 2012
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Would it be possible for someone to RAID5 four 4TB 2.5” SATA SSDs inside the Pegasus R4i? The official compatibility list only mentions HDDs..

Moreover, would it be possible to actually use eight 4TB 2.5” SSDs, or four couples, inside the Pegasus R4i by using those enclosures that merge 2x2.5” inside a 3.5” case in RAID0? Would RAID5-ing four RAID0 couples be a problem? (“double RAID”, kinda like “double NAT”)

In know all of this is slow SATA stuff, still..using a Pegasus R4i is so “clean and tidy”...I hope they’ll eventually make a U.2 version of the same concept...
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I’m a simple man, I’d be happy with
- 8TB apple SSD for boot
- 8TB (2 x 4TB sata in Raid0) mounted on the Pegasus J2i tray for CarbonCopyCloner
- 12TB (4 x 4TB sata in Raid5) inside the Pegasus R4i MPX module for Time Machine

No spinning drives so PowerNap wouldn’t spin them up/down.

As a boot disk I swear by the T2-controlled apple flash, I assume no other solution will be exactly the same in terms of macOS/hw integration and possible issues 10 years down the line..
 
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bsbeamer

macrumors 601
Sep 19, 2012
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giggles said:
by using those enclosures that merge 2x2.5” inside a 3.5” case in RAID0?
Click to expand...

Would absolutely NOT recommend this. Tested this as a possible solution for a client months ago and data loss was a real problem. Happened with several different varieties of the dual 2.5" > single 3.5" converter RAID0 adapters.
 
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giggles

macrumors 65816
Dec 15, 2012
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bsbeamer said:
Would absolutely NOT recommend this. Tested this as a possible solution for a client months ago and data loss was a real problem. Happened with several different varieties of the dual 2.5" > single 3.5" converter RAID0 adapters.
Click to expand...
I see, thanks for the heads-up, will scrap that option.
So I’m left (in fantasizing mostly) with 2 sata ports (to RAID0 via software in macOS maybe) in the upper part of the case and 4 sata ports inside the the Pegasus R4i (to RAID5 via hardware)..
 
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