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Building a new desktop
- Thread starter maflynn
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That was my plan, and I did that last night. I wasn't really in the mood, because I spent a lot of time working and reworking everything to ensure that the wires were nicely hidden away but I wanted to see if I could narrow down what could be the issue.
Anyways, I'm seeing that the motherboard is powering up, there's two LEDs, they flicker on and off, and from what I can see its the memory and cpu identifiers. Also since the fans are spinning up, I'm seeing some signs of life on the motherboard.
I'm not seeing anything on the display, no post, no sound, regardless if I use the board's HDMI or my RTX 2060. Given that behavior I'm reasonably sure I can cross the RTX off as being the problem (especially since it was working in the EGPU). So that leaves me to believe its the motherboard or CPU, not sure which, it could go either way, but I'm leaning towards a defective motherboard.
MicroCenter has a generous return policy, much better then Newegg's, and I'll be popping over there later today to get a new motherboard and CPU.
Related or not, one thing I noticed is a difference between the CPU power connector and the 4+4 cable that came with power supply. That is the PSU cable is keyed differently then motherboard. As the arrow shows, I have a square connecter right there, but the [named] 4+4 cable from the PSU has a rounded corner. Oddly enough the extension cable's male portion is keyed correctly for the motherboard and the female portion that plugs into the PSU cable, is also keyed correctly. That is, the extension cable plugs into the motherboard, where as the PSU cable does not but also the PSU cable can and does plug into the extension cable (if that makes sense). I only noticed this when trying to plug the PSU cable directly into the mother when the motherboard was outside the case last night - I had to use the extension cable.
I'm going to bring both cables with me, and a picture of the CPU power connector and ask one of the salesman about that. I googled it and there's some chatter but nothing that was helpful
If I'm understanding the keying might be a problem. I would think if the motherboard end of the cable is not keyed:
top (r=round, s=square)
---
r/s/s/r
s/r/r/s
There is an issue. Maybe you needed to use the extension cable.
top (r=round, s=square)
---
r/s/s/r
s/r/r/s
There is an issue. Maybe you needed to use the extension cable.
The F models don't have integrated graphics. K models are overclockable and have IG as do the model numbers without any letters.
Whelp,
My tale of woe comes to an end, at least this phase of my woe-ness. As I mentioned, I headed over to MicroCenter and picked up a new processor and new motherboard. I didn't want to buy one and not the other, and possibly picking the wrong component that was defective.
Fate can also be a harsh mistress at times. Microcenter did not have any Intel motherboards in stock - I mentioned this before, and so my choices were to RMA the stuff I got at Newegg and wait or bite the bullet and switch to Ryzen ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I'll still go through the RMA process with Newegg - I want my moneyback
Anyways, here's the semi-finished result. I'm not entirely happy with my cabling efforts, particularly the motherboard power cable, I'm thinking, of re-routing the motherboard cable to the back using the extension cable, but the back of the case is really tight right now. I suppose it will be a project for another weekend. The audio cable is bugging me as well, you can see that running parallel to the GPU. I may try to move that under the GPU, or I'll just cut it, as I really don't have much use for it.
I picked up a Gigabyte ITX X570 motherboard, which was the best motherboard they had. For the CPU, I opted for a 3700x, mostly, since I was dealing with such a headache, let me bump up to the next tier processor. Plus the supplied cooler on the 3700x seems to be more robust cooler then the 3600x. I opted for the supplied cooler over the Noctua - If temps are decent I'll stick with it. Between the GPU, and motherboard and cooler, I'm seeing more LED bling then I prefer, its not rainbow puke level but its there.
After putting everything back together, and saying lots of prayers, the system booted up into the BIOS. I'm at a point where I'll see if there's any updates for the BIOS and then load windows.
My tale of woe comes to an end, at least this phase of my woe-ness. As I mentioned, I headed over to MicroCenter and picked up a new processor and new motherboard. I didn't want to buy one and not the other, and possibly picking the wrong component that was defective.
Fate can also be a harsh mistress at times. Microcenter did not have any Intel motherboards in stock - I mentioned this before, and so my choices were to RMA the stuff I got at Newegg and wait or bite the bullet and switch to Ryzen ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I'll still go through the RMA process with Newegg - I want my moneyback
Anyways, here's the semi-finished result. I'm not entirely happy with my cabling efforts, particularly the motherboard power cable, I'm thinking, of re-routing the motherboard cable to the back using the extension cable, but the back of the case is really tight right now. I suppose it will be a project for another weekend. The audio cable is bugging me as well, you can see that running parallel to the GPU. I may try to move that under the GPU, or I'll just cut it, as I really don't have much use for it.
I picked up a Gigabyte ITX X570 motherboard, which was the best motherboard they had. For the CPU, I opted for a 3700x, mostly, since I was dealing with such a headache, let me bump up to the next tier processor. Plus the supplied cooler on the 3700x seems to be more robust cooler then the 3600x. I opted for the supplied cooler over the Noctua - If temps are decent I'll stick with it. Between the GPU, and motherboard and cooler, I'm seeing more LED bling then I prefer, its not rainbow puke level but its there.
After putting everything back together, and saying lots of prayers, the system booted up into the BIOS. I'm at a point where I'll see if there's any updates for the BIOS and then load windows.
Looks fine to me. That cable is the only thing that sticks out but I don't really see what you could do with it to make it any neater.
I have to do some work on my system to make the cabling neater. The thing has been up and running since I built it outside of Windows updates so it would be strange to take it down. Maybe tonight.
Use extension cables and route up into the top and down the back. Use cable (zip) ties to anchor the big cables to the chasis.
Here's mine again as reference,
Here's mine again as reference,
Definitely interested in the temps with the stock cooler, I have heard AMD do their coolers pretty well.
Agreed, while I do like the look of the Noctua and even DRP4, the Noctua was a royal pain to work with in such tight confines. Another benefit is the cooler had the thermal paste pre-applied - a nice benefit.
If one needs to work on their system for any reason, omg.Use extension cables and route up into the top and down the back. Use cable (zip) ties to anchor the big cables to the chasis.
Here's mine again as reference,
I think the build looks good! It looks like you could ziptie the 24 pin up above and out of sight. I know the TU150 has a blacked out portion of the TG. Usually the HD Audio/Bottom Left connect has enough length you can run between the slot and the port end of the graphics card and down across the bottom.
The Wraith Prism is far beefier than the Stealth that comes with the R5s. I bet your cooling is fine. Noise will depend on your subjective tolerances. My Stealth has a rather obnoxious tone and a bearing rattle at it's 'idle' state. NZXT H1s are back on sale so might make the switch to that or go and pick up an M22 on the way home from work.
The Wraith Prism is far beefier than the Stealth that comes with the R5s. I bet your cooling is fine. Noise will depend on your subjective tolerances. My Stealth has a rather obnoxious tone and a bearing rattle at it's 'idle' state. NZXT H1s are back on sale so might make the switch to that or go and pick up an M22 on the way home from work.
The cabling was annoying me so I redid the wiring at lunch hour. I'm now using the extension cable for the motherboard and I cleaned up the audio cable as well
I'm playing with the fan profile, what bugs me is the speeding up and slowing down. I'll probably increase the case fans but slow down the cpu or try to minimize the ramping up. Ultimately I'll be replacing the stock cooler for the Noctua but for now, I'll live with it
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As far as I can tell, this is one of the big benefits of liquid cooling systems, including AIO CLC units particularly in SFF builds that might end up living on your desk instead of underneath.
There is enough cooling effect from the water circulating through the radiator to absorb momentary temperature spikes from the CPU. Thus I set the CPU radiator fans to spin up as slow as possible in the BIOS.
My case fans are programmed to speed up and down very slowly since there are no factors that will cause a really short burst of heat.
If I recall correctly, I just set the case fans to Auto and running CPU and GPU stress tests and finally just gaming. I noted the max case temperatures and modified the fan curves to favor lower fan speeds for most of the curve.
Note that I deliberately selected a micro-ATX case that is capable of exhausting on the top. Hot air rises.
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This should be my final change/alteration on my build. At this point, I'm done making any sort of changes or tweaking the computer - I'm at a point now where I'm installing software, and running some benchmarks and restoring my backups.
Overall, I'm pretty happy with the outcome. It was challenging to be sure, I made some mistakes, learned some things, and I think overall it was a positive experience.
I pulled the stock cooler over my lunch hour and put in the Noctua. I already knew this, but yet I probably need to re-learn this. Every board is different. The MSI motherboard that I had, could easily accommodate the cooler, and I was able to squeeze in a fan in the rear.
The Gigabyte motherboard, is different enough that I wasn't able to get a fan in the rear, and the motherboard power cable was impacting the Noctua 140mm fan. I lifted the fan up highter but then putting the glass side was problematic. Instead of forcing it (I learned in life, never force anything ), I put the 120mm fan that was originally going to go in the back. Its fits nicely and I'm really happy with the result.
Temps are certainly cooler with this bad boy, Idle, I'm seeing temps about 35 - 40c and underload about 67c while doing an Aida64 stress test. The fans do ramp up, and I can hear them, but its much better over the supplied cooler. There's much less ramping up and down as well.
For comparison sake, when I had the stock cooler, Idle temps were about 40 to 50c, and underload high 70s (about 77 to 78c)
Overall, I'm pretty happy with the outcome. It was challenging to be sure, I made some mistakes, learned some things, and I think overall it was a positive experience.
I pulled the stock cooler over my lunch hour and put in the Noctua. I already knew this, but yet I probably need to re-learn this. Every board is different. The MSI motherboard that I had, could easily accommodate the cooler, and I was able to squeeze in a fan in the rear.
The Gigabyte motherboard, is different enough that I wasn't able to get a fan in the rear, and the motherboard power cable was impacting the Noctua 140mm fan. I lifted the fan up highter but then putting the glass side was problematic. Instead of forcing it (I learned in life, never force anything
), I put the 120mm fan that was originally going to go in the back. Its fits nicely and I'm really happy with the result.Temps are certainly cooler with this bad boy, Idle, I'm seeing temps about 35 - 40c and underload about 67c while doing an Aida64 stress test. The fans do ramp up, and I can hear them, but its much better over the supplied cooler. There's much less ramping up and down as well.
For comparison sake, when I had the stock cooler, Idle temps were about 40 to 50c, and underload high 70s (about 77 to 78c)
You need a flat fan curve up to about 60c, with a delay, or smoothing to stop fans ramping.
Here’s what my fan curve looked like in the Asus.
Ryzen likes to bounce about between 50 and 60c on the desktop so you need to essentially ignore anything that isn’t over 60 for an sustained period. You don’t want the fan responding to all the blips which is what the smoothing does.
Here’s what my fan curve looked like in the Asus.
Ryzen likes to bounce about between 50 and 60c on the desktop so you need to essentially ignore anything that isn’t over 60 for an sustained period. You don’t want the fan responding to all the blips which is what the smoothing does.
It really seems to depend on the Ryzen part, its TDP and the specific cooling solution.
I have two 65W TDP Ryzen CPUs: a 3700X in an NZXT H1 mini-ITX SFF case and a 5600X in a cheapo SilverStone micro-ATX case.
Both CPUs stay within the 35-45°C range under normal usage.
The 3700X in the NZXT H1 is connected to the 140mm AIO CLC. Under a stress test it might top out at 65°C with my current super-quiet fan curves (I replaced the NZXT fan with a Noctua + low-noise adapter cable which knocks off about 15% of performance).
The 5600X in the micro-ATX case is connected to a 120mm AIO CLC, so less cooling power. Again, I replaced the original fan with a Noctua NF-F12 (no low-noise adapter). Originally I had the CPU cooled by a 240mm AIO radiator but I changed things around and put the CPU (65W) on a 120mm AIO and the GPU (215W) on a 240mm AIO.
The 120mm AIO can adequately handle the 65W 5600X.
The 240mm AIO is perfectly paired with the 215W GPU (an Nvidia GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER). The videocard really needs the extra cooling based on usage (it's for a gaming PC).
I have a "work-in-progress" mini-tower build. I moved my previous 240mm AIO CLC (a CoolerMaster MasterLiquid ML240) into this case and it will cool whatever CPU I put into this. At some point, I will likely buy a GeForce RTX 3080 liquid cooled by a 240mm AIO radiator (EVGA or Gigabyte model). That will go into the front part of the case.
As far as I can tell, much of the thermal dissipation performance is dependent on the builder's skill in applying the right amount of a decent thermal compound.
When I started doing this in summer 2020 I did not have the adequate experience. Today, I have a better understanding on how to apply thermal compound. This has more to do with technique than product selection (I've used Arctic and Noctua pastes and left the pre-applied stuff on the CPU blocks).
I look at my NZXT H1 case's operating temperatures from six months ago and today (using the same AIO and same CPU) and despite the ambient temperature differences (summer vs. winter) I know that much of my higher temperatures before were due to poor thermal compound application technique.
Build #2 -- my micro-ATX case -- has been the best teaching device for me. Poor technique, poor component decisions, and the challenges of working in tight quarters amplify my shortcomings.
Today, I have a great SFF gaming build and its main limitation is the length of GPUs it can support. My 2070 SUPER is pretty close to the limit. I want to step up to a 3080 and that will require me to move to my mini-tower/full-ATX case (build #3). But everything I have done on the micro-ATX build #2 case has influenced decisions on the future gaming case.
I have two 65W TDP Ryzen CPUs: a 3700X in an NZXT H1 mini-ITX SFF case and a 5600X in a cheapo SilverStone micro-ATX case.
Both CPUs stay within the 35-45°C range under normal usage.
The 3700X in the NZXT H1 is connected to the 140mm AIO CLC. Under a stress test it might top out at 65°C with my current super-quiet fan curves (I replaced the NZXT fan with a Noctua + low-noise adapter cable which knocks off about 15% of performance).
The 5600X in the micro-ATX case is connected to a 120mm AIO CLC, so less cooling power. Again, I replaced the original fan with a Noctua NF-F12 (no low-noise adapter). Originally I had the CPU cooled by a 240mm AIO radiator but I changed things around and put the CPU (65W) on a 120mm AIO and the GPU (215W) on a 240mm AIO.
The 120mm AIO can adequately handle the 65W 5600X.
The 240mm AIO is perfectly paired with the 215W GPU (an Nvidia GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER). The videocard really needs the extra cooling based on usage (it's for a gaming PC).
I have a "work-in-progress" mini-tower build. I moved my previous 240mm AIO CLC (a CoolerMaster MasterLiquid ML240) into this case and it will cool whatever CPU I put into this. At some point, I will likely buy a GeForce RTX 3080 liquid cooled by a 240mm AIO radiator (EVGA or Gigabyte model). That will go into the front part of the case.
As far as I can tell, much of the thermal dissipation performance is dependent on the builder's skill in applying the right amount of a decent thermal compound.
When I started doing this in summer 2020 I did not have the adequate experience. Today, I have a better understanding on how to apply thermal compound. This has more to do with technique than product selection (I've used Arctic and Noctua pastes and left the pre-applied stuff on the CPU blocks).
I look at my NZXT H1 case's operating temperatures from six months ago and today (using the same AIO and same CPU) and despite the ambient temperature differences (summer vs. winter) I know that much of my higher temperatures before were due to poor thermal compound application technique.
Build #2 -- my micro-ATX case -- has been the best teaching device for me. Poor technique, poor component decisions, and the challenges of working in tight quarters amplify my shortcomings.
Today, I have a great SFF gaming build and its main limitation is the length of GPUs it can support. My 2070 SUPER is pretty close to the limit. I want to step up to a 3080 and that will require me to move to my mini-tower/full-ATX case (build #3). But everything I have done on the micro-ATX build #2 case has influenced decisions on the future gaming case.
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I was looking at Dell Alienware systems and they are available with 5600X through 5950X CPUs. If you select the 5800X and up, then you are required to select water cooling which is something I've never seen before. These are tower systems and they are 105 watt parts so I was surprised at that requirement. I would not select a water cooled system.
I suspect that the turbo mode may use a lot of power and generate a lot of heat. Not a problem if your workload isn't spikey I think.
I suspect that the turbo mode may use a lot of power and generate a lot of heat. Not a problem if your workload isn't spikey I think.
Just got notification from EVGA queue, Kingpin 3090. Paid for overnight shipping, I’m traveling next week and if my wife signs for the package I might get a divorce. Anyway, need a case that fits 2x360 radiators. So far I’ve found only Lian Li O11 XL, any other suggestions?
You can sightly undervolt cpuThis should be my final change/alteration on my build. At this point, I'm done making any sort of changes or tweaking the computer - I'm at a point now where I'm installing software, and running some benchmarks and restoring my backups.
Overall, I'm pretty happy with the outcome. It was challenging to be sure, I made some mistakes, learned some things, and I think overall it was a positive experience.
I pulled the stock cooler over my lunch hour and put in the Noctua. I already knew this, but yet I probably need to re-learn this. Every board is different. The MSI motherboard that I had, could easily accommodate the cooler, and I was able to squeeze in a fan in the rear.
The Gigabyte motherboard, is different enough that I wasn't able to get a fan in the rear, and the motherboard power cable was impacting the Noctua 140mm fan. I lifted the fan up highter but then putting the glass side was problematic. Instead of forcing it (I learned in life, never force anything
Temps are certainly cooler with this bad boy, Idle, I'm seeing temps about 35 - 40c and underload about 67c while doing an Aida64 stress test. The fans do ramp up, and I can hear them, but its much better over the supplied cooler. There's much less ramping up and down as well.
For comparison sake, when I had the stock cooler, Idle temps were about 40 to 50c, and underload high 70s (about 77 to 78c)
View attachment 1719841
I got similar benchmark result with minor undervolt and temps are cooler
People always believe there is only overclocking but for those of AMD Ryzen cpu, undervolting is not that stupid, the loss of performance is pretty meaningless in comparison of what you will gain in term of temperature gain
Everybody here has some bad ass build. But I am just going to throw some crappy little build of mine, done today.
I was digging my old house, which tenant was moved out. I found out this old case with old components, which is AMD Sempron 2800+, 512MB DDR 1 memory, 100GB HDD and ATi Graphic card..
This was my first computer I build during my high school. I was working at McDonald's back then, and I was buying component by component each pay check. It took me while over 3 months to get all hardware together. It was not a powerful build back then, well you know how high schooler's budget. They funny things is that during early 2004's, AMD's Athlon64 was kicking Intel Pentium 4's ass where AMD Sempron was kicking Intel Celeron's ass. Who knew, 15 years later, AMD's is again kicking Intel's ass with it own Ryzen processor.
Anyway, the new build is:
Intel Core i3 9100F, 12GB DDR4, 500GB Western Digital NVME drive, 1TB Nvidia GT710, 650W Power Supply.
I am in process to waiting for my new case to arrive, when that happens, I will put other AMD build into this case.
This case brought so much memories. Where I was so excited to build my very first PC, where I was so excited when it turned on. I was so excited that it was built using my own money and I was very happy when I first launched games.
This build is never meant to be powerful, kick ass, RGB build. It meant to cherish my own memory. I never wanted to throw out this case and hardware with it.