Coffee Lake 8th gen Intel CPU benchmarks are out: 65 Watt i5-8400 beats i7-7700K

[sublunar]

I was hoping that Apple would turn out new high-end iMacs with Coffee Lake when they release the PoweriMacProSupremeDelux in December 2017...

Hope doesn't work with Apple products, though.

They could release them as early as March '18, per general schedules of updates. That's probably hopeful, as well, so in reality, those Coffee Lakes will be here in June '18. Just in time for Intel to release Cannon, or even Ice, Lake.

I've said before, it wouldn't be a good idea to release a 6 core iMac to muddy the water before the iMac Pro comes out but no upgrades could make it a second successive October with no Mac desktop updates.

Wouldn't it be bizarre if an October refresh just jiggled the storage options or introduced a space grey colour option before the 6 core main event next March?

 

[itdk92]

I know Intel has said this 8000 hips are not compatible with logic boards of the 200 series, but I still can’t help but wondering if it would work in a 21” or 27” iMac 2017

 

[cynics]

Frankly, if the 65W 8th gen i5 is going to be faster than the current 91W i7, it sounds like the sweet spot for an all-in-one, so dropping the i7 option and re-designing the iMac for 65W max actually starts to look like a sensible option - leaving the field clear for the iMac Pro and Mac Pro,

Otherwise, the 6-core 8700K would be nipping at the heels of the 8-core Xeon, might even beat it on single-core benchmarks (and Xeons tend to get updated less frequently).

Dropping the i7 would be counter productive. Only way for Apple to stay relevant is to use a CPU that can match the competition. A redesign to accommodate modern hardware makes more sense.

Even a 4 core Core series CPU decimates 8+ core Xeon series in most task. Adding a 6 core i7 to the iMac only makes the Core series SLIGHTLY better at what the Xeon series already excels at.

This is all task specific stuff but the clock frequency plays a bigger roll average task than core count does.

Its not until you get into things like multi user servers, real-time processes like AI and analytics, crunching massive amounts of data, high end transcoding (feature length 4k HEVC), etc that the Xeon really starts to shine. And or doing multiples of those things at the same time.

However due to the Xeons low frequency and most programs not being able to leverage more than 4 cores it no a benefit and generally a hinderance. Games is a easy to measure example, at a resolution that the CPU becomes the bottleneck the 8700K will wipe for the floor with any Xeon available.

 

[itdk92]

Even a 4 core Core series CPU decimates 8+ core Xeon series in most task.
...

Meh, not really. Beside the need to define “most tasks” before we talk about it, I would argue “most tasks” is not what people by a Xeon for.

That would be to run pro apps.

So that 6 core is very welcome

 

[theluggage]

Dropping the i7 would be counter productive. Only way for Apple to stay relevant is to use a CPU that can match the competition. A redesign to accommodate modern hardware makes more sense.

Except that re-designing for a max. 65W processor rather than having to accommodate 91W opens up a lot more design possibilities for a slim, quiet, all-in-one design.

The thing is, the current i5 is already enough for most people - and there's been a lot of discussion on these forums about people- especially those doing audio stuff - plumping for the quieter i5 over the i7 - and it sounds like the new i5 is going to beat the current i7. Its only really the pro 4k video and 3D brigade that really need the i7 at the moment - who are exactly the same people who will benefit from the extra I/O bandwidth, stability and extra physical cores of the Xeon.

To match the competition, Apple need a desktop mini-tower system that has the space to keep a high-end i7 cool, quietly, and take a desktop-class GPU. That is almost certainly not coming soon.

 

[Precursor]

Except that re-designing for a max. 65W processor rather than having to accommodate 91W opens up a lot more design possibilities for a slim, quiet, all-in-one design.

The thing is, the current i5 is already enough for most people - and there's been a lot of discussion on these forums about people- especially those doing audio stuff - plumping for the quieter i5 over the i7 - and it sounds like the new i5 is going to beat the current i7. Its only really the pro 4k video and 3D brigade that really need the i7 at the moment - who are exactly the same people who will benefit from the extra I/O bandwidth, stability and extra physical cores of the Xeon.

To match the competition, Apple need a desktop mini-tower system that has the space to keep a high-end i7 cool, quietly, and take a desktop-class GPU. That is almost certainly not coming soon.

Apple could easily make a Mac with i5-i7 CPU and latest-bestest GPU in the Mac Pro enclosure (the cylinder one) with no heat/noise issues. (and call it only "Mac", since it wouldn't be Pro lol)
I'd buy that in a heartbeat, THAT would beat the competetion.

 

[theluggage]

Apple could easily make a Mac with i5-i7 CPU and latest-bestest GPU in the Mac Pro enclosure

...not so sure about that - the thermal design of the nMP was very, very dependent on that triangular core spreading the load three ways between a CPU and dual GPUs, with the GPUs doing a lot of "GPU computing" work via OpenCL. The nMP is as a dead-end design built around one specific configuration.

No, the hole in Apple's range is still a desktop system with an i7 and a couple of PCIe slots and a choice of GPUs that is compact, but not so much as to cripple it thermally. Call it the "Mac Truck" Trouble is, it is never going to be a money-spinner in itself, but would be an indirect strategic asset by keeping the Mac platform popular with enthusiasts and developers (you know, the people who persuade family, friends, colleagues, bosses etc. to buy Macs and ensure that there is a good range of software and support available - either by writing it or providing a market for it - and don't even charge a commission).

10 years ago, the mini tower was still the mainstay of personal computing, and a Mac mini tower might have cannibalised higher margin iMac and laptop sales - these days, I'm not so sure.

It would be absolutely brilliant if the new Mac Pro range started with an i7/desktop GPU combo at an affordable price - especially with these new i7s - but I expect its going to be a Xeon/ECC thing starting at a minimum of $4000 that might be good value if you're a video pro who can put a price tag on every 10 minutes of editing time and every glitch in a 48 hour render job that might have been prevented by ECC...