do i need this "trim" thing?

[locust76]

I've had my Crucial M4 boot drive going now for six months or so without trim, and it still gets the same speeds during tests as before I cloned my OS on it. I only use 98GB out of the 256GB available, and frequently drag large files on the desktop before relocating them to other drives, but other than that I never "fill it up" or anything.

That said, I haven't had any issues, either. Apps boot quick, nothing hangs or gets glitchy... nothing. (Knock on wood, right?) If something were to start screwing up on my M4, I'd try it then. Until then, I subscribe to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

Read speed is not affected by poor garbage collection, only write speeds, and garbage collects when files are frequently deleted. You don't need to fill the drive up at all. Moving files from one location to another on the same drive is not what you think: the file remains physically in the same place on the drive (i.e., it takes up the same memory cells as before), but it has it's reference changed in the file table as to which directory it's under.

I guarantee you that your write speeds are not what they once were.

 

[wonderspark]

Read speed is not affected by poor garbage collection, only write speeds, and garbage collects when files are frequently deleted. You don't need to fill the drive up at all. Moving files from one location to another on the same drive is not what you think: the file remains physically in the same place on the drive (i.e., it takes up the same memory cells as before), but it has it's reference changed in the file table as to which directory it's under.

I guarantee you that your write speeds are not what they once were.

I decided to test this. I ran AJA and my speeds were the same.

So, I turned TRIM on, and it says TRIM is enabled and "everything looks super," but now my write speeds dropped by 15MB/sec. It actually slowed my writes down immediately.

I'll be turning that right off. No thanks.

 

[locust76]

I decided to test this. I ran AJA and my speeds were the same.

So, I turned TRIM on, and it says TRIM is enabled and "everything looks super," but now my write speeds dropped by 15MB/sec. It actually slowed my writes down immediately.

I'll be turning that right off. No thanks.

TRIM is a process, it's not an option that you just flip on and everything's good to go. The drive has to scan for garbage and TRIM it out. When your OS has TRIM enabled, then it TRIMs after a deletion, but if you haven't TRIMmed before, your drive has to scan over everything and clean it up. You probably ran a speed test in the middle of a TRIM operation.

I've got Win 7 (TRIM enabled by default) and a Samsung SSD. Yesterday I did a speed test after 6 months of usage, and my write speeds were the same as day 1. (390MB/Sec)

 

[wonderspark]

TRIM is a process, it's not an option that you just flip on and everything's good to go. The drive has to scan for garbage and TRIM it out. When your OS has TRIM enabled, then it TRIMs after a deletion, but if you haven't TRIMmed before, your drive has to scan over everything and clean it up. You probably ran a speed test in the middle of a TRIM operation.

I've got Win 7 (TRIM enabled by default) and a Samsung SSD. Yesterday I did a speed test after 6 months of usage, and my write speeds were the same as day 1. (390MB/Sec)

I'm no expert on the matter, but I turned TRIM off and rebooted to get it totally inactive, and my speeds went right back to the same speed as day 1 and earlier this evening. So for me:

TRIM on = 15MB/sec slower
TRIM off = same speed as fresh out of box.

It's not the first time I've heard of this behavior. Someone else said their speed dropped after turning on TRIM. I never tried it myself until now, and it proved to be true for me as well. On the other hand, I've read that Crucial M4 garbage collection is excellent, and I can't argue with that at all, based on my own tests and 1700 hours on my SSD.

If my write speeds drop more than 15MB/sec with TRIM off, I'll try turning it on again, and see if it improves it. Otherwise, I'm just handicapping my speeds for no reason with TRIM on my M4.

Isn't it possible that the benefits vary depending on exactly which SSD is being used? Maybe Crucial's garbage collection really is that great.

 

[locust76]

I'm not sure that TRIM support in the firmware of the drive is enough, I think it also has to be enabled by the OS. If not, why is there even TRIM support on the OS level? How is the drive going to know what's a deleted file and what's not? The drive has no idea what kind of file system it's formatted with, it only knows cells and sectors.

Though I suppose if you had a controller capable of reading the filesystem and knowing which files should be deleted and which should not, then you don't really need the OS telling you the same info.

 

[wonderspark]

I don't know, but I also cannot explain why my read/write speeds have not changed since day one with TRIM disabled, either. People say it will slow down, but I have no idea how many months or years that will take to happen.

 

[GermanyChris]

enable trim..then go into single user mode the do a file system check..

fsck -fy

it'll trim rather than wait on the OS to do it while idle...It'll still take a bit for the garbage collection to happen

 

[derbothaus]

OWC and Sandforce "play" just as well on OS X as they do on Win. It has nothing to really do with OS or filesystem. It has to do with firmware and crappy NAND. You can get great ones. I have a great 6G OWC and an Intel 520 and you can get crap as I have had to send 2 OWC's back after quick death. Neither require TRIM for any performance advantage as I use them at 40-60% full and as boot disk's. I have enabled and disabled. Enabling also does not seem to have any detrimental effect. YMMV. But let's stop with the laugh that OS has anything to do with it. SF is a crap-shoot pure and simple.

 

[Apple Corps]

The OWC ssd did NOT PLAY WELL with my MP 4,1 - up to date firmware all around.

My comments are not OS X related but focused on how their 6G ssd could not be made to work for whatever the reasons on my 4,1.

 

[derbothaus]

The OWC ssd did NOT PLAY WELL with my MP 4,1 - up to date firmware all around.

My comments are not OS X related but focused on how their 6G ssd could not be made to work for whatever the reasons on my 4,1.

I understand. Same with my 5,1. Link controller was an issue. Nvidia chipset. They must not have tested too broadly. Intel connects seem to be solid.