Does true, easy 5.1 require a software or hardware update?

[JonHimself]

You don't have to roll your eyes Just because it is CURRENTLY only outputting 2.0 PCM doesn't mean it isn't capable of outputting multi-channel PCM.

Again, please stop spreading FUD with that know-it-all tone.

I assume that apple TV has all the required certifications, and optical cables can obviously transfer 5.1 sound, so yeah, I agree... I don't see why it wouldn't be able to with a software update..

 

[sycho]

I assume that apple TV has all the required certifications, and optical cables can obviously transfer 5.1 sound, so yeah, I agree... I don't see why it wouldn't be able to with a software update..

Optical cables can only transfer compressed 5.1, not 5.1 PCM. The AppleTV does not have the hardware to convert AAC or PCM 5.1 in AC3. All iTunes bought content is AAC. Further more, there isn't any 5.1 content on iTunes besides the HD Trailers.

 

[skrutzen]

I just downloaded a DTS file and it played perfectly. My receiver switched to DTS and everything. Now how do I rip my dvds to include the DTS track? I am a fan of DTS and try to buy as many movies with that track. Lord Of the Rings has Discrete 6.1 and sounds amazing! I would love to be able to have those movies with DTS attached to it.

 

[Peace]

New Apple specific 5.1 codecs are on the way.

Trust me.Would I lie to you ?

 

[netdog]

New Apple specific 5.1 codecs are on the way.

Trust me.Would I lie to you ?

Given what some have done with the USB connection, I am really curious to see what plans Apple has for this port.

As for the codecs, I think you are certainly correct, and lie is such a strong word.

 

[bankshot]

I don't have the answer but I found this a very interesting read.

Nice find. I was going to suggest essentially what they say (and they say it in far more detail!), though it was only a stab in the dark since I don't have an AppleTV. Good to know that it's possible.

Essentially, you can play 5.1 audio by putting it inside a WAV, AIFF, or Apple Lossless container and sending it through a digital output to a home theater receiver that decodes the 5.1 bitstream. I know because I've done this with iTunes, using both my Macbook's digital out and the Airport Express digital out. Both worked flawlessly. I simply imported a DTS-encoded CD (The Police - Every Breath You Take) into iTunes as Apple Lossless and then played through the digital outputs. It was that simple.

One note of caution - as the above webpage also mentions, you can't play these files over your computer speakers or any analog output. The 5.1-encoded bitstream will be misinterpreted as 2-channel PCM audio, which will sound like VERY LOUD NOISE over analog speakers.

The missing link here seems to be whether this is possible with a QuickTime video file (actually they may address this in the webpage -- I just skimmed it). This would almost make the AppleTV look appealing if I could rip my DVDs and manually add the 5.1 audio track to the resulting QuickTime file. I'd still lose the DVD menus, but it'd almost be worth the savings over a Mac mini.

 

[mollie319]

Well,

I to think 5.1. is no issue on the AppleTV.

I've done the exact same thing as 'Bankshot' only with other files.
In the Apple Forums they discuss this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=901601&tstart=0

I've downloaded a file, and put it in iTunes.
it's an DTS 5.1 96/24 sound file (.wav)
I synced the file on my AppleTV, play the file
and my receiver (Yamaha) outputs on the display:

DTS 5.1 channel sound

All the speakers lit up:
front - left
Center
front - right

rear right
rear left
Subwoofer

When I play an stereo tune, it simple display these speakers:
front - left
front - right

So, that means that the AppleTV can output 5.1 channel sound.

I've used an HDMI cable from the AppleTV to my Receiver.
Works flawlesy

Marcel

 

[netdog]

AppleTV is looking better and better. Again, like iPhone, the key may be in its own flexibility as a little Mac as opposed to a piece of hardware with an embedded system .

 

[princealfie]

Hardware IS ALREADY THERE . The apple tv has a Realtek ALC885 decoding chip.



All it needs is the proper SOFTWARE to support the features.

But can the chip have the processor speed to run the 5 channels separately?

 

[pengu]

Well,

I to think 5.1. is no issue on the AppleTV.

I've done the exact same thing as 'Bankshot' only with other files.
In the Apple Forums they discuss this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=901601&tstart=0

I've downloaded a file, and put it in iTunes.
it's an DTS 5.1 96/24 sound file (.wav)
I synced the file on my AppleTV, play the file
and my receiver (Yamaha) outputs on the display:

DTS 5.1 channel sound

All the speakers lit up:
front - left
Center
front - right

rear right
rear left
Subwoofer

When I play an stereo tune, it simple display these speakers:
front - left
front - right

So, that means that the AppleTV can output 5.1 channel sound.

I've used an HDMI cable from the AppleTV to my Receiver.
Works flawlesy

Marcel

good to hear, but not very suprising really. As you said, itunes/quicktime will pass the ac3/dts in the same file over optical out, and ?TV is running osx, no doubt with quicktime to playback media files.. i will see if i can build a .mov file or a .mp4 file with AC3/DTS and video content. if i succeed and it plays in QT, i'll put the file online for someone to check on an ?TV if someone is willing.

 

[pengu]

well good news and bad news.

a quicktime movie with video and the audio from an AC3/DTS encoded wav file does play, and QT does send the encoded stream to my z5500's decoder.

however. the problem is. it seems you need Dolby Encoder software to create a WAV/AIFF file with 5.1 encoded content. the cheapest i saw was $US249.

i tried all manner of combinations (using some ac3 i ripped from a 007 dvd) but i could not produce a file that QT would pass the ac3 stream to the optical port.


so basically. we CAN have 5.1 audio in a movie playing with ?TV, but we have no way to actually encode the 5.1 audio into the correct format, so the only audio we can use is what's available online (ie, demos of AC3/WAV files, or DTS files from Radio Sweden.. neither of which seem particularly ideal )

 

[Diatribe]

well good news and bad news.

a quicktime movie with video and the audio from an AC3/DTS encoded wav file does play, and QT does send the encoded stream to my z5500's decoder.

however. the problem is. it seems you need Dolby Encoder software to create a WAV/AIFF file with 5.1 encoded content. the cheapest i saw was $US249.

i tried all manner of combinations (using some ac3 i ripped from a 007 dvd) but i could not produce a file that QT would pass the ac3 stream to the optical port.


so basically. we CAN have 5.1 audio in a movie playing with ?TV, but we have no way to actually encode the 5.1 audio into the correct format, so the only audio we can use is what's available online (ie, demos of AC3/WAV files, or DTS files from Radio Sweden.. neither of which seem particularly ideal )

Thanks for the tests. I guess we will have to wait and see what Apple does.

 

[sycho]

Well,

I to think 5.1. is no issue on the AppleTV.

I've done the exact same thing as 'Bankshot' only with other files.
In the Apple Forums they discuss this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=901601&tstart=0

I've downloaded a file, and put it in iTunes.
it's an DTS 5.1 96/24 sound file (.wav)
I synced the file on my AppleTV, play the file
and my receiver (Yamaha) outputs on the display:

DTS 5.1 channel sound

All the speakers lit up:
front - left
Center
front - right

rear right
rear left
Subwoofer

When I play an stereo tune, it simple display these speakers:
front - left
front - right

So, that means that the AppleTV can output 5.1 channel sound.

I've used an HDMI cable from the AppleTV to my Receiver.
Works flawlesy

Marcel

The problem with these kinda of encoding is that people using regular stereo connections are only going to hear static. I ask you this, would you want a CD encoded like this where you can only play it on a system that has a digital connection to the receiver? That mean no car CD players, no boomboxes, no typical CD player set up. That is why this is not a great option.

 

[pengu]

The problem with these kinda of encoding is that people using regular stereo connections are only going to hear static. I ask you this, would you want a CD encoded like this where you can only play it on a system that has a digital connection to the receiver? That mean no car CD players, no boomboxes, no typical CD player set up. That is why this is not a great option.

its a great option for anyone with a Dolby/DTS decoder connected to their ?TV. if you dont have one, don't encode the audio. its not a solution apple is likely to offer, its a way for those of us who want to add our own movies to the ?TV.

i'd love if apple added Dolby Digital Live (takes a sound the "system" is playing with more then 2 channel, encodes it to Dolby Digital 5.1 (maybe even DD EX?) and sents it out the optical/coax port in real time. this would mean we could have AAC5.1 in mp4 movies, and the ?TV would send the required AC3 encoded stream to the decoder. if they did that, i'd be hoping something simmilar was available for the computer lineup too..

 

[mollie319]

The problem with these kinda of encoding is that people using regular stereo connections are only going to hear static. I ask you this, would you want a CD encoded like this where you can only play it on a system that has a digital connection to the receiver? That mean no car CD players, no boomboxes, no typical CD player set up. That is why this is not a great option.

I don't know.
But the discussion was about AppleTV and 5.1 surround sound.
People, like yourself, seems 2 know everything about the AppleTV, even that it doesn't output 5.1 sound.

I say it does. My simple test proves that. Other tests prove that too.
Whatever other people do, with car stereo's I don't care.
The AppleTV CAN output 5.1 surround sound.

And I think Apple wouldn't be that stupid to put it on the market and have no 5.1 sound.

Marcel

 

[Flynnstone]

It seems like we need a Wiki about what can go into a receiver (audio).

I read that the AppleTV can do DTS pass through.
Is there an easy way to rip my DVD with something like Handbrake and get the DTS soundtrack?
Is there (free, lowcost) software the can transcode Dolby Digital or Dolby prologic (or other) to another format that the AppleTv can pass through? Such as DTS?
Many (most?) surround sound receivers have a digital input (Toslink or coax).

If I read all this audio about the AppleTV. It can do surround via it's two audio output channels with a receiver that does Dolby Pro logic (not Dolby Digital) or it can do surround via DTS (others?) via Toslink and pass through.

 

[kavika411]

Thank you to everyone who has attempted to answer the question in my orignal post. Based upon your thorough, well thought out, completely contradicting answers, I make the following declaration to Apple:

Neither I nor a small legion of Apple/iTunes devotees will, no matter how much we want to, buy an Apple TV until you give us even a clue to the most rudimentary of questions - WHAT PREPARATIONS HAVE YOU MADE TO PLAY 5.1 SURROUND FOR THE COMMON VIEWER/LISTENER?

 

[localoid]

Thank you to everyone who has attempted to answer the question in my orignal post. Based upon your thorough, well thought out, completely contradicting answers, I make the following declaration to Apple:

All of the threads here about "teh 5.1" remind me of the "are Quadraphonic LP Records real or a fraud" discussions circa the early-1970's...

I don't think there's been that many, if any, "completely contradicting answers" in this thread -- the differences of opinions have centered around the "details" and pros and cons of using such methods; for example, the "details" regarding raw-streaming of a previously encoded DD sound file to the Apple TV: It's said to work, but for anyone without a receiver w/AC-3 decoder it will sound like very loud static. Yadda, yadda, yadda...

But I think it's important to note that all the (different) opinions and reporting of various findings have made the thread that much more valuable!

Neither I nor a small legion of Apple/iTunes devotees will, no matter how much we want to, buy an Apple TV until you give us even a clue to the most rudimentary of questions - WHAT PREPARATIONS HAVE YOU MADE TO PLAY 5.1 SURROUND FOR THE COMMON VIEWER/LISTENER?

Apple isn't advertising tv as being 5.1-ready... But I'd think it's logical to assume that Apple is probably among the best "prepared" in the industry in regards to anything "content" related, esp. content that has anything to do with making a profit is concerned. After all, its iTunes Store is the Internet's #1 source of (legal) downloads of paid content. However, since Apple rarely comments in detail on future plans, I doubt you'll hear any "official" comment from Apple in advance of a product offering...

Meanwhile... the off-the-shelf solution to "teh 5.1" problem that Hollywood wants every "consumer" to use is centered around playback of content via optical discs, e.g., Hollywood wants "protection" on such content -- DRM, et al. When any kind of recording or copying of content becomes "easy" (for Joe Average Public to do)... Hollywood has nightmares about dollar bills spouting wings and flying away.

Remember the recently published Steve Jobs' open letter about DRM and music?

 

[Mossman]

Working here

As Marcel has done, I downloaded a DTS WAV file and put it into iTunes and it played perfectly - yes, I have got the TV hooked up to a Yamaha 5.1 amp, and then into Miller and Kriesel Speakers

 

[GregA]

Essentially, you can play 5.1 audio by putting it inside a WAV, AIFF, or Apple Lossless container and sending it through a digital output to a home theater receiver that decodes the 5.1 bitstream. I know because I've done this with iTunes, using both my Macbook's digital out and the Airport Express digital out. Both worked flawlessly. I simply imported a DTS-encoded CD (The Police - Every Breath You Take) into iTunes as Apple Lossless and then played through the digital outputs. It was that simple.

I assume that's what these files are?
http://hdonappletv.webhop.net/

I'll have to have a play tomorrow when visiting my parents.

 

[pickerin]

AppleTV plays DTS 5.1 without Modifications

OK, explain how the AppleTV is going to output when it only has SPDIF and a HDMI which is only outputting 2.0 PCM?

Easy. It has a TOSlink, Optical Digital Audio. No limitations in the hardware.

In fact, my AppleTV is CURRENTLY OUTPUTTING DTS 5.1 AUDIO, with no modifications at all.

See my post here on the Forums for the details. However, if you have an AppleTV, iTunes, and time to download a 60 or 80MB DTS 5.1 reference file. Then you too can prove to yourself that there is nothing stopping 5.1 audio from playing on the AppleTV *unmodded*. It's all about the content baby!

And...the next release of Handbrake will properly encode the 6-channel audio so that our DVD rips have 5.1 and will play it on the AppleTV.

There is a great article on Digg that you should check out, I didn't post it, but I'd like people to Digg it up so we can once and for all settle this discussion and get more of these into people's hands.

Here's the article on Digg: Ten Myths of the Apple TV 5.1 Audio

-Rob

 

[MacCanuck]

WRONG!!

It is not a software issue people, it is a HARDWARE limitation.

That is the pretty much the same thing in the MacBook, iMac, MacMinis and Mac Pros. All of those only output stereo PCM.

I have played DVD's on my Mac Mini that produce 5.1 surround to my receiver. I had to turn on a Digitial Output in the DVD player app, but it worked very well. So I doubt it's a hardware issue.

 

[MacCanuck]

Easy. It has a TOSlink, Optical Digital Audio. No limitations in the hardware.

In fact, my AppleTV is CURRENTLY OUTPUTTING DTS 5.1 AUDIO, with no modifications at all.

See my post here on the Forums for the details. However, if you have an AppleTV, iTunes, and time to download a 60 or 80MB DTS 5.1 reference file. Then you too can prove to yourself that there is nothing stopping 5.1 audio from playing on the AppleTV *unmodded*. It's all about the content baby!

And...the next release of Handbrake will properly encode the 6-channel audio so that our DVD rips have 5.1 and will play it on the AppleTV.

There is a great article on Digg that you should check out, I didn't post it, but I'd like people to Digg it up so we can once and for all settle this discussion and get more of these into people's hands.

Here's the article on Digg: Ten Myths of the Apple TV 5.1 Audio

-Rob

Thanks for the link. I am playing some of the sample DTS 5.1 WAV files right now on my AppleTV. My receiver is decoding it perfectly. So I suppose it's a matter of encoding the content with a compressed enough version and then upconverting to DTS or DolbyDigital.

Now if only I could buy movies online up here in Canada!

 

[backstagetv]

So, now i know soon HandBrake could help me convert a DVD straight to something my AppleTV plays and with support of 5.1 sound, cool!

Now, how about i don't have the source DVD, but an AC3-DivX .avi rip of it?
Is there still a way to convert this into something my AppleTV will play and still keep/support the 5.1?
Or is that just too much asked?

Fyi, my AppleTV connects to a standard AV-Receiver with built-in AC3-DTS Decoder...

I'd really appreciate if anyone could shed some light on this, as i've been searching for some time now on how to do this...
Thanks a lot.

BSTV

 

[Edandlindz28]

So, now i know soon HandBrake could help me convert a DVD straight to something my AppleTV plays and with support of 5.1 sound, cool!

Now, how about i don't have the source DVD, but an AC3-DivX .avi rip of it?
Is there still a way to convert this into something my AppleTV will play and still keep/support the 5.1?
Or is that just too much asked?

Fyi, my AppleTV connects to a standard AV-Receiver with built-in AC3-DTS Decoder...

I'd really appreciate if anyone could shed some light on this, as i've been searching for some time now on how to do this...
Thanks a lot.

BSTV

Don't know if this would work, but have you looked at the MPEG player by squared5. they have away to convert .avi to mp4, but I can't remember the audio output. Or drag the .avi to iMovie, but I don't know if that will export with 5.1.