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Espresso Enthusiasts
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I have since given up coffee. Sometimes I miss it, but in hindsight recognize a component was the caffeine addiction. I’m drinking herbal drinks such a Teccino brand Hazlenut composed of: Roasted organic carob, organic barley, organic chicory, dates, almonds, natural hazelnut flavor, organic figs. It’s delicious, minus the caffeine. Oh, and I love Sicily.
Starbuck's coffee in Europe is very poor; burnt, thin, and utterly characterless.
However, in coffee cultures such as Italy, it is virtually impossible to get a poorly prepared coffee; they take a pride in preparing superb coffee - vine in the most remote spots, as I discovered (again) over the past two week in the Balkans.
Couldn't agree more.
Almost every local coffee shop will serve something far superior.
I have since given up coffee. Sometimes I miss it, but in hindsight recognize a component was the caffeine addiction. I’m drinking herbal drinks such a Teccino brand Hazlenut composed of: Roasted organic carob, organic barley, organic chicory, dates, almonds, natural hazelnut flavor, organic figs. It’s delicious, minus the caffeine. Oh, and I love Sicily.
But it is not coffee.
The tools we use, a great machine, certainly makes all of the difference.
You can almost make great coffee with any beans with a great machine.
With great quality beans you can make good coffee without a machine. With the greatest beans and a outstanding machine you make world class coffee/espresso.
Your description of Starbucks coffee is quite uncanny to me. I often describe the taste, here in the US, how I think burnt motor oil might taste. Its just awful to me.
Thin, burnt, over-roasted, and bitter. Quite horrible. Agreed, it is awful.
The pity of it is that the actual ambience and atmosphere of some of the Starbuck's cafés is not too bad, though I deplore their horrible habit of commercial cannibalisation.
Oh I agree totally, I have never gone to Starbucks if I've ever had a choice.
Incidentally, I think their real problem comes down to how often they clean the machines. If the machine is spotless- no old grounds around the joint, all the old deposits cleaned out regularly, then the coffee might taste better if they are using good coffee. But even the best beans will taste bitter if the machine isn't clean (or if they are over extracted).
For what it's worth, I'm currently on my seventh espresso machine. I've had basic Krupps, Magimix and Riviera and Barr. I've had two all-in-one machines- DeLonghi and Seaco and my current machine is a Rocket Cellini Evoluzione V2
Which was just too beautiful not to buy.
https://rocket-espresso.com
I've got a Mahlkonig Vario grinder
It is entirely possible that they don't clean their machines - and I agree, if a machine is not clean this will have an unfortunate effect on how the coffee tastes - but, apart from that, I think Starbuck's doesn't use good coffee in the first place, they over-roast, and the coffee tastes thin, burnt and bitter.
An aside: How do you find the Mahlkonig Vario grinder?
Glad to find an espresso section on MacRumors! I switched from Starbucks last year by purchasing a Nespresso machine. I find that I drink much less coffee and enjoy it more. Would love to step up to another espresso machine at some point but don't really know where to start or if I'll really make the time to take advantage of it. Starbucks lattes taste ok to me but, as mentioned above, kinda burnt and bitter. Also, I find that when I go back to Starbucks drinks they now feel loaded with caffeine compared to what I'm drinking.
Well, as you can see this is a long thread, populated by enthusiasts, who will be more than happy to offer advice and comments and chat about coffee with you.
I am also partial to Kenyan coffee and to coffee from Yemen; personally, I like the "clean, bright, clear" notes of the coffees from the Horn of Africa.
Honestly, it isn't really that impressive.
That is, it produces a consistent grind and a precise measured dose and has plenty of adjustments so from the functional point of view it's very good.
But the first one sprang to pieces in a shower of sparks and they were not at all helpful. Fortunately, the company I bought it from replaced it as a commercial gesture so kudos and thanks to them.
But I've had problems with the ceramic burrs, and I've had to replace the pulley and belt and parts aren't that easy to find. I've had it about three years I think.
Maybe I've been unlucky and as I said, it does work fine but I would look elsewhere if I were looking today.
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Oh, and I forgot. There's a sensor on the hopper so it won't work if it isn't in exactly in the right place and I have a cocktail stick jammed in the back or it doesn't work.
I'm really not that hard on these things. The Rocket has been faultless.
At a resort we frequently go to at Universal Studios (the Portofino), they have an onsite Starbucks and to be honest, it's an extremely solid cup of coffee (we don't do anything blended just the dark roast option, straight up). It about the only time - outside of a rare Sugar-Powered-Something-Something-Latte at Barnes & Nobles - we go to Starbucks.
Maybe it's the environment, the early visit (usually for an early park day so like before 7a), just the generally happy vibe of being at a terrifically fun theme park, but, it's never bad there
I say this as someone currently drinking a cup of coffee, by way of ground-this-morning in a burr grinder, roasted this past week, locally sourced beans, brewed via a French press with filtered water, with a very controlled temp.
Maybe it's the environment, the early visit (usually for an early park day so like before 7a), just the generally happy vibe of being at a terrifically fun theme park, but, it's never bad there
I say this as someone currently drinking a cup of coffee, by way of ground-this-morning in a burr grinder, roasted this past week, locally sourced beans, brewed via a French press with filtered water, with a very controlled temp.
Thanks a lot for taking the time and trouble to write (and post) this answer. Much appreciated.
I have been thinking about purchasing a Mahlkonig Vario grinder (or a Baratza) in the relatively near future.
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I have given up on Starbucks, awful stuff. I find Costa to be much better. I did, however have a bad flat white there the other day and took it back. The barista said that they now make their drinks with Simi-skimmed milk and if you want whole (full fat) milk, you have to now ask for it! He told me it was because so many people ask for Simi-skimmed nowadays. Madness.
As for your Nespresso machine, I was in their shop in the Trafford Centre, Manchester this afternoon and tried some of their new Ethiopian coffee. Superb and bought some.
Oh, good grief.
And you have to request the civilised option?
The tyranny of semi-skimmed milk (more tasteless nonsense).
At home, I always have organic whole full fat milk, and - on the good days, shortly after it has been delivered by the person whose cows produce it - I will also have some organic raw full fat milk (delicious) - the sort where the cream rises, and gives you a white moustache of the sort you had when you drank this stuff as a kid.
In a matter related more to what we are drinking, it's looking like we could soon lose Guatemalan coffees, and more coffees around the world to Coffee Rust. It's spreading and very likely to keep evolving, which will defeat the already genetically modified coffee trees that are currently out there. It will be a sad day if this keeps spreading. I didn't even know that Ceylon once was a coffee growing empire or that the rust wiped it out. Sadly, there is no cure for it, fungi are tough to kill.
https://www.npr.org/sections/thesal...can-crop-150-years-ago-it-wiped-out-an-empire
https://www.npr.org/sections/thesal...can-crop-150-years-ago-it-wiped-out-an-empire
Very interesting, and I hadn't known that.
However, it may depend on the nature of the response by the relevant authorities.
In the 1970s, the coffee crop in Kenya (which relies heavily on coffee) was destroyed by a mixture of disease and drought.
The government invested a lot of time and money attempting to address that.
When I was last there, earlier this summer, I was given a private tour of a government agricultural facility (and college) which was devoted to research of this nature and to growing coffee, (I was shown the nurseries, as well) and the institution gives courses to people in how to grow coffee, harvest it, look after it, market it, and so on.
This meant - that after a considerable amount of research - they developed a robust varietal of Arabica coffee with they grafted onto Ugandan robusta coffee plants - bred to be disease resistant and to offer a good yield relatively rapidly (all of which would make it quite profitable).
Now, I'll readily grant that it is not quite as good as some of the austere coffee varieties that take longer to grow, and yield less but taste terrific.
A cup of Rwandan with brown sugar after supper, an excellent way to round out a meal.
Ah, Rwandan coffee; haven't tried some of that in quite a while. Do enjoy.