For the price, you can beat the AirPods Max.

[Cashmonee]

I never meant to suggest that APMs duplicate the experience in a THX certified Dolby Atmos theater. Nor will it duplicate a home theater setup that cost several thousand dollars. But I bet if you compare a $550 "home theater in a box" deals with APMs, the headphones would win.

The main point is APMs duplicate the Dolby encoded soundtrack with as much audio quality as the headphones can produce. Sounds that arise from the side or rear are heard as the filmmaker intended them to be heard. Ambient sounds have appropriate volume levels. A purely bass thump is felt instead of heard. Etc.

Herein lies a shortcoming of the APMs. If you feel the bass muddles the soundtrack, you have no way of adjusting that via EQ settings. This will vary, to a wide degree, depending on the source material. GvK does have tons a bass and will overpower the soundtrack, as the filmmakers didn't mix their tracks with headphones in mind. Other soundtracks are much better. It would great if one day we get an alternate soundtrack that is EQ'd for headphones.

Previously, I would only use headphones watching video when I had to, and I have Focals with Dragonfly Cobalt DAC. It's just hard to listen soundtracks in stereo when you are used to 5.1. With APMs, it's an acceptable alternative (but NOT an improvement) to my home setup.

I wasn't meaning to imply that you personally had said that, though I admit that is how it came off. I was more thinking about some of the sentiment I have heard in various forums, etc. I agree that they do a good job of simulating surround. I just see a lot of over the top comments sometimes, similar to the way people talk about Sonos or even Homepods. They are good for what they are, but still not as good as "the real thing" so to speak. Which I think we agree on.

 

[dandrewk]

Hyperbole? On an internet forum? Never!

I am guilty of that on occasion. In this instance, it's more of a reaction to the idea that Spatial Audio is a cute parlor track that is pretty cool, but adds little in terms of the listening experience. It's more than that. The ability to create cinematic Dolby Atmos is something new. Sony has it with their 3D immersive sound, but that's for music, and only works with music that has Dolby Amos Music encoded in the stream.

If you don't watch lots of video, then it's a non-factor. Otherwise, it can make viewing content on smaller, portable devices more enjoyable. It needs to branch out into other devices though. As much as an iPad Pro has the best PQ of any portable device, it still can't match a 65" LG OLED panel. Apple is readying their next generation Apple TV, and I'd bet the house it's Spatial Audio enabled. I'm really looking forward to that.

 

[Cashmonee]

Hyperbole? On an internet forum? Never!

I am guilty of that on occasion. In this instance, it's more of a reaction to the idea that Spatial Audio is a cute parlor track that is pretty cool, but adds little in terms of the listening experience. It's more than that. The ability to create cinematic Dolby Atmos is something new. Sony has it with their 3D immersive sound, but that's for music, and only works with music that has Dolby Amos Music encoded in the stream.

If you don't watch lots of video, then it's a non-factor. Otherwise, it can make viewing content on smaller, portable devices more enjoyable. It needs to branch out into other devices though. As much as an iPad Pro has the best PQ of any portable device, it still can't match a 65" LG OLED panel. Apple is readying their next generation Apple TV, and I'd bet the house it's Spatial Audio enabled. I'm really looking forward to that.

Renee Ritchie claims it won’t be on the Apple TV because a TV does not move. He was referring to his briefings with Apple from what it sounded like. It seems like the surround aspect could be separated out and added to the Apple TV.

 

[dandrewk]

Renee Ritchie claims it won’t be on the Apple TV because a TV does not move. He was referring to his briefings with Apple from what it sounded like. It seems like the surround aspect could be separated out and added to the Apple TV.

Interesting, and that makes sense. The headphones already have some sort of accelerometer, so no need to include head tracking in a stationary device. But even if not, head tracking is a cool trick but doesn't really make anything sound better.

Apple, being Apple, wants all their devices to integrate into the ecosystem. Adding Spatial Audio (in whatever form) support to Apple TV and Macs gives buyers another reason to pay the premium for APMs.

 

[BigPotatoLobbyist]

Interesting, and that makes sense. The headphones already have some sort of accelerometer, so no need to include head tracking in a stationary device. But even if not, head tracking is a cool trick but doesn't really make anything sound better.

Apple, being Apple, wants all their devices to integrate into the ecosystem. Adding Spatial Audio (in whatever form) support to Apple TV and Macs gives buyers another reason to pay the premium for APMs.

It would but I largely suspect a lot of it is just laziness on Apple's part wrt the Mac platform and Apple TV, too much obsession over iOS and WatchOS, etc. Apple TV is at a put up or shutup impasse, IMO they need to choose one or the other within the next year.

As for attention to the Mac platform: I do have some hope for this in the future (and happen to have an M1 Macbook, naturally) but they'd best get onto it. The rumors seem to suggest they are.

 

[Cashmonee]

It would but I largely suspect a lot of it is just laziness on Apple's part wrt the Mac platform and Apple TV, too much obsession over iOS and WatchOS, etc. Apple TV is at a put up or shutup impasse, IMO they need to choose one or the other within the next year.

As for attention to the Mac platform: I do have some hope for this in the future (and happen to have an M1 Macbook, naturally) but they'd best get onto it. The rumors seem to suggest they are.

I am not sure if it laziness, or a philosophy that Spatial Audio is for devices that are portable. It really seems like they just don’t think it is necessary on Apple TV or macOS because to Apple it isn’t just surround, but also location of the device.

 

[turbineseaplane]

For spatial audio...I'm hopeful that AirTags will be able to somehow be used for existing Apple TV 4K customers -- perhaps placing a tag on the TV somewhere (maybe even behind it) and telling iOS about it, etc -- there must be a way