Give a DAM...

[carlgo]

...recommendation.

Anything that meets these requirements?

Imports RAW, etc photos from camera, phone, scanner.

Imported photos can be manually dragged (drug?) to folders that I create and label.

Photos can be sent off easily to a variety of external editors and returned of course.

Photos that have been edited and now reside in Aperture can be brought over with editing intact, but just the photos and not smart folders, keywords or any organization.

Full manual control, nothing automatic or smart. No places, memories, ratings, etc. Want to spend more time on the photo thing and not dealing with "helpful" organizational complexity. No interest in social media, sharing, cloud, etc.

Thanks!

 

[oblomow]

...recommendation.

Anything that meets these requirements?

Imports RAW, etc photos from camera, phone, scanner.

Imported photos can be manually dragged (drug?) to folders that I create and label.

Photos can be sent off easily to a variety of external editors and returned of course.

Photos that have been edited and now reside in Aperture can be brought over with editing intact, but just the photos and not smart folders, keywords or any organization.

Full manual control, nothing automatic or smart. No places, memories, ratings, etc. Want to spend more time on the photo thing and not dealing with "helpful" organizational complexity. No interest in social media, sharing, cloud, etc.

Thanks!

I recently bought LynApp. Reasonably happy with it. Fits my needs: organise photos in folders, handoff to Pixelmator/Affinity, view and edit exif/iptc.

 

[MCAsan]

You need to rethink Aperture. It has been declared DOA by Apple years ago. Past time to move on.

Applications such as Aperture, Lightroom, Capture One Pro, Photo RAW....etc. are walled gardens. They each have their own names and algorithms for editing raw images. There are zero standards for that.

If you start with a raw file and send it to a plug in, you will not get back a sidecar the original app can read and use. You will typically send a TIF or PSD and get back one as well.

 

[carlgo]

MCAsan: I know Aperture is dead and that is why I want another host for the photos.
[doublepost=1481850470][/doublepost]ablomo: Thanks for suggestion. LynApp seems to be a full-fledged photo app that I never heard of before. Will check it out.
MCAsan: I know Aperture is dead and that is why I am looking for a new host for my photos.

Lightroom is obviously capable and I could go with that despite the subscription thing if its DAM can be configured to work as I outlined, dumbed down so to say. Maybe MacPhun's promised DAM will be suitable.

 

[MCAsan]

Try On1 Photo RAW. It is beta now and releases formally on the 19th. You can do a trial.

 

[maflynn]

Try On1 Photo RAW. It is beta now and releases formally on the 19th. You can do a trial.

But does that have DAM capabilities? Seems more like a browser and a fast editor.

 

[stillcrazyman]

I was a Lightroom user for while. I've been looking for a single package to use as an editor and DAM.

I use ON1 Photo 10 as a DAM and editor, and for what it is, it does very well for me. The new RAW version is due out, but it's not quite ready for prime time, IMO.
I do have the Lyn app, that is useful for basic organizing and sending to external editors.
I tried to use the venerable GraphicConverter, but i couldn't find a way to use a "Send to / Open with" type of command to use external editors. There aren't a lot of choices out there for DAM.

 

[MCAsan]

But does that have DAM capabilities? Seems more like a browser and a fast editor.

They have never had a DAM. Deciding where to store your images is totally up to you. There is no "import" in Photo RAW. You can use your file system browser (Finder or Explorer) to create folders and move the files or, you can use the RAW Browser. You can use Browser to apply all manner of Presets to one or more images. It really begs the question....why does Aperture, Lightroom, and CiP need an internal database driven catalog/library? Macphun just updated Luminar with more features. They also plan on introducing a browser, not a database driven catalog/library. I am seeing so much more innovation at On1 and Macphun. It is great to have choices.

 

[robgendreau]

If you start with a raw file and send it to a plug in, you will not get back a sidecar the original app can read and use. You will typically send a TIF or PSD and get back one as well.

Not true for all applications; you can sorta get non-destructive workflow going BACK to Lr.

DxO plugins for Lightroom send a RAW to DxO. You edit it and it sends a linear DNG back, that can be the subject of further RAW editing, in the . Obviously one wouldn't want to say undo the perspective change or whatever you did in DxO, but the linear DNG allows for the continued editing as if it were the original RAW. http://www.dxo.com/us/photography/c...-your-dxo-opticspro-10-and-lightroom-workflow

And Mylio DOES send back to Lr a sidecar with Lr-compatible edits and adjustments. Just as if you had editing in Lr for the most common adjustments. It can just work on the RAWs; you don't even need to invoke a plugin. Sorta like dealing with an Lr-LITE.

The criteria that another program can bring over edited (in the sense of adjusted) images is a tough one. That's more of an Aperture export problem than another program's import problem. Since Aperture and other programs all use their own algorithms for rendering RAW, another non-Apple program might produce different results from a RAW than Aperture, even if it understood the command to say change contrast. To guarantee the same look most export high quality images from Aperture, and then import those. Frankly I only did that with modest JPEGs, because it was just as easy in most of my cases to re-do the RAWs with a new RAW processor. YMMV. Check out Aperture Exporter; it's better than most other programs' importers at getting stuff like that out of Aperture IMHO.

 

[carlgo]

How in practice does a Finder-based system work in conjunction with external editors, both with and without their own browsers? A suggested work flow would be appreciated, as would be any other details!

It would seem that browsers require a DAM or other catalogue of photos in which to actually browse. But, if you can send multiple photos to an editor then that editor must have some place to hold and view the photos to be processed and if more than one photo at a time is sent there then isn't that a browser?

 

[MCAsan]

For Photo RAW specifics, watch the videos and even do a trial: https://www.on1.com/products/photo-raw/

 

[carlgo]

I have. The idea seems to be that Photo RAW accesses photos already residing in other programs. The user still has to use another program to import the photos into the computer and make them available for Photo RAW.

Perhaps a finder-based cataloging system can work as the host that PR needs. Hopefully someone here can share the experience of that.

 

[MCAsan]

Not.

Browser, just like Finder, see folders of images in your file system. Those images are not residing inside any other programs. That is the huge benefit of a reference file system....any app can go see the images via normal file system routines. That is very different than a managed library like the default in Aperture or Photos where the images sit hidden inside a database package.

I can and do easily see and access my folders of images from Lightroom, Photo RAW, and Finder.

There is no catalog database into which to "import" the images. You use Finder or Browse to move the images from your camera or card to the folders where you want them to live. It is that simple. If you want rename them or do something else....go ahead. Browse like Finder will simply see the names you have used.

 

[carlgo]

Thanks for staying in this with me! What workflow do you recommend to use Finder and Browser in the best way? Have you settled on a process? At some time I am going to have to get my photos out of Aperture, before Apple disappears them. What host is best for that? Again, thanks for your responses.

 

[MCAsan]

Answers to your question would require an book. I will know more when I get the official RAW release later today. They will have launch event on the 20th where they will talk about their plans for the future.

https://www.on1.com/products/photo-...gn=eNews&utm_source=Plus_Own&utm_medium=email

 

[carlgo]

The spokesperson goes on rather breathlessly about how no importation is needed...Yea it is, the photos have to be somewhere and another program or solution is required in order that there are photos there to be accessed. Takes me back to step one, the importation of new photos and the transfer of existing Aperture photos into someplace where they can be accessed. That requires either a commercial DAM program or something we concoct ourselves in Finder.

Image Capture has some promise as a home-made Finder sort of solution, from my first impressions, but how long before it is done away with in an iOS future?

More and more it seems that Lightroom is the only answer, a program that can do it all and which will be around for a long time, even if only on the Windows side at some point.

 

[robgendreau]

The spokesperson goes on rather breathlessly about how no importation is needed...Yea it is, the photos have to be somewhere and another program or solution is required in order that there are photos there to be accessed. Takes me back to step one, the importation of new photos and the transfer of existing Aperture photos into someplace where they can be accessed. That requires either a commercial DAM program or something we concoct ourselves in Finder.

Image Capture has some promise as a home-made Finder sort of solution, from my first impressions, but how long before it is done away with in an iOS future?

More and more it seems that Lightroom is the only answer, a program that can do it all and which will be around for a long time, even if only on the Windows side at some point.

I'm not sure what spokesperson you're referring to, but that's a hallmark of browsers like Graphic Converter. Just point it to the folder you want. Just like using say Word. Or most any Mac. You've got files, you use an "Open..." command to go find them and open them. Or spotlight search for them. Or make smart folders with say recent images. Don't confuse the importation that a database does (like Lr, Aperture, Photos) with a COPYING process off say an SD card. You could do that in the Finder with just drag and drop, and although sometimes some refer to that as "importing" it really isn't. Confusing, no?

If you've been Aperture, then you have the problem of exporting info out. If you have managed images, even they need to be moved out. If you used Aperture with referenced images, they are already in the Finder and accessible to any other photo program. The INFO in Aperture (like keywords, organization, ratings, image adjustments, etc) is a separate matter, and that info has to be "exported" in some way. Like by writing to files, using something like Aperture Exporter, etc.

I do think Lr is the standard against which others are judged. Yes, there are things about it that we all don't like, but at the end of the day it can do most anything any other photo application can do. You might not like the interface decisions (modules vs say Aperture's floating palettes), but that's a different matter. And at least there are TONS of tutorials and plugins and support for it. So it's a good place to start.

 

[MCAsan]

but at the end of the day it can do most anything any other photo application can do

Where inside Lr can do do the equivalent of Photo RAW Effects module or Layers Module? Luminar also will go beyond Lr capabilities. but first Luminar will need a browser module which Macphun says they will do.

 

[carlgo]

Well, it won't hurt to wait awhile to see who comes up with what. Obviously there is confusion and there are upset people so there is a need for some clearer paths forward.

 

[maflynn]

but first Luminar will need a browser module which Macphun says they will do.

The question is when? At this point I don't people can consider Luminar if they have DAM requirements. While they may roll something out in the future, nothing is written in stone, and it may take years, we just don't know.

 

[MCAsan]

Agreed. At least On1 puts some of their roadmap out for review. When have you seen that from Apple, Adobe, and others?

https://www.on1.com/products/photo-raw/coming-soon/

 

[page3]

The spokesperson goes on rather breathlessly about how no importation is needed...Yea it is, the photos have to be somewhere and another program or solution is required in order that there are photos there to be accessed. Takes me back to step one, the importation of new photos and the transfer of existing Aperture photos into someplace where they can be accessed. That requires either a commercial DAM program or something we concoct ourselves in Finder.

Image Capture has some promise as a home-made Finder sort of solution, from my first impressions, but how long before it is done away with in an iOS future?

More and more it seems that Lightroom is the only answer, a program that can do it all and which will be around for a long time, even if only on the Windows side at some point.

I'm testing On1 RAW and it looks promising, but I agree - an import routine IS required. I'm not quite sure why they keep saying it isn't, after all I have to move my photos from my camera memory card to my storage somehow, and I don't want to be doing that all manually!

I've found an App called "Big Mean Folder Machine" that look like it will do the business of moving my images from my camera to my network drive, while renaming them correctly and placing them in a sensible folder hierarchy. I'd rather one piece of software did it all though!

 

[MCAsan]

I guess I am the one case that provides an import feature is not required. I have no problem dragging/dropping image files off my cards into folders using Finder or Browse. But, I never rename any files. I put them into folders by date and then keyword them as needed. That makes it very easy to find images in my library that has over 111,000 images starting in 1999.

One of the persons working as a spokesperson is Liz LePage. She does lots of weddings and get really into renaming files based on the wedding client name, type of shot....etc. You might want to ask her how she is doing all of that in RAW.

 

[page3]

I guess I am the one case that provides an import feature is not required. I have no problem dragging/dropping image files off my cards into folders using Finder or Browse. But, I never rename any files. I put them into folders by date and then keyword them as needed. That makes it very easy to find images in my library that has over 111,000 images starting in 1999.

One of the persons working as a spokesperson is Liz LePage. She does lots of weddings and get really into renaming files based on the wedding client name, type of shot....etc. You might want to ask her how she is doing all of that in RAW.

Sounds like you're got your images well organised, I wish I did!

I've 20 years of digital photos, sorted in to year, month, day folders. I then have them organised into albums initially within Aperture, then Lightroom and now CaptureOne. Of course, these aren't transferable to on1 raw

I'm hoping there is some way to tag them with the album name so I can then use the tags to create smart albums within on1 raw, or perhaps even rename the folders based on the tag. Not decided.

It's a bit of a mess because photos from various idevices over the years are a pain to import separately and my Apple photos library is a muddle of photos. What I really want is all my Raws within cp1/on1 and an automated process to send them to Photos as jpegs so my whole library as final edits is available for viewing. I do use a Plex which automatically shares my photos, but they're the original raws. I want a way to mirror all my final edits as jpegs within albums.

It's a mess since Aperture. I want the power on cp1/on1 but with the faces and auto tagging of Photos. Can't stand the Photos app though!

 

[MCAsan]

I shoot mostly wildlife and landscapes. So I turn off face detection in cameras and all apps.