Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
No, it's not like floppy disks. The 3.5 mm jack is more akin to the Edison Screw, the light bulb socket developed by Thomas Edison in 1909 and which is still the standard. Just because something has been around a long time is not reason enough to ditch it.

Ah American Imperialism at it's best. If the 3.5mm headphone jack is like the Edison screw, then you're screwed when you travel to the UK with your Edison bulbs as the bayonet connector is the standard mount there, and in most countries once part of the British Empire, as well as France and Greece. So you'll need an adapter to use your Edison bulbs in those countries. You know what might be better then? If you move to the UK, just buy some new bulbs.

The Edison screw also has a lot of issues, and by all means should be replaced, but it isn't because it's a commodity product. But that's starting to change as lightbulbs move to LED technology and are becoming a long term investment tech product not a short lived consumable. Other bulb base styles are becoming more common as are the fixtures that take them. So the days of the Edison screw are numbered. Even light bulbs aren't immune from technology improvements, including wireless power transmission.
 
If Apple is going to take away the headphone jack, they should give you an adapter to allow your current headphones to function
 
Letting the listener choose his own dacs are an audiophiles dream...

But you can do that now. What's that got to do with binning the headphone jack?
[doublepost=1466733755][/doublepost]
It's funny how Gruber states that the complaints play out the same each time Apple removes certain things, and here we are with a thread multiple pages long doing exactly that. "But, but, but I have X dollars of headphones / speakers invested and don't want to change anything about that." - because no one wants to change.

It's been this way forever, regardless of what the change is. Leaded gas to unleaded, incandescent to led bulbs (happening now), floppy (8") to 5.25" to 3.5" to Zip drive, to cd-rom to dvd to thumb drive to streaming. You invest in things that become a standard, but so much we live with daily, at least as far as technology goes, has lifetimes that are fleeting moments, at best, right now.

Your, and Gruber's, argument is flawed. Apple is trying to move to a proprietary port from an extremely ubiquitous standard. That's a lot different than the examples you cite, where Apple moved from one open standard to a newer one.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cageface
In my experience there are really three types of people
1. People who like the Apple style, and don't mind "having" to own wireless, thin devices, or with fewer ports..because for them its a benefit
2. People who don't like the Apple style, and thus purchase something else, or buy an Apple device in error and lament.
3. People who for some reason really care that Apple is clearly heading in the same direction they have been for the last 15 years and either disagree fundamentally or still do not understand, but continue to buy Apple products and can't imagine that people want to own (or a company wants to make) thin, reliable, wireless/single cord, appliance like electronics..and then comment about it on the internet.
 
If Apple is going to take away the headphone jack, they should give you an adapter to allow your current headphones to function

And thereby encouraging customers to continue using cheap 3.5mm tech?

But you can do that now. What's that got to do with binning the headphone jack?

Perhaps you have links to all of the manufacturers who are currently producing inexpensive Lightning compatible headphones, that are easy to use, and incorporate standards Apple hasn't yet announced?

Your, and Gruber's, argument is flawed. Apple is trying to move to a proprietary port from an extremely ubiquitous standard. That's a lot different than the examples you cite, where Apple moved from one open standard to a newer one.

Apple is moving to Bluetooth. That seems like a pretty ubiquitous open standard to me. Lightning is an option for those who prefer a wired connection -- and for anyone who uses an iOS product already, a godsend that they don't have to throw out hundreds of dollars worth of cables and accessories to adopt USB-C?

Apple has only one USB-C product in it's lineup, for which there are very few native USB-C products available in the marketplace. It will take years before USB-C is as ubiquitous as USB-A, and products are as available and inexpensive, even if Android moves to USB-C audio a year after Apple does. Even if Apple were to switch to USB-C, anyone who wants to use a pair of 3.5mm headphones is still going to need an adapter. So switching to a standard gets Apple nothing, especially if the long term goal is a complete move to wireless audio. Well it gets them the same backlash Android customers are going to have when they have to buy micro USB-A to USB-C adapters for every cable and device they own, in addition to their headphones adapters.
 
I wish I could go for BT headphones, but the audio lag on videos issue is just far too common to be able to trust that it will work 100 percent all the time when watching a movie or video of some type on my phone.

Personally I have no problem with moving to Lightning headphones, but I can understand why people might be unhappy about it.
 
between the two comments, it's pretty obvious that you're the one with the problem here...

Explain to me what there is to look forward to in that case smart guy. What will you do with the iPhone 7 that you cannot do with a 6S that relates to the headphone jack? I'm sure you have an extensive list given the nature of your post here. Anxiously awaiting your reply.
 
NOPE! You're rationalizing a dick move by Apple. If lightning/wireless is better the consumer would naturally adopt it but what we've seen is the exact opposite. People like their 3.5 mm connectors. PERIOD!

Lightning is not better than 3.5 mm, if it was the consumer would have spoken by now. Bluetooth is not better than 3.5 mm, if it was the consumer would have spoken by now. What we do know is that billions of people use 3.5 mm devices all day, ever day without any issues. The only problems with the 3.5 mm connector is it's old and Apple can't monetize it.

It shouldn't matter if it's old tech, if it works and we use it then leave it the freak alone. Old tech only matters to Apple because they lose money by not selling useless new tech like lightning headphones.

Wow, you're really angry about something. First of all, consumers are often the worst group to rely on for making choices about almost anything. And Apple wasn't the first to ditch the 3.5mm jack, in fact Apple has not even done anything that we know of as far as the headphone jack goes.

Ubiquitous "standards" change all the time in lots of industries. Bluetooth has not reached the peak of its technology and it is in fact improving very quickly. And like other technologies, as things improve, adoption rates go up.

Really, to fight change is a waste of time. It's going to happen and no matter what you scream about, it's not going to stop the unrelenting forward movement.

I can't wait to reply to you when the next thing you can't stand to see change, changes.
 
As an Amazon Associate, MacRumors earns a commission from qualifying purchases made through links in this post.
But you can do that now. What's that got to do with binning the headphone jack?
[doublepost=1466733755][/doublepost]

Your, and Gruber's, argument is flawed. Apple is trying to move to a proprietary port from an extremely ubiquitous standard. That's a lot different than the examples you cite, where Apple moved from one open standard to a newer one.

Apple hasn't done anything yet. Other companies, in fact, have ditched the 3.5mm plug already. Our point is, that these things have happened before, be it ditching old ports for USB or floppy drives for cd drives, on screen keyboards instead of physical keyboards. And each time people kick and scream, say that Apple will fail and no one will accept the change, until people do exactly that. And in short order people forget about what they complained about, but are at the ready to scream the next time a change is "forced" on them.

It's actually pretty funny to watch it play out time and again.
 
Every now and again you might see that luddite audiophile holdout with his Android phone tethered to his head...
http://www.computerworld.com/articl...e-12-in-second-biggest-downturn-since-07.html

Here is an article stating that Mac sales took a tumble. Last quarter.

One thing I know from personal experience, is when I was looking for a new computer. I for a short moment contemplated about getting the new MacBook. But I just couldn't get around the fact it didn't have USB ports.

I depend on those things.

Also that you can't even charge the computer, while you are using the port, because it has only one port, there are so many times that I need to charge while I need to have an external hard drive attached to it.

The less practical Apple makes their products. I think they will suffer sooner or later.

Maybe I am making an incorrect assumption why Mac Sales have gone down. But I wouldn't be surprised, a lot of people can't not have a 1000 dollar laptop, without USB ports.

And no, adapters are not an elegant solution. You and Apple can go all alone into this marvelous Walled in Future.

I might not go inside the palace though, with many fellow Luddites.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MaloCS
The Edison screw also has a lot of issues, and by all means should be replaced, but it isn't because it's a commodity product. But that's starting to change as lightbulbs move to LED technology and are becoming a long term investment tech product not a short lived consumable.

Some new fixtures I installed last year only came with GU24 based LED bulbs . The medium Edison screw's days are numbered.

Thanks California!

B
 
I disagree that this is comparable to when Apple removed things in the past.

When Apple removed the floppy drive, it was pretty much useless. 1.5mb of storage by 1998 was already laughably small - floppy disks was undeniably on their way out already and pretty much totally replaced by CDs. When Apple removed the CD/DVD drive from computers, those were also on their way out as streaming was taking over music and movies and USB drives were taking over file storage. The same could be said of when Apple got rid of the serial port, etc.

Further, Apple was not the first to make a smartphone without a physical keyboard, there were quite a lot already on the market - Apple was just the first to make it work very well.

The 3.5mm audio jack is not the same. It is not inadequate for the time and thus it is not on its way out and the replacements are not prevalent.

Hindsight is 20/20. In 1998 and 2008, people were shocked that Apple were releasing computers without floppy drives and CDs. You're right that NOW it seems obvious to remove them, but when it actually happened it was the same nonsense as this headphone jack thing. "Apple wants to screw over the customer, Apple wants to sell you an adapter, etc..." Gruber is definitely and Apple fanboy, but he's right on the money that everyone will complain, buy the phone anyway, and forget about it next year- just like when they switched to the Lightning connector.

Right now it seems like a leap to remove the headphone jack. In 2020 we'll stumble upon someone still using an iPhone 6s, listen to their music through the 3.5mm jack, and we'll have forgotten how bad the sound quality was and/or have forgotten that Apple used to sell phones that weren't waterproof.

I'd argue that what Apple wants is 1. to turn a profit (they're a business, after all), and 2. to be on the cutting edge of technology to keep their brand value extremely high, which in turn improves the chances of #1. If they're not staying competitive by making a thinner phone with the latest technology in it, their brand doesn't mean anything. That's why they're doing this. I think they recognized that the 3.5mm jack has been a standard for a really long time because it's relatively common, small, and inconspicuous, not because it's particularly good. I give them credit for having the guts to still do things like this (try new things, that is) despite what a massive company they are now. It's more than most of their competitors can say.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bobob
The only reason I could consider buying a phone like this at this point is if some manufacturer quickly makes a battery case that integrates a standard headphone jack. Get creative, 3rd parties. Save Apple from themselves.
 
Nilay Patel made a fool of himself with that rant of his on the Verge. One that will follow him around like all such idiotic rants do.
The funny thing is they are so thin skinned that they are banning people who called him out on it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bobob
I'm not quite understanding this claim that lightning headphones will be higher quality than analog jack. At some point there has to be a DAC, as the headphone speakers themselves are analog. So whether the DAC is in the headphones, or in the device (phone, stereo, tv, etc) makes no real difference surely? And unless you have high end headphones with a DAC in them, they aren't going to beat the DAC in my high end stereo right?!
 
What a ridiculous comment. If you already have a DAC and expensive headphones then what difference does it make to you if Apple removes the headphone jack? You're not using it anyway. Why do you need an adaptor is you're ALREADY using an external DAC? Did you even read your comment before you posted?

And who says you need to use an inferior headphone with a built-in DAC (that you assume will be cheap)? There will be plenty of cables/adaptors out there from basic no-frills versions to higher-end ones. Companies like Audeze are separating out the Lightning cable from the headphones, so you only need to buy what you plan to use.

And you're flat out wrong about audio quality. A Lightning to 3.5mm adaptor will be an external DAC with a higher quality AMP than what is in your iPhone. It will actually improve audio quality for many people, especially those with more difficult to drive headphones.,

You have answered it yourself. At home or work, removing the headphone jack makes no difference to me because I use my own discrete setup and therefore adds no value. And on the go, I do use the iphone as a source without any external DAC. The current crop of available lightning headphones is limited, and frankly don't really compare in quality (not yet at least) to many top existing 3.5mm headphones. I have no intention of spending more on another pair of mid-range headphone, and therefore yes, adaptors would be required if I want to use my current headphones. And yes, built-in DACs or amp/DACs are "cheap" (I have owned a few portable ones), compared to any discrete high end desktop setup, and in my opinion rarely significantly improve high end, hard-to-drive headphones. You are free to disagree.

So, sure, it probably will improve audio for most people (which is what I had said in my original comment), but the change adds no value to my use case, except maybe forcing me to buy an adaptor.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DiceMoney
There is a significant difference between floppy/dvd drives and 3.5 mm headphones. Usage of floppy/DVD drives was already declining when Apple removed them, yet everyone still uses 3.5 mm headphones (and multiple usb ports). Sacrificing user experience for thinness seems to be the only thing Apple does these days.

Not 'everyone' still uses 3.5 mm headphones--I've moved to Bluetooth exclusively, and given the sales popularity of Bluetooth headphones across the pricing spectrum, I'm pretty sure I'm not alone. Does 'wires dangling from your head' really sound like that fantastic of a user experience?
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.