Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
High Res on AirPods Max when using the lightning cable
- Thread starter H-B0mb
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
That is a really good question. What sources are you going to connect them to?
I would be intrigued to know the answer as well. I have the cable, but don’t have anything that I can connect it to so that I can try out (I only bought it to connect the headphones to my PS5 controller)
I have a hi-res streamer, but it doesn’t have a headphone socket, my AV receiver doesn’t have a headphone socket and my 2 channel amp doesn’t have one either so I am struggling to think how I can test it.
As far as Bluetooth is concerned, I can hear a difference between Apple Music and Qobuz (Uncompressed FLAC) which is significant enough to justify using a Hi-Res streaming service on them. I know people will argue that the headphones downgrade to AAC anyway, but there is a difference with better sources for sure.
I will have a think to see if there is any way that I can test it with the cable
Jason
I would be intrigued to know the answer as well. I have the cable, but don’t have anything that I can connect it to so that I can try out (I only bought it to connect the headphones to my PS5 controller)
I have a hi-res streamer, but it doesn’t have a headphone socket, my AV receiver doesn’t have a headphone socket and my 2 channel amp doesn’t have one either so I am struggling to think how I can test it.
As far as Bluetooth is concerned, I can hear a difference between Apple Music and Qobuz (Uncompressed FLAC) which is significant enough to justify using a Hi-Res streaming service on them. I know people will argue that the headphones downgrade to AAC anyway, but there is a difference with better sources for sure.
I will have a think to see if there is any way that I can test it with the cable
Jason
Thanks Jason. At the moment I bought the cable to connect it to my Xbox Series X controller but I'm planning to buy a new amp, most likely a Naim Uniti Atom, and will stream hi res from that. The Naim has a headphone socket
Hi, turns out, my streamer does actually have a headphone socket so I have done some testing today.
Using Qobuz Studio hi-res uncompressed FLAC on my iPhone via Bluetooth to the APM’s and then via a headphone socket directly to my streamer (Bluesound Node 2) with exactly the same Qobuz service and the same tracks.
I spent quite some time going back and forth between the 2, initially trying to get the volumes as close as possible before actually listening seriously.
The end result being that I could not discern any difference between the 2 at all, not with any of the tracks I used.
They both sounded fabulous and both better than Apple Music, but they were impossible to separate in direct comparisons.
Whether this is a limitation on the APM’s themselves, or if they’ve done such a great job on the AAC codec on the Bluetooth, I don’t know, but it was a very interesting experiment.
Anyway, I hope this helps and if you want me to try anything else, I am happy to help out.
Jason
To be honest that's not the best way to get hi-res audio. I have two AirPods Max and purchased the 3.5mm cable. I collect headphones and have Balanced DAC (digital to analog converter) and headphone amps.
I know people are saying wired is the best way to go which is true for all headphones capable of a direct analog connection. Not the Max.
Here's why:
AirPods Max only takes digital connection. Period. There is no analog input. None.
All audio coming into the Max is digital. It is the built-in DAC of the Max that does the conversion to it's speakers. There is no by-passing it.
Apple offers the 3.5mm cable as a matter of convenience for those who want it. That's the reason why they didn't include the cable in the package. They don't encourage doing it.
Here's what happens.
(1) Your electronic device converts digital signal to analog to the 3.5mm port.
(2) And then that 3.5mm to Lightning cable takes that analog signal and turns it back into digital.
(3) The AirPods Max takes that digital signal and turns it into analog for the speakers.
That's one too many conversions than a simple straight digital signal from your computer/iPhone/iPad fed to your AirPods Max directly.
The cable is good for Airplane travel. That's it. If you have to use the cable at home, I would use it with a DAC and use the pre-amp output. Not the variable headphone jack.
Until Apple builds an direct analog input, the best sound you can get is via AAC digital wireless input. The AirPods Max knows how to decode it and bring it back to sounding full.
I know people are saying wired is the best way to go which is true for all headphones capable of a direct analog connection. Not the Max.
Here's why:
AirPods Max only takes digital connection. Period. There is no analog input. None.
All audio coming into the Max is digital. It is the built-in DAC of the Max that does the conversion to it's speakers. There is no by-passing it.
Apple offers the 3.5mm cable as a matter of convenience for those who want it. That's the reason why they didn't include the cable in the package. They don't encourage doing it.
Here's what happens.
(1) Your electronic device converts digital signal to analog to the 3.5mm port.
(2) And then that 3.5mm to Lightning cable takes that analog signal and turns it back into digital.
(3) The AirPods Max takes that digital signal and turns it into analog for the speakers.
That's one too many conversions than a simple straight digital signal from your computer/iPhone/iPad fed to your AirPods Max directly.
The cable is good for Airplane travel. That's it. If you have to use the cable at home, I would use it with a DAC and use the pre-amp output. Not the variable headphone jack.
Until Apple builds an direct analog input, the best sound you can get is via AAC digital wireless input. The AirPods Max knows how to decode it and bring it back to sounding full.
Is it possible that a software update can enable the lightning port on the Max can be enabled to take incoming digital audio ?. Before the Max, I was using the Sennheiser Momentum 3 headphones, and they (like the Max) have a built in DAC and a USB-C port. WIth that, I used a USB-C cable (both ends) to connect out of my iPad Pro directly into the Sennheisers. If I streamed hi-res from Tidal or Qobuz from the iPad to the Sennheisers, it remained digital all the way.
Yes that’s very possible! I also have a similar wireless headphone Dali iO-6 that takes digital signal via usb-c. In fact Dali recommends this as the best way to go.
Apple can offer this option but knowing how adamant they are with pushing their AAC codec, I’m afraid they won’t do it.
Just a random though. Would a lighting to lighting cable work better in that case between an iPhone and the APM’s or will it be identical again to Bluetooth?
Jason
It would be great if apple enabled it, but they have not. For now, no audio is passed through the lightning cable
That’s not true as you can connect headphones to the lightning port. So it does pass audio
Jason
What needs clarification here is if Apple enabled recognition of the AirPods Max as a direct digital connection from an electronic device which it currently does not without any further update.
Yes the Lightning port takes in digital audio, but only through their proprietary 3.5mm to Lightning cable.
Until Apple offers and/or enables a Lightning to Lightning or USB-C/USB-A to Lightning cable THAT CAN be recognized by the AirPods Max as an audio source, then this is not possible.
Yes the Lightning port takes in digital audio, but only through their proprietary 3.5mm to Lightning cable.
Until Apple offers and/or enables a Lightning to Lightning or USB-C/USB-A to Lightning cable THAT CAN be recognized by the AirPods Max as an audio source, then this is not possible.
You can certainly get audio out of the lightning port on the phone, but the discussion is about getting into the headphones. The lightning port on the Max does not accept audio. As I wrote above, it "may" be something that can be resolved with a software fix, but for the moment, audio does not pass through to the headphones.
I’m obviously being thick.
You say the lighting port on the Max doesn’t accept audio, but it does via the proprietary cable. 3.5mm to lightning.
Do we know for a fact that a lightning to lightning will not work given that the iPhone (for example) does output audio on lightning and the Max do accept audio on the lightning.
Jason
There is no Lightning to Lightning cable that exists especially by Apple as of this writing. Apple will not build it because they will not encourage wired audio listening from one mobile device to another. Defeats their "mobile" agenda of AAC listening.
What Apple needs to do is build a proprietary USB to Lightning cable that will be recognized by the AirPods Max for direct digital conversion (or perhaps a simple firmware update).
Yes the lightning port on the phone outputs Audio. It outputs it to the 3.5 cable which converts it to analog and then converts it back to digital on the headphones. The point of this discussion re hi-res audio etc was about managing to keep the signal digital.
Right now, we have:
iPhone (digital) passes the audio into the 3.5 cable (changes audio into analog) and then changes it back again to digital on the headphones. The analogy I gave above was that with my iPad Pro and Sennheiser Momentum 3 headphones, you could use a USB-C cable to USB-C cable to connect the two and keep the signal digital all the way.
Yes, I have tried a lightning to lightning cable with the Max, and it does not transfer audio period.
Connecting via the cable means you're getting uncompressed audio out of the source (probably at 24-bit/44.8khz, but possibly 16-bit/48kHz), which is absolutely an improvement over the AAC streaming you get over wireless. Play an uncompressed AIF or WAV over Bluetooth and you're compressing it. Play it wired and you're hearing it at its original quality (albeit via an extra conversion stage, but Apple use decent converters, so that shouldn't be anywhere near as destructive as AAC streaming). Even if the source file is at a higher sample rate and/or bit depth than the cable's converters, it's still going to come out 'better' than AAC.
This is all a given understanding that uncompressed audio is best. That's a fact that no one is disputing.
You are assuming that all DACs are created equal. They are NOT. "Decent" does not mean equal.
So yes, getting an uncompressed audio source is best but you're suggestion that (1) your computer has a decent built in DAC AND (2) that little 3.5mm analog to Lightning cable which is another DAC is another decent converter and will be better with multi-stage conversion from digital to analog, the analog to digital, then back from digital to analog isn't "anywhere near as destructive as AAC streaming" to the AirPods Max. Then you are incorrect.
We all know that the fastest way is via a straight line. You just crossed multiple obstacles just to get from digital to analog and you think one of those DACs didn't compress your supposed 24-bit/44.8KHz signal along the way?
If these were all truly decent DACs including that tiny 3.5mm cable, then my God what am I investing in these hundreds and thousand dollar DACs for in my home the size of bricks and shoe boxes? I should have just relied on Apple's USD35.00 3.5mm DAC. End game.
I stand correct when I say the best way to pass audio to the Max with less degradation at its current state is via Apple's AAC. Audio enthusiasts in pursuit of clean signal path will all know this.
wait so the chord is useless in increasing quality?
i just ordered the soundkey dac from amazon hoping to increase quality with the 3.5mm cable + dac to my airpods max. but if it is all useless anyway i would like to know
I would say that 3.5 inch cable to lightning is better than aac. There is not compression via the cable, but there is compression via aac
Here's the thing.
If you're talking optimized AAC Apple Digital Masters signal straight to the Max versus wired connection to the Max, then the cable will not increase sound quality than what the Max is already optimized in doing directly from an Apple device.
If you're talking about using the Max with a non-Apple device, then yes the 3.5mm cable may increase the sound quality if the original source was not optimized for Apple to begin with.
And by investing in an external DAC to process the digital information, you are by-passing the inferior SBC codec being passed to the Max by creating a higher quality audio signal to feed into the Apple 3.5mm cable.
But if you're talking about using Apple Music which was already mastered for iTunes played from an Apple device, you are best served with passing on that digital information straight to the Max than...using that AAC optimized signal, re-feed to a DAC, re-convert back to digital, only to be converted back to analog, then calling it a better way to listen with the Max - who are we kidding.
No. There is compression via the cable. The cable is a mini DAC. It compresses analog audio back to digital signal before the AirPods Max can even take it in.
Here's a tear-down snippet that you can find in YouTube of the audio specific Lightning adapter showing there is a DAC chip and even a mini amplifier to help boost that signal.
So using a Macbook Air (2018) + DAC + Apple Audio Cable + AirPods Max is useless? (this was meant to listening to my WAV/FLAC/AIFF files)
No, that's exactly what the cable's use is for - providing alternative means of listening to various audio sources on the APM.