How do you feel about the webcam on Studio Display?

[UMHurricanes34]

Genuinely curious what all of the new owners of the Studio Display think of the webcam quality after all of the chatter during the review window. After a few days use, I personally think it’s a confounding miss when it came to the priorities they were designing towards for the webcam on the display. I’m not upset about Center Stage per se, but the fact that the camera module itself seems ill suited for doing the job it’s been assigned in the context of a high resolution large computer monitor. It seems overly cropped making it feel even lower resolution, and the processing issues have been noticeable (“smearing” from noise reduction, lack of dynamic range and contrast). I do hope some of the processing can be improved via software update, but I think they may have put the wrong camera component in the thing. How are you all feeling?

 

[jacklivehere]

I think webcam is fine for zoom calls with background lighting and center stage . But certainly not on par with brio 4k.

 

[macman01101]

One thing I don't understand / can't figure out is that the camera seems aimed way too high (when not in center stage mode). For example, many people on zoom calls tell me the center stage is distracting, so I disabled it.But then, they can only see me from the chin up. I have to angle the studio display tilt down, and still it's only showing from the neck up.

I've had several people comment I should "adjust my camera". Thinking of returning for this reason.

 

[falconer.]

Yeah the terrible image quality doesn't bother me much, but the high angle/crop of the frame is insane. On the Upgrade podcast they said it makes it look like take your child to work day lol. I have to tilt the display so far down it's comical in order to make it look normal/comparable to the iMac webcam.

 

[Cashmonee]

One thing I don't understand / can't figure out is that the camera seems aimed way too high (when not in center stage mode). For example, many people on zoom calls tell me the center stage is distracting, so I disabled it.But then, they can only see me from the chin up. I have to angle the studio display tilt down, and still it's only showing from the neck up.

I've had several people comment I should "adjust my camera". Thinking of returning for this reason.

This will generally be true with all integrated cameras in monitors. To be honest, putting a camera in a desktop monitor really is not a great idea unless it has the ability to be angled independent of the monitor. Otherwise you will often end up with a situation you have described.

 

[macman01101]

This will generally be true with all integrated cameras in monitors. To be honest, putting a camera in a desktop monitor really is not a great idea unless it has the ability to be angled independent of the monitor. Otherwise you will often end up with a situation you have described.

Why isn’t it a problem on the iMac then? Do you have a studio display?

 

[sigamy]

Genuinely curious what all of the new owners of the Studio Display think of the webcam quality after all of the chatter during the review window. After a few days use, I personally think it’s a confounding miss when it came to the priorities they were designing towards for the webcam on the display. I’m not upset about Center Stage per se, but the fact that the camera module itself seems ill suited for doing the job it’s been assigned in the context of a high resolution large computer monitor. It seems overly cropped making it feel even lower resolution, and the processing issues have been noticeable (“smearing” from noise reduction, lack of dynamic range and contrast). I do hope some of the processing can be improved via software update, but I think they may have put the wrong camera component in the thing. How are you all feeling?

I totally agree with you.

I question their decision to use the ultra wide camera and crop so much.

I really hope the software can be updated to fix the DR and contrast, we have all this power with neural engine and AI-based computational photography and the current result is just not good at all.

Especially when viewed on an excellent 5K monitor. It reminds me of the HDTV transition and watching SD content on a good HDTV, where a good TV just exposed how bad your cable provider's signal was.

 

[Apple Knowledge Navigator]

I had a very good look at the 'cam at an Apple store just yesterday.

First thing I want to highlight (for what it's worth) is that the device itself is just gorgeous. Fantastic build quality as expected; the panel quality is better than the 5K iMac with greater contrast, and the backlighting consistency/viewing angles were excellent. The speakers were the most surprising feature to me, I felt they sounded better than my HomePod mini. This might have a lot to do with the greater stereo separation, but regardless I was almost shocked at how good they were.

The webcam. Honestly, it's about what I expected - the equivalent of taking a FaceTime call from an iPhone or iPad through a large display. Even with the good lighting of the store, it had the telltale signs of a small sensor with high levels of noise and grain.

This is not a bug or something that can be fixed through software - it is the nature of a small camera. So in this regard, I don't think anyone should be surprised at the image quality. The real topic isn't how it looks to you the host, but how others will receive it.

Therefore, I don't think the nature of the camera is any better or worse than if you were conferencing from another Apple device. The issue with the Studio Display is that because the panel is so large, the image quality is amplified many times over. So what looks good on a smaller device, suddenly looks like a potato cam. But what I would be saying to myself is, "will the person on the receiving end be viewing me through a 27" display, or something more common in the range of 21-24" for a desktop, or a notebook?". In these instances, the image quality would be on par with what we've come to expect from other Apple devices and the issue isn't present.

Just my thoughts. It doesn't excuse the wildly inflated RRP, but product really is excellent and if I were looking to buy one, I would put aside $100 for a Logitech Brio/Streamcam.

 

[macman01101]

Yeah the terrible image quality doesn't bother me much, but the high angle/crop of the frame is insane. On the Upgrade podcast they said it makes it look like take your child to work day lol. I have to tilt the display so far down it's comical in order to make it look normal/comparable to the iMac webcam.

I talked to a senior apple care adviser and gave him a demo. He advised that the camera may be defective (he was concerned it got dislodged in shipping) and I should return it.

He was very nice and trying to be helpful, but it’s clearly not an issue in Apple’s radar yet. I tried to explain that it was a software decision of how to crop the image, but he didn’t agree.

Anyway, I plan to keep it for a few more days until the end of my return window, and hope for a software update.

The more people that call in and complain, the better. Hopefully it gets attention.

 

[falconer.]

I talked to a senior apple care adviser and gave him a demo. He advised that the camera may be defective (he was concerned it got dislodged in shipping) and I should return it.

He was very nice and trying to be helpful, but it’s clearly not an issue in Apple’s radar yet. I tried to explain that it was a software decision of how to crop the image, but he didn’t agree.

Anyway, I plan to keep it for a few more days until the end of my return window, and hope for a software update.

The more people that call in and complain, the better. Hopefully it gets attention.

It's good that the AppleCare advisor was nice about it, but his description of the issue is so flatly ridiculous it makes me wonder what's going on over there—like how could they not know that the Studio Display has a 12MP camera that is cropped at a high angle in software? It's present on every unit and mentioned in nearly every tech press review of the display. It's hardly a rare or lesser-known issue.

Sometimes I suspect they're not allowed to tell the truth or they might just say what they think the customer wants to hear, but if that's the case then that just sets up the customer for disappointment because if you were to return it and get another one, it would obviously be exactly the same. So I don't get the strategy.

 

[UMHurricanes34]

I agree with all of the thoughts here. The ultra wide camera is the problem and it was a design decision that didn’t need to be made.

The camera in the new 16” MBP produces a much nicer looking image, as does the camera in the M1 iMac and I’ve come to the conclusion that a lot of that is because of the focal length being used. Can the contrast and color be addressed in software? Sure. They can also certainly fix the awkward cropping and hopefully make center stage less distracting (how about a follow speed setting?) It’s capable of being really quite distracting, making the trade off even more frustrating. This ultra wide small sensor that’s being cropped to hell is just such a fascinating design decision. Not sure why they thought this was necessary because, otherwise, this display really is fantastic. It checks all of the boxes, except this one. Just such a strange miss.

 

[kreasu_]

I feel like it's good enough for work, but not for like a professional streamer, but you'd want a real camera at that point anyway

 

[blen]

I just compared the M1 iMac and the Studio Display side-by-side at the Apple store. The M1 iMac was at least 2x in terms of clarity and sharpness...identical lighting conditions (literally side-by-side).

Something is fundamentally off...is the sensor itself much larger on the iMac? Any facts on this? Resolution wise, Studio Display should be a hands down winner (12MP vs. 1080p sensor on iMac). I imagine the iMac is able to let in much more light...

 

[bluespark]

This is highly frustrating. As others are pointing out, Apple’s own iMacs have good built-in webcams. Slap the same one in the Studio Display and this would be a complete non-issue. As is, most of us are going to need to plunk external webcams on top of the otherwise beautiful Studio Dusplay.

 

[UMHurricanes34]

I just compared the M1 iMac and the Studio Display side-by-side at the Apple store. The M1 iMac was at least 2x in terms of clarity and sharpness...identical lighting conditions (literally side-by-side).

Something is fundamentally off...is the sensor itself much larger on the iMac? Any facts on this? Resolution wise, Studio Display should be a hands down winner (12MP vs. 1080p sensor on iMac). I imagine the iMac is able to let in much more light...

Theres definitely something wrong with the general ISP pipeline in the Studio Display, but I still think the other cameras will continue to look nicer simply because they’re using focal lengths that are more flattering and suitable for faces. Wide angle lenses don’t make anyone look good when they’re mere inches to feet away from you.

 

[Arctic Moose]

It is a total disgrace.

I tried it a few times, but quickly went back to my Canon 5D and Logitech C920.

The Studio Display camera is really noisy, has no depth of field, adds a sickly green tint and is performing "enhancement" that makes skin, especially faces, look like one of the old Photoshop paint filters has been applied.

 

[blen]

I mean...there's no comparison to a 5D. The Logitech looks worse than the Studio Display IMO, the subject isn't even in focus...

 

[Arctic Moose]

The Logitech looks worse than the Studio Display IMO, the subject isn't even in focus...

Yeah, I noticed that once I pulled the screen shots into Photoshop, seems the Logitech doesn’t focus quite that close, and I didn’t have time to redo them.

I still think the ASD issues are clearly visible, and are magnified many times in video, compared to stills.

 

[UMHurricanes34]

Yeah, I noticed that once I pulled the screen shots into Photoshop, seems the Logitech doesn’t focus quite that close, and I didn’t have time to redo them.

I still think the ASD issues are clearly visible, and are magnified many times in video, compared to stills.

The mosaic paint filter smear effect you speak of is what I noticed first. Unless that is a massive bug, Apple clearly thinks this sensor requires some of the most aggressive noise reduction I’ve ever seen which just makes their hardware decision even more dumbfounding.

 

[sigamy]

While I remain hopeful that Apple will improve some of this via software, I have to say I'm surprised that a patch has not been released by now.

Makes me no longer believe the last minute software bug story. In my mind if there was a last minute bug, that should not take 3+ weeks to address.

 

[UMHurricanes34]

While I remain hopeful that Apple will improve some of this via software, I have to say I'm surprised that a patch has not been released by now.

Makes me no longer believe the last minute software bug story. In my mind if there was a last minute bug, that should not take 3+ weeks to address.

I agree. I think Apple got caught with their pants down here and released that statement as immediate damage control so as not to harm initial sales figures. It was hard to believe initially anyways given that the hardware/software tech stack for this camera module and Center Stage has been used in the iPad for a while now. Not exactly newly developed bespoke tech for the display. We may just be SOL

 

[enricoclaudio]

Maybe it's not as good as a Logi 4K Brio but it's for sure much better than the webcam in my 2014 MBP Retina and better than the one in my 2017 iMac 5K. Sure, it definitely could be better and kinda close to the webcam in my 14" MBP M1 Pro but as it's right now, it works totally fine for me. Also, just the fact I don't have another thing on top of my ASD, other than the ScreenBar Halo, I'm happy with the ASD Cam quality.

 

[Arctic Moose]

It was hard to believe initially anyways given that the hardware/software tech stack for this camera module and Center Stage has been used in the iPad for a while now. Not exactly newly developed bespoke tech for the display.

No matter how I twist and turn this I cannot imagine any reasonable chain of events that could cause this to happen, not to mention how the hell it wasn’t caught before shipping.

This device has lots of space, including depth. All they had to do was put a huge sensor and a big fat (normal) lens in it and they would’ve been done. But no, they had to get all cute.

 

[coffeym]

I agree with all of the thoughts here. The ultra wide camera is the problem and it was a design decision that didn’t need to be made.

The camera in the new 16” MBP produces a much nicer looking image, as does the camera in the M1 iMac and I’ve come to the conclusion that a lot of that is because of the focal length being used. Can the contrast and color be addressed in software? Sure. They can also certainly fix the awkward cropping and hopefully make center stage less distracting (how about a follow speed setting?) It’s capable of being really quite distracting, making the trade off even more frustrating. This ultra wide small sensor that’s being cropped to hell is just such a fascinating design decision. Not sure why they thought this was necessary because, otherwise, this display really is fantastic. It checks all of the boxes, except this one. Just such a strange miss.

Exactly this. Whilst the camera is 12MP, cropping reduces (I think) to 6MP-ish, which is worse than even say the 2020 iPad Pro camera. It is a night-and-day difference between the ASD and the 24" iMac.

My worry is Apple seem to be very fond of this 12MP ultra-wide. I'd not be surprised to see it in the next iteration of the iMac or MacBooks, despite giving a worse picture than a non-ultra-wide camera, just so they can say the devices support Center Stage.

The image noise is truly appalling. But then again, it's not materially different to what's in the 2021 iPad Pros or 2022 iPad Air (for the obvious reason they all sport the same camera). I wish they'd identified the 24" iMac camera as the one they like and stick that in all the other devices.

 

[MinimeJer05]

Used it for a meeting this morning and while it didn't seem as sharp/colorful, I will say I liked the orientation of it. Normally, I have to fool around with my webcam for 10 mins to get it focused on my face, whereas the Studio Display perfectly captured my face and shoulders.

Also, not having a webcam sitting on top of my monitor (or a cord running down into my Mac) is a big plus and something I would prefer over perfect quality (meetings are just part of my day-to-day, I could care-less how good/bad I look as long as the person can hear/see me).