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How is NAS compared with Time Machine in terms of reliability in recovering the files in case something bad happens to the internal drive
- Thread starter hajime
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NAS is hardware, Time Machine is software. Two different things - I don't see how you could compare them. You should be able to use a NAS as a Time Machine destination, or you could use other backup software with a NAS.
support.apple.com
Backup disks you can use with Time Machine - Apple Support
Which devices can work as a Time Machine backup destination?
You mean backing up to a shared folder on a NAS? Well that's essentially the same as backing up to a TM drive. You just want to make sure you're plugged into ethernet.
In itself NAS doesn do backup however most have a Time Machine App that will then appear to a Mac as a Time Capsule location across the network when open Time Capsule on the Mac.
the mac can then use the NAS a time capsule location saving the backup to the NAS as opposed to a local drive designated for TC purposes.
the mac can then use the NAS a time capsule location saving the backup to the NAS as opposed to a local drive designated for TC purposes.
That's one approach, but I think setting up a TM share & shared folder works better, at least in my experience. No need to set up and install another app on the NAS, especially if it's not off-the-shelf. I think you're thinking of very specific hardware, while I'm thinking very much in general.
This is in my opinion the best way to accomplish backups to MacOS via NAS. Synology and many other manufacturers have APPs for their NAS that make the process absolutely painless.
I have been drawn between nas and mini+external drive (smb windows files to the mac mini and then use time machine to take snapshots of different versions of files from the PC) for months. Tried the second approach but all three m2 mini I bought have issues. Apple has no idea what is wrong nor want to admit any issue. They just suggested me to try other model or wait for a few months later and try the mini again Hoping that the issues would be fixed somehow.
So I wonder if I should just buy a synology nas and use its app such as Active Backup for Business to backup the PC or continue to try different Mac Mini until I get one without at least wifi nor ethernet stability issue.
So I wonder if I should just buy a synology nas and use its app such as Active Backup for Business to backup the PC or continue to try different Mac Mini until I get one without at least wifi nor ethernet stability issue.
1. a 3-2-1 backup strategy should include no more than 1 TM backup since they tend to fail.
2. One of these backups should be to media which can be placed in an off-site location
3. I have never gotten TM on a NAS to work reliably. It always gets corrupt after some time and is glacially slow when backing up a ~3 TB disk.
4. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to do my NAS backups. Awesome program.
2. One of these backups should be to media which can be placed in an off-site location
3. I have never gotten TM on a NAS to work reliably. It always gets corrupt after some time and is glacially slow when backing up a ~3 TB disk.
4. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to do my NAS backups. Awesome program.
In the past, I also used Carbon Copy Cloner and Super Duper to backup my Mac which included a Bootcamp partition.
Now that Bootcamp is gone, I need to find a reliable way to backup a separate Windows PC. In the past, even well-known backup programs for Windows failed to recover. So I wonder if smb all the user files from the PC to the Mac and then backup is better and more reliable.
Now that Bootcamp is gone, I need to find a reliable way to backup a separate Windows PC. In the past, even well-known backup programs for Windows failed to recover. So I wonder if smb all the user files from the PC to the Mac and then backup is better and more reliable.
NAS is hardware, Time Machine is software. Two different things - I don't see how you could compare them. You should be able to use a NAS as a Time Machine destination, or you could use other backup software with a NAS.
Backup disks you can use with Time Machine - Apple Support
Which devices can work as a Time Machine backup destination?
I meant software which came with Synology NAS such as Active Backup for Business vs. Time Machine.
Network Attached Storage (NAS) and Time Mac was off local Wifi! o one network attached and one wireless attached is the difference!
I have 2 MM 2018's and a Mac Book Pro all using Time Machine to backup to a Synology NAS. 1 share per machine. Been working for 2+ years now. Had 1 TM corruption where I had to "forget" all older backups and start over. This for 1 MM only and that was just a music server. Another time when the connection to the NAS died and TM stopped on the Macs. These were easily restarted with no loss of backup data. So the pairing works well. Its not flawless when stuff happens in these once-a-year incidents - usually a power failure.
If using TM and it gets corrupted it is almost impossible to fix. You usually have to start again from scratch.
In terms of reliability using other backup programs, such as CCC, for a NAS it depends upon how it is configured. In a RAID configuration with 1 or 2 disks allowed to fail then you have some options, as well as snapshots, which can allow for recovery in case of disk failures. If using a single disk as the destination if it fails and unfixable you are out of luck.
Since things do fail that's the reason for a 3-2-1 backup strategy.
i used to use apple's in-house Time Capsule (for a long long time, until it eventually died !). but since apple stopped making/selling them, i haven't used Time Machine. it was such a neat, plug and play solution.
but Time Machine is still attractive in a lot of ways.
what are a few recommended network drives that have built in wi-fi that play well with mac and Time Machine? are there any? i dont understand routers, switches or any of that.
but Time Machine is still attractive in a lot of ways.
what are a few recommended network drives that have built in wi-fi that play well with mac and Time Machine? are there any? i dont understand routers, switches or any of that.
Active Backup for Business is at least one or two class above Time Machine in terms of reliability and "restorability". it can be run bare metal, has a lot of customization in rotation policy, can de-duplicate between similar machines to reduce space used, can run in conjunction with other Synology apps like Hyper Backup to achieve more complex backup strategy... the list goes on.
Synology does have plan to add Active Backup for macOS but it has yet to happen, not even beta; I remember them introducing this as early as Catalina, but I guess the recent rapid change in macOS underlying tech due to Apple Silicon is not helping this.
For your reference: in our studio, we use Synology as primary file server and also backup server. We deploy mostly Macs for daily use but some Windows PC are needed for accounting. My basic backup setup is tell all Windows PC to use ABB, then all Macs to use TM, they backup to two separate shares on the main backup NAS. Then with this NAS we run Hyper Backup to 3 independent targets: 1) nightly remote to another Synology off-site with Hyper Backup Vault there, 2) nightly local USB HDD 3) this HDD rotates offsite airgapped monthly.
And to answer your original question: TM backup to a network share behaves differently than to a DAS. Over network it creates a disk image and mounts it every time a backup is happening, and of course also when you browse or restore from it. Where with DAS it creates a APFS file structure that is readily readable via Finder. You can imagine the former is much harder to be used in restoration situations. As such, I also keep a TB3 NVMe enclosure with 2TB SSD, slicing it into dozens of APFS volumes, each is a Time Machine backup instance for each of our Macs but only keep the OS / apps / basic user data while excluding media files and such. This SSD is not often backed up to, I only update the instances when a user needs to migrate to a different machine, or I am trouble shooting or doing major OS / apps update that an instant roll back is needed ASAP if something goes very wrong. For actual hourly data backup, the instances on the NAS are still the main backup.
Thanks. I should have used the term "restorability". I often hear people using "bare metal" when they talk about ABB. What does that mean?
I see some people use NAS and TM together. I have no plan for TM backup to a network share. I talk about Mac the past few months as I considered to use it as a NAS but due to various issues with M2 Mini, that approach does not work out. If I were to buy a NAS, I would just connect it directly to my PC and if I do buy a Mac later, do they same thing. I cannot connect NAS and router and computers all together in the same room. It is OK for me to just physically connect a NAS to a computer one at a time.
1.) How many computers do you need to back up?
2.) if mor ethan one, are they Mac , PC, or both?
3.) How much data needs to get backed up?
4.) How often is that data changing?
I use my Synology NAS in addition to external drives for TM backupsNAS is hardware, Time Machine is software. Two different things - I don't see how you could compare them. You should be able to use a NAS as a Time Machine destination, or you could use other backup software with a NAS.
Backup disks you can use with Time Machine - Apple Support
Which devices can work as a Time Machine backup destination?
Bare metal in the backup context means you backup exact replicas of all the device's volumes down to the block level, so when you restore it back to, presumably the exact same hardware, you will get the least amount of incompatibility. Say you have a Windows PC with 256GB boot drive and a 1TB data drive, ABB will backup 1.25TB of "blocks" instead of however much data there actually is inside. On the contrary, other backup solutions operate on volume-level like Time Machine clearly is.
Well if you do get a NAS without Macs, with Windows the ABB is de facto (why else would you get a Synology anyway). If you add a Mac into the mix then since ABB isn't available for macOS then you have to use something else, probably Synology Drive (sync) but it is not exactly a backup solution. TM is not perfect but for the basics it is fine, depends on how crucial your data is and how often they change then you need to invest into other solutions for Macs.
Direct connection from NAS to PC/Macs is pretty straight forward, just a direct ethernet cable between a spare port on both the NAS and the computer, then do some manual network config to put them into the same subnet. With a 10G card on both ends the performance will be pretty close if not better than an ordinary HDD DAS.
You can also backup on some QNAP systems that have thunderbolt ports. Unless you have a lot of disks (or SSDs) you won't be able to saturate the connection, depending on the number of disks you have and their configuration.
It has been out since December 2022... I've tested it, it's got a WAYS to go, though, as it still relies on KEXTs and reducing the Secure Boot level. Not user-friendly at all.
Release Notes for Active Backup for Business | Synology Inc.
Release Notes for Active Backup for Business | Synology Inc.
www.synology.com
Thanks you letting me know, I haven't been following closely enough. And their development looks fairly recent, bare metal support was added literally last week in 2.6.0. I don't have spare units to test nor do we have the time to do virtual test, I guess we will sit out at least half a year and see if it becomes production ready by then.It has been out since December 2022... I've tested it, it's got a WAYS to go, though, as it still relies on KEXTs and reducing the Secure Boot level. Not user-friendly at all.
Release Notes for Active Backup for Business | Synology Inc.
Release Notes for Active Backup for Business | Synology Inc.
Another thing of note is now the Time Machine in Ventura finally lets you choose daily / weekly backup frequency instead of the old mandatory hourly.