How Long Can Apple Sustain This Ridiculous Pricing?

[Plutonius]

My group has moved to a two year replacement cycle for MacBook Pros - after two years people are sick and tired of the issues with the systems.

"5 year lifespan" is laughable - Apple has moved to a disposable model for everything.

My Desktop is a 2009 Mac Pro and my laptop is a 2010 MacBook Pro. I paid a big premium to buy them, they are still running great and I have no desire to upgrade.

I can't comment on the newest line of Macs but then again, Apple is now a mobile phone producer that makes computers on the side .

 

[AidenShaw]

My Desktop is a 2009 Mac Pro and my laptop is a 2010 MacBook Pro. I paid a big premium to buy them, they are still running great and I have no desire to upgrade.

I can't comment on the newest line of Macs but then again, Apple is now a mobile phone producer that makes computers on the side .

The mid-2012 MBPs are the oldest Apple laptops allowed on our network.

 

[Huntn]

My group has moved to a two year replacement cycle for MacBook Pros - after two years people are sick and tired of the issues with the systems.

"5 year lifespan" is laughable - Apple has moved to a disposable model for everything.

I assume that repairs on new MacBook pros consist of replace the motherboard, the screen, the SSD, the battery, and the keys, key covers, possibly soldering upgraded RAM. The primary difference, with my 2011 MBR is the RAM could be swapped out. Personally, I like the days when I could easily open up my Mac laptop and swap out the Ram and the battery. I'm irritated they removed the disk drive from the MBP, while admitting it's rare these days that I burn a disk, but I still do on occasion. The question is, is Apple driving this technology with smaller, lighter, or are the other manufacturers sticking with more repairability?

http://www.cultofmac.com/173403/ifi...w-macbook-pro-is-least-repairable-laptop-yet/

[doublepost=1481637662][/doublepost]

The mid-2012 MBPs are the oldest Apple laptops allowed on our network.

I have a 2011 MBP running Yosemite. Why would that not be allowed on your network?

edit:typo

 

[AidenShaw]

I have a 2011 MBR running Yosemite. Why would that not be allowed on your network?

Yosemite is not supported on that model.

 

[Huntn]

Yosemite is not supported on that model.

Really now...

 

[lowendlinux]

Really now...

Corporate IT is not personal IT.

 

[Huntn]

I assume that repairs on new MacBook pros consist of replace the motherboard, the screen, the SSD, the battery, and the keys, key covers, possibly soldering upgraded RAM. The primary difference, with my 2011 MBR is the RAM could be swapped out. Personally, I like the days when I could easily open up my Mac laptop and swap out the Ram and the battery. I'm irritated they removed the disk drive from the MBP, while admitting it's rare these days that I burn a disk, but I still do on occasion. The question is, is Apple driving this technology with smaller, lighter, or are the other manufacturers sticking with more repairability?

http://www.cultofmac.com/173403/ifi...w-macbook-pro-is-least-repairable-laptop-yet/

[doublepost=1481637662][/doublepost]

I have a 2011 MBP running Yosemite. Why would that not be allowed on your network?

edit:typo

I had an employee at the Apple Store tell me that RAM could be upgraded on the new MBRs by Apple (I assume soldering involved) to make people pay Apple for their upgrades and not do it themselves (I added->) and save money That did not make me happy. I don't think this guy was a tech, and while it may be true, I still believe soldering vs RAM slots is to lower the profile. And as I think about it, when they pulled the disk drives out of them, they did not even drop the price a little.

Corporate IT is not personal IT.

I guess it depends if the word model is referencing a model computer or an IT model. If the latter, I'd ask is Sierra so different than Yosemite that it's a hassle to support the previous iteration of the MacOS? OMG what happens when the next MacOS version comes out??

 

[lowendlinux]

I guess it depends if the word model is referencing a model computer or an IT model. If the latter, I'd ask is Sierra so different than Yosemite that it's a hassle to support the previous iteration of the MacOS? OMG what happens when the next MacOS version comes out??

They stay on the old one..

Here if I want my Mac on the network I have to be running their master of 10.6

 

[Huntn]

They stay on the old one..

Here if I want my Mac on the network I have to be running their master of 10.6

That does not seem a bit restrictive to you? What happens as people upgrade to newer Macs?

 

[lowendlinux]

That does not seem a bit restrictive to you?

I don't care if the SW I need works what else could I possibly need?

 

[Huntn]

I don't care if the SW I need works what else could I possibly need?

That was not my question. I was referencing the restrictions on @AidenShaw's network. Would'nt network issues be based more on the version of the MacOS than the hardware? Although I could see hardware being involved, yet I was using a 5 year old Mac with no issues connecting to my local network.

 

[mobilehaathi]

I don't care if the SW I need works what else could I possibly need?

This is why I haven't updated the OS on my work machines in a while. It seems every time I do my build environment gets borked up.

 

[AidenShaw]

Really now...

Corporate IT is not personal IT.

Bingo lowendlinux.

Systems have to run the IT produced image. IT does not have any images for the early 2011 model, so it's not supported on our network.

 

[kendall69]

That is good to know. As @Scepticalscribe said, Apple has always been priced a bit higher: That used mean hardware and software that worked flawlessly. Okay, an occasional lemon here and there. Now it just pays for their spaceship and other such things. (Spaceship HQ design makes me realize there are Pod people running the show now which explains everything ). The build quality of the hardware and software is a pale shade of what it was even three years ago. They rush everything out without thoroughly testing now and that is coming home to roost; to complicate things they upcharge on purpose and brag about it which makes the price point even more offensive. So, yes, they are priced way too high.

I have a love/dislike relationship with Apple. My 2013 iMac works pretty good on El Capitan (not upgrading to Sierra etc. until I absolutely have to, if at all); but I've been through five iPhones now since 2014 (exchanging this dud 7+ for 6s+). I would have jumped to Android if I didn't pay for this with Apple gift cards. For me, the software bugs alone do not constitute the overcharge. They keep tripping up, sooner or later they will have to lower prices AND up the QC.

Who knows how long the hubris will continue, but as someone who is very disappointed to have to constantly think about my phone and home computer in ways I do not want to I have to rethink my tech; if Apple keeps this up the backlash will continue and sales will continue to drop. You can only float on image and raising prices for your quarterly margins for so long. I can no longer ignore Windows for home use and as someone who had 14 years of smooth sailing with Apple, it's sad to even type stuff like this.

I actually ran into viruses with Mac OS this September; hard enough I had to wipe my machine 3x using the highest security settings. That took 10 days. Thank goodness my 2010 iMac was still working during that time.

[doublepost=1481744772][/doublepost]It's two thing - 1) people are still willing to pay a premium and have since Apple was building computers. 2) it's about productivity. I can work circles around and PC machine when it comes to productivity, I always have since mac came out with a WYSIWYG style computer. Remember when you used to hit two dozen keys just to make a word BOLD, and never know that it worked till you printed? Probably not. Now let's do all all the PC hacking into the mix and no one has the time to prevent all the PC HACKS that take place on an hourly basis. Lastly, I used one Mac desktop for nearly 10 years with no problems. SO Apple will keep getting their prices because of buyers like me who ONLY purchase Apple products 100% of the time.

 

[kazmac]

[doublepost=1481744772][/doublepost]It's two thing - 1) people are still willing to pay a premium and have since Apple was building computers. 2) it's about productivity. I can work circles around and PC machine when it comes to productivity, I always have since mac came out with a WYSIWYG style computer. Remember when you used to hit two dozen keys just to make a word BOLD, and never know that it worked till you printed? Probably not. Now let's do all all the PC hacking into the mix and no one has the time to prevent all the PC HACKS that take place on an hourly basis. Lastly, I used one Mac desktop for nearly 10 years with no problems. SO Apple will keep getting their prices because of buyers like me who ONLY purchase Apple products 100% of the time.

Use what you like. You're happy, awesome.

I used Macs without issue for 14 years and iPhones for five years without issues. Not any more.

Different strokes for different folks.

 

[v0lume4]

They'll keep charging it as long as people keep buying it. And to that end, they are.

However, I do believe that folks are beginning to "wake up" a bit to Apple's antics. The competition from the other side (computers AND phones) is as good as its ever been and in some cases, surpassed Apple. Look at things like the HP Spectre x360. The price for performance and form factor is insane. Look at the Surface Studio. Apple literally isn't even competing in that segment. Look at the Google Pixel. Millions sold already and it's just a first gen product. Look at how many people bought the S7E. Buyers of the Note 7 LOVED it. It's too bad about the (BIG) technical problem it had.

What I'm getting at is this. Consumers are fickle creatures. It really doesn't take too much to change their minds. People get bored. I believe that Apple is betting on the Apple name to continue selling hardware forever and that just won't happen. Can't be #1 forever. Nobody can.

 

[maflynn]

but wonder for how long can they keep this caviar pricing going?

It will continue until the point where they're unable to sustain sales.

I think up until recently the premium pricing was working because buyers felt they were getting a premium product and experience. Apple made great strides to commoditize the computer, i.e., making it disposable, in doing that they hurt the premium feel. Why spend over 2k on a machine that is designed to be thrown away in a couple of years instead of upgraded. They can't have it both ways imo, you cannot have a premium computer and consider it a commodity to be used up and thrown away.

I think we're at a nexus with Apple computers, and while the 2016 MBP may be selling well for the short term, I think the long term outlook is less rosy. Not strictly because we're in a post PC world (we are to a degree), but because of the price point and getting value for that price.

I could go into some my thoughts on why, such as Tim Cook's quote on wondering why people would buy a pc, or their attempt to prop up sales of the iPad by not making a touch enabled computer, but my main point is that Apple's commoditization is going to hurt them more in the long

 

[Huntn]

It will continue until the point where they're unable to sustain sales.

I think up until recently the premium pricing was working because buyers felt they were getting a premium product and experience. Apple made great strides to commoditize the computer, i.e., making it disposable, in doing that they hurt the premium feel. Why spend over 2k on a machine that is designed to be thrown away in a couple of years instead of upgraded. They can't have it both ways imo, you cannot have a premium computer and consider it a commodity to be used up and thrown away.

I think we're at a nexus with Apple computers, and while the 2016 MBP may be selling well for the short term, I think the long term outlook is less rosy. Not strictly because we're in a post PC world (we are to a degree), but because of the price point and getting value for that price.

I could go into some my thoughts on why, such as Tim Cook's quote on wondering why people would buy a pc, or their attempt to prop up sales of the iPad by not making a touch enabled computer, but my main point is that Apple's commoditization is going to hurt them more in the long

On my 2011 MBP, I had the screen (if I'm not confusing it with the previous Mac ), the motherboard, and the hard drive replaced, all except the hard drive on Apple's dime (including my paying AppleCare). I also upgraded my RAM. I used that computer for 5 years and it's still going. So the bottom line is if these items are still replaceable, vs throwing away the entire unit and replacing it, I don't seeing much as changed. If the consumer does not notice a cost differentiation then this model might continue to work.

However for myself, the big exception was the $500 price increase to keep dedicated graphics and it was a breaking point for me, causing me to revert to a lesser model. I view this as an example of market shrinkage if a bunch of customers start actively reducing their investment costs in Apple hardware. The other consideration is customer service and what in my experience can only be called generosity in many cases, such as when my wife took her iPad in cause it was acting funny, and out of warranty, and she walked out with a replacement iPad on Apple.

Customer service, keeping my hardware going without a lot of extra costs, and of course the MacOS. We'll just have to see how it goes with the new box, but that still does not make me thrilled to spend $2000 on a laptop without dedicated graphics and a puny SSD.

 

[iamthemacguy]

Could not locate a better forum, so plunked it here.
......
I'm not yet ready to abandon Apple, but wonder for how long can they keep this caviar pricing going? Anyone got some good tea leaves?

Actually, for the price you are saving money in the long run, especially when you consider your time troubleshooting and fixing things.

IBM has a huge migration of its employees moving to the Apple platform. They have published their financial savings of the conversion of $250-$500 per computer over a four year life cycle. Just do a Google search of "IBM saving money Apple".

So when you take all things into consideration, a Mac may save you money, or the difference is a wash in the end.

 

[Huntn]

Actually, for the price you are saving money in the long run, especially when you consider your time troubleshooting and fixing things.

IBM has a huge migration of its employees moving to the Apple platform. They have published their financial savings of the conversion of $250-$500 per computer over a four year life cycle. Just do a Google search of "IBM saving money Apple".

So when you take all things into consideration, a Mac may save you money, or the difference is a wash in the end.

IT maintenance costs has always been a plus on the MacOS side.

 

[jdechko]

1-Apple has like 15% marketshare, if you want to stay competing against Microsoft which has like 80% share you need to put a high margin

I don't think Apple cares much about PC market share. The PC market as a whole has been shrinking, and many younger users do the majority of their computing on their phones—a device that is always with you and always connected.

The iPhone is where the money is, so that will of course continue on, and I think that Tim really believes that the iPad is the future, so I think they will continue to invest heavily in the iPad.

People wonder where that leaves the Mac. There has to be a group of Apple engineers that love the Mac, and the new MBP shows that the Mac is far from dead. Why else would they invest all of that time and money in the new features? However, the pricing does bother me considerably. The old lineup made sense: MBA hit the important sub-1000 price point. The MacBook filled the thin-and-light, and the 13" pro started right around the 1300 mark as well.

But the new MacBook with function keys was billed as a replacement for the Air, and I think that's a fair move. But it only replaced the air in functionality, not price point. I get that new technology is expensive, and that Apples modus operandi is to maintain their margins, but it does seem like a kick in the face when it takes so long to have new machines released and they cost 30-50+% more than the previous generations. And the fact that Apple kept the previous generation machines around highlights this even further.

 

[lowendlinux]

I think we'll see a price drop next year. When the rMBP came out it was priced quite a bit higher then the cMBP but that changed the next year.

 

[randian]

I think we'll see a price drop next year. When the rMBP came out it was priced quite a bit higher then the cMBP but that changed the next year.

Yes, but if you need one the display will be a lot more expensive so you won't save much overall. I was thinking about buying a 13-inch MBP plus one of the new LG displays to replace my 2010 iMac. If I want the current discount on the display I have to buy now and then wait who knows how long for a cheaper MBP to appear, hopefully with Skylake, if it appears at all. In the mean time I've bought an expensive paperweight.