How to quit an app in OS 4.0?

[Merkie]

Honestly I can't think of all that much I care about that can't be handled through those seven channels. I'd love to hear some examples, though, since people seem to still be complaining about it.

Not you in particular.

IM client. Still impossible.

 

[ViViDboarder]

IM client. Still impossible.

How do you figure? Meebo works great.

 

[Merkie]

How do you figure? Meebo works great.

Without retarded push notifications I mean. The way it works on any other computer / smartphone without a problem. You can't do that on the iPhone.

 

[BaldiMac]

Without retarded push notifications I mean. The way it works on any other computer / smartphone without a problem. You can't do that on the iPhone.

What's the problem with push notifications for IM?

 

[ViViDboarder]

Without retarded push notifications I mean. The way it works on any other computer / smartphone without a problem. You can't do that on the iPhone.

I never used any other smart phone and my computer it works the same way. I see the dock icon light up and then I switch to the app to check it. How is this any different? You get notified that you got an IM, you can even read it there. Then to reply you touch the app and you're right into the conversation.

 

[outcastrc]

Thats what I got out of it as well.

Theres nothing for beejive (as an example) to let me chat without using push. If I am doing something outside of the 7 new apis (not that I can run them anyways as I am 3G) I still have to close the app to open beejive, say what I want, then close again. Push made it bearable to use IM, and OS 4 doesn't look like it will be improving IM at all.

Unless I missed something...

 

[ViViDboarder]

Thats what I got out of it as well.

Theres nothing for beejive (as an example) to let me chat without using push. If I am doing something outside of the 7 new apis (not that I can run them anyways as I am 3G) I still have to close the app to open beejive, say what I want, then close again. Push made it bearable to use IM, and OS 4 doesn't look like it will be improving IM at all.

Unless I missed something...

So you mean for something like a quick reply API. That would be REALLY cool actually. It could function almost like the Mail API does. So if you get a message it comes up on the screen and then reply would only slide up a window that would let you write your response. That would be awesome!

 

[Eso]

What's the problem with push notifications for IM?

Push drains your battery 20% faster 24/7 whereas some people just want to keep the client open while they are actively in a conversation and doing other things on their phone.

Personally, I think that 20% figure is ********. If my iPhone gets a whiff of Push my battery drain while in standby increases 300%.

 

[Merkie]

What's the problem with push notifications for IM?

I never used any other smart phone and my computer it works the same way. I see the dock icon light up and then I switch to the app to check it. How is this any different? You get notified that you got an IM, you can even read it there. Then to reply you touch the app and you're right into the conversation.

Because it's slow. I have a 2G iPhone, and whenever I get a push notification that someone sent me a message, I first have to open the app (takes a few seconds), sign in (takes about 30 seconds), let the contact list load, and then finally I can read the message and reply. It almost takes a minute! Now this probably won't be as bad on 3G with the 3GS, but it's still a lot slower than actual multitasking. For instance, on my Android phone the IM app opens instantly. I can reply within seconds after receiving a message.

Can't do that on the iPhone. Push notifications make it work, but it's not a pleasant experience at all. And it won't get better with OS 4.0.

 

[ViViDboarder]

Push drains your battery 20% faster 24/7 whereas some people just want to keep the client open while they are actively in a conversation and doing other things on their phone.

That is absolutely false. How do you figure? PUSH messages come down from Apple's servers only when you receive something. It's not a fetch every 5 minutes.

 

[ViViDboarder]

Because it's slow. I have a 2G iPhone, and whenever I get a push notification that someone sent me a message, I first have to open the app (takes a few seconds), sign in (takes about 30 seconds), let the contact list load, and then finally I can read the message and reply. It almost takes a minute! Now this probably won't be as bad on 3G with the 3GS, but it's still a lot slower than actual multitasking. For instance, on my Android phone the IM app opens instantly. I can reply within seconds after receiving a message.

Can't do that on the iPhone. Push notifications make it work, but it's not a pleasant experience at all. And it won't get better with OS 4.0.

Well the 2G phone won't get 4.0 anyway... and the 3G won't get multitasking...

But they made a mention of better save states so I'm guessing that the application is cached to the SSD for quicker startup. You'll start up be able to resume right where left off. This should be quicker actually than the way it works now. I'm also 90% sure this is the same way Android handles it and the same way WP7 plans on doing it.

 

[outcastrc]

So you mean for something like a quick reply API. That would be REALLY cool actually. It could function almost like the Mail API does. So if you get a message it comes up on the screen and then reply would only slide up a window that would let you write your response. That would be awesome!

You know that does give me an idea. Why can't push be a two way street? (other then apple never thinking of it) That way beejive pushes you the message, you reply right in the push box and push sends it back. That could work awesome.

Not that it'll ever happen... Just a thought...

 

[ViViDboarder]

You know that does give me an idea. Why can't push be a two way street? (other then apple never thinking of it) That way beejive pushes you the message, you reply right in the push box and push sends it back. That could work awesome.

Not that it'll ever happen... Just a thought...

Jailbroken iPhones have that for SMS. But yea, it would be an awesome API.

 

[Merkie]

Well the 2G phone won't get 4.0 anyway... and the 3G won't get multitasking...

But they made a mention of better save states so I'm guessing that the application is cached to the SSD for quicker startup. You'll start up be able to resume right where left off. This should be quicker actually than the way it works now. I'm also 90% sure this is the same way Android handles it and the same way WP7 plans on doing it.

I hope you're right, but what I got from the presentation is that an IM client will be exactly the same on OS 4.0. Save states won't help because you still have to sign in again. I don't know, it just seems more like a nasty workaround. I don't really like it. Maybe it works a lot better in practice, but for now im skeptical.

 

[Eso]

That is absolutely false. How do you figure? PUSH messages come down from Apple's servers only when you receive something. It's not a fetch every 5 minutes.

20% faster than w/o the PNS service, not 20% faster than leaving an IM client open all day.

The point is for many people, 20% increased battery drain of 24 hours a day is a lot more than 100% increased battery drain for an hour or two of actual IM conversation.

 

[ViViDboarder]

I hope you're right, but what I got from the presentation is that an IM client will be exactly the same on OS 4.0. Save states won't help because you still have to sign in again. I don't know, it just seems more like a nasty workaround. I don't really like it. Maybe it works a lot better in practice, but for now im skeptical.

The sign in shouldn't be an issue since the 2G is out of the question... My 3G signs in really quickly in most apps. Also, after having read the message I can start typing my reply before it finishes and it's definitely done by the time I hit send. If they can even speed that up it'd be great.

 

[Merkie]

20% faster than w/o the PNS service, not 20% faster than leaving an IM client open all day.

The point is for many people, 20% increased drain of 24 hours a day is a lot more than 100% increased battery drain for an hour or two of actual IM conversation.

Damn, so that's why my notebook battery dies so quickly, because of the IM app consuming huge amounts of CPU cycles!

Oh wait. No it doesn't it's sitting there idle for 99% of the time.

The sign in shouldn't be an issue since the 2G is out of the question... My 3G signs in really quickly in most apps. Also, after having read the message I can start typing my reply before it finishes and it's definitely done by the time I hit send. If they can even speed that up it'd be great.

It's better but still not great. Instant messaging is usually something you do in the background yourself as well, you'll be busy browsing, reading the news or playing a game and then you get a message. You'll want to quickly switch apps, send a reply and quickly switch back. Instant messaging is never my main priority when I use an IM client, but on the iPhone you just can't really use it that way. It's unpleasant for me.

On Android, I have Google Talk running in the background all day long. It's almost exactly like text messaging, doesn't drain the battery at all. I can quickly switch apps. It works nice and blends into the background like it should. I like it. I currently don't like instant messaging on the iPhone. I hope it gets better, but I doubt that I'll ever find it pleasant to use unless Apple starts enabling real multitasking for third party apps.

 

[farmermac]

Simple, multi tasking works exactly as it does now. The iPod ap runs in the background until you pause it, then it goes away until you call it up again

 

[ViViDboarder]

20% faster than w/o the PNS service, not 20% faster than leaving an IM client open all day.

The point is for many people, 20% increased battery drain of 24 hours a day is a lot more than 100% increased battery drain for an hour or two of actual IM conversation.

Now that I'm thinking about it... What would the Local Notifications be for if any app wasn't available to run in the background? Would this be limited to things like VoIP or Music which have backgrounding? If so then how come their example was a TV guide type app showing a local notification? It had to be running in the background for that.

 

[Merkie]

Now that I'm thinking about it... What would the Local Notifications be for if any app wasn't available to run in the background? Would this be limited to things like VoIP or Music which have backgrounding? If so then how come their example was a TV guide type app showing a local notification? It had to be running in the background for that.

That's a good point. Apple didn't really explain the way their "multitasking" implementation works well.

 

[BaldiMac]

Now that I'm thinking about it... What would the Local Notifications be for if any app wasn't available to run in the background? Would this be limited to things like VoIP or Music which have backgrounding? If so then how come their example was a TV guide type app showing a local notification? It had to be running in the background for that.

While open, the TV Guide app tells the local notification service to send a notification at 8:00pm. It can then be closed.

 

[BaldiMac]

Push drains your battery 20% faster 24/7 whereas some people just want to keep the client open while they are actively in a conversation and doing other things on their phone.

Personally, I think that 20% figure is ********. If my iPhone gets a whiff of Push my battery drain while in standby increases 300%.

20% faster than w/o the PNS service, not 20% faster than leaving an IM client open all day.

The point is for many people, 20% increased battery drain of 24 hours a day is a lot more than 100% increased battery drain for an hour or two of actual IM conversation.

Where did you get 20% from?

 

[ViViDboarder]

While open, the TV Guide app tells the local notification service to send a notification at 8:00pm. It can then be closed.

Ugh, that'd be a huge disappointment. They opened up the calendar API so if that's really what they mean then they could have just added calendar events.

The only reason I have to think that it could be more backgrounding is that they said the notification comes from the App itself... Hopefully that means while running.

 

[Eso]

Damn, so that's why my notebook battery dies so quickly, because of the IM app consuming huge amounts of CPU cycles!

Oh wait. No it doesn't it's sitting there idle for 99% of the time.

What does PNS on the iPhone have to do with an IM client on a laptop? Oh right, nothing.

An IM client on the iPhone may not be very taxing on the CPU, but it maintains a network connection, which is battery-intensive. Nevertheless, some people may only chat an hour per day, and would rather have 100% increased battery drain while running the app in the background as opposed to 20% increased battery drain all the time, even when they aren't even using the iPhone.

Where did you get 20% from?

The iPhone 2.0 (and 3.0 lmao) keynote

 

[teek]

I bet when that bar comes up with all your apps you can probably hold your finger on it until the X comes up then tap the X to close it.

Nope I think not, I think you just have do drag the app icon off of the bar and *poof* .. just like deleting icons from your taskbar? on the mac