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He, and rightfully so, does not have the need nor the interest of putting up with things that do not relate to his actual line of work, and Windows and this Surface doesn't just want a bit of that, it REQUIRES a LOT of that.

I'm a computer technician that works with a lot of seniors and self-described "computer illiterates". I'm finding, after six years of doing this, that ordinary people HATE file systems and the necessity of filing things. I don't know how many times I've looked at a customer's system and everything they've made or used is in the Downloads folder. I can't explain, in a way that they'll accept, why to do this. I hear: "Why can't they make a computer that's simple?" Essentially, Windows is too complicated and the iPad is the answer.
 
It needs mouse support, and desktop Safari (jeesh, this one really gets me).

Do you honestly think iOS will stay gimped? I don't think so.
 
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It's awesome for children and elderly people or anyone that that is intimidated by traditional computers. My spouse is very much the analog type so it is perfect for her. She has no need for file systems, just browse the web and write emails. The simplicity is a boon for me as I no longer have to play the role of in-house IT consultant.
 
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I remember Steve J vision was computers as cars vs trucks analogy. You use the desktop and higher end laptops for truck like duties. And the car aka iPad for you casual use. I see tablets and iPads for my parents. It simple you don’t worry about viruses anymore. It’s super hard to **** up an iPad by installing software.

I just got my first iPad in years. A 12.9 3rd gen and I love it. It’s for casual use, PDFs, YouTube, writing notes and jotting stuff down. I love it. If I were every to go back in school this would be my main tool to study!!! And I imagine my kids having tablets with pencils to study in schools.

My 2017 mb pro laptop is on the shelf now! I don’t for see buying a laptop for years and years and years. Heck I’d just buy an old laptop if this keyboard takes a dump on me.
[doublepost=1545636893][/doublepost]Nice i’m Gonna buy my dad a pro 10.5 iPad next year. YOLO!
 
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She uses it for google classrooms for her assignments. She can also access her grades and possible missing assignments through genesis. She also has IXL for 90% of her homework. She also has access to iTunes U for study materials.

This sounds good. However I guess it also depends on the school/college itself. For iPads to be useful for school, schools themselves have to be integrated in the Apple ecosystem and use apps that are available in App Store. For now this is still not the case in my country. I think that this is an important point as well and does explain why some people are willing to go with iPad only while others like me can't.

We have a Mini at home, that she doesn’t need as much as she used to. They use google docs a lot as well, she uses both the iPad and mini for those. Usually she only uses the mini when she forgets to charge the iPad.

Cool that you have mini as well.

I bought the 12.9” pro with pencil. My plan is to use it for a notebook and canvas access. In winter 2019 they are moving away from Pearson, which apparently is in a fight with Apple, and onto Cengage do I will have access to full digital textbooks for a fraction of the cost of real books. Being able to either split screen the text and notes or full screen the text books and work on my Mac are my goals. I will need my Mac for certain workflows, so I’m prepared for those as well.

I use my regular iPad as a digital notebook too with the pencil. I bought it for this purpose and I have to say it serves it quite well. What kind of workflows will you need the Mac for?

I used my iPad for studying for the entrance exam and absolutely loved it. Split screen with the app I needed and notes was amazing.

Makes sense. I actually tend to put my notes directly in my books. This is why I love the combination of the iPad with pencil. I tend to highlight a lot and write in the empty space. This way it's easier for me to remember stuff.

I realize the larger sizes aren’t usable for you, maybe a case with a handle would help accommodate the larger sizes for you.

Yeah could be but the larger takes more space and honestly for this space I prefer a laptop. I tend to type a lot (lots of chatting both for work and personal pleasure, lots of forum posting, lots of work with Office documents) and I don't like software keyboards. So the moment I add a physical keyboard I prefer to have a laptop. For now I am more in the camp of having both laptop and then medium size iPad. This way the iPad is portable enough to carry it around in my purse and use it outside. And then I just use my laptop at home.
 
This sounds good. However I guess it also depends on the school/college itself. For iPads to be useful for school, schools themselves have to be integrated in the Apple ecosystem and use apps that are available in App Store. For now this is still not the case in my country. I think that this is an important point as well and does explain why some people are willing to go with iPad only while others like me can't.


Agreed. It won’t happen on its own. I think there’s a pretty large push to head this way. I’ve helped with her homework and her math especially. Being able to answer a question, get it wrong and see why it’s wrong is invaluable IMHO. I went through school filling out worksheets and then just getting it back graded and not knowing why answers were wrong. It was more important for them to stick to the curriculum than make sure students had a full grasp of the material.

Cool that you have mini as well.
I use my regular iPad as a digital notebook too with the pencil. I bought it for this purpose and I have to say it serves it quite well. What kind of workflows will you need the Mac for?

Mainly Office. I will be taking courses in excel and access. I will also need PowerPoint and word for submitting work throughout the course.

Makes sense. I actually tend to put my notes directly in my books. This is why I love the combination of the iPad with pencil. I tend to highlight a lot and write in the empty space. This way it's easier for me to remember stuff.

I’m actually really excited at this prospect. I know some hate digital textbooks, my wife included, but for the price digital really makes sense. Cost of books was one thing keeping me from going back to school.


Yeah could be but the larger takes more space and honestly for this space I prefer a laptop. I tend to type a lot (lots of chatting both for work and personal pleasure, lots of forum posting, lots of work with Office documents) and I don't like software keyboards. So the moment I add a physical keyboard I prefer to have a laptop. For now I am more in the camp of having both laptop and then medium size iPad. This way the iPad is portable enough to carry it around in my purse and use it outside. And then I just use my laptop at home.

I guess this makes sense. For me it had to be the iPad OR the laptop. I couldn’t afford both. Not having to buy paper notebooks or whatever and being able to keep everything on me in one place is way more my speed. I can’t write on a laptop and I already had the mini. The iPad made more sense to me for sure.
 
This will never be a desktop replacement for me considering I can’t run full programs like Lightroom etc... however, it is great for doing this right here. Browsing and writing. Fortunately, I have a 2018 MBP and iMac. I’m good there. I wish this could be the replacement that I want it to be.
 
I use my iPad Pro to play Civilization 6 and make messy handwritten notes so I don’t have paper everywhere. I’m on medical retirement and process all incoming documentation by scanning (the default save is \iCloud on my scanning settings). I use a PDF markup app to read the documentation, sign/mark it if necessary and return via email. Scanning isn’t even involved if I receive electronic documentation.

Note taking is *very* big for me and it’s far easier for me to write down rather than type down information. When I retired in May, 2017 I destroyed 20 years of handwritten lab notes so going paperless (or as paperless as possible)is a big deal. I’ve got a Bluetooth keyboard if I need to do heavy document creation, etc.

I’ve also got a 2018 iPad and pencil and Surface Go. I do prefer the Microsoft pen to the Apple version.

Tom
 
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Agreed. It won’t happen on its own. I think there’s a pretty large push to head this way. I’ve helped with her homework and her math especially. Being able to answer a question, get it wrong and see why it’s wrong is invaluable IMHO. I went through school filling out worksheets and then just getting it back graded and not knowing why answers were wrong. It was more important for them to stick to the curriculum than make sure students had a full grasp of the material.

Very good point. I was lucky enough that my parents thought that math is super important for my education. I had at least 5 math books to solve every school year. I would solve 5 problems from each and then my parents would go over my solution in the end of the day and tell me if it was OK. Receiving this feedback early enough is definitely good experience. I agree with you. I had not explored that much the iOS education apps. What you describe sounds awesome!

Mainly Office. I will be taking courses in excel and access. I will also need PowerPoint and word for submitting work throughout the course.

Makes sense. I am in a similar boat. I do prefer to use Office on my Windows laptop/Windows desktop at work than on an iPad.

I’m actually really excited at this prospect. I know some hate digital textbooks, my wife included, but for the price digital really makes sense. Cost of books was one thing keeping me from going back to school.

I think that people were against digital books because they were losing the personal touch. In general I do think that the brain remembers more if we have more personal interaction with the book. I actually used a pencil to add notes to my school books. It was quite light pencil that was easily erased. I never compromised my books but I still had the option to add study notes, thoughts and line stuff in the book directly. So for me the moment there was good enough digital pencil I was sold. With the pencil you have back the personal touch and the interaction with the book you know.

I guess this makes sense. For me it had to be the iPad OR the laptop. I couldn’t afford both. Not having to buy paper notebooks or whatever and being able to keep everything on me in one place is way more my speed. I can’t write on a laptop and I already had the mini. The iPad made more sense to me for sure.

Oh I would not buy both expensive laptop and iPad Pro. I also don't have desktop computer at home. My laptop is actually my desktop :). Even with this though I knew that at the most I will buy regular 6th gen. Having expensive laptop and iPad Pro (at the same price as my current laptop) is definitely not an option for me. I chose the laptop because of the heavy keyboard usage.

Plus I also don't use the iPad for media consumption. Due to eye issues I am forbidden to read in bed, to watch movies in bed and lots of other stuff you use tablets for.
 
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I'm a computer technician that works with a lot of seniors and self-described "computer illiterates". I'm finding, after six years of doing this, that ordinary people HATE file systems and the necessity of filing things. I don't know how many times I've looked at a customer's system and everything they've made or used is in the Downloads folder. I can't explain, in a way that they'll accept, why to do this. I hear: "Why can't they make a computer that's simple?" Essentially, Windows is too complicated and the iPad is the answer.

A file system dates back over half a century ago and started in corporate offices for Document Libraries. Filing documents, etc into a basement storage with a hierarchy process that’s ... well ... “well documented” for accessing retrieval. Too many windows corporate users file their documents in such an annoying way - 5-10foldees deep. Seems to work well for them with a specific project or application their working with. Fast forward 10mths later with a different project, file type or application frequent use and ask them where said document they worked on before ...

1. You’d be amazed how many need a few minutes of browsing about to find the document.

2. In doing the above wasting so many minutes manually mouse clicking that universal indexing and search could’ve found it in brief seconds.

The funny part is the human mind doesn’t work like a file system so it ads to our daily stress.

Over the last 15yrs working with Windows, even with Win10 Enterprise the default file path + file name and extension has a limitation of 256-characters started from the root “C:\” drive. Let’s not forget the nice find of Excel having its own limitation of 218-characters if ANY cell has a reference to another workbook.

Some applications bypass this which leads to the annoying support nightmare of a hot head whom cannot remember or from said application(s) using the “Save As” dialog, never came across these limitations in Win7 before migration to Windows 10. Why is there so many annoying loop holes (LMAO; iOS automatically corrected loop for poop hahahahaa) in file name length and file path length thrhoughout windows?!

Yes there is a way to change this in the registry of Windows but nobody really knows how it’ll affect the kernels file system, applications file sync like OneDrive, SharePoint Online, And sharing such files to Win users that have not adjusted the registry I’m such a way.

To be honest, in my opinion file systems will soon be fully gone from our OS firstly by hiding Windows Explorer in Windows, and we’re already seeing it in iOS and in macOS where /Library was hidden.

Tags
Colours
File Names
Thumbnails, icon view size, etc
Spotlight / Universal Search
Voice Search

These will and have already begun to replace the a typical Ana archaic file browser in macOS.

File management has and is better taken care of by the application that manipulates and views the file.

Excel manages .xls/.xlsx and similar file types and even shows by default the last 10 workbooks/worksheets you’ve worked on.
Outlook - .eml and similar email formatted type files. Excel isn’t going to open them and if it does the data isn’t legible.

I rather the OS and applications manage the file system, offer me a seamless way for backup (time machine in macOS), and ability to copy said files to a cloud storage of my choice 1 at a time or en mass bulk or all regardless of what application is the main one that uses it.

When applications act rogue and take over a file extension screwing up use and legibility then you need to make the changes. Funny how so many people can easily install any application, complain about file management access, or even stomp their feet when something goes wrong yet very few know how to change the default app for a file type. Let alone change their default web browser lol.

You should see the ticket I got last week after explaining the 256/218 character ligations that are default by Microsoft and have been since windows 3.1. Had to advise to the person to re-organize his file structure, after installing drivers and firmwares for chipset components to help improve his computer performance. Major win but you can almost hear the cursing and feet stomping just by reading the ticket as he “demanded” an explanation as to why “HE” never saw this enforced and expects this to be communicated across the corporation.

The years of experience didn’t prepare me for that one lol.
 
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A file system dates back over half a century ago and started in corporate offices for Document Libraries. Filing documents, etc into a basement storage with a hierarchy process that’s ... well ... “well documented” for accessing retrieval. Too many windows corporate users file their documents in such an annoying way - 5-10foldees deep. Seems to work well for them with a specific project or application their working with. Fast forward 10mths later with a different project, file type or application frequent use and ask them where said document they worked on before ...

1. You’d be amazed how many need a few minutes of browsing about to find the document.

2. In doing the above wasting so many minutes manually mouse clicking that universal indexing and search could’ve found it in brief seconds.

The funny part is the human mind doesn’t work like a file system so it ads to our daily stress.

Over the last 15yrs working with Windows, even with Win10 Enterprise the default file path + file name and extension has a limitation of 256-characters started from the root “C:\” drive. Let’s not forget the nice find of Excel having its own limitation of 218-characters if ANY cell has a reference to another workbook.

Some applications bypass this which leads to the annoying support nightmare of a hot head whom cannot remember or from said application(s) using the “Save As” dialog, never came across these limitations in Win7 before migration to Windows 10. Why is there so many annoying loop holes (LMAO; iOS automatically corrected loop for poop hahahahaa) in file name length and file path length thrhoughout windows?!

Yes there is a way to change this in the registry of Windows but nobody really knows how it’ll affect the kernels file system, applications file sync like OneDrive, SharePoint Online, And sharing such files to Win users that have not adjusted the registry I’m such a way.

To be honest, in my opinion file systems will soon be fully gone from our OS firstly by hiding Windows Explorer in Windows, and we’re already seeing it in iOS and in macOS where /Library was hidden.

Tags
Colours
File Names
Thumbnails, icon view size, etc
Spotlight / Universal Search
Voice Search

These will and have already begun to replace the a typical Ana archaic file browser in macOS.

File management has and is better taken care of by the application that manipulates and views the file.

Excel manages .xls/.xlsx and similar file types and even shows by default the last 10 workbooks/worksheets you’ve worked on.
Outlook - .eml and similar email formatted type files. Excel isn’t going to open them and if it does the data isn’t legible.

I rather the OS and applications manage the file system, offer me a seamless way for backup (time machine in macOS), and ability to copy said files to a cloud storage of my choice 1 at a time or en mass bulk or all regardless of what application is the main one that uses it.

When applications act rogue and take over a file extension screwing up use and legibility then you need to make the changes. Funny how so many people can easily install any application, complain about file management access, or even stomp their feet when something goes wrong yet very few know how to change the default app for a file type. Let alone change their default web browser lol.

You should see the ticket I got last week after explaining the 256/218 character ligations that are default by Microsoft and have been since windows 3.1. Had to advise to the person to re-organize his file structure, after installing drivers and firmwares for chipset components to help improve his computer performance. Major win but you can almost hear the cursing and feet stomping just by reading the ticket as he “demanded” an explanation as to why “HE” never saw this enforced and expects this to be communicated across the corporation.

The years of experience didn’t prepare me for that one lol.

I do think about the ability to repair computers when I think about filesystems and how they're managed. If you take away the ability to see the filesystem, how do you fix it? All your data and settings would have to be somewhere else if someone had to rebuild the device. Some data (financial or deeply personal) I would want local or on a removable device.

An example: Windows 7 is easier to repair than Windows 8.1 is, and Windows 10 is harder. Why? Microsoft has taken away many features techs used to repair machines (F8, Safe Mode access from a shut down machine, Startup Repair that usually worked, etc) so that I'm cautious about hiding and simplyfing more things. I do wish there was a Tech Mode that would give you 1) an optional boot progress screen like Linux has so you could see where the boot stopped, 2) a dashboard that tells you the status of the system, 3) Startup Repair methods that work, or better yet a more robust boot process. Security improvements have made it very hard to repair a Windows 10 box that has failed to boot due to bad drivers or updates. Grab their data and rebuild from scratch, then reinstall their software seems now to be the only method that works to repair Windows ... and it's a shame and it's not elegant.

Which is why I'm on a Mac. I'll fix PC's all day long, but when I get home, I want the OS to get out of my way and let me do what I want the way I want to. I don't want it to talk back.

I do like how the Mac hides the operating system from the normal user. It's very restful. But, a technician can unhide everything if necessary. You can't do that on iOS. The MacOS seems to be more durable and more efficient than Windows, and from what I can see anecdotally, it breaks less often. My first modern Mac was a MacBook 2.1 and it was using 2007 hardware. Put Vista on the same hardware and the fans would spin full blast nonstop; the MacBook never used its fans. Most impressive and the reason I switched to my current MBP (17" mid-2009).

BTW: I like your signature. People need privacy.
 
I do think about the ability to repair computers when I think about filesystems and how they're managed. If you take away the ability to see the filesystem, how do you fix it? All your data and settings would have to be somewhere else if someone had to rebuild the device. Some data (financial or deeply personal) I would want local or on a removable device.

An example: Windows 7 is easier to repair than Windows 8.1 is, and Windows 10 is harder. Why? Microsoft has taken away many features techs used to repair machines (F8, Safe Mode access from a shut down machine, Startup Repair that usually worked, etc) so that I'm cautious about hiding and simplyfing more things. I do wish there was a Tech Mode that would give you 1) an optional boot progress screen like Linux has so you could see where the boot stopped, 2) a dashboard that tells you the status of the system, 3) Startup Repair methods that work, or better yet a more robust boot process. Security improvements have made it very hard to repair a Windows 10 box that has failed to boot due to bad drivers or updates. Grab their data and rebuild from scratch, then reinstall their software seems now to be the only method that works to repair Windows ... and it's a shame and it's not elegant.

Which is why I'm on a Mac. I'll fix PC's all day long, but when I get home, I want the OS to get out of my way and let me do what I want the way I want to. I don't want it to talk back.

I do like how the Mac hides the operating system from the normal user. It's very restful. But, a technician can unhide everything if necessary. You can't do that on iOS. The MacOS seems to be more durable and more efficient than Windows, and from what I can see anecdotally, it breaks less often. My first modern Mac was a MacBook 2.1 and it was using 2007 hardware. Put Vista on the same hardware and the fans would spin full blast nonstop; the MacBook never used its fans. Most impressive and the reason I switched to my current MBP (17" mid-2009).

BTW: I like your signature. People need privacy.
The very first thing I did with my first mac 3 weeks ago was unhide files/directories and show file extensions. I am now making my peace with macOS.
 
I do think about the ability to repair computers when I think about filesystems and how they're managed. If you take away the ability to see the filesystem, how do you fix it? All your data and settings would have to be somewhere else if someone had to rebuild the device. Some data (financial or deeply personal) I would want local or on a removable device.

An example: Windows 7 is easier to repair than Windows 8.1 is, and Windows 10 is harder. Why? Microsoft has taken away many features techs used to repair machines (F8, Safe Mode access from a shut down machine, Startup Repair that usually worked, etc) so that I'm cautious about hiding and simplyfing more things. I do wish there was a Tech Mode that would give you 1) an optional boot progress screen like Linux has so you could see where the boot stopped, 2) a dashboard that tells you the status of the system, 3) Startup Repair methods that work, or better yet a more robust boot process. Security improvements have made it very hard to repair a Windows 10 box that has failed to boot due to bad drivers or updates. Grab their data and rebuild from scratch, then reinstall their software seems now to be the only method that works to repair Windows ... and it's a shame and it's not elegant.

Which is why I'm on a Mac. I'll fix PC's all day long, but when I get home, I want the OS to get out of my way and let me do what I want the way I want to. I don't want it to talk back.

I do like how the Mac hides the operating system from the normal user. It's very restful. But, a technician can unhide everything if necessary. You can't do that on iOS. The MacOS seems to be more durable and more efficient than Windows, and from what I can see anecdotally, it breaks less often. My first modern Mac was a MacBook 2.1 and it was using 2007 hardware. Put Vista on the same hardware and the fans would spin full blast nonstop; the MacBook never used its fans. Most impressive and the reason I switched to my current MBP (17" mid-2009).

BTW: I like your signature. People need privacy.

Regarding fixing computers - mostly applications ..
Developer Teams can make their applications more robust. Microsoft specifically has begun over the last few years with a "Fix It For Me" were a small downloadable applet not requiring admin credentials can resolve a few issues right down to the registry.

The only reason when troubleshooting an Application that I use the file system is to inject/remove specific files or delete a folder entirely. When an OS from the core is responsible for the actual core file system - many over the last 40yrs already are to be frank; then there would be no need to touch it.
- uninstalling an application should FULLY remove ALL files, folders, and other hooks within the system. Unfortunately this has been a horrible practice of NOT doing this for decades. Things need to change for a better performing system. Heck even OSX has left overs in /Library from removed applications.

Registry, or using Terminal is an alternative way of working to clean out a file system. By Default Local Admin or domain admin group membership by a user should specifically require elevated privileges before messing this low level.

Regarding end user data.
All your data remains in pretty much the same system that you're using.
Changing your way to access it doesn't change the fact that it's there, or you having the full modify/special permissions to do with it as you please. It really shouldn't else we'd have a MUCH DIFFERENT type of conversation but let's just keep that particular conversation to personal privacy and data that is submitted by our smartphones into social media and then fully owned by said services once its there. Ability to download "records" is not the same as you've uploaded - take a GOOD look, you'll see.

On your iPhone, iPad do you really worry about WHERE your photos or Videos are? Do you worry about where your Alarms, Notes, Calendar Meetings, ToDo List is, other PIM data, or your other data is? No you don't. You access ALL relative data into the applications that are primed to access, use, modify or delete said data. Simple and Easy.

Windows ... really? "what you talking about Willis?!"
F8, Safe Mode access from a shut down machine, Startup Repair - ALL work the VERY SAME as Windows 7, XP and ME. You can still access msconfig, DOS, PowerShell (administrative tools / windows feature enabled), computer management, etc just the same as before. If you don't know this ... this conversation should be done right now lol.

F8 = Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Networking, Verbose Mode, etc. is all there in Windows 10 Enterprise, Professional. Only imbedded systems don't have these options and I highly doubt that too. I can access these on a Intel Compute Stick let along a Lenovo T440/450/460/470/480/X1 Carbon 5th/6th generation machines and many other PC brands.

1> F8, Safe Mode Verbose Mode.
Option: boot from USB or PXE and access DOS (already elevated) and launch Event Viewer.

"'Security improvements have made it very hard to repair a Windows 10 box that has failed to boot due to bad drivers or updates"
- Safe Mode and Safe Mode with Networking.
Uninstall and remove the drivers and package
Double check no other hardware is connected during boot.
Disable any applications or services that are not primary - msconfig minimal boot (vs Safe Mode booting).

- sounds like you don't have a LOT of experience troubleshooting windows. Besides there is a LOT of troubleshooting on the OSX (I'm still having a hard time calling it macOS because Mac OS debuted before OSX).


but when I get home, I want the OS to get out of my way and let me do what I want the way I want to. I don't want it to talk back.
Brother ... you and I are HERE ... eyes in the same direction.

This is precisely why I believe that the file system will soon go away. We use Applications, Services, the Internet. Devices have gotten a LOT simpler.

Did anyone complain when Unix, Linux and finally OSX took over disk fragmentation? Nope. The hard drive, SSD's, still work the same way just much more efficiently over the long term so, as the famous Bertrand Serlet once said .. "No user should ever have to worry about disk defragmentation" ;) Nor should they worry about the file system.

Our brains don't systematically categorize all data we consume.
We can watch a murder point blank. Yet the police investigators KNOW that with every minute passes facts ... starting with the most important yet smallest in our minds are the first to get misconstrued, forgotten and soon changed. Remember that old saying and game Broken Telephone? Have you played that at camp as a young kid? If you're younger than 35 most likely you haven't and thus the phrase maybe lost on you along with the importance of it related to memory and factual data.

PS: Signature is a line from that Netflix movie "Anon" ... it struck an accord with me when I heard it. Definitely we need our privacy.

Looking forward to growing and learning more ... maybe YOU can teach me macOS>

My first Mac was a 2002 Quicksilver PowerMac G4 733Mhz machine. I knew more then about using a Mac than I do today as the majority of my time and learning is for my profession - working in a Windows world. I look forward to transitioning to full MacOS support and database and architectural design soon enough.
 
Italicized from DeepIn2U above:

Regarding fixing computers - mostly applications ..
Developer Teams can make their applications more robust. Microsoft specifically has begun over the last few years with a "Fix It For Me" were a small downloadable applet not requiring admin credentials can resolve a few issues right down to the registry.


and I wish those were still available.

The only reason when troubleshooting an Application that I use the file system is to inject/remove specific files or delete a folder entirely. When an OS from the core is responsible for the actual core file system - many over the last 40yrs already are to be frank; then there would be no need to touch it.
- uninstalling an application should FULLY remove ALL files, folders, and other hooks within the system. Unfortunately this has been a horrible practice of NOT doing this for decades. Things need to change for a better performing system. Heck even OSX has left overs in /Library from removed applications.


I totally agree: Taylor's Law - I can ALWAYS find something left over when an application uninstalls itself.

Registry, or using Terminal is an alternative way of working to clean out a file system. By Default Local Admin or domain admin group membership by a user should specifically require elevated privileges before messing this low level.

Regarding end user data.
All your data remains in pretty much the same system that you're using.
Changing your way to access it doesn't change the fact that it's there, or you having the full modify/special permissions to do with it as you please. It really shouldn't else we'd have a MUCH DIFFERENT type of conversation but let's just keep that particular conversation to personal privacy and data that is submitted by our smartphones into social media and then fully owned by said services once its there. Ability to download "records" is not the same as you've uploaded - take a GOOD look, you'll see.

On your iPhone, iPad do you really worry about WHERE your photos or Videos are? Do you worry about where your Alarms, Notes, Calendar Meetings, ToDo List is, other PIM data, or your other data is? No you don't. You access ALL relative data into the applications that are primed to access, use, modify or delete said data. Simple and Easy.


No, I don't worry on my iDevices, and that's kind of the point. I was lucky when I restored my iPad Mini the other day; it just worked. What if it didn't work?

Windows ... really? "what you talking about Willis?!"
F8, Safe Mode access from a shut down machine, Startup Repair - ALL work the VERY SAME as Windows 7, XP and ME. You can still access msconfig, DOS, PowerShell (administrative tools / windows feature enabled), computer management, etc just the same as before. If you don't know this ... this conversation should be done right now lol.

F8 = Safe Mode, Safe Mode with Networking, Verbose Mode, etc. is all there in Windows 10 Enterprise, Professional. Only imbedded systems don't have these options and I highly doubt that too. I can access these on a Intel Compute Stick let along a Lenovo T440/450/460/470/480/X1 Carbon 5th/6th generation machines and many other PC brands.

1> F8, Safe Mode Verbose Mode.
Option: boot from USB or PXE and access DOS (already elevated) and launch Event Viewer.


They all work the same, IF you can get to them. But, you can't access them from a shut down machine if they're not already enabled when it was a working system. Most new Win 10 systems (and I see mostly Home, and sometimes Pro) are GPT/UEFI systems and F8 is disabled from the factory. If I can get the system to boot, I hold down Shift when I click Restart and I can get to the Recovery Environment.

"'Security improvements have made it very hard to repair a Windows 10 box that has failed to boot due to bad drivers or updates"
- Safe Mode and Safe Mode with Networking.
Uninstall and remove the drivers and package
Double check no other hardware is connected during boot.
Disable any applications or services that are not primary - msconfig minimal boot (vs Safe Mode booting).

- sounds like you don't have a LOT of experience troubleshooting windows. Besides there is a LOT of troubleshooting on the OSX (I'm still having a hard time calling it macOS because Mac OS debuted before OSX).


Most of the update-related information is found in the CBS log, and I'm still trying to figure that file out. It would help if I were a programmer, but I'm not. And there are ways, probably, to remove those bad updates with DISM. But this is the wrong forum to discuss that.

Brother ... you and I are HERE ... eyes in the same direction.

This is precisely why I believe that the file system will soon go away. We use Applications, Services, the Internet. Devices have gotten a LOT simpler.

Did anyone complain when Unix, Linux and finally OSX took over disk fragmentation? Nope. The hard drive, SSD's, still work the same way just much more efficiently over the long term so, as the famous Bertrand Serlet once said .. "No user should ever have to worry about disk defragmentation" ;) Nor should they worry about the file system.


Devices have gotten simpler to us, because the systems have gotten far more complex behind the curtain. Windows is a problem because it was developed piecemeal from DOS, having to respect the massive installed base during its evolution. It can't escape that legacy. UNIX was far more integrated in process and in design from the beginning, giving MacOS a massive head start in reliability. I'm not saying that the file system should be impossible to access by anyone; just that it should be hidden from the user, like MacOS does.

Our brains don't systematically categorize all data we consume.
We can watch a murder point blank. Yet the police investigators KNOW that with every minute passes facts ... starting with the most important yet smallest in our minds are the first to get misconstrued, forgotten and soon changed. Remember that old saying and game Broken Telephone? Have you played that at camp as a young kid? If you're younger than 35 most likely you haven't and thus the phrase maybe lost on you along with the importance of it related to memory and factual data.

PS: Signature is a line from that Netflix movie "Anon" ... it struck an accord with me when I heard it. Definitely we need our privacy.

Looking forward to growing and learning more ... maybe YOU can teach me macOS>

My first Mac was a 2002 Quicksilver PowerMac G4 733Mhz machine. I knew more then about using a Mac than I do today as the majority of my time and learning is for my profession - working in a Windows world. I look forward to transitioning to full MacOS support and database and architectural design soon enough.


I agree with you about that! and I hope you get where you want to go in life.
 
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