In certain situations (e.g. iPad Pro 12.9 or iPad 3/4 in active use), it's the difference between charging and not charging.
We could argue semantics all day long but I have no time or interest doing that. You are free understand this thread the way you want. I understand it as concern 10W charger with iPad 2018 being slow, which my findings with my prevoius Air + 12W charger vs my new 2018 + 10W charger do not support. I do not see any practical difference in total charging time. They both take even 4 hours from empty to full charge (iPad not in use while charging).
Have you actually made ANY research of your own regarding this issue? I have done that and released results in this thread. When you will do the same?
Again semantics. My posts are related iPad 2018 or Air and mentioned chargers with those and nothing else. Surely 12W charger is more powerful if used with device taking full advantage from it. I don’t think with 2018 you get any really noticeable difference.
It's a 20% difference so at best, that's what one can expect.
Here is something I don't quite understand. If you have the iPad connected to PC and are monitoring load via iMazing, how are you charging it via Apple's 10W charger? Isn't the 8.5W figure therefore the load pulled via the USB port on your computer and not the Apple charger?
I have been relying to that photo myself and been wondering why design charge is smaller than that in 2018. If design charge has always been lower than 8827 mAh I’m sure ios battery apps would have got that corrected. I don’t think think they are relying to tear down test battery images when determing design capacity since they could have checked that by PC apps pulling detailed battery information. It maybe due to reasons you mention. I actually said in another thread that maybe apple is ”underclocking” battery somehow. But if that is the case I would expect all battery ios apps knowing this but still they assume it is 8820, so maybe they have slightly different size batteries. Based on iMazing battery details there are different vendor batteries around.
Is there really anyone complaining that they have measured actual difference in charging time? From OP’s post I could not determine if he actually tested it somehow or just assumed it slower since it came with 10W charger.
Like I mentioned, i have tested Air and 2018 and they take 4 hours from empty to full. I think charging circuit has effect on that due to constant monitoring and trickle charging at the end causes that efficiently charging time is pretty much identical between the two.
I agree, it will be the most and only when device can take full advantage of that extra and not just waste that by doing some adjustments to cause charging time not changing noticeable at all.
No because once you have paired pc and iMazing with usb cable you can then access the same information by wifi, so you are able to monitor charging with different chargers.
This is interesting. Have they been like this always,or are there different capacity batteries installed in some units?
I noticed those extreme values and they were there already when units was straight out of the box. I think they do some tests at the factory.
Or perhaps iOS battery life apps simply don't have access to design capacity information (same with charge cycles, etc) and what Apple allows them to see is just original battery capacity and current max capacity.
No idea. This test would take hours so I can't really be bothered to actually test charging times scientifically.
Hmm, a better comparison might be from 0-80% or 0-50%. The devices shouldn't be trickle charging at those levels. Again though, those tests would take too long.
Will test again tomorrow and include readings from iMazing.
I don't think they use different capacities. Again, this 5th gen iPad (2017) that showed 8557 mAh design capacity in iMazing is the same one that reported 8820 mAh capacity in the Battery Life iOS app.
Reckon they do. Does your 2018 iPad also show 2446 mAh in max battery charge? Then that likely means it's capable of drawing 2.4A from a charger with sufficient power output.
Cook has always been a money man. He was hired out from Compaq to be just that, Chief Operating Officer, before that he closed factories and hired contract workers to benefit the bottom line.
I just ran through a little over 1000 iPads 6th generation and all of them have the 12w adapters. I have another 100 that just came in last night, I will see if they are 12w or 10w and report back.
I would advice you refraining from stating false facts.
Wow, is this modern day road rage or what. I have no interest keep repeating myself to you. I already explained you everything and still you keep insisting you know better than I what I said or meant by saying something. Give it a rest, I'm not continuing this with you any longer.
To conclude our amicable debate may I remind you that the above is physics and in this case proven by numerous reviews as well as tests that were presented to you in this thread.
Could be but I still think that since there is this design value (like shown in iMazing) I believe that is where it should be read what battery capacity really is. I mean if there would be another value programmed there, it would be shown in iMazing too, I think. Also I have been using other IOS app called Battery (Ken Ken) and it does detect max capacity different way, for example when battery from my previous unit was down several 100 mAh,s it kept saying 100%/100% condition, so maybe that max capacity value those apps use is just programmed there based on the model which they can detect and they cannot snoop from charger circuit more detailed information anymore.
I agree. That's possibly where difference could show more.
OK. So then we will get better understanding if the charging circuits are identical between the models if iMazing give you the same readings as mine.
My current 2018 shows 2355 mA max battery charge (and 3224 mAh max discharge) but I never charged it with anything else than included 10W charger and I know that is from the factory since I checked this before actually charging the unit myself the first time (other than plugged it to my notebook usb-port. It also showed 8996 mAh battery effective charge - this one came with strong battery that still holds nominal capacity after 2-3 dozen charges while that another I returned already was going down fast after first couple of charges). My previous 2018 I returned due to battery and display issues showed 2223 mAh in max battery charge.
Here is your post from May 2018. Clearly, iMazing was able to see the original total capacity of ~8820 mAh. Why is it not reported as the original capacity when connected via USB/Wi-Fi while iOS battery health apps report this information? Only Apple knows.
Thanks for doing so detailed testing. For some reason iMazing gave you lower charging wattage what I get on my 2018 model. Did you let it be a little while and see if it was still the same? In my unit I see it gradually goes up and about 8.5W is what it is charging battery before going to trickle charging where it gradually drops wattage. Did you keep iPad display off and make sure no background software is doing its things during that.
I understood that so that design charge (8557) is equal to battery nominal capacity which should actually be 8827 but it is not at least in all devices. Max charge is just extra capacity that new battery has more or less for a while. For example that max charge in my current unit straight out of the box was almost full 9 amps!! But after first charge it stabilised around 8800. Previous unit with weak battery was dropping down to 8200 max charge within first couple of charges.
I bet it is counted from design charge.
iPad display is off. Too much hassle to change settings on the iPad for the test so I didn't bother with that. I didn't have a lot of background tasks anyway. I let charging settle for 1-2 minutes for each test since I didn't want there to be a big difference in charge states between tests. 1.2-1.3W may not seem like much but that's around 16.5% difference in this case.
Sounds like you tested it pretty similar way as I. I did not change settings either, I just closed all programs from background, like I actually always do when I stop using it.
It is interesting if efficiency has improved in 2018 so much, or is there some variable we missed? Even that 85% is a bit less than what I expected. Would it be possible that Air had even lower than 80% efficiency in internal charging circuit? I mean if 2017 > 2018 brought 5% then maybe.
That's what it mathematically looks like but I'm afraid that may not practically happen. I would have noticed 30 minutes difference in my tests. I did not measure by seconds but within some minutes and there was no noticeable difference to me a while back when I measured against Air + 12W charger. I'm very happy with charging speed with my 2018 + 10W charger and I don't miss 12W charger at all.
I don’t get it? Does a lot of owners have the 29W charger? I don’t think so. Many people got this iPad instead of a Mac, I only think it’s primary tech owners and Apple lovers who get both. I only got the 29W because I have a MacBook Pro
