I had to resort to torrent to download El Capitan

[Mr. Dee]

What is wrong with the OS X App Store? I bought a Early 2015 MacBook Pro in November. Working great with Yosemite, but I of course wanted the latest and greatest. Trying to download it over Wi-Fi at my brothers and at an Internet Café was not working. I invested in a Thunderbolt Ethernet adapter then tried downloading at Internet Café every week since the beginning of December. Every time I tried, the estimate was 16, 14, 10 until it settled on 5 hours. I bought extra time hoping it would download. When I eventually had to pause it, I only got 1.8 GBs of the 6 GB download. I thought, ok, well, I can pause it then resume next week.

Went back to the Internet Café, resuming is next to impossible. The first time I tried a resume, it started over at 0 MBs. I was like WTF! Did this for couple weeks then gave up. Tried again 2 weeks ago, got it up to 2 GBs, paused, then returned to the Internet Café, tried to use the resume unfinished downloads in the Store settings. Nope, started over. I said, no way!

I tried things like changing to Googles Public DNS, this even fixed issues with Office 2016 updating. I noticed OS X starting at Yosemite (since this is my first Mac), has some issues with network downloads. Safari for instance will seem to throttle downloads, when I switch to Firefox as the active application, the download speeds up.

Eventually, I said, I am not going to waste one more MB. I loaded kick@$$ torrents, searched for 10.11.3 and lucky enough, it was there. I had tried previous El Cap torrents in the pass, but it seemed like persons were not seeding it. So, I crossed my fingers and hoped for the best. I used Transmission to perform the download. Within 45 mins I had El Capitan versus the App Stores ridiculous 5 to 11 hours. I performed the upgrade to El Cap from Yosemite and was up and running within 26 mins time.

Apples App Store needs to some serious work where networks are concerned. I own a Windows machine and I was able to download the Windows 10 November Update within 1 hour. The network performance on OS X is atrocious. Then again, I am new to El Cap, so maybe things have improved since I have not been able to put its through paces.

Its nice to finally be able to play with new features like Split View. A subtle update, but nice to have none the less. I have to give Apple major kudos though, the upgrade was so smooth, installed within 26 mins, everything was back where it was, even folders I had open.

 

[steve62388]

It's funny you say that, I just had to download El Cap two days ago and it worked fine. Maybe your local internet cafe has a crappy connection?

 

[simonsi]

Shock horror but internet cafe's sell time and not bandwidth - its not in their interest to give you big speed...they will be throttling your connection, their business model, not the App store.

 

[mooninite]

Shock horror but internet cafe's sell time and not bandwidth - its not in their interest to give you big speed...they will be throttling your connection, their business model, not the App store.

Exactly. I've never had any issue downloading anything from the AppStore. Sounds like a connectivity issue @ the Internet cafe.

I'm kind of surprised those are even a thing considering how having net access at home is like having running water... A necessity!

 

[Mr. Dee]

Well, I live in a rural area and I am on a metered connection, so I have to do big downloads like this at an Internet café.

Its strange all you read this, but the most important parts went over your heads:
- Trying to download it over Wi-Fi at my brothers
- I tried things like changing to Googles Public DNS, this even fixed issues with Office 2016 updating.
- I used Transmission to perform the download. Within 45 mins I had El Capitan versus the App Stores ridiculous 5 to 11 hours.
- I own a Windows machine and I was able to download the Windows 10 November Update within 1 hour. This was at the Internet café also.

So, sorry, it is certainly not a connectivity issue at the Internet cafe. I have downloaded other things around 1 GB and had it down in 6 mins.

I haven't tried it out with El Capitan, so we will see when I go there this week if the problem persist. The obvious issue was the App Store though, since I got it down through Transmission in 45 mins.

 

[T'hain Esh Kelch]

You really should be carefull with torrenting OSX updates these days.

 

[simonsi]

The key thing with the torrent is you have zero idea where it came from and what came with it. Internet Cafe's typically have low bandwidth per user and cheap connections, it can entirely depend on what else is being downloaded at the time, same as at your brothers on WiFi.

The fact that people CAN download from the App store indicates it is generally OK, there is a lot of network between you and the App store (or more importantly the local cache you are pointed to), that is outside Apple's control.

 

[pika2000]

Try using a VPN and see if it fixes it. Sometimes there might be something wrong with the local routing to Apple's servers.

It does put in perspective all these "cloud" focused systems that we have now. It's all too easy to assume everybody have fast broadband access.

 

[Gav2k]

i get 200 down 12 up and trust me the issue is apples end and always has been, there app store does not push out files quick enough. so i can sympathise with the op on his issue.

 

[JohnDS]

I have read elsewhere:

Apple content is served by Akamai which uses geolocation based on the IP address of the DNS request to determine which server should provide his content. When you use Google or OpenDNS to resolve the Apple domain name, all the requests to Akamai appear to be coming from the same location and they're all directed to the same server pool, overloading that pool and causing the slow downloads. The solution: be wary of using Google or OpenDNS when downloading iTunes files or similar large files. Use your own ISP's DNS servers instead or run your own resolving DNS server.

Here is a list of public DNS servers:

http://pcsupport.about.com/od/tipstricks/a/free-public-dns-servers.htm

 

[Weaselboy]

What is wrong with the OS X App Store?

If the location you list for your account (Jamaica) is accurate, I'm guessing that is the problem. Apple uses cached servers around the world to distribute these downloads, and I bet there is no cached server on the Island, so no matter how fast your connection is you will be reliant on some distant server and the janky connections in between.

I am in California and even in the busiest days, like when Apple does an OS X update, I am usually able to fully saturate my download connection since presumably they have a ton of cached serves in California.

 

[IHelpId10t5]

You really should be carefull with torrenting OSX updates these days.

Getting ANY software from a Torrent is like playing Russian Roulette but loading all but one chamber with bullets.

Certainly you should check:
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202369

 

[Mr. Dee]

You really should be carefull with torrenting OSX updates these days.

The key thing with the torrent is you have zero idea where it came from and what came with it. Internet Cafe's typically have low bandwidth per user and cheap connections, it can entirely depend on what else is being downloaded at the time, same as at your brothers on WiFi.

The fact that people CAN download from the App store indicates it is generally OK, there is a lot of network between you and the App store (or more importantly the local cache you are pointed to), that is outside Apple's control.

Getting ANY software from a Torrent is like playing Russian Roulette but loading all but one chamber with bullets.

Certainly you should check:
https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202369

It never was my intention to download from torrent, it ended being a last resort that actually worked. That's why I went with it. Everything seems to be working good so far. I know that when 10.11.4 comes out it won't be much of a burden. When I extracted the zip file with the OS X.app and launched it, Yosemite performed a verification because it realized I downloaded it from the Internet, but it eventually went into setup.

 

[ActionableMango]

This reminds me of the front page article where several legitimate iOS apps had been infected because the developers had downloaded xcode from unauthorized sites. The developers resorted to that because downloading xcode from Apple was extremely slow (in China).

 

[pika2000]

i get 200 down 12 up and trust me the issue is apples end and always has been, there app store does not push out files quick enough. so i can sympathise with the op on his issue.

Not always Apple's fault. I have a similar issue for almost a week last month. App store downloads were crawling. I used VPN and it was blazingly fast again. Sometimes there are faults in the routing of the ISPs somewhere for certain sites.

 

[T'hain Esh Kelch]

Everything seems to be working good so far. I know that when 10.11.4 comes out it won't be much of a burden. When I extracted the zip file with the OS X.app and launched it, Yosemite performed a verification because it realized I downloaded it from the Internet, but it eventually went into setup.

That does not in any way rule out that you have a compromised system.

 

[Mr. Dee]

That does not in any way rule out that you have a compromised system.

Sorry, but you are being a bit too paranoid. You are making an assumption the system has been compromised yet have never used my Mac to make that determination.

I am a seasoned Windows user, its not the first and it certainly won't be the last time I download a torrent. Yes, torrents do have a shady side, but not all of them do. It is a legitimate channel for distributing all sorts of content, it is also used for piracy too unfortunately. Anyway, I had no other choice, you said I might have compromised my system, at the same time, you can't offer a solution as to what I should have done in case someone is in a similar situation.

In fact, I exhausted legitimate channels such as a local Jamaica Apple User Group on Facebook reaching out to persons on the page if anyone already had a downloaded copy I could get to upgrade the system. That brings up another point. If I got a copy of the El Capitan installer from a stranger or trusted friend, should I also question where they got it too?

I should have also put in my post, I tried installing El Cap at the Apple Bellevue, WA Store and it was slow there too, the excuse from the Apple store reps, the network was being hammered, which a legitimate answer. I believed them then and there and this was in the USA. I then tried at the Marriott where I was staying, mind you I was able to upgrade my Windows 10 laptop to 10240 there with ease. The last place I didn't get to try was the Microsoft campus and I had my reasons, I didn't want to be controversial being seen on campus with one.

We also don't take into account, OS X Yosemite has documented issues with mdnsresponder and discoveryd. Nobody has so far pointed that out. I can't confirm if the issue persist, but I will be going to the Internet Café again this week to download a copy of Adobe CS6 Master Collection for Mac from Adobe's website. That's a 6 GB download, we'll see how that goes, if its just as slow, I will gladly point Firefox to the bay.

 

[Fishrrman]

Mr. Dee wrote above:
"Sorry, but you are being a bit too paranoid. You are making an assumption the system has been compromised yet have never used my Mac to make that determination."

I agree with you.

We've gone from a time long ago when Apple software releases used to be VERY easy for anyone download, to a time where the user is forced to jump through hoops just to get software that Apple [generally] offers for free.

A good case in point is iPhoto 9.6.1, the final version of iPhoto that lets users keep using it on El Capitan.
Try and get that if you don't have iPhoto already listed in your App Store's queue of "purchased items".

I've had no more problems with Apple OS stuff "from the torrents" than I have with software downloaded directly from Apple, via either the App Store (which I HATE) or Apple's software update web pages.

Sometimes, after you've tried "the normal channels" and discovered they won't work, you just have to get the software however you can get it.

Go with "what works", and don't worry about it.

Or, in the words of a Central Vermont RR road foreman (told to us in an operating rules class), "a man's gotta do, what a man's gotta do" ....

 

[Riwam]

Sorry, but you are being a bit too paranoid. You are making an assumption the system has been compromised yet have never used my Mac to make that determination.

I am a seasoned Windows user, its not the first and it certainly won't be the last time I download a torrent. Yes, torrents do have a shady side, but not all of them do. It is a legitimate channel for distributing all sorts of content, it is also used for piracy too unfortunately. Anyway, I had no other choice, you said I might have compromised my system, at the same time, you can't offer a solution as to what I should have done in case someone is in a similar situation.

In fact, I exhausted legitimate channels such as a local Jamaica Apple User Group on Facebook reaching out to persons on the page if anyone already had a downloaded copy I could get to upgrade the system. That brings up another point. If I got a copy of the El Capitan installer from a stranger or trusted friend, should I also question where they got it too?

I should have also put in my post, I tried installing El Cap at the Apple Bellevue, WA Store and it was slow there too, the excuse from the Apple store reps, the network was being hammered, which a legitimate answer. I believed them then and there and this was in the USA. I then tried at the Marriott where I was staying, mind you I was able to upgrade my Windows 10 laptop to 10240 there with ease. The last place I didn't get to try was the Microsoft campus and I had my reasons, I didn't want to be controversial being seen on campus with one.

We also don't take into account, OS X Yosemite has documented issues with mdnsresponder and discoveryd. Nobody has so far pointed that out. I can't confirm if the issue persist, but I will be going to the Internet Café again this week to download a copy of Adobe CS6 Master Collection for Mac from Adobe's website. That's a 6 GB download, we'll see how that goes, if its just as slow, I will gladly point Firefox to the bay.

*********

As to myself I find ridiculous the warnings about the "Big Bad Wolf" aka "Torrent".
People are ashame of confessing they used it and ask for forgiveness from all other readers when they did that "unforgivable sin" because of lack of ways to avoid it.
Come on, let's be reasonable!

I used torrents on many occasions and don't recall a single case of virus infection caused by any downloaded file, (but of course viruses on macs are not like viruses on Windows).

Nowadays to be honest everything can be dangerous if people do not take care what they do or don't.

Within a week I received about 25 to 30 mails, my usual quantity.
However times have changed... and not for the good.
Out of them about a dozen (12) came with all kind of "attachments", like supposed "invoices", supposed "shipping notices", supposed "payments", requests "to confirm" all kind of personal information and so on and so forth.

While in the past only a few file types in attachments were considered dangerous, presently criminals can include a perfectly working infection script even in a Word .doc file.

If someone uses Windows and clicks on those supposed invoices, shipping notices, payments, data, etc....he can only blame himself for infecting his system by having acted stupidly.
But of course, even we, mac users, must be extremely careful since we risk to spread infections to non-mac users...and Phishing knows no difference regarding the OS of the computer concerned.

The same need of reasonable and cautious behaviour applies to torrents and every other element computer users might employ.
The danger is the user , not the tool per se.

As long as one knows what one is doing... or refraining to do, there is nothing to be scared about to the point to believe one's system might be "secretly infected", as one suggested in this thread.
That is pure paranoia.

Reason and caution are the computer users' best friends, not fear...
Ed

 

[KALLT]

Sorry, but you are being a bit too paranoid. You are making an assumption the system has been compromised yet have never used my Mac to make that determination.

I am a seasoned Windows user, its not the first and it certainly won't be the last time I download a torrent. Yes, torrents do have a shady side, but not all of them do. It is a legitimate channel for distributing all sorts of content, it is also used for piracy too unfortunately. Anyway, I had no other choice, you said I might have compromised my system, at the same time, you can't offer a solution as to what I should have done in case someone is in a similar situation.

In fact, I exhausted legitimate channels such as a local Jamaica Apple User Group on Facebook reaching out to persons on the page if anyone already had a downloaded copy I could get to upgrade the system. That brings up another point. If I got a copy of the El Capitan installer from a stranger or trusted friend, should I also question where they got it too?

I should have also put in my post, I tried installing El Cap at the Apple Bellevue, WA Store and it was slow there too, the excuse from the Apple store reps, the network was being hammered, which a legitimate answer. I believed them then and there and this was in the USA. I then tried at the Marriott where I was staying, mind you I was able to upgrade my Windows 10 laptop to 10240 there with ease. The last place I didn't get to try was the Microsoft campus and I had my reasons, I didn't want to be controversial being seen on campus with one.

We also don't take into account, OS X Yosemite has documented issues with mdnsresponder and discoveryd. Nobody has so far pointed that out. I can't confirm if the issue persist, but I will be going to the Internet Café again this week to download a copy of Adobe CS6 Master Collection for Mac from Adobe's website. That's a 6 GB download, we'll see how that goes, if its just as slow, I will gladly point Firefox to the bay.

You just have to be mindful that someone may have messed with your install. If you are willing to take that risk then you are absolutely free to do this. There are trolls and malicious people out there though and a tampered OS is riskier than a userspace software or video download. Nobody is judging you for this, but it is a risk you should know about. If I were in the same spot, I would probably not upgrade any time soon until it is solved. Torrenting itself it not a problem, as long as you have the means to verify the download independently and take precautions. I think the OS X installer is only protected by Gatekeeper.

Besides, if this problem is not solved, you will run into it again when the next update appears. El Capitan also introduces many other issues that Yosemite did not have. It’s pretty much a balancing act of issues and risks. ;-)

 

[Mr. Dee]

Really enjoying the discussion. A lot of the early responses so far have centered around 'torrents' being 'bad'. Determining source is a legitimate concern, since building the download happens through multiple parts being assembled from seeders. I have downloaded torrents for years, never had any issues with it. When I had a Hackintosh, I downloaded modified OS X x86 builds without issues. I downloaded Vista RTM through a torrent and ran it keyless without issue.

There are legitimate concerns in addition to Pro's and Con's. I am not going to write it off as an option for future use if I continue to experience problems with the App Store. I was able to download and update smaller applications such as Slack, OneDrive, Twitter easily using the App Store, so I am not writing it off either. Its just these big downloads it can't seem to handled by it. I am not first to complain either. There is a thread from some who said it took 15 hours to download then failed.

I appreciate the rational thought here, I had to do what I had to do. All reasonable avenues were exhausted. I can't spend $600 US to come to the US and download and I am certainly not going to travel to another parish or town to download an OS update. Going to my Internet Café or brother is far enough as it is. When the next revision of OS X is released, what I will do if I do get to travel to the states later this year again, is ask them to download it for me at the Apple Store. So far everything is going well.

 

[mossy]

I'm kind of surprised those are even a thing considering how having net access at home is like having running water... A necessity!

Internet cafés are all over the place in Europe. So they do exist and provide a valuable service to people.

 

[mooninite]

Internet cafés are all over the place in Europe. So they do exist and provide a valuable service to people.

lol okay

 

[Toltepeceno]

Internet cafés are all over the place in Europe. So they do exist and provide a valuable service to people.

They are all over the place here, called cibers, people here do not have internet like running water and in fact most do not. There are 3 within about 4 blocks of me on the same street. People in the us think the us is the whole world.

As a note most cibers here do a good business, the schools give out a lot of internet research type of homework. A half hour is typically 3-4 pesos, 4 would be less than a quarter us.

 

[Riwam]

They are all over the place here, called cibers, people here do not have internet like running water and in fact most do not. There are 3 within about 4 blocks of me on the same street. People in the us think the us is the whole world.

As a note most cibers here do a good business, the schools give out a lot of internet research type of homework. A half hour is typically 3-4 pesos, 4 would be less than a quarter us.

*************
Don't take it personally if people believe that all over the world their home conditions prevail as well.
They could learn a lot of other countries, their culture, their music, etc., like for instance from your country.
For many people in the USA the only thing they know and appreciate is mexican food... but of course there is much, much more than just that

Cordiales saludos de un sudamericano expatriado por los azares de la vida que admiró siempre los héroes de la revolución mejicana como Zapata o Pancho Villa.
Edmundo