I prefer throttling to noise

[doitdada]

I have never ever thought about using a laptop as my main video editing / rendering platform. I can understand the situation is kind of complicated for power users now that the Mac Pro seems to be on halt until next year. Still I consider laptops as a second option and not even a real alternative to desktops. Towers are easy to cool and don’t have issues with heat and noise when built correctly, but I still consider a computers noise level as one of the most important aspects in 2018 and not the absolute maximum capacity under heavy load. Performance seems to be pretty good anyways, like I can use a rMB 2015, but I prefer the specs of a MBP 2018 15 alot more. I will never look to laptops for pure power, but as a functional and portable companion to a real desktop.

An important question to answer must be if the Blackmagic GPU will be able to solve this issue and frees up thermal load when not using the dGPU in the MacBook Pro chassis and just tax the 580 in the external chassis.

Would buy a iMac Pro if I was dependent on power and had 100k+ views on my YouTube videos or had clients to fulfill in professional network programming. I buy Macs for convenience and not pure power. The new MBP 2018 may not be a desktop replacement for hardcore video users, but it will be a very futureproof choice for the rest of us. Macs have always been about balance, and I like it that way.

 

[mikethebigo]

I agree with you, that "Pro" is different things to different people. I have a 2018 MBP and I know for sure I will never hit any serious throttling issues, but that's because I'm not doing video editing and the like.

The problem is the 15" i9 model has no other obvious demographic than video editors. And it's not really actually very good at doing that compared to mobile competition or desktops as you mentioned. It's like an oxymoron, video editing level hardware in an ultrabook sized enclosure that can't support it, for a massive premium price. I can certainly see the issue.

But for what I'll do, I'm sure I'm going to be very happy with this machine.

 

[fokmik]

I agree with you, that "Pro" is different things to different people. I have a 2018 MBP and I know for sure I will never hit any serious throttling issues, but that's because I'm not doing video editing and the like.

The problem is the 15" i9 model has no other obvious demographic than video editors. And it's not really actually very good at doing that compared to mobile competition or desktops as you mentioned. It's like an oxymoron, video editing level hardware in an ultrabook sized enclosure that can't support it, for a massive premium price. I can certainly see the issue.

But for what I'll do, I'm sure I'm going to be very happy with this machine.

What model do you have? For browsing the web,itunes,idle your 2018 mbp gets warm hot?

 

[jerryk]

Plenty of pros use mbps for video work. Especially you tubers that post travel or trip videos. Also, a lot of digital nomads only have a mbp to do their work.

 

[doitdada]

The problem is the 15" i9 model has no other obvious demographic than video editors.

I guess macOS, FCP and Adobe will find ways to utilise this chip along the way. A lot of the time it takes a while for instructions in a new chipset to align with software. It’s not very often we see Apple launch such an upgrade without a proper announcement and I believe more software and code will accommodate this new CPU during this fall.

Metal will also replace OpenGL this fall, requiring software publishers to think differently and be more low level about their code. I guess we will have both good and bad experiences with this change and some software will have to play catchup. First I will think Final Cut and Logic Pro will get the best of this, as they are in house software, but how Adobe will use this technology is hard to guess.

«The performance gains from Metal come largely from its optimizations to reduce CPU load, enabling software to much more efficiently make use of the power of the GPU. Metal achieves this using explicit synchronization and shared memory space between GPU and CPU; lower driver overhead, precomputed shaders and up-front state validation; and efficient multithreading, where every CPU thread can send commands to the GPU.»
https://iphone.appleinsider.com/art...ojave-requires-metal----and-deprecates-opengl

Plenty of pros use mbps for video work. Especially you tubers that post travel or trip videos. Also, a lot of digital nomads only have a mbp to do their work.

Again, they have the choice to go for power, noise and Windows. If I was travelling I would value thinness, portability and weight over pure power, which I feel the MacBook Pro does. The i9 may be a bit weird in High Sierra, but I hope Mojave and updated software will be able to make it worth the higher price in October. You don’t have to purchase the 2018 before Mojave will be released as long as you have a rather newish computer. 2012 retina or better.

 

[mikethebigo]

What model do you have? For browsing the web,itunes,idle your 2018 mbp gets warm hot?

Right now I’m using Safari, Mail, Messages, iTunes, etc. Normal Mac usage. The Intel Power Gadget is showing that my processor is sitting mostly idle between 1.2-1.4 GHz. Temp is sitting around 35-40 C and the package power usage is almost flatlined. The system itself is pretty cool, and it’s never gotten anywhere near hot except when MacOS was first getting set up.

I think for real world usage, most of people’s concerns are way overblown. The CPU handles everything with such ease that its only for like milliseconds turbo boosting when I do something specific, otherwise it’s taking it so easy it’s just like 95% idle.

I’m sure if I load some heavy consistent CPU/GPU stress test program it would be a different story. That will never reflect my usage though. Even with me using the i7.

 

[Aea]

I'd personally prefer an adequate thermal solution to either of those.

 

[cm_junk]

I prefer well-designed laptops that can cool the processors they carry.

 

[ofarlig]

I'd personally prefer an adequate thermal solution to either of those.

Can you point me to a laptop that can run the CPU in full load and throttle, that also is quiet when doing so?

 

[dazz87]

I prefer paying for a 2.6GHz i9 that runs at 2.6 and not 2.1............

 

[Aea]

Can you point me to a laptop that can run the CPU in full load and throttle, that also is quiet when doing so?

I've said this before and I've said this again. Everything throttles. The i9 throttles so bad it's a joke.

- Sent from my 2018 i9

 

[ofarlig]

I've said this before and I've said this again. Everything throttles. The i9 throttles so bad it's a joke.

- Sent from my 2018 i9

Yeah, so you are saying you would prefer the perfect cooling solution that no manufacturer with any high end laptop ever has been able to create? Sure, wouldn't we all.

 

[Aea]

Yeah, so you are saying you would prefer the perfect cooling solution that no manufacturer with any high end laptop ever has been able to create? Sure, wouldn't we all.

I never said that and you know that.


I would prefer that my $4,584.88 machine didn't throttle down to 800 Mhz under load.

I would prefer that my $4,584.88 machine didn't throttle down to 2.5Ghz under load even when I use Macs Fan Control to set the fans to maximum (which is what half the posters here are suggesting).

I would certainly have preferred it if Apple took the high road here and didn't sell an i9 that their chassis clearly can't support in any type of thermal load.

Obviously I would be ****ing ecstatic if they could create the perfect cooling solution and let me run my i9 at turbo 24/7. But that's not remotely my expectation.

 

[doitdada]

I've said this before and I've said this again. Everything throttles. The i9 throttles so bad it's a joke.

- Sent from my 2018 i9

I understand that being on the edge of technology can be challening, especially when you pay premiums, but video apps are transitioning from OpenGL to Metal with Mojave, and may make your hardware better utilised during the fall. High Sierra has been a weird macOS iteration, and I hope better low level programming can make issues like this feel smaller.

I would not buy the i9 until late fall. It has always been the case for extra cores and instructions, that it takes some time for software to balance out the performance and utilise new hardware. This happened in 2011 when Sandy Bridge and quad cores came out. This was also the case when in 2006 when dual core became the standard in laptops.

Early adopters tax.


"Apps built using OpenGL and OpenCL will continue to run in macOS 10.14, but these legacy technologies are deprecated in macOS 10.14. Games and graphics-intensive apps that use OpenGL should now adopt Metal. Similarly, apps that use OpenCL for computational tasks should now adopt Metal and Metal Performance Shaders," the company noted.

 

[Queen6]

Can you point me to a laptop that can run the CPU in full load and throttle, that also is quiet when doing so?

Ever tried working internationally with a desktop in your carry-on?

Performant notebooks are going to be noisier than ultra books. One has to assess the priority, my own primary W10 notebook is silent under basic productivity tasks, under massive load fan noise is apparent, equally it doesn't throttle.

For me the best balance one can hope for, without a major leap in technology...

Q-6

 

[ofarlig]

I never said that and you know that.


I would prefer that my $4,584.88 machine didn't throttle down to 800 Mhz under load.

I would prefer that my $4,584.88 machine didn't throttle down to 2.5Ghz under load even when I use Macs Fan Control to set the fans to maximum (which is what half the posters here are suggesting).

I would certainly have preferred it if Apple took the high road here and didn't sell an i9 that their chassis clearly can't support in any type of thermal load.

Obviously I would be ****ing ecstatic if they could create the perfect cooling solution and let me run my i9 at turbo 24/7. But that's not remotely my expectation.

So what is it you want? You said "I'd personally prefer an adequate thermal solution to either of those.". Those being either throttling+quiet or not throttling+loud. I am in TS camp here, I prefer quiet + throttling over loud and full turbo for the default fan curve.

Ever tried working internationally with a desktop in your carry-on?

Performant notebooks are going to be noisier than ultra books. One has to assess the priority, my own primary W10 notebook is silent under basic productivity tasks, under massive load fan noise is apparent, equally it doesn't throttle.

For me the best balance one can hope for, without a major leap in technology...

Q-6

The same goes for my work laptop, meaning that whenever I do anything that loads the CPU it sounds terrible. I have no problem with it giving me less performance but staying quieter.

 

[doitdada]

One has to assess the priority, my own primary W10 notebook is silent under basic productivity tasks, under massive load fan noise is apparent, equally it doesn't throttle.

What kind of Windows laptop do you use?

I tried the quad core Surface Book 2 13 inch with dGPU, and I disliked the trackpad and the Windows style performance settings where you use a slidebar.

I guess Windows is a real alternative for power users as you can replace components and use a wider range of peripherals. Still it doesn’t challenge the balance you get presented with on a MacBook Pro, even though there seems to be some problems in its infancy with the 2018 versions.


I also feel most of the YouTubers complaining are working in a set studio environment that doesn’t need them to own a laptop. I guess most of them would have been happy if there was a MacPro or Mac Mini available.

 

[Aea]

So what is it you want? You said "I'd personally prefer an adequate thermal solution to either of those.". Those being either throttling+quiet or not throttling+loud. I am in TS camp here, I prefer quiet + throttling over loud and full turbo for the default fan curve.

I'm sorry I didn't write it out in plain fan boy.

The chassis is inadequate for the thermal load of the i9. They should not have sold the i9. Or they should have redesigned the chassis to handle it.

 

[Queen6]

So what is it you want? You said "I'd personally prefer an adequate thermal solution to either of those.". Those being either throttling+quiet or not throttling+loud. I am in TS camp here, I prefer quiet + throttling over loud and full turbo for the default fan curve.



The same goes for my work laptop, meaning that whenever I do anything that loads the CPU it sounds terrible. I have no problem with it giving me less performance but staying quieter.

As I stated priorities, I want fast and performant, nor do I expect such excessive throttling from a professional/prosumer notebook.

Ultimately these notebooks are tools and need to perform accordingly. Apple has chosen to cripple performance for a quiet experience, which is nonsensical on a $4K notebook.

My W10 primary has performance/fan modes ranging from silent to max power, and OC of the GPU, so it's possible to have have the best of both worlds.

Q-6

 

[ofarlig]

I'm sorry I didn't write it out in plain fan boy.

The chassis is inadequate for the thermal load of the i9. They should not have sold the i9. Or they should have redesigned the chassis to handle it.

They can most likely make it handle more heat by ramping up the fan, but it will become louder which I guess they didn't want. TS seems to be in the same boat there and want their laptop to be slower but quieter, I am in that camp as well. You said you didn't want either of those which seems to be impossible if we look at the laptop market currently.

 

[simonsi]

The problem is the 15" i9 model has no other obvious demographic than video editors.

TBH I think its a fashion item aimed at those who simply buy the highest end machine because its there. Just like a Ferrari in some ways. Agree serious users who might use the power can't so won't buy it.

 

[TechGod]

I guess macOS, FCP and Adobe will find ways to utilise this chip along the way. A lot of the time it takes a while for instructions in a new chipset to align with software. It’s not very often we see Apple launch such an upgrade without a proper announcement and I believe more software and code will accommodate this new CPU during this fall.

This is not how it works...what??

 

[Aea]

This is not how it works...what??

That... is kinda how it works. Small nugget of truth in a large pile of manure.

 

[doitdada]

This is not how it works...what??

Look at how Skylake vs Kaby Lake handles 4K 10bit HDR (H.265/HEVC).

or

The iPhone 8 shoots H.265 4K video, and macOS High Sierra can view it, but editors who rely on Final Cut Pro X cannot yet utilize the codec until Apple issues a highly anticipated update. (sept 2017)

However, Coffee Lake delivers no IPC difference from Skylake or Kaby Lake.

 

[aevan]

I prefer well-designed laptops that can cool the processors they carry.

Then I can recommend the MacBook Pros.