iPhone SE (2022) I spent the day trying to teach seniors how to use an iPhone and it was a nightmare.

[mansplains]

I find it a little silly how the younger we are, we want the money and time to learn new technologies and advancements, but when we're old and have the money and time, we're stuck in our ways. I think of self-driving cars in particular, by the time I'm declining in physical ability, a car to drive me around sounds amazing, but most seniors I know hate the idea of an EV, no matter the possible benefits. Retirees have plenty of time to read manuals and learn how to operate a phone, computer, etc just like they had to learn other things throughout life.

 

[turbineseaplane]

I find it a little silly how the younger we are, we want the money and time to learn new technologies and advancements, but when we're old and have the money and time, we're stuck in our ways.

I just want to tighten this up.

My older relatives were VERY into their iPhones & iPads for the photos and messaging with family and some Facetime and games and shopping, etc.

What happened is they got older and it got more and more confusing for them with the "upgrades" over the last 5-10 years.

They were always going to "age out" mentally, but it was sped along by iOS really no longer being nearly as intuitive and flexible as would be ideal to help them keep using it as long as possible.

 

[Andrew7]

I appreciate that Apple has attempted to carry on Steve Jobs’ vision of creating products that try to be as least counter intuitive as possible. This isn’t promising news — at the same time, I understand there’s always going to be hurdles trying to get the previous generation on board with advanced technology.

 

[Melinn]

OP writes about elderly needing better accessibility. Several indignant elderly pops up here to say they handle it great. But this wasn’t about you now was it? Are you living in assisted homes needing help with basic stuff and have low cognitive functioning?🙄

 

[digitalcuriosity]

OP writes about elderly needing better accessibility. Several indignant elderly pops up here to say they handle it great. But this wasn’t about you now was it? Are you living in assisted homes needing help with basic stuff and have low cognitive functioning?🙄

What many today are finding out today when doing your banking it is on line reaching a credit card company also on line, i just had to file a claim for auto repair to Progressive Insurance everything had to be done on line even pictures they required had to be taken with there controlling my phone camera all on line
So you start understanding things have changed and if you want or need to deal with any of the above you have to find ways for doing it.

 

[whitby]

OP writes about elderly needing better accessibility. Several indignant elderly pops up here to say they handle it great. But this wasn’t about you now was it? Are you living in assisted homes needing help with basic stuff and have low cognitive functioning?🙄

Correct, but also, as was the point of my post, it is that it is not just the older generation. I deal with people in their 40s with exactly the same issues. The complexity of modern smart phones and dealing with them is not a previous generation (as you delicately put it) problem only, it is also younger people who have become technophobic as a result of the added complexities of the modern smartphone.

 

[Heindijs]

None of my grandparents ever used smartphones (or computers for that matter) so a landline had always worked just fine. My last grandparent passed away five years ago and she managed just fine with a regular phone and paperwork.

The point is, do these people need a smartphone or could they manager with something they've used their entire lives already?

 

[adrianlondon]

None of my grandparents ever used smartphones (or computers for that matter) so a landline had always worked just fine. My last grandparent passed away five years ago and she managed just fine with a regular phone and paperwork.

The point is, do these people need a smartphone or could they manager with something they've used their entire lives already?

The problem is that some companies/industries really don't understand that some people might not have a smartphone. Banking is getting trickier (in most of Europe) if you have to do it in branch or - shudder - by telephone. Flights and other forms of transport often struggle with people who don't have boarding passes on their phone.

Then there are new industries (well, new to older people!) which could actually be very useful for them - such as food (supermarket or restaurant) delivery and uber booking.

 

[Melinn]

None of my grandparents ever used smartphones (or computers for that matter) so a landline had always worked just fine. My last grandparent passed away five years ago and she managed just fine with a regular phone and paperwork.

The point is, do these people need a smartphone or could they manager with something they've used their entire lives already?

In many countries such as my country, your life will be very hard without a bankID which is "An E-identification and digital signature solution issued by banks, enabling users to securely identify themselves and sign agreements online". One will need either a smart phone up to date or a PC. I mean you can get by without bankID but it will be very hard.
Though many who have low cognitive functions etc lets their close relatives handle their bankID. And yes they can get by without it but as said its much harder.

 

[PaulD-UK]

Quote @digitalcuriosity "I feel Apple needs to have a user manual like many companies had years ago..."

I fit into the OP's target age, but my cognitive decline is not yet terminal.
I get by using about 5% of my iPhone 13 mini's features, because I haven't been able to RTFM. 😱

If there was a pdf (indexed) manual, by the time Apple writers get it finished they would have to throw it away and rewrite another one. 😯
Online search isn't 'a good alternative', because the answer doesn't come with any cognitive context so is just another random thing that has to be memorised.

One thing I do have expertise in is Apple's Final Cut Pro (for Mac, not iPadOS haha). Using Premiere and FCP<7 was my job for two decades.
It has a ~950 page manual, which I've read and fully understand.
But which I no longer have the power to memorise fully.

There are about 550 documented keyboard commands, which are listed in the manual.
There are a not-fully-documented proportion of these commands that the Undo key will work on.
If you use Undo on a command that doesn't allow it's use, then the program will 'undo' the last command you used that does Undo...
With no indication on the user interface if that section of the project isn't visible.

So to use the program fully you have to have read and memorise the whole thing, because very often the actual user interface isn't giving any clue as to what you have just done.
And you can wreak havoc on hours of previous work...

I don't use iPhone third party apps except WhatsApp and FB, and the NHS (govt Health app, which is essential!), because everything important is done on my desktop 5K Mac, which has multiple 'spaces' to lay out all the information I need - where it can exist without risk of losing it...

I'm very certain I won't be able to memorise the whole of any particular iteration of iOS, so I get by at about 15% of the speed you young Bro's manage haha.

Would that it were different!

Quote @digitalcuriosity "What many today are finding out today when doing your banking it is on line reaching a credit card company also on line, i just had to file a claim for auto repair to Progressive Insurance everything had to be done on line even pictures they required had to be taken with there controlling my phone camera all on line
So you start understanding things have changed and if you want or need to deal with any of the above you have to find ways for doing it."

Good God! One comma, one capitalisation and one Return...
I can't learn to use iOS like that. 😱

 

[Clix Pix]

I definitely much prefer to use my Mac for anything that is important and that requires use of a keyboard, whether it be connecting with my bank account online or communicating with family and friends through text and email. I absolutely loathe typing on the iPhone, although if it's absolutely necessary I'll do it.

Yes, I agree that things today are much different -- processes and the way we do things. In the old days, one made a phone call or went to the bank or other place of business and that was pretty straightforward. Now one has to jump through hoops to get through to the online bank account in order to transact one's business. Sometimes it's just easier to go to the bank in the first place. Also those of us who still have a safe deposit box still need to go to the bank in order to put something in or retrieve something from it.

Grocery delivery is convenient -- I've been using that for the past couple of months or so and am especially looking forward to having it on cold winter days when I need food and yet don't want to go out. The downside of it, though, is that it costs more than going to the store itself, and for me, part of the grocery store experience is seeing some new product or new food and buying it to try it out, or seeing that they've restocked their inventory of something that has long been a favorite food.

With the grocery delivery thing, it just doesn't feel the same indicating on the online form what one wants and choosing it. Fine for stuff one has bought for years but anything unfamiliar, well, one is taking chances on that. I much prefer being in a store and looking at the item, handling it and judging its feel and color (fresh produce) or being able to quickly assess the nutritional content and compare it with other similar items. I still occasionally go to the grocery store, too, in addition to using the delivery service and I appreciate the experience much more.

As we get older, people have different priorities than we did when we were young, and new, often difficult decisions to make about the future, new living arrangements, etc., and sometimes that is complicated by health issues. While some people have no indications of cognitive issues, others may be developing them, and the onset of actual dementia can also be a barrier to learning something new. What might have been a fun and easy challenge a few years ago in learning something new may now have taken on increased difficulty. Not to mention that, yes, the new technology today is absolutely more complex and demands more of the individual using it than in the past. Cars, telephones, the ways we shop and do our banking, or even interact with our doctor and other medical professionals....

It's not easy being a teenager grappling with many changes and life decisions. It's also not easy being an aging adult grappling with many changes and life decisions..

 

[Topaz47]

Honestly, I think Apple really needs to simplify the iPhone for the elderly. I know there are accessibility modes, but you don’t want to have to go through all that and spend hours trying to customize the phone. Also, the whole phone setup process needs to be delayed; having to go through it for an hour puts them off from even wanting to bother. I first set the phones up to make accounts, but it turns out none of them could understand how to unlock the phone. Entering a passcode was a nightmare because they kept forgetting it, even though it was a birthday they knew, lol.

So, I tried Touch ID and Face ID, and that was even more complicated and kept erroring out. Then, the Siri thing kept popping up on the phones with Touch ID, despite turning it off, and the whole swiping from the button kept making the screen go down to the bottom half. :/ There were too many apps; all they wanted was the phone app, but it doesn’t default to the keypad, which was too much for them to find.


The phones are too fiddly now, and pressing random things as they try to hold the phone meant the phone got lost in a sea of opening stuff up. So, I tried the assistive access, but why isn’t this an option from the get-go? It asks you the age of setup; why not have a 65+ or something for a senior mode?


They don’t need passcodes, accounts, and a sea of information. It’s insane, and it’s insane how fiddly these phones are. I never noticed because I’m used to it, but for these people with hands that barely move, the fake Touch ID button and the swiping from the bottom on Face ID phones seem to be the worst! I think having a proper physical button, like iPhones used to have, would have been superior. The one complaint about the fake button was that it didn’t feel like a real button, so they couldn’t gauge it.


I left there achieving nothing because they couldn’t figure out their old Nokia phones. The unlock thing on the keypad was too difficult, and if I turned that off, they kept dialing 999 in their pockets for some reason. That’s why I was there: they were calling emergency services 100 times a day, lol.


I think what I’ve realized is that I need to go back with flip phones that answer and hang up when you open and close them. However, the two I tried before didn’t act like that, and they had too many features. I really thought I could make the iPhone simple, but NOPE!


Apple should work on their phones to make them more accessible and less fiddly, without having to go through a sea of menus.

Scaramoosh, I sympathize with you. I am not a very frequent poster on here, but I understand what you were going through. Sorry, haven’t read all the posts here.
I have a few friends that have a mental block with their  devices. These friends absolutely need one on one instructions. From your description there were too many seniors for you to help, or there should have been more volunteers to assist you.

Most of the apps could have been removed to simplify the operation of the devices.

I do not believe Apple has to have a dumb phone, people have to purchase what they can use or learn to use. The reality is that some people will never understand using any type of cell phone. They probably just need a panic button on a chain that they can press in an emergency.

 

[digitalcuriosity]

Scaramoosh, I sympathize with you. I am not a very frequent poster on here, but I understand what you were going through. Sorry, haven’t read all the posts here.
I have a few friends that have a mental block with their  devices. These friends absolutely need one on one instructions. From your description there were too many seniors for you to help, or there should have been more volunteers to assist you.

Most of the apps could have been removed to simplify the operation of the devices.

I do not believe Apple has to have a dumb phone, people have to purchase what they can use or learn to use. The reality is that some people will never understand using any type of cell phone. They probably just need a panic button on a chain that they can press in an emergency.

Old or young people have to start using the many IPhone forums, there is a lot of help in them to get everyone on track if they are willing to join the forums.

 

[wilberforce]

It bothers me somewhat that the implied assumption or genralization in this thread that seniors are feeble tech idiots that need a dumbed down phone or OS. I think of my “senior” neighbor that is VP of AI applications at Oracle, I wish I was nearly as smart and sharp as him. Generalizations are rarely helpful or kind; better to consider people as individuals with individual needs and interests.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

I find it a little silly how the younger we are, we want the money and time to learn new technologies and advancements, but when we're old and have the money and time, we're stuck in our ways. I think of self-driving cars in particular, by the time I'm declining in physical ability, a car to drive me around sounds amazing, but most seniors I know hate the idea of an EV, no matter the possible benefits. Retirees have plenty of time to read manuals and learn how to operate a phone, computer, etc just like they had to learn other things throughout life.

Isn't possible that regardless of age there are a myriad or reasons for people to decide what to learn, to embrace, or not? For example, my mother-in-law is approaching her long 99 years of age, and in recent years she has been using a PC to write stories, engage in research at her local museum (volunteer worker), email (or write and the mail via USPS) to her friends and family, and so on. In her case it has nothing to do with wanting to learn "new technologies," but to use "a tool" that serves a purpose. Her time is limited, so why wasting her valuable time learning something that has no value to her?

The same can be said for the ones who want to make money, and so for the ones who aren't interested in making money, or even wanting or not wanting an automobile. The main difference between an EV and a car with an internal combustion engine is the one is propelled by electrical power, and the other by an ICE. Why should anybody buy an EV or ICE automobile he or she does not want or need? Those are choices people make day in and day out throughout their life. Driverless automobiles? Well, that may be the future 😊

Retirees who need to read manuals do so when the need arises. How can you tell if any of us in this forums is already retired once, or even twice? There are numerous reasons for people to retire from the workforce, and also different reasons for people reeding or not reading manuals. If you use your time at work "wisely" and become skillful at what you do, those learned skills can of benefit to you for many years to come. Some retirees may want to learn something new, but some others don't want or need to spend "their" time doing something else, which includes using the skills they are most proficient with..regardless of skill level or kind.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

Old or young people have to start using the many IPhone forums, there is a lot of help in them to get everyone on track if they are willing to join the forums.

That is true!

 

[AM2354]

Ok, I have to 100% jump into this subject matter, because it reflects me. I am 71 years old and I aim a Paramedic for 35 years this December, and yes I am still doing it. I have to constantly figure out drug dosages and administrations along with IV pump meds and calculations. I run circles around the new medics. I am an avid trail biker and I a ride my bike in doors in the winter where I do 10 miles a day. I am an Ordained Minister as well as a Eucharistic minister. I am an apple beta tester, and I am the one people come to when they screw up their phones.

Bottom line is that my mind didn't leave the stage with my age. Senior's want to receive and make a call, receive and respond to a text message, and to receive and deliver an email, this one is not as popular. They don't need all the bells and whistles, and probably be happy with a flip phone

 

[digitalcuriosity]

Ok, I have to 100% jump into this subject matter, because it reflects me. I am 71 years old and I aim a Paramedic for 35 years this December, and yes I am still doing it. I have to constantly figure out drug dosages and administrations along with IV pump meds and calculations. I run circles around the new medics. I am an avid trail biker and I a ride my bike in doors in the winter where I do 10 miles a day. I am an Ordained Minister as well as a Eucharistic minister. I am an apple beta tester, and I am the one people come to when they screw up their phones.

Bottom line is that my mind didn't leave the stage with my age. Senior's want to receive and make a call, receive and respond to a text message, and to receive and deliver an email, this one is not as popular. They don't need all the bells and whistles, and probably be happy with a flip phone

Myself i am 88 still drive still use computer still use iPhone 15 Pro still use I pad, cut my own grass do my own changing of oil and filters on car and truck, point i am trying to get across is if you try to stay involved and try staying involved with the ever changing digital world you can still be an active person with out begging or just asking others for there help.

 

[tbgb50]

Old people know what it's like to be young. Young people have no idea what it's like to be old. I keep up with technology because it has been a lifelong interest. My wife could care less.

 

[AlaskaMoose]

Ok, I have to 100% jump into this subject matter, because it reflects me. I am 71 years old and I aim a Paramedic for 35 years this December, and yes I am still doing it. I have to constantly figure out drug dosages and administrations along with IV pump meds and calculations. I run circles around the new medics. I am an avid trail biker and I a ride my bike in doors in the winter where I do 10 miles a day. I am an Ordained Minister as well as a Eucharistic minister. I am an apple beta tester, and I am the one people come to when they screw up their phones.

Bottom line is that my mind didn't leave the stage with my age. Senior's want to receive and make a call, receive and respond to a text message, and to receive and deliver an email, this one is not as popular. They don't need all the bells and whistles, and probably be happy with a flip phone

Agree 100%. The bells and whistles are nothing but a waste of time. In fact they are distractions that prolong the time it takes to reach point B from point A. As I mentioned before, in real life one's time is limited.

 

[Mikeske]

Ok another older person here piping in. I am 70 and my wife is 80 and she is in assisted care for dementia. Some of the issues is the fact that I had to eliminate/hide a lot of apps on her iPhone 16 E so that she could understand her phone she actually doesn’t need the internet except for her Facebook account as she still recognizes some of her family and remembers 2 of our 4 children but I made sure she has all the children, her family and my family. I also set up her phone with the photos we have to help her remember when she wants to look at them.

iOS is a hot mess but the other OS in the phone world is even more difficult to understand and use as it is even harder for someone that has been using iOS for the past 15 years. I did have a company android phone before I retired four years ago.

I eventually found ways to set the phone up for my wife to call me and to let communicate with the kids when she wants to. For me I don’t have any issues with understanding for the most part iOS but that is because I been using it a long time and even longer time going all the back to the Apple Lisa I used in computer labs in college. My wife gets upset with herself when she can’t remember details but I go and can still calm her as she trust me after our 45 years together.

 

[digitalcuriosity]

Ok another older person here piping in. I am 70 and my wife is 80 and she is in assisted care for dementia. Some of the issues is the fact that I had to eliminate/hide a lot of apps on her iPhone 16 E so that she could understand her phone she actually doesn’t need the internet except for her Facebook account as she still recognizes some of her family and remembers 2 of our 4 children but I made sure she has all the children, her family and my family. I also set up her phone with the photos we have to help her remember when she wants to look at them.

iOS is a hot mess but the other OS in the phone world is even more difficult to understand and use as it is even harder for someone that has been using iOS for the past 15 years. I did have a company android phone before I retired four years ago.

I eventually found ways to set the phone up for my wife to call me and to let communicate with the kids when she wants to. For me I don’t have any issues with understanding for the most part iOS but that is because I been using it a long time and even longer time going all the back to the Apple Lisa I used in computer labs in college. My wife gets upset with herself when she can’t remember details but I go and can still calm her as she trust me after our 45 years together.

I give you a lot of credit for how your handling it, i worry about these same items and don’t have a real idea how i will handle it.
Many things have changed in my life as i am sure it has changed in many others lives also, many younger people don’t understand about these subjects or care about them but trust me as these young people start aging thay will start understanding it the clock of life keeps ticking nothing can stop it.

 

[Powerbooky]

Things just need to have one deliberate use. For example, trying to use the home button to unlock on the SE was a nightmare; it needed a very specific press, otherwise, it would bring up other things. Then, suddenly, they were in the multitasking window or Siri asking if we want to enable it or a hundred other things, lol. For some reason, they wanted to do a long, hard press, not this light, quick one the fake home button needs, but finding my old iPhone 4S, it works fine.

I know exactly what you mean. While it is possible to simply the whole interface to a bare minimum for easy use.
But that also raises the question: why get an expensive phone that is essentially very powerful and use it only for regular phone calls?
I have family members beyond 70 with a disability, so far they can handle an iPhone and iPad better than an Android one. They did have help to set it up right though; like bigger text and some short cuts being set up for them. The only thing that still needs to be done is an automatic connection with an hearing aid and that is still problematic. Those still don't switch as easy as AirPod's do.

 

[digitalcuriosity]

I know exactly what you mean. While it is possible to simply the whole interface to a bare minimum for easy use.
But that also raises the question: why get an expensive phone that is essentially very powerful and use it only for regular phone calls?
I have family members beyond 70 with a disability, so far they can handle an iPhone and iPad better than an Android one. They did have help to set it up right though; like bigger text and some short cuts being set up for them. The only thing that still needs to be done is an automatic connection with an hearing aid and that is still problematic. Those still don't switch as easy as AirPod's do.

To make a point a while back i bought a small Logitech Bluetooth keyboard it came with no manual and Logitech web had nothing to help with using it.
I even called Logitechs support number but the key board has no name or number so they could not help me.

I knew to put batteries in it and turn it on and push the small almost hidden paring control, but had no idea how to get it connected to my iPad, i just gave up until about a week ago and i started looking at the iPads setting’s and noticed the keyboard on the lower menus i touched it and a number displayed i put the numbers in the keyboard and hit enter and it said connected.
And then i could start typing in the forums threads not having to use my fingers.

 

[Powerbooky]

To make a point a while back i bought a small Logitech Bluetooth keyboard it came with no manual and Logitech web had nothing to help with using it.
I even called Logitechs support number but the key board has no name or number so they could not help me.

I knew to put batteries in it and turn it on and push the small almost hidden paring control, but had no idea how to get it connected to my iPad, i just gave up until about a week ago and i started looking at the iPads setting’s and noticed the keyboard on the lower menus i touched it and a number displayed i put the numbers in the keyboard and hit enter and it said connected.
And then i could start typing in the forums threads not having to use my fingers.

Yeah... on a Mac it would pop on-screen, but on iPad it doesn't do that.

Talking of Logitech... this reminds me of anecdote early this year.
I have this Logitech keyboard, bought a while back for my other older Mac. When I connected it to my new Mac mini M4, I was stunned, it worked immediately without me doing anything. I assumed it connected automatically, like AirPod's do because it's near and iCloud magic. After I tidies cables and stuff it suddenly didn't work anymore. Turned out that I totally forgot that on the back of the monitor I connected the Mac mini M4 to, there was a Logitech USB dongle connected - because the older Mac couldn't handle the newer bluetooth of the keyboard. Since the M4 used Thunderbolt to connect to the monitor it instantly detected the keyboard. After I tidied the cable I had remove that dongle. Oops.

These dongles are handy, but can be horrible for anyone that has no technical insight. Even for me it was hard to find the right piece of software to configure that thing - had to do that my other Mac because it was originally used for a trackball, not the new keyboard. Here's were Logitech really fails in their manuals online.