Intel to ship Sandy Bridge in early 2011

[hitekalex]

They should upgrade what they can, without further delay. Letting the value proposition sink for 20-22-24 months, damages the brand.

What could be easier than adding BTO options for more RAM? It takes a few taps on a few Apple employees's keyboards.

I am sure you're aware that the MBA memory is not DIMM-based.. the memory is soldered onto the motherboard. So adding more memory would entail a motherboard design change.. certainly would not be a BTO option.

Personally.. I wouldn't care for another minor C2D based refresh.. Apple needs to figure out how to move MBA to a modern generation processors (be it by Intel or AMD). They also need a form factor refresh - the current one has gotten stale. If it takes them another 6 months - so be it. Another minor C2D based update would be an embarrassment.

 

[thinkdesign]

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Didn't we read here that Air's RAM is 1 gig each, that they solder in 2 to get 2 gig, and that the holes for more continue in the same row.... currently unused? Unless the post-er was all wrong on that info a few monthss ago, it is easily possible to use more of those circuit board holes for a BTO option.

 

[stoconnell]

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Didn't we read here that Air's RAM is 1 gig each, that they solder in 2 to get 2 gig, and that the holes for more continue in the same row.... currently unused? Unless the post-er was all wrong on that info a few monthss ago, it is easily possible to use more of those circuit board holes for a BTO option.

The MBA has 16 x 128Mb chips soldered on the mobo 8 per side (each side is treated as a 1GB DIMM bank). In theory, they could keep the same design and use higher density chips (assuming they have the same pin out and size).

 

[thinkdesign]

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Scottsdale: One thing a 15" Air like you suggest would have going for it, would be more room inside for the separate GPM chip, and then since it's a new case maybe they squeeze in another USB jack.... and maybe redetail the hinge too.

Perhaps for a while they sell both 11.6" and 15"?. Whether the small one is branded as an "Air", or not.

Then someday if they ever find the chipsets for it, the 13" reappears?

A 15" would I think, generate lots of marketplace excitement. Though backpack sales on campus might fall, in favor of more shoulder bags!

 

[Scottsdale]

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Scottsdale: One thing a 15" Air like you suggest would have going for it, would be more room inside for the separate GPM chip, and then since it's a new case maybe they squeeze in another USB jack.... and maybe redetail the hinge too.

Perhaps for a while they sell both 11.6" and 15"?. Whether the small one is branded as an "Air", or not.

Then someday if they ever find the chipsets for it, the 13" reappears?

A 15" would I think, generate lots of marketplace excitement. Though backpack sales on campus might fall, in favor of more shoulder bags!

A 15" display would nearly fit in the current MBA's case. Apple needs to eliminate the worthless and ugly bezels from these Macs... all of them!

I really do NOT believe there will be solely an 11.6" MBA. They might have a 13 and an 11 but not just 11. Definitely not an 11" and a 15 without a 13" display. The money is in the 13" because the user doesn't lose from his or her experience... and that is exactly why SJs will not go smaller than a 13" in my opinion.

I am thinking a small bead like edge that runs around the display. I really believe that makes a lot of sense, and it would allow Apple to make smaller computers. Maybe that is a problem, as they need to fit all of the components in there, but probably not with a 15" or 17" displays. Figure an MBA just like the current one without the bezel and a large 14" or 15" display in there. Would be perfection for the user.

I am okay with the MBA design otherwise, but the bezel is the one problem with its design. I do think we will probably get a redesigned MBA when we get one. I think Apple would do better, in terms of getting the performance and space needed for components by eliminating the tapering.

 

[CaoCao]

Regarding TDP, Zacate is 18W TDP counting the discrete level performance IGP on-die

 

[Hellhammer]

Regarding TDP, Zacate is 18W TDP counting the discrete level performance IGP on-die

Zacate is reported to work @1.6GHz (500MHz for the GPU). I'm more interested about the Turbo as Intel has had fairly aggressive Turbo in their products. If it goes to near 3GHz, it will fight well against Intels

 

[thinkdesign]

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I guess what is least clear to me is, how Apple makes choices about when is one revision too close timewise (or too small specwise) to do. And when is one product design "too close" to another. The much talked about but never very sourced business about "They wouldn't: A would cannibalise B". These sorts of posts seem to be maximally - personal opinion. (The iPods have certainly had plenty of models not hugely spaced apart specwise, and plenty of revisions. But that's a product they've decided to emphasize.)

I realise that the Air has little history to analize, and it's lightness and thinness make it somewhat a special case not neccessarily well illuminated by MBpro history.

My question now is... is the lack of an interim update a sign of EOL in 2011q11, or just a sign that they don't care enough about this niche to do anything more than a bundle of changes far in the future? Which they will do?

The only clues suggesting no EOL to me are the Existance of the DigiTimes and Barron's rumors, even if they got the specifics all wrong. Would a dying product have revision rumors, at all?

 

[iMacmatician]

Zacate is reported to work @1.6GHz (500MHz for the GPU). I'm more interested about the Turbo as Intel has had fairly aggressive Turbo in their products. If it goes to near 3GHz, it will fight well against Intels

I wouldn't be surprised if we see mid or even high 2.x GHz Turbo given that ULV Arrandales can already hit 2.4 GHz on Turbo.

500 MHz GPU would put it around 5430 performance (assuming it's 80 SPUs, and during non-bandwidth intensive tasks). I'd expect GPU turbo as well.

 

[tactician1016]

At this rate, we may need to set up a "I'm waiting for Sandy Bridge" thread, like the "I'm waiting for Arrandale" thread, or rather, seven threads. Those were the days...

 

[chrmjenkins]

At this rate, we may need to set up a "I'm waiting for Sandy Bridge" thread, like the "I'm waiting for Arrandale" thread, or rather, seven threads. Those were the days...

There already have been some. The Arrandale thread was started over a year ahead of time IIRC. There just hasn't been a prominent one yet.

*goes to setup waiting for Haswell thread*

 

[bwiley]

just to get a little crazy.

I am okay with the MBA design otherwise, but the bezel is the one problem with its design. I do think we will probably get a redesigned MBA when we get one. I think Apple would do better, in terms of getting the performance and space needed for components by eliminating the tapering.

MBA ushered in the unibody. Next MBA, an introduction to liquid metal? Haven't been keeping up with the "readiness for primetime" of that, but if the GPU isn't the next big thing, and the SSD and RAM have been essentially "sitting around" - cost notwithstanding - what else could you do to the MBA to give it a really compelling story?

Yeah, probably idle daydreaming, but I'm bored.....

 

[unwinded]

So I'm guessing zacate is what they're calling bobcat now? I read that the embedded GPU will have 480 stream processors and near the performance of an ATI HD 5650. If that's true and if what anandtech previewed was the 12 EU version of the sandy bridge embedded GPU, ATI's solution will be around twice as powerful plus support OpenCL. I really don't see Apple relying on the Intel solution for devices like the Air and Mac-Mini (and 13" MacBooks if they keep the optical drives) lacking OpenCL...

CPU-wise AMD is a step back but the GPU is way ahead and GPUs are becoming important for applications other than just games. I hate when people say "I don't need a GPU because I don't play games, just give me a fast CPU" because that kind of person probably doesn't do anything CPU intensive!

So if this GPU-assisted computing/GPU-accelerated/OpenCL/Cuda stuff does start getting utilized then you have to look at the whole CPU/iGPU package and AMD might be a better fit. Intel admits their GPUs have traditionally been designed with media apps in mind, not games and claims that focus will change. Hopefully that means they will beef up the staff that writes drivers which have traditionally been crap and full of artifacts even in old games. AMD will have a huge advantage there

 

[iMacmatician]

So I'm guessing zacate is what they're calling bobcat now?

Bobcat is the core. Zacate and Ontario are APUs that use Bobcat cores. Ontario's for low power while Zacate's for higher performance (and power).

I read that the embedded GPU will have 480 stream processors and near the performance of an ATI HD 5650.

Ontario/Zacate doesn't, but Llano probably does (according to rumors).

To call Bobcat cores "tiny" is an understatement.

 

[NintendoFan]

Interesting. This AnandTech article on Sandy Bridge says that it does not have OpenCL enabled.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3876/intels-core-2011-mobile-roadmap-revealed-sandy-bridge-part-ii/2

So I guess we have something of a he-says she-says right now. AnandTech is probably a lot more technically savvy than C-Net, on the other hand Intel high level muckety-mucks, stuck in the media world of the late 20th century, are probably more likely to talk to C-Net and to announce new PR to them.

I think we (Apple users as a whole) are certainly better off if C-Net is correct --- one less complication going forward.

Maybe CNET got confused and meant OpenGL?

 

[CaoCao]

Bobcat is the core. Zacate and Ontario are APUs that use Bobcat cores. Ontario's for low power while Zacate's for higher performance (and power).

Ontario/Zacate doesn't, but Llano probably does (according to rumors).

To call Bobcat cores "tiny" is an understatement.

Zacate is the size of a penny (US one cent coin)

If the size of Zacate was doubled it could be a powerful yet still low energy chip