iOS vs Android is it going to be like beta vs VHS?

[ChazUK]

The lack of a desktop platform is going to prevent them from matching MSFT and AAPL.

That really doesn't explain why Symbian flourished for so many years whilst Windows Mobile pretty much floundered during its existence.

Microsoft had the desktop platform yet Nokia were simply dominating with Symbian.

You only have to look at the iPod as well to see that a single desktop/mobile way isn't really much of a concern to most people. The iPod only really took off when the Windows version of iTunes was released. I wouldn't be surprised if the vast majority of iPhone users were also Windows users too. Where does Apple's desktop platform come into play here?

Success I the desktop doesn't automatically equal success in mobile. Look at Windows Phone 7.

 

[jeffe]

People are giving Android WAY too much credit.

15 years ago I read how Linux and Open Source was going to take
over and then everyone realized how cluttered and unfocused the Linux
market was and it settled in beneath the proprietary systems.

I don't see Android as being any different. Why exactly should anyone think Android has staying power? The lack of a desktop platform is going to prevent them from matching MSFT and AAPL.

So you're really arguing that Native apps on the OS are going to make a comeback over web apps.

 

[G51989]

People are giving Android WAY too much credit.

15 years ago I read how Linux and Open Source was going to take
over and then everyone realized how cluttered and unfocused the Linux
market was and it settled in beneath the proprietary systems.

I don't see Android as being any different. Why exactly should anyone think Android has staying power? The lack of a desktop platform is going to prevent them from matching MSFT and AAPL.

Hate to tell you this, Android has more marketshare than iOS and Apple.

I give android Tons of credit, I love it ( my work phone is an 4S, I love it to ), it runs on pretty much anything.

Gingerbread and above, its fast, stable, tons of Apps, and its nice and open.

Don't get me wrong, I like my iOS. Its a great Phone, but I can see them Getting Microsofted again, only it'll be google.

Apple overcharges for their hardware and software, where android has tons os hardware options, and provides mostly the same experience and ease of use.

What does this remind you of?

Oh yeah, when Microsoft and the PC OEM"s beat apple into a pulp.

Don't get me wrong, I doubt that will happen again, but if Apple Keeps Overcharging, and not udpating anything ( IOS6 is a joke ). People will see Windows Phone, and Android, and BB10 and think " hmmm..cheap...faster...more apps? ( Android is catching up very quickly ). " Why do you think Android is eating away at Apple's marketshare? Price point choice, and hardware choice.

And, Android doesn't need a Desktop OS, like iOS does not. The Mac is a Joke compared to Wintel Machines.

 

[nuckinfutz]

Hate to tell you this, Android has more marketshare than iOS and Apple.

I give android Tons of credit, I love it ( my work phone is an 4S, I love it to ), it runs on pretty much anything.

Gingerbread and above, its fast, stable, tons of Apps, and its nice and open.

Don't get me wrong, I like my iOS. Its a great Phone, but I can see them Getting Microsofted again, only it'll be google.

Apple overcharges for their hardware and software, where android has tons os hardware options, and provides mostly the same experience and ease of use.

What does this remind you of?

Oh yeah, when Microsoft and the PC OEM"s beat apple into a pulp.

Don't get me wrong, I doubt that will happen again, but if Apple Keeps Overcharging, and not udpating anything ( IOS6 is a joke ). People will see Windows Phone, and Android, and BB10 and think " hmmm..cheap...faster...more apps? ( Android is catching up very quickly ). " Why do you think Android is eating away at Apple's marketshare? Price point choice, and hardware choice.

And, Android doesn't need a Desktop OS, like iOS does not. The Mac is a Joke compared to Wintel Machines.

Open is nice if you get indemnification from the licensor (Google) but that doesn't appear to be happening. You could be on your own against a Patent Troll with this "free" OS.

I don't see Google doing anything with Android. Microsoft's play is easy....leverage Windows and Office. Apple's play is easy to see...leverage media and OS X. Google's play is advertising. Samsung is really the only vendor making money because of their hardware markets.

Android isn't taking marketshare from Apple (their quarterly numbers continue to rise) Android's growing at a slightly faster clip if you constrain to numbers to smartphones only. If you add in tablet and music player sales (a la iPod Touch) Apple springs into the lead.

Android isn't cheaper.

3GS = Free
4 = $99
4s = $199

Android's claim right now is super huge phones and that really isn't a huge market yet. iOS 6 may not be a great OS for user facing features but developers will like it and Apple's doing a better job at handling developers IMO than Android is.

 

[G51989]

Open is nice if you get indemnification from the licensor (Google) but that doesn't appear to be happening. You could be on your own against a Patent Troll with this "free" OS.

You could, but I doubt that will happen.

I don't see Google doing anything with Android. Microsoft's play is easy....leverage Windows and Office. Apple's play is easy to see...leverage media and OS X. Google's play is advertising. Samsung is really the only vendor making money because of their hardware markets.

I can see Android just being a mainstream mobile OS, because its a good one, I can see MS comming in, getting a good chunk as well.

No, Samsung is not the only vendor making money, because if any other vendors, such as Moto, HTC, and the like or whoever was losing money on Android Phones, they would not keep making them, so yes Android phones are turning a profit, or no one would make them.

Android isn't taking marketshare from Apple (their quarterly numbers continue to rise) Android's growing at a slightly faster clip if you constrain to numbers to smartphones only. If you add in tablet and music player sales (a la iPod Touch) Apple springs into the lead.

They arent taking Apples current customers for sure, but new customers, I think Android is taking way more of those..

Android isn't cheaper.

Wrong.

3GS = Free

I bet the 3GS loses all support the day the next iPhone comes out, and btw. I had a 3GS, it was garbage, my ****** free android phone ( before I got my S3 ) blows it away. And my S4 blows away the 4S

4 = $99

And a mid range android phone for the same money is better.

4s = $199

I can and did ( upgrade ) get a Galaxy S3, for the same money, that blows the 4S away in every single category.

Android's claim right now is super huge phones and that really isn't a huge market yet. iOS 6 may not be a great OS for user facing features but developers will like it and Apple's doing a better job at handling developers IMO than Android is.

IOS6 = OMFG?! The features that android already has, and we don't? And oh yeah, lets replace the amazing google maps with some ****** in house program!

No, Andoirds claim to fame is that is runs on a TON of hardware.

want a Big screen? Android has it.
small screen? Android has it
real keyboard, android has it!
Swappable batteries? Android has it!
Open OS? Android has it.
Constant new phones? Apple doesn't offer that for sure.

Its exactly what MS will say with the surface

iDont have an X86 i5 Processor
iCan't run millions of Apps ( Windows software eco system is much better than Apples )
iDon't have a smartcover
iDon't have a keyboard
iCan't run 20 years worth of great apps
iDon't have an Keyboard
iDon't have an track pad
iCan't run real apps.

Not saying apple makes crap, they don't But under estimating things like android is foolish.

 

[BlizzardBolt]

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Or: https://forums.macrumors.com/profile.php?do=addlist&userlist=ignore&u=5626

Thank You!

 

[jeffe]

Apple's play is easy to see...leverage media and OS X. Google's play is advertising.

What exactly do you mean by that Google's play is advertising and Apple's is OS X and leveraging media?

 

[kevinof]

Thank you thank you. Don't mind constructive debate but he's just doing my head in with his constant negative spin.

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Or: https://forums.macrumors.com/profile.php?do=addlist&userlist=ignore&u=5626

 

[sentinelsx]

The biggest issue i see with android is it is owned by Google which is only really concerned with pushing their ad business through it like other services they offer. Fragmentation or other issues are not that big of a deal because they see the 70% market share and think "we are killing it".

The next issue is the OEMs and carriers who are only in it for their newest shiny hardware and useless bloat. The reason you don't see updates fast is not really because it is very hard, simply because it is not very profitable to offer an update. Android phones still remind me of the old dumbphone days when carriers had control over the phones and the manufacturers came out with quarterly models to one up each other all the time. Only this time there is a touch screen and a better OS involved. But the rest of the situation is the same.

There is no way android can completely kill iOS or keep MS pushed to the wall for ever, some of us are tired of the OEMs' and google's "good old days" nostalgic ways.

 

[sentinelsx]

And a mid range android phone for the same money is better.

Umm no. I don't think after experience a finally cohesive and decent looking ICS and Jellybean iteration i can tolerate gingerbread on a midrange android. Never.

want a Big screen? Android has it.
small screen? Android has it
real keyboard, android has it!
Swappable batteries? Android has it!
Open OS? Android has it.
Constant new phones? Apple doesn't offer that for sure.

So where is a 4 inch nexus with HD screen, dual core processor, a quality build, and a decent enough camera? Looks like you either have to buy a crappy midrange if you go small or buy a mini tablet. What a choice!

If real keyboard was such a big deal, why are people buying galaxy S2/S3s and not motorola Droid 3/4s?

99% of the android users including myself have not swapped a battery. It is annoying to micromanage multiple batteries. Also most new android phones are efficient and even the One X with its built in battery destroys other phones except the S3 in which it comes neck to neck in my experience.

Open OS? For the carriers and OEMs, yes. Where is my choice of simply downloading pure AOSP from google servers and installing it on my GS3? Oh right, i need to build my own device for that. That throws the open argument out.

Constant new phones? Not everyone buys a new phone every month.

iDont have an X86 i5 Processor
iCan't run millions of Apps ( Windows software eco system is much better than Apples )
iDon't have a smartcover
iDon't have a keyboard
iCan't run 20 years worth of great apps
iDon't have an Keyboard
iDon't have an track pad
iCan't run real apps.

The first line is a joke right?

I can easy run all my windows stuff on a macbook fine actually. Run all my engineering software with out a hitch in fact. Best of both worlds. OS X and windows running at top performance in a single machine.

 

[nuckinfutz]

What exactly do you mean by that Google's play is advertising and Apple's is OS X and leveraging media?

Google has always promoted free apps with advertising in them because they own that market. They don't care about paid apps. Apple tried to emulate this with iAds and it's a failure because Apple's DNA isn't about advertising it's about making great things that people want to pay for.

The biggest issue i see with android is it is owned by Google which is only really concerned with pushing their ad business through it like other services they offer. Fragmentation or other issues are not that big of a deal because they see the 70% market share and think "we are killing it".

There is no way android can completely kill iOS or keep MS pushed to the wall for ever, some of us are tired of the OEMs' and google's "good old days" nostalgic ways.

Not believing in Android's future isn't saying we hate Android it's just an acknowledgment that Android came up at precisely the right time. RIM was on its way to implosion and Microsoft was "Stuck on stupid" in the mobile space. RIM, unlike Microsoft, isn't large enough to survive their blunder but Microsoft makes tons of profit and can make large steps (deal with Nokia) to move back into the market. I agree with sentinelsx that Google really is only seeing the market from an advertising perspective. Microsoft and Apple are far more interested in developing a stable platform for developers IMO. Microsoft has set minimum pricing for apps and has a sensible policy of reducing their cut for high volume apps. Something I'd like to see Apple follow.

Umm no. I don't think after experience a finally cohesive and decent looking ICS and Jellybean iteration i can tolerate gingerbread on a midrange android. Never.

So where is a 4 inch nexus with HD screen, dual core processor, a quality build, and a decent enough camera? Looks like you either have to buy a crappy midrange if you go small or buy a mini tablet. What a choice!

If real keyboard was such a big deal, why are people buying galaxy S2/S3s and not motorola Droid 3/4s?

99% of the android users including myself have not swapped a battery. It is annoying to micromanage multiple batteries. Also most new android phones are efficient and even the One X with its built in battery destroys other phones except the S3 in which it comes neck to neck in my experience.

The problem i'm running into is the now jaded Android user probably stuck on a Gingerbread phone that is acting up. They are becoming distrustful of the platform and will take convincing that they should give Android another round. There are a lot of people looking to see what the 6th gen iPhone is like before making their decision. Should be interesting.

Thank you thank you. Don't mind constructive debate but he's just doing my head in with his constant negative spin.

Sorry Kevin....normally i'm very positive guy. I don't hate Android at all but I'm adverse to being fed BS.

For instance G51989 said "because if any other vendors, such as Moto, HTC, and the like or whoever was losing money on Android Phones, they would not keep making them, so yes Android phones are turning a profit, or no one would make them."

Really?

HTC profits last quarter dropped 58% and their guidance for next qtr is a further drop of 23%


Right now the only players making money are likely Samsung and Moto in Android. I suspect many of the Android vendors will start pushing W8 phones pretty soon.

Right now when you look at Android it's doing well in only one market. Smartphones. Their tablets have not found traction and music players have not found traction. What this means to me is that Android is a carrier creation. The carriers had nothing new to push and latched onto Android and sent out a lot of phones. Since carriers don't care about music players or tablets they don't push them hence the poor numbers.

I'm not saying Android going to survive. It will. But in 4 years we'll be on Macrumors talking about something new and we'll reminisce about the days when Android was selling more than anyone.