iPad iPad Pro to Surface Pro

[The_Interloper]

You talking up Windows software selection isnt relevant. That software usually isnt optimized for touch screen devices without a mouse/keyboard input which is what the tablet mode would consist of. If you think you can use Windows apps and Android emulators (lol) and compete with the iPad as a media consumption device, you are wrong. Will it work? Sure, but it'll be worse.
...
But one device is clearly made to be a 2-in-1 while the other is made to be a media consumption device. They struggle and excel in different areas.

So where does that leave the iPad Pro? Is it a media consumption device (same OS as the regular iPad) or a 2-in-1? Apple now suggests the latter, with pseudo-laptop keyboard folios and $350 keyboard/trackpad cases. Also, it's way too expensive for most people to justify merely for consuming media.

Yet...it doesn't run desktop apps and mouse/trackpad support is terrible in some apps where it simply cannot emulate swipes/touches etc correctly. Therefore, it suffers from the same issues in the opposite direction as the Windows tablet argument above, i.e.:

"Mouse/trackpad support usually isnt optimized for touch screen apps without a multitouch input which is what the iPad would consist of. If you think you can use iPad apps with mice/trackpads and compete with the Surface as a desktop/laptop device, you are wrong. Will it work? Sure, but it'll be worse."

(my changes in bold)

In other words, both companies are selling compromised devices:

Windows - touch and pen-enabled, great for productivity, mediocre for touch-based media consumption
iPad - touch and pen-enabled, mediocre for productivity, great for touch-based media consumption
Mac - not touch or pen-enabled, great for non-touch/pen productivity, mediocre for media consumption

It's a case of what compromises you are willing to make and how many devices you want/can afford.

 

[SteveJUAE]

I'm not misunderstanding anything. I'm saying one device is a laptop that struggles as a tablet or media consumption device (but can do it). The other is the best media consumption device and can operate as a pseudo-laptop similar to a chromebook.

You talking up Windows software selection isnt relevant. That software usually isnt optimized for touch screen devices without a mouse/keyboard input which is what the tablet mode would consist of. If you think you can use Windows apps and Android emulators (lol) and compete with the iPad as a media consumption device, you are wrong. Will it work? Sure, but it'll be worse. And saying there are workaround like using an android emulator is just getting way away from the point. Thats like saying you could use an iPad to mimic a PC by remote connecting into one. Its reaching just to make a point.

I'm not defending one side or the other here. But one device is clearly made to be a 2-in-1 while the other is made to be a media consumption device. They struggle and excel in different areas.

Sorry you can't have it both ways if you catergorize these 2 in 1 struggling as a tablet then the psuedo laptop of mobile os is what ? left in the stable LOL

You are missing the point, many do not want a psuedo laptop, they want a laptop than can handle most tablet like functionality too a point that they do not have to justify 2 devices, its that simple and the appeal of 2 in 1's

Sure if you want the best tablet experience and laptop buy 2 devices

All the software options etc are just a bonus and I remind you it was yourself that tried to belittle MS store I simply pointed out like dave who misunderstood there is a lot more out there. You also forget it does not have to be always optimized for tablet mode as on a 2 in 1's they are a laptop too, so your point is mute

With 2 in 1's you can scale up or down to suit your workflow and requirements where Mobile OS there is no scaling up to the same degree or level

Whilst I only tried Android emulators for one TV streaming package I use on hols, many enjoy legacy games etc and for those that have the odd must have app, it's available

 

[Awesomesince86]

Sorry you can't have it both ways if you catergorize these 2 in 1 struggling as a tablet then the psuedo laptop of mobile os is what ? left in the stable LOL

You are missing the point, many do not want a psuedo laptop, they want a laptop than can handle most tablet like functionality too a point that they do not have to justify 2 devices, its that simple and the appeal of 2 in 1's

Sure if you want the best tablet experience and laptop buy 2 devices

All the software options etc are just a bonus and I remind you it was yourself that tried to belittle MS store I simply pointed out like dave who misunderstood there is a lot more out there. You also forget it does not have to be always optimized for tablet mode as on a 2 in 1's they are a laptop too, so your point is mute

With 2 in 1's you can scale up or down to suit your workflow and requirements where Mobile OS there is no scaling up to the same degree or level

Whilst I only tried Android emulators for one TV streaming package I use on hols, many enjoy legacy games etc and for those that have the odd must have app, it's available

Now you are making assumptions as to what people want?

For those that want a laptop that can handle most tablet like functionality, then a Surface is definitely a better device. No argument there. For those that want a media consumption device where they can also do simple productivity stuff like work in office apps and reply to email, I would say the iPad Pro is easily the better device.

I "belittled" the MS store because it is terrible. Theres no doubt. Sure you still have the standard Windows software, but you were discussing the viability of the Surface as a tablet device and I said that most Windows software isnt made to be used in a touch environment without any other input types. Can you use it in laptop mode still? Yes, but now you are changing the parameters and not actually judging it as a tablet. So I would reverse your phrase back to you...you cant have it both ways.

This is becoming a roundabout discussion. As myself and The_Interlooper both said (in different ways), the Surface is better for productive but mediocre for media consumption while the iPad is better for media consumption but mediocre for productivity.

 

[Dave245]

Now you are making assumptions as to what people want?

For those that want a laptop that can handle most tablet like functionality, then a Surface is definitely a better device. No argument there. For those that want a media consumption device where they can also do simple productivity stuff like work in office apps and reply to email, I would say the iPad Pro is easily the better device.

I "belittled" the MS store because it is terrible. Theres no doubt. Sure you still have the standard Windows software, but you were discussing the viability of the Surface as a tablet device and I said that most Windows software isnt made to be used in a touch environment without any other input types. Can you use it in laptop mode still? Yes, but now you are changing the parameters and not actually judging it as a tablet. So I would reverse your phrase back to you...you cant have it both ways.

This is becoming a roundabout discussion. As myself and The_Interlooper both said (in different ways), the Surface is better for productive but mediocre for media consumption while the iPad is better for media consumption but mediocre for productivity.

The thing is the iPad is a great tablet, in fact it’s the best tablet on the market (in my opinion). I have loved using my iPad Pro over the years. However it seems that Apple are now trying to get into the 2 in 1 market with the Magic Keyboard.
Microsoft have always positioned the Surface devices as 2 in 1 devices, where as the iPad seems to be moving in different directions.

Microsoft have their way of doing things, and Apple have theres.

 

[koigirl]

I've had the Surface Pro 5 and now the SP7 after switching from an aging MacBook Air bc Apple refused to fix their keyboard issue with newer models. Plus I run software that does not have a Mac equivalent so I found myself paying for Windows and Parallels which added another $350-400 to the cost of my overpriced MBA. I loved the Mac interface but could no longer justify the added expense with failing keyboards, ancient screen technology, etc. My Surface Pro's have never given me a bit of trouble.

I have a 2-year old Ipad Pro I use for media consumption but it is certainly not a laptop substitute. Yes, you can do most of what you can do with a laptop (certainly not all) but it requires workarounds for sure. And I find myself using it less and less over time bc I have a Note 10+ with a huge, glorious screen. The IPP is used primarily for media consumption; I've considered upgrading but don't use it enough at this point to justify an upgrade and it still works fine for its purposes.

I don't use my Surface Pro much in tablet mode either. For me, a tablet becomes less compelling as laptop and phone technology forms, specs, and features improve. Especially one that does not have a fully capable operating system to run full software.

I wonder how many people there are out there like me who once were esconced in the Apple ecosystem and gradually left bc Apple didn't focus on meaningful Mac improvements for years. One thing led to another. I returned to Windows, then decided to try a flagship Android phone (reasoning my Windows machine wasn't fully integrated anyway) and it's not been painful at all. I can see myself eventually having no Apple devices at all and for many years I had everything Apple and steered everyone I knew in their direction.

 

[maj71303]

I've had the Surface Pro 5 and now the SP7 after switching from an aging MacBook Air bc Apple refused to fix their keyboard issue with newer models. Plus I run software that does not have a Mac equivalent so I found myself paying for Windows and Parallels which added another $350-400 to the cost of my overpriced MBA. I loved the Mac interface but could no longer justify the added expense with failing keyboards, ancient screen technology, etc. My Surface Pro's have never given me a bit of trouble.

I have a 2-year old Ipad Pro I use for media consumption but it is certainly not a laptop substitute. Yes, you can do most of what you can do with a laptop (certainly not all) but it requires workarounds for sure. And I find myself using it less and less over time bc I have a Note 10+ with a huge, glorious screen. The IPP is used primarily for media consumption; I've considered upgrading but don't use it enough at this point to justify an upgrade and it still works fine for its purposes.

I don't use my Surface Pro much in tablet mode either. For me, a tablet becomes less compelling as laptop and phone technology forms, specs, and features improve. Especially one that does not have a fully capable operating system to run full software.

I wonder how many people there are out there like me who once were esconced in the Apple ecosystem and gradually left bc Apple didn't focus on meaningful Mac improvements for years. One thing led to another. I returned to Windows, then decided to try a flagship Android phone (reasoning my Windows machine wasn't fully integrated anyway) and it's not been painful at all. I can see myself eventually having no Apple devices at all and for many years I had everything Apple and steered everyone I knew in their direction.

You got one of those people right here. I recently decided that I've had enough of being in the apple ecosystem and thought that it was time to move along. The laptops, desktops, and tablets are nothing special anymore. The price of the
phones just don't cut it now. i gave my 12.9 IPP to the wife as her upgrade and then the Mac air as well. The iPhone 11 pro max i had is just tired looking and iOS as a whole now just uninspiring.

I now rock a S20+ and use my Samsung Galaxy Book 2 that came with S-pen and keyboard. If you ever get a chance use the Microsoft phone app to connect your Samsung device to the surface. It opens up a whole new world of inter-connectivity. You can reply to text, view notifications, and even work the entire phone from the app. You can launch apps on the phone and use them all while on the Surface. I do the same on my Galaxy Book 2. I'm amazed at how flawless it is.

I get all the main apps i need to run from the Microsoft store on the tablet and can install anything else i might need. the flexibility of the unlimited software that runs on windows is what keeps mac from getting hardly any traction in the corporate world. For those that say they can pay to boot camp and run parallels is just an added expense. You don't find windows users saying they have to virtual desktop MacOS to do things.

I did however pick myself the iPhone SE 2020 as a backup device since that price point is too ridiculous to pass up. But it will just be a backup device since it is not even close to what my S20+ is. S20+ will be my daily and the SE 2020 will go in the emergency kit replacing my pixel 3.

 

[mi7chy]

The thing is the iPad is a great tablet, in fact it’s the best tablet on the market (in my opinion).

Yeah, that's debatable. My iPad 7th isn't even good for consumption since it lacks VP9 for YouTube, no Kodi, no YouTube Vanced, etc. Sufficient for grandparents but for semi-technical it's a limited and restrictive toy.

 

[Dave245]

Yeah, that's debatable. My iPad 7th isn't even good for consumption since it lacks VP9 for YouTube, no Kodi, no YouTube Vanced, etc. Sufficient for grandparents but for semi-technical it's a limited and restrictive toy.

I've always considered the iPad to be a great tablet, i can watch Netflix, Youtube, all my iTunes library (i have a lot of TV shows). With the iPad Pro and Apple pencil i can draw, take notes and so on. I also love to use LumaFusion on the iPad Pro as well, especially with it being an editing app designed around touch.

IOS is polished and very touch friendly on the iPad Pro (even if there are a couple of bugs since IOS 13). I've just been disappointed in Apple recently, it seems like the quality has gone down along with the customer service.

 

[michael9891]

Yeah, that's debatable. My iPad 7th isn't even good for consumption since it lacks VP9 for YouTube, no Kodi, no YouTube Vanced, etc. Sufficient for grandparents but for semi-technical it's a limited and restrictive toy.

It might not meet your needs, but it's clearly more than just something grandparents can make use of.

 

[spinedoc77]

Has anyone made this switch? Looking for experiences / opinions.

Thanks.

Surface pro hands down, the ipad is just way too limited for my uses. The ipad is a good consumption device, but there isn't anything that the surface pro can't do as what I like to call a dumb tablet or a consumption tablet. I just find the simplicity of iOS is actually a handicap most of the time, the stuff that I do need to be very simple I just use my phone for where iOS shines because it's such a small screen comparatively. I'd say consumption is often worse on iOS for varying reasons, one big one is browser extensions, another is being able to say goodbye to youtube ads, also simple stuff like customizing the desktop, icons, etc. Multi tasking isn't anywhere near as good, on Windows with multiple and different sized windows, multiple desktops, and just a ton of customization programs there is no contest.

As a tablet in terms of hardware IMO the SP is the best tablet out there mainly because of the kickstand which let's it avoid stuff like that magic keyboard. The SP really straddles the line between tablet and laptop quite well and does great in each category, but ultimately is a better tablet than a laptop.

I'd say the main advantage of the ipad is battery life, unfortunately Microsoft went backwards and the SP7 gets markedly less battery life than the SP6 and the Surface ProX with ARM apps isn't much better (it's actually worse with x86 programs). Along the same lines are little things like the power brick, I'd kill to have the ipads power brick.

 

[ian87w]

Seems like this kind of question can be answered easily to whether the OP can live with iOS only apps or not.

Surface Pro runs regular Windows, which means it has access to all regular x86 Windows applications.
iPad Pro only runs iOS apps. Although for some that might be enough, that's not true for everyone.

Both imo are two different devices in the end.

 

[Awesomesince86]

Yeah, this has been discussed too much already IMO. To me this is pretty simple...

If your priority is media consumption, get the Ipad.

If your priority is productivity, get the Surface.

Both can do either but in a limited fashion.

 

[tbayrgs]

Yeah, this has been discussed too much already IMO. To me this is pretty simple...

If your priority is media consumption, get the Ipad.

If your priority is productivity, get the Surface.

Both can do either but in a limited fashion.

Pretty much this. I'd just take it further and suggest you identify your software needs and then see which of these devices meets your needs better. Pretty straight forward.

All the software I generally use on a daily basis is available on an iPad so I can live with an iPad Pro just fine. I'm also not a developer, doing pro level audio or video work, nor have other specific x86 only software requirements. Plenty of others won't be able to survive just using an iPad.

It seems far too common for forum members to be trying to shoehorn a specific device into their workflow, likely because they have mostly/all Apple stuff, or tend to prefer it in many cases and want to be all-in the Apple ecosystem. I'd prefer it as well but if my workflow dictates I'd be limiting myself trying to use a Mac, iPhone, or iPad when a better, non-Apple solution is available, I wouldn't be trying to force the issue. Path of least resistance.

 

[xraydoc]

I have a Surface Book 2 and an iPad Pro. While differences were well discussed above, the one thing that keeps me couch surfing on the iPad Pro is the damn smooth 120Hz display. Doesn’t matter how powerful Windows 10 is compared to iPadOS. The Surface line just can’t compete in terms of fluidity.

I do have a 120Hz display on my desktop PC, but of course I can’t pick up a 34” display and sit with it on the sofa (well, I could, but it sure wouldn’t be comfortable, nor is it a touch screen).

 

[SteveJUAE]

I have a Surface Book 2 and an iPad Pro. While differences were well discussed above, the one thing that keeps me couch surfing on the iPad Pro is the damn smooth 120Hz display. Doesn’t matter how powerful Windows 10 is compared to iPadOS. The Surface line just can’t compete in terms of fluidity.

I do have a 120Hz display on my desktop PC, but of course I can’t pick up a 34” display and sit with it on the sofa (well, I could, but it sure wouldn’t be comfortable, nor is it a touch screen).

For a media/consumption device and full OS give me a OLED tablet/2 in1 with stunning blacks and colours over a 120hz display. They are just a feast for the eyes with all the pros of full OS, both things an IPP can't compete with

 

[Alex W.]

I tried a Surface Pro 6, however I couldn’t get along with Windows. i loved the kickstand And the keyboard was nice (it did feel a bit flimsy at first tho). i eventually sold the device when I couldn’t get along with Windows. I do regret selling it and not sticking it out longer.

I wouldn’t say the iPad Pro is junk, my father and mother both have iPads and havent touched a laptop for a few years. The price of the iPad Pro’s along with the Apple pencil and the new Magic keyboard is entering into laptop territory, even Surface Pro/Book territory.

iPad is def overpriced for a mobile OS, like its begging for a OSX/IOS hybrid.

 

[nfl46]

Our office went from Surfaces to iPads as well. It was one of the biggest complaints in 2019, so in January 2020, we all got iPads. Then again, we only use iMacs in our office.

 

[Dave245]

Our office went from Surfaces to iPads as well. It was one of the biggest complaints in 2019, so in January 2020, we all got iPads. Then again, we only use iMacs in our office.

I thought people have been saying that Surface devices are more productive than iPads, especially in the setting of an office with what people call “real work”
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For a media/consumption device and full OS give me a OLED tablet/2 in1 with stunning blacks and colours over a 120hz display. They are just a feast for the eyes with all the pros of full OS, both things an IPP can't compete with

The iPad Pro has a 120hz screen but no OLED, I think Mini-Led is on the cards for next year, if the rumours are true.

 

[Alex W.]

I thought people have been saying that Surface devices are more productive than iPads, especially in the setting of an office with what people call “real work”
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The iPad Pro has a 120hz screen but no OLED, I think Mini-Led is on the cards for next year, if the rumours are true.

The surface laptop 3's are, metal versions are a legit MacBook Pro, just without osx.

 

[spinedoc77]

Yeah, this has been discussed too much already IMO. To me this is pretty simple...

If your priority is media consumption, get the Ipad.

If your priority is productivity, get the Surface.

Both can do either but in a limited fashion.

I can't say I agree with this, but it's very personal and depends on each person's preferences. I find my surface pro is a MUCH better consumption device than the ipad (once again only speaking for myself) for a variety of reasons. I can think of some easy ones right off the bat such as being able to avoid youtube ads and browsing with browser extensions, and of course I have to throw out the incredible utility of the SP's kickstand.

On the flip side I personally don't find the ipad very productive, but that's because I need specific Windows programs and also even with programs available on both like MS Office I specifically need the features the Windows versions offer. But with that said you will find TONS of ipad users who feel their ipads are "productive" and I support that, the right tool for the job and all.

 

[saber32au]

I can't say I agree with this, but it's very personal and depends on each person's preferences.

Agree!

I can think of some easy ones right off the bat such as being able to avoid youtube ads and browsing with browser extensions, and of course I have to throw out the incredible utility of the SP's kickstand.

+1

I don't own a SP per say, but the reasons you've stated are exactly the same reasons why I prefer using my laptop for media consumption. No youtube ads, no ads on web pages, watch media on a bigger screen, physical keyboard vs typing on a screen, can readily transfer files etc. That in addition to having a fully fledged laptop which can double as my main work PC is why for me, an Ipad is a poor alternative to a SP/laptop.

 

[SteveJUAE]

I can't say I agree with this, but it's very personal and depends on each person's preferences. I find my surface pro is a MUCH better consumption device than the ipad (once again only speaking for myself) for a variety of reasons. I can think of some easy ones right off the bat such as being able to avoid youtube ads and browsing with browser extensions, and of course I have to throw out the incredible utility of the SP's kickstand.

On the flip side I personally don't find the ipad very productive, but that's because I need specific Windows programs and also even with programs available on both like MS Office I specifically need the features the Windows versions offer. But with that said you will find TONS of ipad users who feel their ipads are "productive" and I support that, the right tool for the job and all.

Yes there seems to be a bit of a miss conception on IPP being a better media/consumption device

Most good laptops/2 in 1's etc that run full OS W10 or MacOS are far more capable in running media and general consumption material

What makes IPP nicer but not necessarily better is the way many like to interface by swapping, swiping and jumping around selections via finger touch interface vs pen and mouse and KB

If your simply interface driven or endurance in your media consumption then an IPP is a good option others with different priorities or more strings to their bow may prefer or find alternatives a better solution