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BODYBUILDERPAUL

Suspended
Feb 9, 2009
1,773
1,438
Barcelona
After using an incredibly unsexy Dell desktop Windows machine complete with plastic keyboard & cheap mouse along with a clunky OS the other day, it instantly made me appreciate and fall in love with the beautiful experience that I get whenever I use my Mac or Apple product.

IMO they have never been better - Loving the Macs, iPhone X design ranges, Apple TV 4k is incredible, beautiful UI, iPad Pro design, iOS10-13, Mac OS, iTunes, Photos, TimeMachine - all beautiful IMO. And CarPlay in the car is just beautiful - heck, even the ugly Apple Watch is nice in its Nike Watch UI for the gym or runs or biking :)
 

kazmac

macrumors G4
Mar 24, 2010
10,103
8,658
Any place but here or there....
Yes, I am sick of Apple especially the neglect of hardware & software, price gouging, build gimps and the obnoxious push toward services. For any real functionality in Notes now you need an iCloud account (No thanks). :( Ditto the TVapp, you have to be logged in and online now to see any media on your iDevices. Even if I had reliable internet at home, I am not a fan of that.:( And there's no guarantee they will honor AC.

All that said, I won't be too surprised if I stick around.:rolleyes: I just wish Apple wasn't so lazy/cheap with the hardware and software builds. Then I wouldn't care about the changes as much.
 

TopherMan12

macrumors 6502a
Oct 10, 2019
786
899
Atlanta, GA
Apple needs to get their QA sorted for hardware and software. That is certain especially since Apple is held at such a high standard that any issue becomes a PR nightmare. Personally, I think is time for Apple to stop pushing out huge macOS releases and incorporate more incremental updates to keep the OS moving forward with features. The hardware failures such as the butterfly keyboard nonsense needs to just stop. No excuses for it.

Having said that, there isn't an alternative that is perfect in hardware and software by any stretch of the imagination. I use Windows more hours in the day than I do Mac and and the grass is not greener on that side of the fence. And beyond that, no other ecosystem provides the seamless experience between devices that Apple does. So no, I'm no more "getting sick of Apple" than I am getting sick of Microsoft or Google as I have been customers of all of them for quite some time. But when those companies can provide the experience that I enjoy with Apple products then I may have to reevaluate where I am. But they don't provide that and so I am sticking with Apple for the time being.

Ditto the TVapp, you have to be logged in and online now to see any media on your iDevices. Even if I had reliable internet at home, I am not a fan of that.:( And there's no guarantee they will honor AC.

So why would you want someone who is not logged into your account to be able to see media on your iDevices? Maybe I misunderstand your point. Why would Apple not honor the terms and conditions of Apple Care?
 

jeyf

macrumors 68020
Jan 20, 2009
2,173
1,044
my 2017 MBP was a big turn off for me.
in genera Apple products are high end cost with low to medium quality.
 

levander

macrumors 6502
Jul 21, 2011
263
168
I'll try to make this a short reply. Here's from a different perspective, I was a PC person for close to 40 years. I even would build my own PCs and even earned a certification as a PC Technician. I got tired of using Windows the last 2-3 years or what some people sick of Windows, so I switched over Apple. Going onto almost 6 years now and I like the Apple experience as everything just works (knocking on wood as I type this). I also like how my iPad, iPhone, iMac and AW3 integrate with each other. I have nothing bad to say about Windows as I was just simply tired of using that platform. I was tired of have every electronic device "play" nice with each other as it was a juggling act finding the right drivers (in the beginning) or if some device just wouldn't play nice with other devices. Like I said it's from a different perspective and I can see the flip side of this and I really don't need to read the comments as I have been there, done that.

Strider64, what you’re talking about is the upside of the Apple platform. There definitely are things that “just work” on the Apple platform, which is a competitive advantage for Apple.

The downside is that many of their products are expensive. And Apple is developing more and more quality issues. When I’m browsing computer news, I’m coming across articles like this a lot these days:


And note that’s an article written less than a mongth ago in October making fun of Apple for already being on version 13.1.3 because of so many bug fixes. Right now in November and we’re on 13.2.2.

And it’s not just the recent news with iOS 13. Just before checking this board, I had what Apple calls their executive team call to help me with an issue with CarPlay that was introduced in the iOS 13 update. And I actually missed the phone call where Apple was trying to help me with one of their new bugs, because of two older longer standing issues with Apple products.

I set an alarms on my iPad Air for 11:20 AM ten minutes before Apple was going to call me. It didn’t go off so I wasn’t waiting for their call. It ended up going off at 11:44 AM. When I looked at it, I think what happened is when I set the alarm I noticed a neat feature where I could choose a song to play instead of one of the cheesy sound effects Apple includes. But the song I chose I noticed later was actually a DRM’d song I had downloaded back when I was an Apple Music subscriber. But I cancelled that subscription. So I’m thinking what happened is when the alarms was supposed to go off, it noticed it couldn’t play the song so just didn’t do anything, Why it went off later at 11:44 AM with one of the chintzy sound effects I have no idea. I checked and I had no other alarms set besides that 11:20 AM one. Better quality written software to me shouldn’t have let me choose a song I couldn’t play. That iPad is an iPad Air which is a device just a little too old to get the iPadOS update. So it has nothing to do with iOS 13. It!s running iOS 12.

And then when Apple did call at 11:30, my iPhone 8 did it ring. It’s something I’ve been dealing with for awhile. The mute switch in that phone doesn’t stick good. It’ll slide to the on position by itself. When I googled about this awhile back, it’s a common problem and what people do is they just cut off a little tiny piece of rubber band and shove it in the hole for the mute switch so it doesn’t slide on to own. But of course this piece of rubber band will fall out occasionally. And I changed the case on my iPhone yesterday, which is when that piece of rubber band must have fallen out.

Anyway, it was an odd experiencing missing a phone call where Apple was trying to help me with a new bug in their products because of not one, but two old issues with their products. Almost like the universe is trying to tell me something about Apple.
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duh
innovation has been turned off for a while at Apple

Good, they need to focus on quality. Get the stuff working on the products they already have. Then we can talk about innovation.
 
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daviecee

macrumors newbie
Nov 2, 2019
9
1
My liking of Apple has been waning over the years. Too many updates that actually make my workflow experience worse and concentrating on too many things that I don't care about. Dark mode and emojis for example. So I have been thinking of switching.
My wife actually made the jump for her latest phone and as the resident IT expert (The only IT guy, I know how to switch off and on 😉) I have experienced the other side.
My latest purchase has been an iPhone 11 Pro. Says it all but I am getting more and more skeptical.
 

kazmac

macrumors G4
Mar 24, 2010
10,103
8,658
Any place but here or there....
Apple needs to get their QA sorted for hardware and software. That is certain especially since Apple is held at such a high standard that any issue becomes a PR nightmare. Personally, I think is time for Apple to stop pushing out huge macOS releases and incorporate more incremental updates to keep the OS moving forward with features. The hardware failures such as the butterfly keyboard nonsense needs to just stop. No excuses for it.

Having said that, there isn't an alternative that is perfect in hardware and software by any stretch of the imagination. I use Windows more hours in the day than I do Mac and and the grass is not greener on that side of the fence. And beyond that, no other ecosystem provides the seamless experience between devices that Apple does. So no, I'm no more "getting sick of Apple" than I am getting sick of Microsoft or Google as I have been customers of all of them for quite some time. But when those companies can provide the experience that I enjoy with Apple products then I may have to reevaluate where I am. But they don't provide that and so I am sticking with Apple for the time being.



So why would you want someone who is not logged into your account to be able to see media on your iDevices? Maybe I misunderstand your point. Why would Apple not honor the terms and conditions of Apple Care?

TVapp, I do not see the need to be logged into the TVapp and forced to be on the internet all the time just to see the content that is already loaded on our iDevices.

In other words, the way things were prior to 2018.

But mom has agreed to my switching her over to the VLC app too, so I won't have to be logged in my Apple account all the time. Given the amount of phishing attempts I've been hit with since late 2016, I'd rather not stayed logged in if I can help it. Yet another reason why Apple's services are not for me.
 
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kazmac

macrumors G4
Mar 24, 2010
10,103
8,658
Any place but here or there....
I am royally annoyed again. This Air 3 I bought almost two months ago just manifested touch irresponsiveness for the first time. :mad:

Plus, my 8+ touch id has become garbage too recently (and with the F serial number making me think my trade in last year was for a refurbished 8+). So glad I returned the 16” MBP and the 3rd gen iPad Pro.

This failure rate bullcrap is inexcusable at this point. Just biding my time (waiting for Ice Lake 45w chips) and will move on next year.

I gave Apple way too much money, time and energy, especially since 2016, they’re not fixing the iPads and becoming more locked down. It’s time to get over my fears of jumping to Windows and just do it.
 
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levander

macrumors 6502
Jul 21, 2011
263
168
I am royally annoyed again. This Air 3 I bought almost two months ago just manifested touch irresponsiveness for the first time. :mad:

Plus, my 8+ touch id has become garbage too recently (and with the F serial number making me think my trade in last year was for a refurbished 8+). So glad I returned the 16” MBP and the 3rd gen iPad Pro.

This failure rate bullcrap is inexcusable at this point. Just biding my time (waiting for Ice Lake 45w chips) and will move on next year.

I gave Apple way too much money, time and energy, especially since 2016, they’re not fixing the iPads and becoming more locked down. It’s time to get over my fears of jumping to Windows and just do it.

The problem is, Windows May be no better.

But at least it’s cheaper.

Given the recent quality problems with Apple though, I’m convinced that unless you have a specific reason, like you want to develop software for the iPhone, or your a video professional who needs industry compatibility, something like that, there’s just no good reason to spend the ridiculous extra amount of money a Mac laptop costs, It’s like if you’re gonna get screwed over, why not get screwed over cheaper?

The days where I am for an Apple UI across all my devices are over. But I’m not just gonna run out and dump everything Apple. I’m gonna look piece by piece. And I’m going to avoid adopting new technology too quickly. Never just if something is neat and would be nice to have. But only if there’a a big improvement. Most of these people wearing Apple Watches do not need them. The health monitoring functionality seems like it would worthwhile for people with certain health problems. But if it’s just so you don’t have to take your phone out of your pocket, you are making a mistake.

Like can you imagine if you had gotten really into HomeKit and went and bought all the smart home devices? Then iOS 13 comes out and stuff randomly stops working?

I’m fine for now getting up off the couch and opening the blinds myself if I want some sun in the room. No need for some error prone Apple software to try to talk to some 3rd party hardware that operates my blinds. Just too much of a headache how low Apple’s commitment to quality is.

And I’m sure Appleks next release will be a stability release. But what about the release after that? It’s gonna take a minimum of five years of dedication to quality to change my mind. And I really can’t imagine Apple doing it in less than 10.

And let’s be honest, we all know Apple is not going to do that. They haven’t even bothered to publicly address how bad the iOS 13 release is.
 

kazmac

macrumors G4
Mar 24, 2010
10,103
8,658
Any place but here or there....
I know Windows may not be better, but given that my job etc. are going in that direction, I do not need MS' online services to be productive, and I'll have similar build quality, I have to at least try. It is not about cheaper, it's about reliability and be able to create in the manner I have been for 20 years now.

This is not directed at you levander.

When you have to stop creating in the middle of creating because the iPad gets too hot and subsequently stops responding to touch and the pencil, what's the point of owning the iPad.

Ditto being forced to use iCloud so that Notes has more functionality, and you must be logged into Apple and online to see what's already on your iDevice?

When the Mac Safari is wonky, and I am forced to upgrade my OS to sync my movies now.

Um, no thanks.

Safari doesn't work well on any platform, touch ID fails every single time now. So what am I supposed to do?

Tired of giving Apple money when they won't address issues, and are locking down things even more.

Apple has received more money from me in the last five years than previous because of faulty hardware. I can no longer reward them for this.

It's not about the grass being greener, it's simply about using tech that stays out of my way so I can create. I am not sure I will find that again, but I have to try other things.
 
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cosmo811

macrumors member
Sep 27, 2011
60
49
Cambridge, UK
The last iPhone I owned was the iPhone 4. I had the old classic MacBook Air for about two years before I accidentally spilled water on it (really frustrating thing was the Genius technician said that I'd managed to save about 85% of the motherboard from any damage because of my quick reaction in switching the laptop off, turning it upside down, and using a hair-dryer to try and dry it off quickly, but that once any of it is damaged at all it all has to be replaced), and in the end I spent about 3 years with the Dell XPS 13 and 2.5 years with the Samsung Galaxy S8.

They were fine. Mostly. Both had a lot of strengths to them, but they also had a bunch of issues. I ran into constant hardware issues with my XPS 13 - three failed batteries (though from what I gathered it was less te battery and more the cable connection to the motherboard?), and then the last of those three times they had to replace the battery, M.2 SSD, WiFi card and topcase. Each time involved being without a laptop for about 2 weeks, which as a PhD student is unbelievably difficult and stressful. The build quality feels nice, but in my experience it's actually pretty poor. The Galaxy S8 also had a lot of strengths - The display was beautiful, it was light, a great form-factor, and had great build quality. But man the software experience was awful. I ended up having to do a Factory Reset every 4-5 months because it just go so laggy and sluggish overall. Switching between apps, opening up new ones, jumping back and forth, sharing to other apps... all the sort of basic stuff you need to do all the time just became slow and frustrating over time. And the battery life was pretty terrible, honestly, which is probably related to the fact that over time I became more and more concerned about my privacy on that device.

So when Apple ran the 'Back to University' promotion, I ended up getting the MacBook Pro 13" 2TB (1.4GHz i5, 512GB SSD, 16GB RAM) as my sole computer. I use my MX Master and the smaller Magic Keyboard in conjunction with my Dell monitor as a desktop with a USB-C hub.

It's just a brilliant experience overall and so refreshing. Windows 10 has come a long way and I think people who utterly hate it really should consider giving it another try as they're likely speaking from ignorance. That said, I would pick Mac OS over it for literally anything except gaming, and even then the only PC games I play are World of Warcraft and Civilisation VI, which both run well on my Mac.

And then when I got the iPhone 11 Pro to replace my Galaxy S8 (following Samsung's announcement of ending updates to it) and holy **** that phone is just incredible to use as well. In both the laptop and phone, there's so much thoughtful design on every level and the integration has already given me a few 'holy ****' moments. The first time was when my partner and I were on holiday, and I wanted to send her all the photos I'd taken during our day exploring the city. After just sending them using AirDrop I realised I couldn't live without that feature anymore. The second time was on that same holiday when my partner tried to connect to the WiFi network of the Airbnb we were staying at, and my phone got a popup offering to share the WiFi code I already had on my phone with her; I pressed Accept, and it autofilled on her phone. Wow. Lastly, I was logging into my Patreon account and it texted a 2FA code to my iPhone; my laptop automatically scanned the message, extracted the code, and offered to autofill it into Safari on my Mac. I really get what people mean when they talk about the Apple ecosystem now.

I can't really see myself going back to Windows or Android at this point. I'd use Windows if I ever decided to built a gaming PC of course, but I already have a PS4 Pro I do all my gaming on anyway. Neither Windows 10 nor Android are anywhere near as bad as I have heard some rabid Apple fans claim; both have a lot of strengths of their own. If you can get a Pixel or Google One device, you can generally have a pretty nice software experience. And I've spent time using the Microsoft Surface Pro and it's a really nice device. A very clean experience. But it's not on the level of Apple. Not even close. On my Mac and iPhone, everything is so simple and intuitive, with beautiful, thoughtful design. I definitely used to love messing around with laptops and phones, flashing ROMs, installing obscure Linux distros, rooting, hacking, dual-booting, whatever. But these days I just want a fast, pleasant, beautiful, consistent, and reliable experience across my phone and laptop, and I've never experienced anything else like what you get on Apple devices.
 
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spyguy10709

macrumors 65816
Apr 5, 2010
1,010
673
One Infinite Loop, Cupertino CA
Apple II loyalists were "fed up" when apple removed expansion card slots with the introduction of the Macintosh. 68k loyalists were "fed up" with the switch to PowerPC. Classic enthusiasts were "fed up" with the introduction of OS X.

The cycle repeats.
 
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pcd213

macrumors 6502a
Jun 24, 2019
598
680
I can’t say I’m fed up with Apple because, to me, that implies that I’m leaving the ecosystem. I think Lenovo’s keyboards are vastly superior, and I like some of what Microsoft is doing with Surface, but I can’t see myself leaving Mac OS or iOS. I think Apple knows this, and their lack of fear of customer attrition tempers their drive to put out fires and to create flawless products and services in the future.

I can tell you that I’m incredibly upset with the turn Apple has taken in recent years in the reliability of their hardware and software (the MacBook keyboard fiasco, iOS 13 and Catalina bugs and botched rollout, HomePod bugs, etc.). What a shame.
 

levander

macrumors 6502
Jul 21, 2011
263
168
I can’t say I’m fed up with Apple because, to me, that implies that I’m leaving the ecosystem. I think Lenovo’s keyboards are vastly superior, and I like some of what Microsoft is doing with Surface, but I can’t see myself leaving Mac OS or iOS. I think Apple knows this, and their lack of fear of customer attrition tempers their drive to put out fires and to create flawless products and services in the future.

I can tell you that I’m incredibly upset with the turn Apple has taken in recent years in the reliability of their hardware and software (the MacBook keyboard fiasco, iOS 13 and Catalina bugs and botched rollout, HomePod bugs, etc.). What a shame.

Exactly. Competition is the only thing keeping these corporations honest. And Apple has carved out space that doesn’t have enough competition. For me it’s the unified UI across devices. And every new device I adopt makes it harder for me to switch in the long run.

I think Microsoft is (once again) best positioned to overtake Apple's space. Google and Amazon are too all over the place to pull it off to me. And theit profit motive aren’t even based on consumer computing devices. For Google it’s really advertising. And I don't understand Amazon as much. For Amazon it seems like it’s just wherever they can make a buck, they’ll try it. But even though Microsoft is best positioned, it seems like Microsoft and Apple have some sort of truce of sorts. Have you noticed Apple doesn’t even have a laptop suitable to compete at scale with Windows laptops? An $1,100 MacBook is never going to sell as many units as the $400 Windows laptops. And the desktop computers are the same way.

but like Gates used to follow IBM and wouldn’t do anything to tick them off. At some point he decided it was in Microsoft’s best interest to abandon that ship and do their own thing. It’s not the same. But there’s a similar thought process going on in Redmond with Apple these days I bet. The Surface isn’t really something Apple was originally doing, even though Apple is now moving in that direction with iPadOS. But at some point Microsoft is gonna go head to head with Apple again.

I used to hate Microsoft in the 90’s. I was a computer science student going to college who used Linux. And I could not believe how much higher quality the free software was than the stuff Microsoft was making billions of dollars off of. You did have to fiddle with the Linux stuff to get stuff installed. But once it was installed, it was solid. But for the first time ever I’m looking forward to Microsoft having more success in the future.

it’s getting time to finally sell some of my Apple stock. What Apple is doing now will take time to show up in the short-sightedness of the stock market. Where everybody with real money‘s main concern is next quarter’s financial results. But Apple is incredibly stubbornly eroding away at what was a very loyal customer base. And this will show up in their financial results in at least the next five years I bet. It’s not over yet. It’s not time to grab what you can and jump ship. But it’s time to start figuring out how you’re gonna get off this ship and look for opportunities.

As I’m starting to unload my Apple stock, I’m personally also looking for good spots to buy Microsoft.
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The last iPhone I owned was the iPhone 4. I had the old classic MacBook Air for about two years before I accidentally spilled water on it (really frustrating thing was the Genius technician said that I'd managed to save about 85% of the motherboard from any damage because of my quick reaction in switching the laptop off, turning it upside down, and using a hair-dryer to try and dry it off quickly, but that once any of it is damaged at all it all has to be replaced), and in the end I spent about 3 years with the Dell XPS 13 and 2.5 years with the Samsung Galaxy S8.

They were fine. Mostly. Both had a lot of strengths to them, but they also had a bunch of issues. I ran into constant hardware issues with my XPS 13 - three failed batteries (though from what I gathered it was less te battery and more the cable connection to the motherboard?), and then the last of those three times they had to replace the battery, M.2 SSD, WiFi card and topcase. Each time involved being without a laptop for about 2 weeks, which as a PhD student is unbelievably difficult and stressful. The build quality feels nice, but in my experience it's actually pretty poor. The Galaxy S8 also had a lot of strengths - The display was beautiful, it was light, a great form-factor, and had great build quality. But man the software experience was awful. I ended up having to do a Factory Reset every 4-5 months because it just go so laggy and sluggish overall. Switching between apps, opening up new ones, jumping back and forth, sharing to other apps... all the sort of basic stuff you need to do all the time just became slow and frustrating over time. And the battery life was pretty terrible, honestly, which is probably related to the fact that over time I became more and more concerned about my privacy on that device.

So when Apple ran the 'Back to University' promotion, I ended up getting the MacBook Pro 13" 2TB (1.4GHz i5, 512GB SSD, 16GB RAM) as my sole computer. I use my MX Master and the smaller Magic Keyboard in conjunction with my Dell monitor as a desktop with a USB-C hub.

It's just a brilliant experience overall and so refreshing. Windows 10 has come a long way and I think people who utterly hate it really should consider giving it another try as they're likely speaking from ignorance. That said, I would pick Mac OS over it for literally anything except gaming, and even then the only PC games I play are World of Warcraft and Civilisation VI, which both run well on my Mac.

And then when I got the iPhone 11 Pro to replace my Galaxy S8 (following Samsung's announcement of ending updates to it) and holy **** that phone is just incredible to use as well. In both the laptop and phone, there's so much thoughtful design on every level and the integration has already given me a few 'holy ****' moments. The first time was when my partner and I were on holiday, and I wanted to send her all the photos I'd taken during our day exploring the city. After just sending them using AirDrop I realised I couldn't live without that feature anymore. The second time was on that same holiday when my partner tried to connect to the WiFi network of the Airbnb we were staying at, and my phone got a popup offering to share the WiFi code I already had on my phone with her; I pressed Accept, and it autofilled on her phone. Wow. Lastly, I was logging into my Patreon account and it texted a 2FA code to my iPhone; my laptop automatically scanned the message, extracted the code, and offered to autofill it into Safari on my Mac. I really get what people mean when they talk about the Apple ecosystem now.

I can't really see myself going back to Windows or Android at this point. I'd use Windows if I ever decided to built a gaming PC of course, but I already have a PS4 Pro I do all my gaming on anyway. Neither Windows 10 nor Android are anywhere near as bad as I have heard some rabid Apple fans claim; both have a lot of strengths of their own. If you can get a Pixel or Google One device, you can generally have a pretty nice software experience. And I've spent time using the Microsoft Surface Pro and it's a really nice device. A very clean experience. But it's not on the level of Apple. Not even close. On my Mac and iPhone, everything is so simple and intuitive, with beautiful, thoughtful design. I definitely used to love messing around with laptops and phones, flashing ROMs, installing obscure Linux distros, rooting, hacking, dual-booting, whatever. But these days I just want a fast, pleasant, beautiful, consistent, and reliable experience across my phone and laptop, and I've never experienced anything else like what you get on Apple devices.

cosmo, I know what you’re saying about Apple having introduced some neat little features that are more seamless than what we are used to in dealing with computers. But wait until you come across a bug that alters your workflow in a way that is a real pain in the ass. And even though it used to work fine, Apple broke it in one of their updates, and you called them and Apple told you they’d fix it in a future update. But you wait and you wait and you wait and they just never fix it. And you call them back and they tell you to keep waiting. And you call them again and then they say they have no record of this ever being a confirmed problem, That’s the kind of stuff happening to a lot of the people posting in this thread, including myself.

The fact that you can send a photo to someone in a few less steps than it would take to email them just doesn’t seem like as big a deal any more. Even though yes, for Microsoft to overtake Apple’s space, they would need to implement something like that. But really, implementing Airdrop is a lot simpler than having an overall quality ecosystem that is well supported.
 
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I7guy

macrumors Nehalem
Nov 30, 2013
35,142
25,213
Gotta be in it to win it
I'll try to make this a short reply. Here's from a different perspective, I was a PC person for close to 40 years. I even would build my own PCs and even earned a certification as a PC Technician. I got tired of using Windows the last 2-3 years or what some people sick of Windows, so I switched over Apple. Going onto almost 6 years now and I like the Apple experience as everything just works (knocking on wood as I type this). I also like how my iPad, iPhone, iMac and AW3 integrate with each other. I have nothing bad to say about Windows as I was just simply tired of using that platform. I was tired of have every electronic device "play" nice with each other as it was a juggling act finding the right drivers (in the beginning) or if some device just wouldn't play nice with other devices. Like I said it's from a different perspective and I can see the flip side of this and I really don't need to read the comments as I have been there, done that.
Your past mirrors mine. In fact I still build my desktops from components. We have a multi-platform computing house and use what's best for the task at hand. Similar to you sometimes I wish that "windows would just work".

The perspectives raised in this thread are not new, and have been stated in various formats over the years.
 
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