Is ARM the death knell for the hackintosh?

[Yebubbleman]

I think you’re right. Once Apple’s no longer releasing Intel versions of the OS, that MAY be the end of the road for subsequent releases to show up on Intel systems. Again, having said that, I’m sure that some group may make it their sworn duty to look at what all the ARM code is doing (in macOS XX?) and attempt to write Intel versions of all that and even release a tidy little updater. But, effectively a non-event for folks that wanted to simply take macOS and run it on a MUCH faster Intel PC that Apple doesn’t offer.

And, I also think it’s possible that, since the code will be coming from Apple (when performing any upgrades), it’s likely that each “version” of macOS actually consists of a lot of different packages specifically meant for each system to be installed to. I know it works this way on iPadOS and iOS (where the upgrade is sized for the specific device receiving it), so I wouldn’t doubt that it works that way on any future laptop/desktop Apple Silicon systems.

Another question, are there even ARM BYO systems out there?

System updates (both point release updates for the "current" macOS release as well as the Security Updates for the two immediately previous releases) will include minor firmware updates for Intel Macs now and those are definitely system-specific. I don't know if the firmware updates are baked into the update itself or if the update kicks off a separate under-the-hood process to fetch the updated firmware for the given Mac model. Whereas for iOS and iPadOS, the update for the specific model (e.g. iPad mini (5th Gen, Cellular)) is what's downloaded and processed as any other device's update wouldn't work.

Major macOS releases always contain a TON of changes under the hood. Getting people to band together to re-write that code for Intel would not be feasible, let alone possible. It's a nice idea. I often fantasize about open source forks of Snow Leopard to make a totally different desktop platform. But it'd be a lot of work that ultimately wouldn't make sense. Especially since macOS, on the whole, is becoming less utilitarian as the years pass. I'm going to get another Intel Mac soon. Then in a few years, maybe an Apple Silicon 13"/14" Pro/Air/MacBook, but I don't know if I have that many more Macs in me past that point. I'm just able to do so much more in Windows without limitations or Apple's arbitrary deprecation of technologies like 32-bit app support (albeit, there's not really a need to support 32-bit ARM macOS apps as there ought to not be any).

As for ARM BYO systems, the Raspberry Pi is a popular one. But, otherwise, I don't know of any others. I think that a lack of hardware selection will be the least of anyone's concerns when it comes to whether or not Hackintoshing is viable on a third party ARM system.

 

[Unregistered 4U]

Major macOS releases always contain a TON of changes under the hood. Getting people to band together to re-write that code for Intel would not be feasible, let alone possible. It's a nice idea.

I think I’m moreso hedging my bets than anything else. I avoid saying it’s impossible only because I really don’t know about ALL the things that would need to be overcome in order to make it happen!

 

[Yebubbleman]

I think I’m moreso hedging my bets than anything else. I avoid saying it’s impossible only because I really don’t know about ALL the things that would need to be overcome in order to make it happen!

For sure. I often fantasize about being able to do this with Snow Leopard (as it's a good base version that lacks much of the iCloud/iOS influence but still captures the essence of what is/was awesome about the Mac platform) and then it just forking out and being its own open source OS. Alas, just a pipe dream.

 

[i.am.not.a.hipster]

Nonsense.

The MacPro4,1/5,1 will live on despite the switch to ARM.

Someone will probably come up with an add-on PCI card hacked together with Apple Silicon on it for the Mac Pro.

Mark my words.

 

[MacLawyer]

I think eventually all Macs will require the T2 chip or its successor to run the current OS. IMO that is what will slowly kill off the Hackintosh.

 

[StellarVixen]

Anyone who thinks the opposite is in a huge denial.

We are back to the PowerPC era, and hardly anyone was building hackintoshes back then.Yes, there were Mac clones, but these used special hardware. You can't just walk into a retail store and buy ARM parts to assemble a Hackintosh.

I'll enjoy my Hackintosh as much as Apple allows me to, and then I'll see what ARM has to offer.

 

[StellarVixen]

I think eventually all Macs will require the T2 chip or its successor to run the current OS. IMO that is what will slowly kill off the Hackintosh.

That will be when 2019 iMac becomes obsolete, which will not be soon.

 

[Maximara]

How exactly do you imagine running PPC OS on a PC?

Sheep Shaver. In fact, there has been a recent update on the Mac fork to where it is 64-bit clean (I have some World Builder games I still run from time to time). If that can be ported to ARM...

 

[MandiMac]

Sheep Shaver. In fact, there has been a recent update on the Mac fork to where it is 64-bit clean (I have some World Builder games I still run from time to time). If that can be ported to ARM...

Wouldn't this run on ARM anyway because of Rosetta 2?

 

[Ritsuka]

Yes, it will run under Rosetta.

 

[Maximara]

Wouldn't this run on ARM anyway because of Rosetta 2?

I mean run natively not via translation. Sheep Shaver can be temperamental and having it run natively may make it less so. The speed boost is just gravy.

 

[Apple Desktop Bus (ADB)]

Nonsense.

The MacPro4,1/5,1 will live on despite the switch to ARM.

Someone will probably come up with an add-on PCI card hacked together with Apple Silicon on it for the Mac Pro.

Mark my words.

You honestly believe that someone will be able to purchase Apple Silicon chips and include them in their PCI card and Apple will allow it?

Did that happen with the move from the G5 to Intel? Why would you think it'd happen this time? Even if we ignore the fact that Apple will never sell their chips for such use and will definitely sue anyone trying to do such, there's still the fact that it'd be incredibly expensive to do such and the market so limited to make it not even worth the investment.

 

[Hexley]

Title says it all. Once Apple drops OS support for Intel Macs in a future version will the idea of a hackintosh be dead? May be a few years before the Intel Macs are deprecated but we can expect it to happen sometime.

macOS support will drop as early as 2024 or as late as 2028.

 

[Maximara]

macOS support will drop as early as 2024 or as late as 2028.

Based on what happened with the PowerPC to Intel transition the later year is more likely. Heck, Apple even offered an optional software package for Snow Leopard to keep running Rosetta 1...though admittedly their last update to Snow Leopard broke that.

 

[Hexley]

Based on what happened with the PowerPC to Intel transition the later year is more likely. Heck, Apple even offered an optional software package for Snow Leopard to keep running Rosetta 1...though admittedly their last update to Snow Leopard broke that.

PowerPC support lasted 4 years after last Mac transitioned to Intel.

8 year software support aplies to Intel Macs who have enjoyed software updates for as long as 8 years.

My late 2012 iMac was supported until Catalina. When Big Sur came out this month it dropped support.

So say a late 2020 iMac 27" would have support until 2028.

 

[KShopper]

What would be the point of running a Hackintosh in a post-M1 world? So you can have worse performance and compatibility issues? lol.

 

[JMacHack]

What would be the point of running a Hackintosh in a post-M1 world? So you can have worse performance and compatibility issues? lol.

Some people just like to tinker, and there's nothing wrong with that!

Personally I believe that the hackintosh community won't die out completely, but will likely be smaller and by necessity, have to be more dedicated. I do believe that desktop ARM CPUs will be available someday (not Apple, maybe NVidia or Qualcomm, et al.) and someday they'll catch up with the M1 in speed. Maybe by then the hackintosh community will revolve around ARM CPUs instead of x86.

 

[adonis3k]

I've gone from my Ryzen 2700x Hackintosh to a Mac Mini M1 no looking back, performs just as good if not better and no noise even though it had AIO, but that Ryzen spiked like a beeeatch all the time!

 

[Rasta4i]

I've gone from my Ryzen 2700x Hackintosh to a Mac Mini M1 no looking back, performs just as good if not better and no noise even though it had AIO, but that Ryzen spiked like a beeeatch all the time!

Do you use it for editing?

 

[adonis3k]

Do you use it for editing?

very light 4k stuff fellow Gooner.....yawn! lol

 

[Maximara]

PowerPC support lasted 4 years after last Mac transitioned to Intel.

Uh you do know I was talking about non OS PowerPC support, right?

Unless I missed something there were no "new" Power PC Macs from 2006 onwards (First Intel Mac dropped Jan 2006) and the old models were discontinued in 2006. The patch that prevented the optional Rosetta download for Snow Leopard from working (Security Update 2012-001 (Snow Leopard)) dropped by Feb 1, 2012. Last time I checked 2012-2006 is 6 but since some of the PowerPC macs weren't discontinued until mid 2006 I went with 5 years.

If we go by OS as you seem to be doing it is only 3 years as Snow Leopard dropped August 28, 2009.

So you are effectively incorrect from either POV.

 

[dogslobber]

I've gone from my Ryzen 2700x Hackintosh to a Mac Mini M1 no looking back, performs just as good if not better and no noise even though it had AIO, but that Ryzen spiked like a beeeatch all the time!

What do you do when Apple abandons you with OS updates? The insurance an Intel Mac has is it can run another OS with security updates until its fan spins its last revolution. With an M1 Mac you're machine is unsupported as soon as Apple pulls the plug on OS updates. I find giving Apple such control extremely alarming and it's one reason I am happy to switch to Linux permanently when Apple decides Intel Macs are no longer worth supporting. Pity the M1 Mac owner.

 

[SchrodingersMartian]

I hope it does ruin development on Hackintoshes as it is extremely disrespectful to put Mac OS on a PC which will hurt Apple in the end. Do we not remember the Mac clones of the late 90s? If you can afford to put Mac OS on a horrible Dell PC or HP then you can afford to by a Mac and I hope until you do your data gets erased and you have all types of software issues and lose important project files until you come to your senses.

 

[dogslobber]

I hope it does ruin development on Hackintoshes as it is extremely disrespectful to put Mac OS on a PC which will hurt Apple in the end. Do we not remember the Mac clones of the late 90s? If you can afford to put Mac OS on a horrible Dell PC or HP then you can afford to by a Mac and I hope until you do your data gets erased and you have all types of software issues and lose important project files until you come to your senses.

Well aren't you the life of the party with such a bizarre statement. Given how the average units per year has quadrupled since the Intels Macs were introduced, yes, that is hurting Apple's bottom line.

 

[Maximara]

What do you do when Apple abandons you with OS updates? The insurance an Intel Mac has is it can run another OS with security updates until its fan spins its last revolution. With an M1 Mac you're machine is unsupported as soon as Apple pulls the plug on OS updates. I find giving Apple such control extremely alarming and it's one reason I am happy to switch to Linux permanently when Apple decides Intel Macs are no longer worth supporting. Pity the M1 Mac owner.

Given, based on past behavior, we are talking 7 years I don't see this as an issue. Besides you can still use the old OS though it will put you in the same camp as the 'Use Windows XP until the Devil and his minions have snow ball fights' crowd.