Is There a Better Music Player to Sync Mac Library with iPhone?

[UKenGB]

To get hold of the library database, I suspect you'd have to try and extract it from a backup. I doubt iMazing would be able to access it directly on the iPhone.

I am looking at other iDevice music players, but it has to have a CarPlay option which limits possibilities and it is a depressing fact that most of the developers of such apps have no idea about dealing with music data and how to present it in a meaningful and genuinely useful manner - even the non-free ones.

 

[bzgnyc2]

To get hold of the library database, I suspect you'd have to try and extract it from a backup. I doubt iMazing would be able to access it directly on the iPhone.

I can confirm that iMazing V.2 accesses the phone live (as well as backups it or iTunes makes) and it lets you copy individual files to a Mac. I can also confirm that the SQLite Media library that comes off the phone can be opened with sqlite on a Mac.

iMazing says it can copy individual files (and therefore presumably the SQLite files) back too but I can't test that right now. Not sure if it needs to do full backup/modify/restore to do that or it can replace individual files on the phone. Someone else will have to take the next step of potentially corrupting (seems unlikely but of course not impossible) their phone's music library and potentially having to restore/rebuild.

I am looking at other iDevice music players, but it has to have a CarPlay option which limits possibilities and it is a depressing fact that most of the developers of such apps have no idea about dealing with music data and how to present it in a meaningful and genuinely useful manner - even the non-free ones.

I don't CarPlay but VLC supposedly supports it now. I don't find it's desktop UI terribly intuitive but they do seem to know what they are doing technically so it might be worth a shot.

 

[UKenGB]

I'll have to look into accessing the music library database. Sounds a possible solution, once I've figured out the database schema which will undoubtedly be way more complex than it needs to be.

I use VLC on the Mac for its technical capabilities, but I don't hold out much hope for its UI on the iPhone. I'm not looking for the ability to play lots of weird media file types, as mine are all AAC or MP3. I just need it to work the same way as Music.app on MacOS, in as much as it deals with the files' metadata in the exact same way.

I'm going to wield the hammer and delete all trace of Music.app on the iPhone (and hence clear out ALL the current files and data), reload it, turn OFF anything to do with iCloud, streaming, purchases etc and sync the music all over again. See how that turns out.

Fingers crossed.

 

[ChrisA]

I own all the music, I own the iPhone, I own the Mini; $25/year to organize and play my music through my devices seems ridiculous to me. I'd buy an App, but if I was into subscriptions I'd just stream music.

The $25/year is not just some kind of license. It is a service that stores the music for you. You pay for storage and bandwidth. You need this if the music you bought will not physically fit on your phone and you want to access it over the cellular network.

But on the other hand, if you already subscribe to Apple Music, it is unlikely that you have any music that is not on their service, unless it was made by some unsigned band or some friends.

 

[landshark2]

The $25/year is not just some kind of license. It is a service that stores the music for you. You pay for storage and bandwidth. You need this if the music you bought will not physically fit on your phone and you want to access it over the cellular network.

But on the other hand, if you already subscribe to Apple Music, it is unlikely that you have any music that is not on their service, unless it was made by some unsigned band or some friends.

My iPhone is a 256GB model, so my 500+ album library is far from challenging my storage capacity. And I have a significant number of albums that are not available at the iTunes Store, which I assume means they aren't available on the Apple Music streaming service.

All 3 of my Budgie albums aren't available on iTunes, Gong Espresso II isn't available, Danny Gottlieb Aquamarine isn't available, 3 of my David Grisman albums aren't available. I'll stop at the G's.

And I don't see how this $25 annual subscription is going to cause the music that I play on my iPhone to show with albums sorted like any competent music store would sort them. I think it would sort them in Apple's ignorant alphabetical by first name sorting.

 

[UKenGB]

The $25/year is not just some kind of license. It is a service that stores the music for you. You pay for storage and bandwidth. You need this if the music you bought will not physically fit on your phone and you want to access it over the cellular network.

But on the other hand, if you already subscribe to Apple Music, it is unlikely that you have any music that is not on their service, unless it was made by some unsigned band or some friends.

I agree that for some users it's a great option, but for those of us who do not need or want what that service provides, any amount per year would simply be a total waste.

What we are trying to establish here is the alternative to simply handing it all over to Apple, which is symptomatic of today's society IMO where everyone hands over control of their lives to large corporations (and/or governments) to make decisions for them. That is not how I choose to live my life.

Despite its shortcomings, Music.app in MacOS can provide all that is required. It can handle all the local music media you throw at it, provides the means to edit the metadata tags in whatever way you desire (including a much better album artwork system than that used by iTunes) and it respects those tags you take the trouble to populate. You can even hide the Music Store to not be troubled by it at all.

Where it all falls down is trying to then get that on the iPhone. The sync process is decidedly flaky and the media you end up with on the iPhone can be different from how you set it up on the Mac, with no easy way to correct this abysmal behaviour.

That's what we are trying to solve and no remote server for storage or streaming can change that. This is a problem local to the iPhone - not a Cloud in sight.

 

[MacFarmer]

I also have issues with this new crappy apple music app.

For me, I have 120gb of music, and if I sync with new Mac Music app, all album artwork gets messed up. I do have set it up as manually manage music.

So what I did: I have music playlists on Apple music, I manually drag them to my iPhone, so they appear there. But for actual music files, I manually drag them from iTunes location to iphone via Waltr app. This app uploads music files and they appear on iphone, without album artwork being messed up. So music files are fine, and I music app playlists recognize songs, so no issues there too.

But this is clearly a messed up workflow. Apple really messed up with with music. Books too. I think they just don't care about details anymore..

 

[UKenGB]

… I think they just don't care about details anymore..

So true. They just want to be able to shout about what great features they now offer, without seeming to care that so much of it simply doesn't work as they claim it does, if at all.

 

[bzgnyc2]

I also have issues with this new crappy apple music app.

For me, I have 120gb of music, and if I sync with new Mac Music app, all album artwork gets messed up. I do have set it up as manually manage music.

So what I did: I have music playlists on Apple music, I manually drag them to my iPhone, so they appear there. But for actual music files, I manually drag them from iTunes location to iphone via Waltr app. This app uploads music files and they appear on iphone, without album artwork being messed up. So music files are fine, and I music app playlists recognize songs, so no issues there too.

But this is clearly a messed up workflow. Apple really messed up with with music. Books too. I think they just don't care about details anymore..

Hi MacFarmer, this Waltr app looks interesting. Can it really sync music in iTunes, etc into the Music app on an iPhone? The features listed on its web page look promising but I often find such pages elide fundemental limitations not apparent until I invest all sorts of time playing with the software. Can you share your experiences with the software?

 

[UKenGB]

Today I dedided to try and start again, so deleted Music.app from the iPhone which as expected, also (not immediately though) deleted all the actual music files from the iPhone.

I then turned on AirPlane mode to ensure no connection for the iPhone to the 'Net. Possibly not necessary, but I wanted to be sure.

I then connected the iPhone to the Mac and was surprised to see that in Music.app, it was still showing the iPhone as having all the music although the iPhone itself shows none there and over 200 Gb of storage free. I also saw it display about 200 Gb used AND over 200 Gb free and available which since the iPhone has 256 Gb is a clear indication that Apple have f****d up somewhere.

In fact, I think it is part of the problem.

I then used the Finder sync window to select all the music I want to sync, basically a number of playlists that amount to about 25k tracks and started the sync - skipping backup as that's a waste of time when just testing music sync.

After a too short time it finished with no error, but instead of the 160 Gb that should have sync'd, the iPhone was only showing about 17 Gb of music. I repeated the sync multiple times, but every time, despite no error, no more music was being copied up to the iPhone. Music.app on the Mac meanwhile was still showing a very large list of music it thought was still on the iPhone - but was not.

So here's what I figured:-

Previous sync'ing meant Music.app on Mac had a list of what it thought was on the iPhone but deleting Music.app and all the media from the iPhone did not update the list that Music.app on the Mac holds. So when trying to sync, it only copied what it thought would fit onto the iPhone, which explains the 17 Gb of music it copied, which matches the 17 Gb of free storage Music.app on the Mac thought was available on the iPhone.

My guess is that it works out how much it thinks can be copied before it starts, so it completes without error, but that doesn't help the user who is left not knowing why only some of the intended media has been sync'd and worse, it does not then update the list on the Mac. So next attempt will just see the iPhone as full and copy nothing more.

This is nothing but unbelievably poor software from Apple. No excuses, it is an abysmal attempt at creating sync software.

So I picked one small playlist to sync. Just a few tracks that it would think were already on the iPhone, or at least would fit the available space and started sync again. This time it was able to complete the sync of that playlist AND update the list held on the Mac as well as deleting what was already on the iPhone, but not in this small playlist. So finally, what the Mac thought was on the iPhone and what was actually on the iPhone were correct, with all the correct available free space. Phew.

Then I selected the big playlist that includes all the 160+Gb of music I want on the iPhone and started sync again and eventually, in 'Step 5 of 5', the progress line shows it actually copying over 20k tracks. It is currently working its way through all that. Same music as was on there earlier today, but hopefully now exactly as it is in Music.app on the Mac with no access to the Internet or even Music.app on the iPhone to mess around with the sync process. Once that is finished, I'll select the additional playlists I want to sync but that should be real quick as their tracks will already be up there.

Then I'll download Music.app to the iPhone again and immediately turn off all access to Apple Music (streaming service) and any purchased media so it should not try and match anything up and all should stay correct and as it was on the Mac.

The issue with the list held on the Mac of what it thinks is on the iPhone not being correctly updated is a problem however as the only way to sync that list is to sync a small amount of music which deletes all the rest and then it all has to be copied up to the iPhone all over again. So not something one wants to repeat. I just hope it all does end up how I want so I will not have to do it again.

There is something else that's not quite right. The playlist I am currently sync'ing contains "25,607 songs", as reported by Music.app on the Mac and there were 37 of those already on the iPhone from the first small playlist sync. Which means it should be sync'ing 25,570 additional songs/tracks, yet the progress line of the sync process displays "Copying xxxxx of 22.562" which is roughly 3k songs/tracks short. Where are those 3k tracks? Why are they not being sync'd?

The only answer that occurs to me is that when the large sync starts, that progress line initially displays a much smaller number as the total to sync, but as it proceeds, that number increases as if it starts the sync before it's finished counting them all and repeatedly updates that total as it counts until eventually it has counted all those still to sync. IOW, the final total that no longer changes while the sync proceeds is how many were left by the time they were all counted. So those already sync'd by the time it finished counting are not included in that total figure which hence does not represent all the tracks it is copying in this sync.

That's the only explanation I can think of, but it's a crummy way to write software. What's the point of displaying a total to the user when it's not correct and just some rather random number less than the true number. Or maybe the sync software simply can't count.

Anyway, that's where I am and when the sync has finished I'll report back on how it worked out and if the music is there all present and correct. 🤞

 

[UKenGB]

Main playlist sync completed and then additional playlists also sync'd.

Then enabled WiFi and downloaded Music.spp to iPhone and ensured all mention of 'Apple Music' or 'purchased' was turned OFF. Started Music.app and…

All looks good. All artists (even 'purchased') have correct name, not munged by Apple, Artists displayed as Album Artist and sorted according to Sort Album Artist and all their albums appear correct and sorted as they should be.

It's been a bit of a nightmare to achieve, but looks like I've got there.

The solution appears to be to start from scratch on the iPhone (i.e. no media and NO Music.app) and sync from the Mac with no connection possible (for the iPhone) to anything Apple related. Then download Music.app to the iPhone and it will use what is there rather than munge the metadata as it syncs.

I 'think' any additional music by existing 'purchased' artists (now correctly named and sorted) will simply be associated with the artists as they now are and not try and change them.

However, we'll see… 🤞

 

[bzgnyc2]

I then connected the iPhone to the Mac and was surprised to see that in Music.app, it was still showing the iPhone as having all the music although the iPhone itself shows none there and over 200 Gb of storage free. I also saw it display about 200 Gb used AND over 200 Gb free and available which since the iPhone has 256 Gb is a clear indication that Apple have f****d up somewhere.

Yes this is what I've come to conclude lately...

After a too short time it finished with no error, but instead of the 160 Gb that should have sync'd, the iPhone was only showing about 17 Gb of music. I repeated the sync multiple times, but every time, despite no error, no more music was being copied up to the iPhone. Music.app on the Mac meanwhile was still showing a very large list of music it thought was still on the iPhone - but was not.

This is nothing but unbelievably poor software from Apple. No excuses, it is an abysmal attempt at creating sync software.

There is something else that's not quite right. The playlist I am currently sync'ing contains "25,607 songs", as reported by Music.app on the Mac and there were 37 of those already on the iPhone from the first small playlist sync. Which means it should be sync'ing 25,570 additional songs/tracks, yet the progress line of the sync process displays "Copying xxxxx of 22.562" which is roughly 3k songs/tracks short. Where are those 3k tracks? Why are they not being sync'd?

That's the only explanation I can think of, but it's a crummy way to write software. What's the point of displaying a total to the user when it's not correct and just some rather random number less than the true number. Or maybe the sync software simply can't count.

I experienced similar issues with iTunes/iPhones sync'ing on a smaller scale (my library is ~ 6K songs + videos and I normally sync ~ 3K) some time ago. Some of it was due to the exact sync settings I used and/or some duplicates and/or double-counting in my playlists. For people who like A + B + C - B = A + C it was a bit frustrating to make sure everything was sync'd. I like to think that people who write my software not only know algebra but believe in it...

The storage usage summary on the iPhone gives similar frustration. Capacity and usage would similarly operate under some sort of algebra but instead its a bit fuzzy. I've learned that System Data is basically a plug. Plus I've seen things move among unrelated catagories live.

I had to move on with one issue after many many hours. My Photo usage sits at a minimum of 200MB even when I'm at 0 photos (yes that's with nothing in Archives, Deleted photos, etc). I can reset the phone but as soon as I sync with to my Mac, Photos reports that space used (yes sync'ing photos back to the iPhone is turned off). Spent many hours reseting, resyncing phone, looking through folders via iMazing, e-mails back and forth with iMazing people (who gave this many more hours than my purchase price would justify) but Photos usage always returned to 200MB. I spent a lot of time on this thinking maybe my phone was hacked but eventually chalked it up to sloppy software...

 

[bzgnyc2]

Main playlist sync completed and then additional playlists also sync'd.

Then enabled WiFi and downloaded Music.spp to iPhone and ensured all mention of 'Apple Music' or 'purchased' was turned OFF. Started Music.app and…

All looks good. All artists (even 'purchased') have correct name, not munged by Apple, Artists displayed as Album Artist and sorted according to Sort Album Artist and all their albums appear correct and sorted as they should be.

It's been a bit of a nightmare to achieve, but looks like I've got there.

The solution appears to be to start from scratch on the iPhone (i.e. no media and NO Music.app) and sync from the Mac with no connection possible (for the iPhone) to anything Apple related. Then download Music.app to the iPhone and it will use what is there rather than munge the metadata as it syncs.

I 'think' any additional music by existing 'purchased' artists (now correctly named and sorted) will simply be associated with the artists as they now are and not try and change them.

However, we'll see… 🤞

Great and glad to hear the good news. Hopefully positives results continue to follow. The amount of work we have to do to workaround things these days is hard to justify but at least we're here.