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I would prefer multitasking to be added to context menus in addition to the existing gestures. I often feel like I'm playing whack-a-mole trying to drag stuff where I want them to be.

Consider keyboard shortcuts. They make it faster to accomplish things. However, if one didn't know CTRL/CMD+C is copy and CTRL/CMD+V is paste, it's still possible to do these things via menu.
Exactly. One of the biggest problems is when you don’t have more than one way to perform a function.

Copy/Paste:
1) Pinch
2) Long Press
3) Keyboard Shortcut

The new pinch gesture is ridiculous. But I’m completely unaffected by it because there’s two other methods that work better. No problem. But what about Multitasking.

Multitasking:
1) Open app full screen. Slide up a bit, drag app to side of existing app

One single way to trigger such an important task is a pretty huge oversight. Contextual long press is the obvious solution but I’d even take a Siri command so I can say “Open Safari and Mail” or “Open Notes in split screen”.
 
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Yesterday. I used Windows 10 with my 1440p monitor. I had three terminal windows open and a browser. I used two terminal windows and the browser for reference while I worked in the third terminal cross-referencing information from the other three sources. This type of workflow is not atypical for me, and probably many others.

I know when I'm coding it's not uncommon to have multiple windows open as well. And certainly having to switch between them would be exceedingly frustrating and slow down work.



You would think the training wheels could come off, except that Apple in recent years keeps changing how the UI works.



Sure. It's one thing to tap, swipe, and pinch. That's pretty basic with touchscreen user interfaces after 10+ years. But it's entirely another to swipe with three fingers left or pinch with three fingers twice in a row, or drag up from the bottom-left with a stylus... (Assuming you're using the latest operating system.. otherwise those don't work and the gestures are different.) It's another to know which parts of iPadOS Music are actionable. Before you used to swipe up for more options, now you tap somewhere. Apple keeps changing things beyond the basic tap, swipe, and pinch; so training wheel are very much needed.
All fair points. Like I said, I came in to say my piece from a Devil’s Advocate point of view, not as an iPadOS apologist. There are plenty of use cases where its just not going to cut it, but I maintain that it is much more learnable and capable of heavy productivity than it is given credit for. Understood that coding, for example, is a particularly challenging use case for iPadOS.

Also agree as pointed out by others that the real let down of iPadOS is the native apps themselves Rather than the ability to multitask with them. The productivity apps are all so woeful, that the iWork suite is by far the superior set of apps on iPad, which if you tried to say that on a desktop OS, would be absurd. That is what iPadOS really needs more than anything else, is proper full feature parity desktop level apps.

The only reason I am able to use iPadOS in my demanding work environment is because all of our ERP, productivity, and financial software is web-based. We don’t have local installs of any of those things on our hardware, or if we do they are portable, like Slack for example. I unfortunately think this will only change once Apple starts releasing their ARM Macs, and Apple’s custom processors start overlapping in the product lines.

Yes, I do have to switch tabs back and forth more often sometimes, and usually am using keyboard shortcuts for that stuff on iPad, but have made adjustments to my workflow so that this kind of thing is less of a choke point than it would have been if I refused to change my workflow from my macOS norm.

I also, despite fully agreeing with your last paragraph, stand by the idea that a lot of criticism comes from not wanting to take the time to learn a new way of doing things, instead trying to fit that square peg in a round hole, or don’t use the iPad enough to become used to the navigation for more advanced multitasking and productivity use.

One of the tools cursor based UI’s have that touch based just don’t is cursor hover contextual cues. This is actually a huge deal and challenge for touch UI design, as you can’t make an expositional instruction pop up in the UI by hovering, and long press is already taken for other functions.

Ultimately I would love to have a Samsung DEX like solution, where I could just have my foldable iPhone with me and connect it to an external monitor with a keyboard and mouse, and macOS UI just appears, unfold it into a 10-12” tablet when on the go and iPadOS UI presents itself...
 
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Ultimately I would love to have a Samsung DEX like solution, where I could just have my foldable iPhone with me and connect it to an external monitor with a keyboard and mouse, and macOS UI just appears, unfold it into a 10-12” tablet when on the go and iPadOS UI presents itself.

That would be nice. I can't imagine how much Apple would charge for a device like that. :eek:
 
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Agreed.

To be honest, my only gripe with the old style multitasking is the scrollable list just had these unnecessarily huge icons and there was no way to search for an app. Adding a search bar at the top and the option for different view modes (list, icon, app preview) with ability to pin/favorite apps in the app selection would've taken care of my gripes.

I really hate how right now, you pretty much need apps to be on the dock to be able to use them in split view. Also, it's not very obvious which apps support multitasking and which ones don't.
Yeah having to keep every app you might want to multitask with in the dock, or else having to exit out of an app you're using to fetch it is my biggest problem with how it works currently. I like the idea of a more compact grid (like an iPhone home screen) sliding out to let you choose! Not sure if it would work with slideover though?
 
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Yeah having to keep every app you might want to multitask with in the dock, or else having to exit out of an app you're using to fetch it is my biggest problem with how it works currently. I like the idea of a more compact grid (like an iPhone home screen) sliding out to let you choose! Not sure if it would work with slideover though?
Agreed, this is a problem. Anyone I know or have heard about that uses the iPad for heavier multitasking has all apps on the dock, like this:

ABC1FF90-D891-4D00-BF85-62E1FE78BC49.jpeg

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That would be nice. I can't imagine how much Apple would charge for a device like that. :eek:
I would gladly pay high end MBP prices for that device, no problem.
 
Yeah having to keep every app you might want to multitask with in the dock, or else having to exit out of an app you're using to fetch it is my biggest problem with how it works currently.
It sure was easier when I had a Smart Keyboard and could just CMD+space. But for now I just use put a folder with commonly used apps in my dock.

I wonder if adding a command key to the on-screen keyboard would work. Or maybe a gesture to pull up an app selection widget.
 
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It sure was easier when I had a Smart Keyboard and could just CMD+space. But for now I just use put a folder with commonly used apps in my dock.

I wonder if adding a command key to the on-screen keyboard would work. Or maybe a gesture to pull up an app selection widget.
Hmm, I wouldn't mind having a system generated "folder" on the dock which displays only and all multitasking-capable apps. Allow the option to display this shortcuts folder via Settings > Home Screen & Dock (> Multitasking). Or it could be made part of the Suggested and Recent Apps.

I do wish Apple would make better use of the larger displays and allow more than 16 apps per page on folders. Iirc, iOS 6 was able to display more than 16 on iPads.
 
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That's bad for discoverability
Discoverability for touch will likely never work like discoverability for mouse and keyboard. However, since some folks have problems using it, they could certainly add new features under “accessibility” to maybe help folks figure it out? What happens to the UI when you turn on Voice Over? Can you multitask?
I don’t think they are anymore intuitive.
And they’re not discoverable. If you don’t already know what “spreading your fingers” or “four fingers up” will do, there’s nothing to tell you unless you go looking in the tips.
 
If I four finger swipe on iPadOS I lose the window I'm currently in. For example, I'm in a terminal window changing configuration files on a server. I have two other servers in two other windows that I'm using as a reference (because the software is already installed and setup on those so I am bringing over common settings). On an iPad if I swipe over to another screen I lose the terminal session I'm in. On Windows, I can keep that same session active and focused while I move windows around.

I used an iPad as a primary device for 13 months. I finally stopped when my iPad exhibited the unresponsive touch issue and light bleed issue. At that time I moved to a 2-in-1 Windows machine. I would never look back. For me Windows provides such a better experience for actually getting things done. Their tablet mode sucks, for sure, but I only use that for casual surfing and ebooks; for those it works great.

I'm going to agree with the posters above who said that it doesn't appear Apple has a clear direction with iPad and/or its user interface. It changes every year and it's a mess. Gestures are simply not discoverable.
I can see your problem with your terminal windows. Quite different for my example. Is the problem iPadOS or the app?

I do agree that iPadOS is still in its exploratory phase, which can be frustrating.
 
Agreed, this is a problem. Anyone I know or have heard about that uses the iPad for heavier multitasking has all apps on the dock, like this:

View attachment 897420
[automerge]1583350436[/automerge]

I would gladly pay high end MBP prices for that device, no problem.
It's times like this that I wish iOS had an option for saving app layouts. The "chuck all your apps in dock folders" paradigm is something I have been flirting with from time to time, but I find I have never been able to wrap my brain around accessing everything via the dock, and when it's time to revert, I find it's a hassle to have to move all my apps back to where they were before.
 
Gruber recently linked to a Twitter thread/rant about iPad.


After reading these rants my takeaway is usually ‘Why don’t you just use a Mac?’. Also seems pretty clear this new keyboard was designed to make the iPad more laptop like so the criticism that it makes the iPad harder to be a tablet seems odd. Especially when reviews said it was easy to remove from the case/stand. More and more when I read these I feel like the iPad is just not for some people and that’s OK. It doesn’t have to be for everyone. It’s fine if John Gruber isn’t an iPad fan. It doesn’t mean the iPad is a bad product it means it’s not for him.
 
Rogifan, that is so very true. Those people ranting about the iPad and how it does not match the Mac, then just use the Mac as that is obviously the device for you. No one is forcing you to adapt to the iPad.

For real iPad users there is two sorts, those that use as a simple consumption device who have no use for multi screens, touch pad, etc. My wife is just such a person. She still uses the iPad exactly the same as when it first came out 10 years ago.

Then there are the people that are natural iPad Pro users, that use for real work and ‘prefer’ the touch screen experience and the General way iPadOS works over the Mac. I am in that camp. Those relish the split screen facility and the new magic keyboard as those add to the usefulness of the device, without taking away anything from the iPad experience.

I think it is genius that Apple have been able to make a device that makes both my wife and I happy although our uses are so different.
 
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Rogifan, that is so very true. Those people ranting about the iPad and how it does not match the Mac, then just use the Mac as that is obviously the device for you. No one is forcing you to adapt to the iPad.

For real iPad users there is two sorts, those that use as a simple consumption device who have no use for multi screens, touch pad, etc. My wife is just such a person. She still uses the iPad exactly the same as when it first came out 10 years ago.

Then there are the people that are natural iPad Pro users, that use for real work and ‘prefer’ the touch screen experience and the General way iPadOS works over the Mac. I am in that camp. Those relish the split screen facility and the new magic keyboard as those add to the usefulness of the device, without taking away anything from the iPad experience.

I think it is genius that Apple have been able to make a device that makes both my wife and I happy although our uses are so different.

I agree with you but I will just add a third group of users where I fall in. I don't use my iPad as a main consumption device (so not like your wife) but I also do not rely on my iPad to be my main computing device (as you). I have my Windows laptop and the laptop is my go to main device. That being said leisure travelling with 15.6 inch laptop sucks. I mean I don't need to do it. And this is where the iPad shines - for a week it is completely doable to use it. Pair it with keyboard and it is good enough laptop replacement for basic stuff that I would do during leisure travel. Now if it was business travel I would just grab with me my 14 inch company Windows laptop and be done with it.

Why do I have an iPad then? Apple Pencil support. Love to use the iPad as digital notebook for writing down stuff or for reading books and taking notes or annotating PDFs. Love the iPad for that. And yes it can be used for watching movies during trips and it can be used for simple browsing, posting in forums etc.

It is not the touch screen honestly as my company laptop has touch screen too. It is the pencil support that matters to me. Also Bluetooth latency sucks. I tried to pair the iPad with a Bluetooth mouse but scrolling is complete PITA so unfortunately I have to use the touchscreen with the keyboard and this is annoying. For a person that has to do in rare cases it is tolerable but if someone has to go through every day and they have the money I would say invest in the magic keyboard.
 
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I like using multi-tasking. However, the application of gestures to make it work is way too cumbersome/clunky and counter intuitive. For example, tapping a simple GUI button on an app panel when I want the panel to go from a floating state to side-by-side, or a button to make a panel disappear altogether would be a lot much more simple/straight forward than the pinch, slide, swipe gyrations necessary to get the desired screen orientation. And more intuitive too.

And in a larger sense, there has been way too much programming attention given to devising touch maneuvers that a more simple approach could readily accomplish.

I like using my iPad Pro for video, music listening, email, word processing, web surfing, messaging, PDF editing and minor photo editing. I also like using it for night sky searching/identification and some games.

What I don’t like (aside from the multitasking design):

I think the Apple TV concept, and to some degree the Music app, are terribly designed. Apple TV lacks a search function for my personal videos; the titles are truncated even on a 12.9 screen; and it lacks organizational tools to facilitate grouping of videos for faster access. Music makes the creation of a playlist akin to a visit to the dentist. And the design for lyrics plus shuffle/replay a failed attempt at making something more functional but instead making it more complex to figure out. Remember, this stuff is supposed to be intuitive.

Further, I don’t like using the iPad for more complex tasks such as more complex photo editing (eg photoshop/lightroom etc) and sound editing. Same with Numbers and Keynote. Putting together a spreadsheet via tapping etc. is awkward at best. These types of apps are much easier to use on a computer (laptop or desktop).

Lastly, I fail to see the usefulness of a mouse. I understand the concept and why it would be helpful. However, the application of such just doesn’t match the overall design flow of the OS. In other words, it too is clunky.

Overall, I think program design over the past 4 to 5 years, especially Apple apps for both macOS, iPadOS and IOS, has lost its way. The dumbing of the software has removed creative functionality in a broad attempt to appeal to the most basic of users. I can only imagine Steve Jobs shaking his head before going ballistic.
 
Rogifan, that is so very true. Those people ranting about the iPad and how it does not match the Mac, then just use the Mac as that is obviously the device for you. No one is forcing you to adapt to the iPad.

For real iPad users there is two sorts, those that use as a simple consumption device who have no use for multi screens, touch pad, etc. My wife is just such a person. She still uses the iPad exactly the same as when it first came out 10 years ago.

Then there are the people that are natural iPad Pro users, that use for real work and ‘prefer’ the touch screen experience and the General way iPadOS works over the Mac. I am in that camp. Those relish the split screen facility and the new magic keyboard as those add to the usefulness of the device, without taking away anything from the iPad experience.

I think it is genius that Apple have been able to make a device that makes both my wife and I happy although our uses are so different.

There are far more than two types of iPad users, as each and every user has their own needs, wants and preferences. Just read these forums and you'll see it filled with people love their iPads but feel restricted by some of the limitations in iPadOS who clearly fall between your two user types. Some or all of these limitations can easily be fixed by Apple and honestly the "just go use a Mac argument" is kind of stale at this point. I can't tell you how many times I read comments like that here when people discussed how mouse support would NEVER come to the iPad because it would ruin the touch experience. Yet here we are.

I like the convenience of detaching my 11 and 12.9 iPads from their keyboards when I want to use them as consumption devices. I love using them with the keyboard as productivity devices. The new keyboard is great, but in typical Apple fashion leaves saying we really like it, but.... why does it cost so much? Where is the escape key? Where are the function keys? Why can't I tilt it back more? Why can't I flip it all the way around like the previous keyboard? I knew all those limitations when I bought yet bought it anyway because the trackpad is so awesome. That doesn't mean it can't be better. Same with all kinds of things in iPadOS (files app, clunky multitasking and on and on).

It's great you are happy with your iPad - I'm happy with mine too. But that doesn't mean it couldn't be a lot better...
 
There are far more than two types of iPad users, as each and every user has their own needs, wants and preferences. Just read these forums and you'll see it filled with people love their iPads but feel restricted by some of the limitations in iPadOS who clearly fall between your two user types. Some or all of these limitations can easily be fixed by Apple and honestly the "just go use a Mac argument" is kind of stale at this point. I can't tell you how many times I read comments like that here when people discussed how mouse support would NEVER come to the iPad because it would ruin the touch experience. Yet here we are.

I like the convenience of detaching my 11 and 12.9 iPads from their keyboards when I want to use them as consumption devices. I love using them with the keyboard as productivity devices. The new keyboard is great, but in typical Apple fashion leaves saying we really like it, but.... why does it cost so much? Where is the escape key? Where are the function keys? Why can't I tilt it back more? Why can't I flip it all the way around like the previous keyboard? I knew all those limitations when I bought yet bought it anyway because the trackpad is so awesome. That doesn't mean it can't be better. Same with all kinds of things in iPadOS (files app, clunky multitasking and on and on).

It's great you are happy with your iPad - I'm happy with mine too. But that doesn't mean it couldn't be a lot better...
To be clear I’m not arguing iPad/iPadOS is perfect. But I guess I’m just partial to criticism from people who use iPad as their main computing device. How much time would Gruber spend with the iPad (outside of consumption) if he didn’t have to review it for his blog?

Having said that I still think Apple needs to be more clear on what the iPad is for compared to what the Mac is for. Why are they separate devices with different operating systems? If someone asked Phil Schiller if they should buy a 12.9” iPad Pro or a 13” MBP what would he say? What questions would he ask?
 
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The idea that the ipad --with gestures --is more productive than keyboard driven apps is dying. I use my ipad for illustration and animation. For serious work, I always use keyboard commands. Ios apps are evolving to become more discoverable--ironically--more traditionally menu driven. Cute ideas like 3 finger cut and paste in Procreate simply don't get the job done.

True. iPad was nice for quick sketch and initial idea, but my final execution are always on my large Cintiq. Even it have gestures support, I am disabling it for in favor nimble, quicker handy keyboard shortcut.
 
FWIW, Gruber loves the Magic Keyboard and the way Apple has implemented cursor support.

I’ll be honest, I’m even finding multi-tasking much more natural with the trackpad. The UI still isn’t perfect, but the actions to invoke multitasking seem more natural to me with the trackpad.
 
I get so frustrated when I try to cut with a fork but oftentimes its not as good as a knife. I then go onto the internet and express how my fork isn’t as good in some circumstances as my knife, so that other people can better understand my frustrations.
 
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I would say for people to use what they are most comfortable for their uses. I love the iPad Pro and get frustrated when I have to use a Mac, but I know other people have the reverse opinion which is fine. Whatever suits your use case.

I don’t know if it is just me, but I find the iPad so much quicker to respond. An example. I was on my iMac yesterday and got an email with a meeting which I clicked to put in calendar to just to get the dreaded spinning beach ball - after 10 seconds I got fed up with waiting, went to my iPad Pro, found the email and clicked link there to get instantaneous response to put in calendar. I had finished the process on my iPad before the spinning wheel had stopped on the Mac! I previously thought this sort of thing might be software problem on Mac, but this problem still persists after fresh install and is exactly the same on my MacBook too.
 
I would say for people to use what they are most comfortable for their uses. I love the iPad Pro and get frustrated when I have to use a Mac, but I know other people have the reverse opinion which is fine. Whatever suits your use case.

I don’t know if it is just me, but I find the iPad so much quicker to respond. An example. I was on my iMac yesterday and got an email with a meeting which I clicked to put in calendar to just to get the dreaded spinning beach ball - after 10 seconds I got fed up with waiting, went to my iPad Pro, found the email and clicked link there to get instantaneous response to put in calendar. I had finished the process on my iPad before the spinning wheel had stopped on the Mac! I previously thought this sort of thing might be software problem on Mac, but this problem still persists after fresh install and is exactly the same on my MacBook too.

Interesting what email client are you using? I mean is it Apple email client or say Outlook or something else.

In general my laptops (both persona one and company one) are faster to respond to my iPad but have in mind that I use mostly Microsof apps at work and I do not think that Microsoft apps are optimized on iOS. In terms of personal laptop I use it mostly for browsing in net and watching movies and I kind of tend to have lots of open tabs. Because of the iPad reloading issues in the end I am faster and more efficient on my laptop than on my iPad. As for movies well in general it is quicker to open a movie file from a folder on a laptop than on a computer. So for the things I do both on laptop and iPad the laptop is faster.

That being said there are certain things I do only on the iPad so I cannot compare - like sending articles to Notability and arrange photos in movies in iMovie. Or color in Procreate.
 
The iPad is such a great tablet, and iPadOS is really a great touch first operating system. If you use your iPad strictly as a tablet plus Apple Pencil, you will not be disappointed. If you want to use your iPad as a laptop, that's fine. But, you are going to experience some compromise, and likely some frustration. Why? Because you are using trackpad and keyboard input with an operating system designed around touch. It's ok if you can manage the challenges, but it will not be as effective as using a trackpad and keyboard on a device (laptop) designed specifically for that form of input. This is logical right.

You would not expect a Prius to be as good at hauling lumber as an F-150 pickup. You wouldn't expect an F-150 pickup to be as good of a commute car as a Prius. So, in the end, the vehicle you purchase will depend on how often you commute vs haul lumber. Obviously, if you only need a large pickup bed once a year, it doesn't make much sense to drive one to work and around town....burning gas, fitting into tight parking, etc..
 
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The iPad is such a great tablet, and iPadOS is really a great touch first operating system. If you use your iPad strictly as a tablet plus Apple Pencil, you will not be disappointed. If you want to use your iPad as a laptop, that's fine. But, you are going to experience some compromise, and likely some frustration. Why? Because you are using trackpad and keyboard input with an operating system designed around touch. It's ok if you can manage the challenges, but it will not be as effective as using a trackpad and keyboard on a device (laptop) designed specifically for that form of input. This is logical right.

You would not expect a Prius to be as good at hauling lumber as an F-150 pickup. You wouldn't expect an F-150 pickup to be as good of a commute car as a Prius.

A tablet and a laptop are two different devices, but that does not mean there isn’t room for improvement in the tablet. There are a LOT of shortcomings Apple can address to improve iPadOS without compromising the touch based portion of it. The hardware is quite powerful and far, far ahead of the software.
 
The iPad is such a great tablet, and iPadOS is really a great touch first operating system. If you use your iPad strictly as a tablet plus Apple Pencil, you will not be disappointed. If you want to use your iPad as a laptop, that's fine. But, you are going to experience some compromise, and likely some frustration. Why? Because you are using trackpad and keyboard input with an operating system designed around touch. It's ok if you can manage the challenges, but it will not be as effective as using a trackpad and keyboard on a device (laptop) designed specifically for that form of input. This is logical right.

You would not expect a Prius to be as good at hauling lumber as an F-150 pickup. You wouldn't expect an F-150 pickup to be as good of a commute car as a Prius. So, in the end, the vehicle you purchase will depend on how often you commute vs haul lumber. Obviously, if you only need a large pickup bed once a year, it doesn't make much sense to drive one to work and around town....burning gas, fitting into tight parking, etc..

I don't think your analogy applies with the iPad as a laptop. For me, I use it both.. as a tablet and a "laptop." And using it as a laptop allows allows me to address certain things I couldn't do as a effective on a tablet. For instance, typing. Now, I can understand... the argument against mouse input compared to touch input. And I agree, the iPad is a touch first operating system.

But I've been using Magic Mouse 2 for awhile now.. it's a different experience. And I welcome it. I just don't agree with it being a challenge to use. It's not challenging at all, for me. I can't speak for everyone.... but I don't get any frustration. When I'm at the desk... I use it as a "laptop." And I can pick it up and use it as a tablet whenever I see fit.
 
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