M1 Bootable Backups!

[SuperMatt]

I saw that SuperDuper now supports bootable backups in Big Sur for Intel and M1 Macs! Please note; this is beta software AND the bootable backup feature on M1 Macs requires the Big Sur 11.4 beta.

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[Ben J.]

That's great to hear.
I use Carbon Copy Cloner, and they say they can't do this until Apple makes it possible. To make bootable clones on M1.
Good news.

 

[Apple_Robert]

That's great to hear.
I use Carbon Copy Cloner, and they say they can't do this until Apple makes it possible. To make bootable clones on M1.
Good news.

What CCC has on their website is old.

From the OP link:

"To be clear, this is only possible because Apple made it possible in macOS 11.4. I'm certain it required changes to the M1's startup process and to asr to finally make it happen. Without those changes, we couldn't have done this in a supported way."

I expect we will see something from CCC before too long.

 

[Ben J.]

Thanks.
I DID read the OP thoroughly and I see that this has to do with macos updating.

I actually corresponded with Mike at Bombich today, got very good support with my spesific problem, and he said that they were waiting for Apples response to their request for a fix to this whole "systemvolume-cloning-problem" (my "wording").

 

[Apple_Robert]

Thanks.
I DID read the OP thoroughly and I see that this has to do with macos updating.

I actually corresponded with Mike at Bombich today, got very good support with my spesific problem, and he said that they were waiting for Apples response to their request for a fix to this whole "systemvolume-cloning-problem" (my "wording").

Thank you for the update. I hope we see CCC ver. 6 soon. It is already in beta 3.

 

[Mike Boreham]

Thank you for the update. I hope we see CCC ver. 6 soon. It is already in beta 3.

I thought I was getting all CCC betas (beta update setting is on) but the latest version for me is 5.1.26

This is a release version, recently updated from 5.1.26 b4.

Are you getting CCC 6 betas?

 

[Mike Boreham]

I thought I was getting all CCC betas (beta update setting is on) but the latest version for me is 5.1.26

This is a release version, recently updated from 5.1.26 b4.

Are you getting CCC 6 betas?

Although I keep testing bootable backups I don't need them or like them.... I just like the challenge! When I boot to a clone there is so much re-signing in, re-synchronising, re-setting up etc that it is anything but being up and running in five minutes for me. And booting from a clone would only ever (for me) be a temporary solution. If possible I would always erase reinstall and migrate from a Data-only clone.

Also I have recently understood what I had read before here. This largely went over my head at the time but the bottom line has been spelled out very clearly in the latest update to Take Control of your M-Series Mac...that M1 Macs will not boot from an external if the internal drive has failed. Removing one of the use cases for bootable clones.

I heartily recommend the Take Control of M Series Mac.....it joined up a lot of dots for me.

 

[haralds]

I just converted a CCC data-only clone to bootable for emergency purposes - when you have it you never need it!
I used a USB-A dock for a WD Elements USB3 drive for the install. I booted to Recovery and reinstalled targeting the Data volume. I let that trundle overnight. It was booted the next morning.
What became evident is that at least for the first initialization spinning disks (a WD Elements) are WAY too slow for use. I was able to boot and initialize the system, but it took forever. When I had validated that it was possible to boot the clone for emergency repairs, I opened terminal to shut things down, which took another 5 min. The Finder never got out of spinning beach balls “validating” apps. Since I would continue to clone to the Data disk, I figured that this validation would be repeated if I ever needed to boot from the clone again. No point in leaving that to play out.
After rebooting the system went to Recovery and I had to validate the disk (log in) before I could actually boot.
The days of easily booting between different disks and systems are clearly over.
I have a beta of CCC v6, but it does not yet support system clones on M1.

 

[Mike Boreham]

I have a beta of CCC v6, but it does not yet support system clones on M1.

Thanks for the account....how did you get a beta of CCC ver 6?

 

[Apple_Robert]

Thanks for the account....how did you get a beta of CCC ver 6?

If a beta slot is available on the new beta release, a window will pop up highlighting the latest beta release features and offering a download button. I got the window twice last week and neglected to download right away. When I tried a third time, I didn't get the beta window anymore.

 

[Mike Boreham]

If a beta slot is available on the new beta release, a window will pop up highlighting the latest beta release features and offering a download button. I got the window twice last week and neglected to download right away. When I tried a third time, I didn't get the beta window anymore.

Thanks for this info. I got it last night and it is still available this morning.

Very impressed! Very fast (even when not using ASR). Major interface changes. I have done two bootable clone tests, one to a TB3 destination and one to USB (Sam T5), Both worked.

 

[Apple_Robert]

Thanks for this info. I got it last night and it is still available this morning.

Very impressed! Very fast (even when not using ASR). Major interface changes. I have done two bootable clone tests, one to a TB3 destination and one to USB (Sam T5), Both worked.

That is great news. If the beta is still available when I get home, I will install it. For some reason, my remote connection isn’t working at the moment.

 

[Fishrrman]

Very good to see this.
And Kudos to SuperDuper -- they "beat CCC" in achieving this goal first...!

 

[Apple_Robert]

I got the beta installed as well. Looks like 1 month until the final release and you can purchase CCC6.

 

[SuperMatt]

I see people talking about Carbon Copy Cloner betas. Does their latest beta also support M1 bootable backups? If not, please mention that. The point of this thread is M1 bootable backups. I feel the talk of the CCC betas without saying whether those betas support M1 bootable backups is muddying the waters.

Note: I saw one poster say bootable M1 backups were not supported on a specific beta version... but the further discussion made it sound like people are now on newer beta versions, which is why I ask.

 

[haralds]

Thanks for the account....how did you get a beta of CCC ver 6?

It's described on one of the CCC support pages. You need to have your system set up to allow booting from external drives. After doing the CCC clone boot into recovery and select the option to reinstall. Follow the prompts to install on the external drive selecting the data partition. Your Mac will download the installer and do the right thing.

 

[Rodan52]

Downloaded CCC 6.0 b-4 today. Big changes to UI including Dark Mode.
To upgrade simply go to CCC preferences and tick the box in Updates tab to Inform me of Beta releases, then check for updates. You will then get the instructions for download.

 

[SuperMatt]

Reminder: this thread is in the Apple Silicon (Arm) Macs forum, and is about bootable backups on the M1 Macs. This can be about CCC, SuperDuper, or any other software that does it or about their future plans to do it. Tangents are expected within reason, but it seems like this thread has diverged from the M1 aspect of things.

Let us try to remember what forum and thread we are in, and let’s keep things on the topic at hand.

With that said, SuperDuper’s makers have released a new beta and explain the M1 bootable backup a bit more here:

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www.shirtpocket.com

Of note:

• Some users were confused by the macOS 11.4 Beta requirements. 11.4 is only required for M1 Macs. Intel Macs work fine with SuperDuper under all versions of Big Sur.
• Startup volumes will often not show up in the Startup Disk Preference Pane in System Preferences under Big Sur. This does not mean the drive isn't bootable—it's a weird bug in Big Sur.
  
  To start up from the backup, use Option+Power On on an Intel Mac, or hold down the Power button when powering on with an M1 Mac.
  
  If you do this, you'll note that the Mac's regular drive doesn't appear in the startup disk preference pane...but the backup drive does! It's weird. But the backup is OK! You can breathe!

 

[Mike Boreham]

It's described on one of the CCC support pages. You need to have your system set up to allow booting from external drives. After doing the CCC clone boot into recovery and select the option to reinstall. Follow the prompts to install on the external drive selecting the data partition. Your Mac will download the installer and do the right thing.

Thanks...I was actually just asking how you got the CCC version 6 beta app.....which I have since done from "Check for updates" with "inform me of beta releases" enabled.

I have a beta of CCC v6, but it does not yet support system clones on M1.

CCC version 6 does support bootable clones on M1. It has worked for me in three tests. You have to us the LBBA option described here.

 

[Mike Boreham]

CCC version 6 does support bootable clones on M1. It has worked for me in three tests. You have to us the LBBA option described here.

It is interesting from that link above that CCC version 6 is designed so that the default Standard backups are Data volume only. Bootable backups are somewhat hidden in the LBBA by double click on the Destination selector.

My hunch is that Mike Bombich sees the way things are headed, and the fact that M1 Macs can't boot from a clone if the internal drive has failed further reduces the use cases for bootable backups.

 

[grahamwright1]

I've always liked the idea of a bootable backup, and have used SuperDuper for years now, but these problems with the asr utility that CCC and SuperDuper have encountered has made me realize that I'm fine with just a good data backup. As long as the user data is safely backed up then I'm getting comfortable with the idea of a network based OS install / recovery.

I do feel sorry for the non-technical users who regularly ask why they need to have a second and third copy of their data on external disks

 

[jdb8167]

I've always liked the idea of a bootable backup, and have used SuperDuper for years now, but these problems with the asr utility that CCC and SuperDuper have encountered has made me realize that I'm fine with just a good data backup. As long as the user data is safely backed up then I'm getting comfortable with the idea of a network based OS install / recovery.

I do feel sorry for the non-technical users who regularly ask why they need to have a second and third copy of their data on external disks

I have a Time Capsule backup. I have a Backblaze backup. I have two external disks that I rotate as backups. And I store everything important in iCloud anyway. I'm still worried about losing stuff

 

[haralds]

I just ran into the situation on a Catalina machine where I realized the Security update would not be replicated. I think it might not be worth the trouble and just easier to have a data disk to migrate in the rare event of a disaster.

 

[Rodan52]

I think we are all coming, albeit slowly, to the realisation that the convenient, bootable clone backup is a thing of the past.
I remember my wife running her 2011 MBP for about three weeks from her CCC clone while awaiting delivery of a new HD after her old HDD died. When it arrived and was installed we formatted from DU on the clone then reverse cloned the CCC backup onto the new SSD. All back to normal in a few hours.🤥. Never again I fear.

 

[Kung gu]

I think we are all coming, albeit slowly, to the realisation that the convenient, bootable clone backup is a thing of the past.
I remember my wife running her 2011 MBP for about three weeks from her CCC clone while awaiting delivery of a new HD after her old HDD died. When it arrived and was installed we formatted from DU on the clone then reverse cloned the CCC backup onto the new SSD. All back to normal in a few hours.🤥. Never again I fear.

superduper supports bootable backups from 11.4