Mac mini 2013/2014 refresh.

[MJL]

No Mac mini design ever had heat issues. I'm having several models, including the original one from 2004 and the 2011 model. Every single one runs cool. .

The 2011 and 21012 are NOT running cool, 98 C under load is not cool. Perhaps if you only browse the web then it is running "cool" but to me cool is below 65 C at maximum load.

And do not start spouting that the Apple engineers know what they are doing - just check out what the maximum temperature is for the CMOS battery or for the memory or SSD for that matter and then you'll see that they are not designed to be used at 98C.

 

[metsjetsfan]

The 2011 and 21012 are NOT running cool, 98 C under load is not cool. Perhaps if you only browse the web then it is running "cool" but to me cool is below 65 C at maximum load.

And do not start spouting that the Apple engineers know what they are doing - just check out what the maximum temperature is for the CMOS battery or for the memory or SSD for that matter and then you'll see that they are not designed to be used at 98C.

good point, is Haswell reported to run cooler? What have been the readings on the new 2013 MBAs

 

[mayuka]

The 2011 and 21012 are NOT running cool, 98 C under load is not cool.

My temperature never exceeds 85°C while under full load. Maybe you're doing something wrong or have blocked the fans. The temperature is well within specs, however. Otherwise, you Mac would simply shut down. Then you should be worried.

@metsjetsfan: Not really. It depends which Haswell Apple decides to use. They are designed to nearly the same TDP.

 

[mcarling]

I agree that there is a high chance of that the form factor becomes like the Airport Extreme and Time Capsule. It makes sense for cooling, imho the current form factor has heat issues and the Mac Pro design has advantages for the cooling whilst being cheaper to manufacture than the present enclosure.

For permanent storage there is no need to stick to the 2.5" form factor, the internals are shrinking by the day, and I can it see becoming it obsolete within a few years.

The new Airport Extreme / Time Capsule enclosure accommodates a 3.5" disk drive.

I bet it's just a CPU and chipset upgrade with Thunderbolt 2.

The chances of any Mini introduced in the next six months having Thunderbolt 2 is exactly 0.0%. Why? The Lynx Point chipsets for Haswell do not support Thunderbolt 2, but do include two original Thunderbolt ports. The Mac Pro will support Thunderbolt 2 with a (not yet available) expensive discrete chip that will certainly not go into the Mini. The soonest a Mini might have Thunderbolt 2 support is mid- to late-2014 when Intel will include Thunderbolt 2 support in their chipsets.

My temperature never exceeds 85°C while under full load. Maybe you're doing something wrong or have blocked the fans.

Ambient room temperature also has a big effect on chip temperature.

 

[mayuka]

Ambient room temperature also has a big effect on chip temperature.

During the last days, ambient temperature was around 32°C here. These are not particularly cool conditions...

I noticed that the hdd has an important influence on overall temperature inside. Some older Hitachi (now Western Digital) drives are known to be very hot (60-70°C). The stock Toshiba drives are way cooler (but louder too). In the 2011 model I'm using a Samsung 830 SSD in the main slot and the stock Toshiba 500 GB drive in the other slot. On normal usage temperature is about 56°C and 2000 rpm exhaust fan. On max. usage (preparing a movie with Final Cut) it is 87°C at current conditions. My 2007 model (2.0 GHz C2D) (with 10.7) runs at 90°C +-2°C at max by the way.

The surface on which the Mac mini stands is also important. You should consider that too.

 

[blanka]

My Mini 2011 Radeon never tops 70, even not in the summer now, room temp touching 30C and ambient air saying 46°C on temp monitor app.

 

[calvol]

My 2011 2.5 dual-core with ATI gpu runs about 80C doing video encoding. Prior to that, I had a 2012 2.6 quad-core with HD4000, and that thing ran HOT, about 103C doing an OpenGL test-- I returned it, and bought the 2011.

 

[henry72]

Some people think Apple might drop the ethernet port, but I don't think so simply because the new iMac released last year still has an ethernet port. Either way, I don't care but this is how I look at future Apple products.

However, I can definitely see the Firewire 800 is going and possibly one more Thunderbolt port.

 

[Edge]

My prediction is that the new Mini will share the form factor of the new Airport Extreme and Time Capsule.

Wouldn't surprise me. Could even be half way in between the AppleTV and the Airport form factor. Cheaper to manufacture, better cooling. Attached is my rough mockup.

The new form factor would make it impossible to install two HDDs, but it would still be possible to install one HDD plus one SSD.

Just like the iMacs with the new PCI-E SSD form factor, and with easier replacement of a 2.5" drive.

 

[karsten]

Wouldn't surprise me. Could even be half way in between the AppleTV and the Airport form factor. Cheaper to manufacture, better cooling. Attached is my rough mockup.



Just like the iMacs with the new PCI-E SSD form factor, and with easier replacement of a 2.5" drive.

that's freaking sweet, instant buy here if it's anywhere near that

 

[mcarling]

Could even be half way in between the AppleTV and the Airport form factor. Cheaper to manufacture, better cooling.

It would be cheaper to manufacture one size case for all three product lines: Airport Extreme, Mac Mini, and Time Capsule.

 

[CraigJ]

I can because:

1) if you connect to a thunderbolt display you get it that way.
2) If you replace it with an additional thunderbolt port you still have the ability to have wired internet and have additional flexibility.
3) 802.11ac (for those who have it) eliminates the speed advantage
4) most people connect wirelessly anyway
5) Apple has always shown itself willing to push people away from tech it considers dying, especially when it can give them extra sales.

To wit:

1) As the Mini, Pro and rMBP were revamped/introduced, they dropped the optical drive.
2) They dropped firewire from the Pro and left it of the rMBP
3) they left Ethernet off the rMBP.

I'm not saying it's definite, of course, but it could easily happen

Not only should they not drop Ethernet, they should update all the desktop machines to support 10GbE

 

[rnauman821]

Not only should they not drop Ethernet, they should update all the desktop machines to support 10GbE

That would be pretty pointless with the cost of 10gbps switches.

 

[thogin]

I'll throw in the usual comment that I hope Apple puts the SD card slot on the front this time.

 

[COrocket]

I'll throw in the usual comment that I hope Apple puts the SD card slot on the front this time.

And a USB port or 2 while they are at it...

 

[Cape Dave]

easier to replace 2.5 inch drive. YES!

 

[calaverasgrande]

because it's REMOVABLE media

I'll throw in the usual comment that I hope Apple puts the SD card slot on the front this time.

It really is the most petty thing.
Ditto for the iMacs with the SD slot on the back.
What the?

I'm also thinking they could potentially lose one of each type of jack they have on the current Mini.
- audio in
- firewire
- HDMI
- USB

if they were really going for the gusto then they could lose the ethernet as well.
Assuming an SSD drive on PCIe maybe we could see an Airport-esque deign.

I hope none of that happens and we get a black cased box similar to the current mini but with the SD slot front and center.

 

[hudson1]

It would be cheaper to manufacture one size case for all three product lines: Airport Extreme, Mac Mini, and Time Capsule.

Really depends on how many of each are being produced. My hunch is the fixed costs generated solely from the form factor are smaller on a per unit basis than the unit variable cost increase from putting a mini, AE, or TC in a new MacPro case. As I said, just a hunch.

 

[Count Blah]

My temperature never exceeds 85°C while under full load. Maybe you're doing something wrong or have blocked the fans. The temperature is well within specs, however. Otherwise, you Mac would simply shut down. Then you should be worried.

@metsjetsfan: Not really. It depends which Haswell Apple decides to use. They are designed to nearly the same TDP.

Or maybe his mini's CPU got the poor quality thermal paste job. Not EVERYTHING is to be blamed on the end user

 

[spda242]

My 2011 2.5 dual-core with ATI gpu runs about 80C doing video encoding. Prior to that, I had a 2012 2.6 quad-core with HD4000, and that thing ran HOT, about 103C doing an OpenGL test-- I returned it, and bought the 2011.

My 2011 (AMD GPU) usually has a temp between 80-92C.
What I hate most are that some light surfin' and jumping between Windows with Mission Control causes the CPU temp to skyrocket which causes the fan goes haywire and then it feels like the system throttles the CPU since everything just seem to stop...

When I build my own machines (Windows Systems for Gaming) I usually don't mess with overclock etc but I make sure that the system is cool and quiet under load. If I remember correct my current system usually have a temp of <45C (CPU/MB) and ~60-70C for the GPU and this is a 3570K/GTX670 in a "quite small" Prodigy case with Noctua fans.

For me, Operating Temperature of the 2013 Mac mini are the most important "feature", if it is as horrible as my 2011 which probably will be the case looking at Haswell from a general perspective I only see two options, ditching Mac/OSX or go Hack and live with whatever problem that causes.
I just wish Apple would make a real desktop machine that would fit somewhere between the mini and the new Pro.

 

[Cape Dave]

Just raise the current mini a quarter inch and use all the space for better cooling. Job done!

 

[MJL]

My 2011 (AMD GPU) usually has a temp between 80-92C.
What I hate most are that some light surfin' and jumping between Windows with Mission Control causes the CPU temp to skyrocket which causes the fan goes haywire and then it feels like the system throttles the CPU since everything just seem to stop...

When I build my own machines (Windows Systems for Gaming) I usually don't mess with overclock etc but I make sure that the system is cool and quiet under load. If I remember correct my current system usually have a temp of <45C (CPU/MB) and ~60-70C for the GPU and this is a 3570K/GTX670 in a "quite small" Prodigy case with Noctua fans.

For me, Operating Temperature of the 2013 Mac mini are the most important "feature", if it is as horrible as my 2011 which probably will be the case looking at Haswell from a general perspective I only see two options, ditching Mac/OSX or go Hack and live with whatever problem that causes.
I just wish Apple would make a real desktop machine that would fit somewhere between the mini and the new Pro.

+1

I ditched that machine for an older 2010 Server, later got the base 2011 model and added a SSD that was pulled from a MacBook.

Did lots of experimenting - easier ventilation, better thermal compound but nothing made a lot of difference. You can increase the idle speed to approx. 2200 which alleviates the issue somewhat. Biggest impact was turning the Mac Mini upside down - in the normal position the hot air rises to the top of the enclosure and does not easily get removed and the aluminum housing does not loose its heat fast enough. When upside down the hottest air is at the bottom plate where the fan intake sits.

Some reckon put it on its side but I never tried that.

 

[mayuka]

Wouldn't surprise me. Could even be half way in between the AppleTV and the Airport form factor. Cheaper to manufacture, better cooling. Attached is my rough mockup.

Urgs. That looks so plasticee... I hope you're wrong. (Good mockup by the way.)

 

[MJL]

Have just been looking at the teardown of the time machine and airport and if I take a look at what's in store for the new Mac Pro then I fear (!) that Mr Ive has taken a shine to the new form factor which then has to be propagated to everything else. So yes, I rate the chance at more than 50% that it will have a new form factor. There are at least two advantages that I can see: better cooling and better WiFi / Bluetooth performance but I still hate that form factor.

I can also see the re-use of the power supply currently in the time machine and airport: according to the information of the teardown it is 5A @ 12V which can be just enough (!) for the Haswell processor.

 

[Mr. Retrofire]

I can also see the re-use of the power supply currently in the time machine and airport: according to the information of the teardown it is 5A @ 12V which can be just enough (!) for the Haswell processor.

I doubt that.

The Mac mini 2012 has a 12 V/7.1 A (≈ 85 W) power supply:
http://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net/igi/GDHcnEiKtSf4nGhX.huge

The Mac mini 2011 had a similar ≈ 85 W power supply:
http://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net/igi/HubvGgpDbWGZCMLu.huge

Each USB 3.0 port needs 4.5 W (5 V/0.9 A) for external devices, which means that the USB external device support needs at least 18 additional Watts. And let us not forget Thunderbolt, which needs 10 W for external devices (10 W per TB port).

Cooling, WiFi and other components need also additional Watts. And let us not forget, that no component in a computer reaches 100 percent efficiency.

Sixty Watts is like two hot & young woman at the end of a very cold day. Unrealistic.