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Mac Quality

petermcphee said:
I really like the iMac "chiclet" style keyboard. The keys are less "chunky" than comparable PC keyboards I've used, and the aluminum accents class it up.

BTW, this post should be taken with a grain of salt because I am also a guy who actually "likes" the Apple Mighty Mouse. :)
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+1

I agree on both. I LOVED the chiclet style on the MB, compared to every other laptop keyboard, and the iMac is just like that. The iMac is a little farther spaced, but it's a LOT easier than this crappy Dell keyboard I'm on at work. All the keys stick, and the spacebar only works 1/4 of the time. The mouse is also crap too. It doesn't click unless it wants to. The iMac keyboard is SO much nicer. I don't like the new slim keyboard, but that's because I used 10 key all the time. Not having it on my laptop almost killed me. (I type numbers all day at work, so it's some of the only keys I use. Either way, I don't think Apple's quality is anything to complain about. Have you seen the quality of PCs? Ugh. I hate 'em.
 
Man, I have Macs from 2000 and I can tell you the quality is still the same.


G4 Cube DIED.

G4 iBook keyboard smells like BO (google this)

iMac 17" w/ stand first gen power supply fail plus loud fans

Powerbook G4 15" memory slot crapped out

not my Powerbook G4 15" but my colleague monitor developed white patches on the screen. known issue but the blind bloke didn't even realize it until a year after the extended warranty on that expired.

macbook white developed a nice crack.


So really nothing has changed over the last 9 years. it's hit or miss.
 
imfrog2002 said:
Either way, I don't think Apple's quality is anything to complain about. Have you seen the quality of PCs? Ugh. I hate 'em.
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That would be hard to dispute, except that the folks in Cupertino charge way more than the PC brands do, don't they? Apple has consistently touted and marketed their products in a totally different price point and niche.

High standards are expected to be met.
 
kabunaru said:
Macs are great quality. You just got a bad batch of Macs.
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This seems to be the standard Apple quality defense. I think I even read on a thread here where someone posted, after reading about the OP's multiple hardware problems and replacements, that the store he/she was going to just got a "bad batch." That one cracked me up.

I have a lot of great things to say about my computer. Reliable isn't one of them. The quality of Mac's is all in the image, use, and design.
 
MTI said:
That would be hard to dispute, except that the folks in Cupertino charge way more than the PC brands do, don't they? Apple has consistently touted and marketed their products in a totally different price point and niche.

High standards are expected to be met.
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True, but how much less time is spent figuring out issues? I've saved at least 20 minutes a day. My PC at work has me tied up at least 10-20mins each day with an issue. The iMac, maybe 1-5 minutes. The iMac is cheaper if you add in all the Advil that I need for the headaches of Windows... ;)
 
The quality of apple iMac displays has definitely declined. The panel on my 2006 20" white iMac is just as good as the cinema display I used at work.

My new 24" imac is brighter on the left than the right, with a warmer tint in the middle. There's also a bit of backlight bleed bottom left (none at all on my old iMac). Not really good enough for for colour critical jobs; and from what I've been reading the alu iMac's are all the same, so there's no point in exchanging it.

A Mac Pro is more powerful than I need, and can afford, the iMac isn't pro enough. Designers used to be Apple's core market; I guess it's now the iPod crowd.
 
kabunaru said:
Macs are great quality. You just got a bad batch of Macs.
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Same could be said of PCs. Note that I'm referring to hardware, not OS's. Apple has had it's share of exploding batteries, pirated formula capcitors, dead pixels and the like.

Now here's an interesting thought that iMac owners think about all the time . . . If you're going to build the monitor into the device . . . wouldn't you want to be sure it was the most bulletproof part of the system? Ram you can replace, hard drives and optical drives can be replaced . . . but when that LCD panel starts to display lines and grey patches . . . then what? I know, I know . . . you buy a new one . . .

There are presently two lawsuits in California regarding the iMac LCD display failures, a lawsuit about a 2nd Gen Touch exploding in a kids pants causing burns, and settlements in the "millions of colors" and nano scratching suits.

The sad part of all the "dead" iMacs these days . . . can't make a decent aquarium out of them like you could before.
 
panzer06 said:
The larger issue is the general deterioration of QC throughout the manufacturing sector. From clothes to computers and TVs, many manufacturers have done a poor job maintaining acceptable levels of quality in the products they sell.

Every one really needs to remember that all mass-produced products are subject to inconsistencies in materials, poor manufacturing equipment maintenance, worker apathy and any other random issue that may impact quality.

While millions of Apple customers receive great products in perfect working order, somebody is going to end up with one of those less than perfect machines. The rush to find the lowest cost manufacturing facilities for any given product has exacerbated the problem. Even so-called luxury brands have succumbed to this rush to cut cost and increase margins. Quality suffers but not enough to force more stringent QC.

In many cases companies believe it is simply less expensive to deal with the complaints and service issues than to reduce defects by x%. We would like to believe the numbers are there to back up such behavior, however, it is more likely the brand name company (in this case Apple) just doesn't make the effort to provide stringent oversight of the company or companies performing the actual manufacturing.

"Just good enough" is the watch phrase these days and if you're one of the unfortunate who happen to get a unit that's not so "good enough", better have bought that extended service plan.

Outsourcing may have brought better jobs to a wider variety people across the globe and lower prices to the consumer nations but in many cases accountability has suffered, impacting not just quality of goods produced but the treatment of workers, land use and environmental impact.

It's sad, It's not right, but it's the world we live in. :(

Cheers,
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amen to that. I think we might start seeing some of the manufacturing jobs that were outsourced coming back home. Take demming's 14 points for example, if we only would have listened back in the day, maybe we wouldn't be talking about this stuff now!
 
You are consolidating all the various levels of quality together which I don't think is a good measure.

1) I agree build quality has continually worsened since Apple stopped manufacturing their own produce. All of Apple's products now are contracted out to the same companies that produce electronics for Dell, Sony, HP, and other major companies. Given that Apple's build quality, while not what it once was is on par with PC. You can't expect anything better.

2) Design quality for Apple products has actually improved over the past 15 years. Products look unique, sleek, and desirable. Today's Macs are the most user upgradable Apple has ever produced.

3) Materials quality for the most part is excellent. Only Apple uses high end Aluminum across its entire line. The plastics Apple uses are also many notches above what you'd find on PCs.

4) Accessories have taken a back seat as all companies try to preserve margins. The headphones in iPods are included to say it's "ready to go." Reality is most who object to the crappy pack-in headphones upgrade to ones that cost $50-200. Consumers realize they are buying an iPod, not headphones. Personally I wish Apple would just make the headphones optional and charge $20 less. They won't of course because the pack-in headphones cost them $2.

5) Apple Tech support via Phone is miserable. I do my best not to call but instead go direct to the Apple Store. The Geniuses are not necessarily smarter but they can't pretend you are an idiot and blame you like phone support loves to do.
 
Gloops said:
A Mac Pro is more powerful than I need, and can afford, the iMac isn't pro enough. Designers used to be Apple's core market; I guess it's now the iPod crowd.
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I was thinking of this the other day -- when you look at Apple's product line, it seems there is a glaring omission:

MacMini, for very casual users, people who only want to spend $1000 or so (after tax and applecare) to try out a Mac. Also good for people who want everything to be as small as possible or want one as a backup computer.

iMacs, for the all-in-one market, not a huge one by market share but most PC makers now offer something along these lines.

MacPros, for wealthier professionals or companies. The huge boost in price (and underwhelming specs) of the new entry-level MacPro makes it really hard for lower-income professionals or, say, videocamera or home-recording enthusiasts to justify buying it. While you're at it, you may as well spend a couple grand more for the dual-socket model.

So... there's a miniature Mac, an all-in-one Mac, and an ultra-high-end professional Mac. My question is WHERE IS THE MAC in all of this? You know, the $1200 - $2000 desktop that uses, say, the iMac's internal parts but puts it in a REGULAR desktop enclosure that allows for easy ram and PCIM card upgrades?

This gaping hole in the product line could really hurt their desktop sales this year, predicted to be one of the worst for the desktop market in a decade.

IMO Mac's reputation for higher quality than most is totally over. Only the fanboys can contort their brain enough to still believe it. The standard joke is now that you can expect your Mac to last until shortly after the Applecare expires -- and that of course, no one in their right mind would choose to forego Applecare, given the problems you can expect to have. This adds even more to the already sky-high prices of the desktop line.

I just bought a new Mini (to replace a G5 tower that sure enough barely lasted a year past the applecare), and the cheap plastic-ness, loose ports (even on the 2nd replacement), spotty performance (I may have to return it a 3rd time!!!) is disgusting. I can't believe this crappy core2duo with 1gb and a 120GB HD cost me over $800!!! (Canadian, after taxes, no applecare.) Sorry Apple, you're going to lose me to a Hackintosh if this keeps up.
 
The only Mac I have that does NOT work is a IIci. I did however go through 3 MacBook Pros before finding one that had both acceptable fit/finish and no LCD issues. I gave up after 3, the one I've got has a little of both. :/ But, the PM G4, and the two PM G5s still work. (Knock on wood for the 2.7).
 
Gloops said:
Not really good enough for for colour critical jobs; and from what I've been reading the alu iMac's are all the same, so there's no point in exchanging it.
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Then you haven't seen my iMac screen. It is more then good enough for color critical jobs.

You didn't go look at what the screen on the new iMac's looked like before you bought it? That sounds odd.
 
mashmosher said:
I was thinking of this the other day -- when you look at Apple's product line, it seems there is a glaring omission:

MacMini, for very casual users, people who only want to spend $1000 or so (after tax and applecare) to try out a Mac. Also good for people who want everything to be as small as possible or want one as a backup computer.

iMacs, for the all-in-one market, not a huge one by market share but most PC makers now offer something along these lines.

MacPros, for wealthier professionals or companies. The huge boost in price (and underwhelming specs) of the new entry-level MacPro makes it really hard for lower-income professionals or, say, videocamera or home-recording enthusiasts to justify buying it. While you're at it, you may as well spend a couple grand more for the dual-socket model.

So... there's a miniature Mac, an all-in-one Mac, and an ultra-high-end professional Mac. My question is WHERE IS THE MAC in all of this? You know, the $1200 - $2000 desktop that uses, say, the iMac's internal parts but puts it in a REGULAR desktop enclosure that allows for easy ram and PCIM card upgrades?

This gaping hole in the product line could really hurt their desktop sales this year, predicted to be one of the worst for the desktop market in a decade.

IMO Mac's reputation for higher quality than most is totally over. Only the fanboys can contort their brain enough to still believe it. The standard joke is now that you can expect your Mac to last until shortly after the Applecare expires -- and that of course, no one in their right mind would choose to forego Applecare, given the problems you can expect to have. This adds even more to the already sky-high prices of the desktop line.

I just bought a new Mini (to replace a G5 tower that sure enough barely lasted a year past the applecare), and the cheap plastic-ness, loose ports (even on the 2nd replacement), spotty performance (I may have to return it a 3rd time!!!) is disgusting. I can't believe this crappy core2duo with 1gb and a 120GB HD cost me over $800!!! (Canadian, after taxes, no applecare.) Sorry Apple, you're going to lose me to a Hackintosh if this keeps up.
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I just placed my order for one of these on the Dell Outlet site. Free shipping 3 -5 days how much longer are you guys going to keep paying the $500 Apple tax? the 2009 Mac Mini is a $250 - $300 machine at tops but becuase you want the OS you pay the Apple tax.


Studio Slim - 540s
(System Identifier: 09RCF1JB)


Studio 540s Slim Tower: Intel Core 2 Quad processor Q8200 (4MB L2, 2.33GHz, 1333FSB)
Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium

System Price : $439.00

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Operating System
Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Memory
3 GB DDR2 SDRAM 800MHz (3 DIMMs)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hard Disk Drive
640 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Modem
V.90/56K PCI DataFax Modem
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Certified Refurbished
Certified Refurbished
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Base
Studio 540s Slim Tower: Intel Core 2 Quad processor Q8200 (4MB L2, 2.33GHz, 1333FSB)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Media Bay
16X DVD +/- RW w/dbl layer write capability
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Software Upgrade
Microsoft Works 9.0
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hardware Upgrade
USB Optical two button mouse
USB Multimedia Keyboard
Dell 19 in 1 Media Card Reader
 
scoobierules said:
It seems with every new update the quality of the product gets worse than the one before.
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9-ad_apple_1984_2.png


"Silence! This criticism of the company is unfounded".
 
I don't see a real point to the OP's post, but I do have to agree with him. The quality seems to be getting worse and worse. Technology gets more advanced, and cheaper to make. The sacrifice is that the good American companies go out of business so they buy from Chinese companies that produce crap parts.
 
I love the aluminium laptop style keyboard that comes with iMac's myself. What I'd like to see is a hardware design refresh for Mighty Mouse - the little scroller is a bit unreliable.

Otherwise, I think it's pointless whining about the iMac keyboard. Just buy a different keyboard. ;)
 
Bubba Satori said:
iMacs with junk screens had the highest return rate of any computer in my store. Ever.
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Which generation were these? I'm hoping the Aluminums have been reworked to avoid frying out the logic boards. If the very latest gen are also fail in just over 3 years, Apple will be losing much of their fan base.
 
Lexlee said:
Then you haven't seen my iMac screen. It is more then good enough for color critical jobs.

You didn't go look at what the screen on the new iMac's looked like before you bought it? That sounds odd.
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Careless, I know. I assumed the panel would be as good, if not better, than a machine I bought 3 years ago. It was an online special offer, so I took a gamble.

The easiest way to spot inconsistencies is to open Safari and look at the blue stripes in the bookmarks window. Mine noticeably gradate from lighter on the left to darker on the right - and they're pretty washed out right the way across, with the brightness turned right down.

If you have a perfect screen, lucky you.
 
Does anyone else remember "chicklets" gum? All this talk is making me want some. Do they still make?

As for Apple producing junk, welcome to the terrordome Mr. and Mrs. Public Enemy. It is indeed the world we live in and everyone is cutting corners and costs. Some people get the shaft and get the bad stuff, most continue to get the good. There will always be story's of bad mobo's and bad screens and bad memory and the list goes on and on. At the end of the day OSX and Apples still far superior customer service - keeps them head and shoulders above any other main stream computer manufacturer out there today. Although the gap may be narrowing.
 
Fonzijr1964 said:
+1

stop hating and go back to the dark side

not that i dont agree i think the 3G is a POS but its what they sell so sue me
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When I see crap replies like this my immediate thought is "Be quiet junior, the adults are trying to have a grown up discussion". I realise that's inappropriate so... uh.. wait. Actually, no, I've got nothing else. If that's the best reply you've got to someone voicing a genuine concern then be quiet junior, the adults are trying to have a grown up discussion.
 
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