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baryon

macrumors 68040
Oct 3, 2009
3,903
2,972
Well, if the specs of the Air and the Pro are similar, it should be the same performance, however, note that the MacBook Air is still the old design: It doesn't have the cool glass trackpad yet, and I'm sure Apple wants to add that pretty soon. The MacBook Pro is a very actual design, while the Air hasn't been redesigned (I mean, the way it looks on the outside) since its launch.

I wouldn't care for the fact that the Air is thinner, the Pro is already super thin. However, if this factor is very important for you, that makes sense. I would get the pro, because of the glass screen and the glass trackpad (the Air has a plastic trackpad and plastic screen).
 

bcrguy

macrumors regular
Sep 29, 2009
171
0
Burlington Ontario Canada
Hi guys, i was planning to get a MacBook Pro but at the store where they sell it they sell me the Pro they sell me the air for the same price, i feel that the Air is better value because it's thinner and it has almost the same features.
I want to use the computer around the house, take it to work, starbucks, a daily usage computer, like something between my desktop and iPhone, and that's NOT an iPad in my case, i would use it to download music and sync my iPhone on iTunes, apereture, even light video editing probably just twice a year or so, one part i care about is Second Life (3D Virtual World)... is the performance the same even with a lower clock processor? since 3D apps use more GPU than CPU.

Would 4 tabs in safari + iTunes music + secondlife + 1 Work app go fine all together? should i get the pro?

get the pro because the air does not have a superdrive built in and if im not mistaken its another 100 bucks.. (canada) and the pro you can upgrade ram as well.. the air is stuck at 2, the pro comes stock at 4 expandable up to 8..

pro all the way..
 

Adidas Addict

macrumors 65816
Sep 9, 2008
1,455
0
England
I think from the current models the 13" MBP is the clever choice. I have a feeling the new rev Air will be using one of intels ULV chips which will make performance even slower, BUT it should also make it more affordable and cooler. Paired with an SSD and decent graphics a ULV would make sense and battery life would be greatly improved. The Air badly needs the glass trackpad too, makes a huge difference in the user experience.

When the Air was released it was a standout WOW product, but nowadays lots of manufacturers are making thin and light models for only a few hundred £££'s which is making the Air look more and more overpriced. I have always had a soft spot for the Air, but I feel its lost a lot of its attraction and wow factor lately.
 

southnc

macrumors member
Mar 12, 2010
56
1
Yeah, this is a tough choice.

Let's say you are considering a Macbook Air VS Macbook 13" Pro with SSD.

The Pro weigh's just 1.5 lbs more than the Air; maybe even less difference if your using the SSD on the Pro.

The Pro is a lot more powerful, less heat, SD slot, DVD burner, longer battery, and cheaper in SSD form.

My plan is to have the iMac as the heavy-hitter at home and need a supplementary portable for email, browsing (FULL), Skype, video, and other light tasks. The iPad is a joke, imo (HP Slate should kill it). I wish they had made the tablet out of the Air instead. Regardless, my preference is for an SSD Air or SSD 13" Macbook Pro.

Interestingly, both the Pro and Air are due for updates. I guess it's better to wait, but with the new 13" Pros so light, the Air is definitely getting squeezed.

Should be interesting to see what Apple does - hopefully, soon.
 

Paix247

macrumors 6502
Jul 26, 2006
363
1
Minneapolis
I have a new iMac and a MB Air. I love the combo. Something to consider is the MBAir power adapter is also smaller than the 13" MBP.
 

manhattanboy

macrumors 6502a
Jan 25, 2007
960
370
In ur GF's bed, Oh no he didn't!
I have a 2.53GHz 13" MBP and a 1.6GHz "Revision B" MacBook Air. The difference between the two machines is like night and day.

I have given up trying to run fairly intensive graphics apps (InDesign, PhotoShop) on the MBA. The iWork suite is fine, but anything more sophisticated bogs down the processor.

I love traveling with the Air, but I find myself growing increasingly frustrated because the machine is just downright sluggish. If I had to choose between the MBA and the MBP - that is, if I could only have one - I'd pick the Pro hands down.

Well, that's funny because I'm running CS5 fine nearly everyday....
But I do have the SSD version...

Anyways, to the OP, if you do a search you will see that this topic has been beaten to death!
Beating_a_dead_horse.jpg
 

DannyNguyener

macrumors regular
Mar 13, 2010
117
0
I was in your same shoes.

Lets just say this, I have a 2.13Ghz 128SSD MacBook Air.

It was my first Mac/Apple product I ever purchased, and it is my primary computer to this day.

-I use Aperture Daily to edit and manage my enormous 60+GB library of ONLY photos shot in RAR format.
-I open up more than 5 tabs at times when browsing
-I play Age of Empires 3, Starcraft, Warcraft, and any other RTS game you can think of.
-I also played the Sims on the MacBook Air and it works fine.
-I convert movies and videos to put on my iPad daily as well.


I can understand why MBP users enjoy bashing on the earlier generation MacBook Air, but the current revisions run fine and I think the MacBook Air should continue improving in the future upcoming releases.
 

Shodan

macrumors member
Oct 10, 2009
88
0
The 1.86/2.13 GHz Penryn CPU is plenty of power for Photoshop and Adobe CS

For someone who uses Photoshop for light image work, such as small form BMP's or PNG's.

Introduce RAW Bridge files and the Air just dies due to the heat.

Don't get me wrong, I loved my Rev.B 1.6GHz Air, but any real heavy work just didn't work.

If the rumours of a 11.6" version are true, I will get one to run alongside my Pro as a Travel book - not sold on the iPad till further Application development.
 

tflournoy95

macrumors 6502
Sep 21, 2009
457
0
then you basically say a 300 dollar cell phone is a ripoff because you can get 25" monitor with that money, sometime you just want somethig light to do basic stuff, of course they force you to pay a premium for that, I just want one because it costs me as much as the MBP

yea but the mbp has basically twice the performance, its about half as think as mast pc laptops, it has a better screen, and feels a lot sturdier. theres just no comparison.
 

Gaelic2

macrumors 6502
Aug 17, 2007
277
7
Mountains of N. California
My MBA is perfect for traveling, though I wouldn't recommend it for your primary Mac. I view it as a "supplemental" machine that I travel with. I do any heavy lifting at home on a desktop. If it's going to be your main Mac, get the MB Pro.

I totally agree! I use my MBA for travel only. I use it for checking my stocks, banking, expenses and off load pics from my camera. I check e-mail and the net but all my heavy lifting is for my iMac desktop. I like the size and weight as opposed to a MacBook which I had in the past. If I wanted only one computer, it would be a MacBook pro 15" which could handle it all.
 

halledise

macrumors 68020
I run an MBA as my only computer.

It does everything I want and this includes gaming in bootcamp.

I'm not sure how intensive second life is, but the other stuff is definitely a breeze for the 2.13 ghz model of MBA.

To those who think "MBA is supplementary" or "MBP and MBA is no comparison", most of you must not have even toyed with the MBA, it's a lot more powerful than at first glance.

At any rate, if you didn't make the request about 2nd life, I'd say definitely go for it, but I'm just not sure what 2nd life is, though I have a feeling it'll likely run quite well, you'd be surprised at what the 2.13 ghz can do.

+1 :D
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
Danny:

Thanks for your post. The specifics connect more with my wait-or-buy quandry, than most. "Buy now" for me would have to mean the 2.13, though I can (barely) afford to wait 'till October (but not without cost to my career-change, to writing).

Hearing that the 2.13 can handle Aperture is interesting. I think I read that Aperture has been revised or soon will be... would the new version's demands be any more? If I get the 2.13 it would be the newest one with the Toshiba SSD (silently sourcing/spec-bumped last May) said in a recent MR to be much faster, though I don't know what practical difference that change, alone, makes.

I have been so well educated by this blog on the Air's pros & cons, that I now know about 6 reasons to wait, and an equal number of reasons not to.

I need it to be a sole computer... for daily mobile use... and am physically unable to tolerate the 13" MB Pro's weight (arthritis, back trouble). Economically... if a new Air by Oct. solves the Air's current tight-shoe problems, I don't care how high the price of the best version goes... but also I'm old enough etc. that long-term costs govern; i.e. if I buy the 2.13 tomorrow, I need to use it for many years.

So my situation's particulars lead me want to stretch the Air to be a bit more than it is. I just got blessedly free of daily outlet-hunting for my phone (insurance gave me a phone upgrade to a touch pro 2)... but it seems that my probably-best option, buy a 2.13 Air right now, will put me BACK into the outlet-hunting business (and the hinge-babying biz). But several recent posts emphasizing what the 2.13 CAN do, have helped me to make my decision. Next Tuesday night!
 

Clatchy

macrumors newbie
Jul 24, 2010
2
0
I got a MBP 15" (late 09 2.4 GHz i5) over an Air, simpley because of the specs and that it would run better.
 

gman901

macrumors 6502a
Sep 1, 2007
607
14
Houston, TX
I had a 2.13 Air, and would love to get it again if they knock another $600 off it(since it's pretty much outdated). I'll wait and see if a new one comes out. In the meantime, my iPad pretty much handles all the exact same stuff my Air did plus more since it is so light and portable. I use my Alienware M11x for all the heavy lifting. Both of these together only weigh just under 6 pounds and fit in the new Incase sleeve they sell at the Apple store. If the next Air can dual boot to Windows 7, play games at medium details and come under 3 lbs, I may have to think about my current setup.
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
How long 'till current 13" MbP arrives in Refurb Store?

The Apple online refurb store, that is.

When I consider the 2.13 Air vs. a 13" Macbook Pro... the latter for me would be the $1,199. one plus the optional 256 SSD.

None of these new Macbook pros have shown up in the refurb store, yet. How long should that take?

......... It just occured to me that I don't know if that optional 256 gb SSD offered for the 13" MBP is of a slower or faster type? Would it hold true for the 13" MBP (as in the Air, per the recent revelation) that Samsung ones are slower, and Toshiba-sourced 256 gb SSD's are faster?

(If I call Applestore 800 number, would they be able to read the part # of the MBP's SSD to me?)

A refurb discount on that version of a current model MBP would offset some of the high ... is it $750. or $800. ... that they charge for that SSD option.
 

Spacekatgal

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2009
203
0
The Apple online refurb store, that is.

When I consider the 2.13 Air vs. a 13" Macbook Pro... the latter for me would be the $1,199. one plus the optional 256 SSD.

None of these new Macbook pros have shown up in the refurb store, yet. How long should that take?

......... It just occured to me that I don't know if that optional 256 gb SSD offered for the 13" MBP is of a slower or faster type? Would it hold true for the 13" MBP (as in the Air, per the recent revelation) that Samsung ones are slower, and Toshiba-sourced 256 gb SSD's are faster?

(If I call Applestore 800 number, would they be able to read the part # of the MBP's SSD to me?)

A refurb discount on that version of a current model MBP would offset some of the high ... is it $750. or $800. ... that they charge for that SSD option.

Just a thought, but in the 13 inch, why on earth would one go with the Apple SSD? If you really educate yourself on the state of SSDs in 2010, you'll see there are only two choices. I'd VERY highly recommend reading the most recent Anandtech roundup to understand why the Intel X25 is such a great product.

Granted, wear leveling is a problem in any SSD because you can only write to each MLC cell 10,000 times. And the lack of TRIM in OSX means that performance will still degrade over time - though less now than it used to. Even despite this, the X-25 is a great buy. I got mine for about $200.

Bri
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
spacekatgal:

Because I know nothing about computers. Even the 75,000 simple rules one must know to use Windows exceeds the amount of memory still unused between my ears :eek:

I need a computer that will serve my perhaps not too typical needs, which I've summarised before ... so I won't repeat. I don't want to have it be - me serving the computer's needs, i.e. always needing to learn more things.

So, (1.) lack of detailed knowledge, and (2.)* fear of voiding extended warranty. I also need to buy the Air from Apple, in order to be able to buy the 1:1 help service.

2* but I just read an hour ago somewhere, that not all other-sourced SSD installations void the warranty.

So, among Apple-approved vendor-installers (and I'd rather pay one co. for both functions)... are there any would put in the Toshiba 256gb SSD? So I could safely buy the non-ssd Air (or 13" MBP) and then have it upgraded... and NOT have to take the SSD back out if I ever had to have the computer serviced by Apple?

I need maximum reliability, and if I get into grad school any down-time for computer headaches could actually jeopardise my ability to compete for the 2nd year of scholarships. I must minimize the risk of downtime from any/all causes. I am terrified of potential computer snags which I don't even know how to articulate (hence, fleeing PC's), and even more - of having 2 companies -- Apple and some SSD vendor/installer -- potentially playing ping pong over their divided responsibility for solving any problems. So, avoiding that ping pong, and avoiding downtime, is worth any initial price-premium to me.

So within those needs..... is there an apple-approved perfectly safe way to upgrade an Air to 256gb SSD? Or to save money upgrading a 13" MBP to 256/512 on the cheap?
 

Spacekatgal

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2009
203
0
Very long story.

You're in school, competing for scholarships - and have arthritis and can't carry anything but the Air? Okay. This story is getting a little complicated for me, but I'll keep it simple.

My understanding is you can upgrade the Ram and the HD on your Macbook without messing up the warranty. It's not like it's hard to do. You need a T6 screwdriver and a small phillips head. It takes about 10 minutes. And if you did have a problem, you could just put the old one in. Not a big deal, to quote SJ.

Those SSDs be Apple's official choice, but the independent science that measures these things has no proof that it's a better. Quite the opposite, in fact. They are really overpriced, in my opinion.

If you're in school, it's not like if your computer breaks you can't get by using the lab for a day or two. Be prepared to fight people using Facebook, though.
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
Thanks for trying to help....

... but perhaps our situations have more differences than is easy to imagine.

I won't be opening any computers, or self-installing, then uninstalling a SSD if I need Apple service. And there is no "lab" whose computers I can borrow if my laptop has downtime.

I'm not in school yet... I have a deadline of January to write some new things for an application for a grad program, which I can only afford if I also win lots of scholarships. Once in school (a writing program) I must produce a piece of finished writing 7 days a week, and on some days hand in that plus a bigger assignment. There's a thesis in both long-form plus a slide-lecture version. Competitveness to get year #2's scholarships means getting stuff published while in the first year, too.

Since I'd be a commuting student 4 days a week, and bouncing around to various non-school libraries and bookstores on Fri.-Sat.-Sun... this literally means carrying the laptop around 6 or 7 days a week. (With a big cheap monitor on my desk in school, and another one on my desk at home.) The program has a part-time IT advisor, but supplies no hardware. Ever.

If I have any downtime or worse, disputes about which company has to fix anything, then I'll fall behind competitively, and then won't be able to win the set of big scholarships and grants essential to study there for the 2nd year.

The work pace is -- run, run, run! Using the computer for writing and research - all day, every day.

I plan to use the computer for 5-6 years, to the end of the 2nd battery. If I overpay by $500. or even twice that amount for big enough and durable enough (SSD) memory... what's that compared with (if this is the case) increasing the odds of downtime or repair disputes...... which could lose me over $20k in grants and turn the whole grad school undertaking into a financial trainwreck?

So, nobody's going to let me use their computer if mine breaks. My laptop must work reliably -- first for a year of preparatory work, and then if I win a big enough grant package to get into the school -- starting 9/2011 I'll need the computer to work every single day for the next 21 months, without fail.

If Apple's SSD's are now the fast kind, then the only attraction of other sources is -- having 256gb on an Air ....... or if the Air's skimpiness and update-stalling forces me to go with the 13" MBP + wear a backpack every day, the attraction would be avoiding Apple's price-gouging on 256gb... or maybe even being able to afford 512?
 

Spacekatgal

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2009
203
0
... but perhaps our situations have more differences than is easy to imagine.

I won't be opening any computers, or self-installing, then uninstalling a SSD if I need Apple service. And there is no "lab" whose computers I can borrow if my laptop has downtime.

I'm not in school yet... I have a deadline of January to write some new things for an application for a grad program, which I can only afford if I also win lots of scholarships. Once in school (a writing program) I must produce a piece of finished writing 7 days a week, and on some days hand in that plus a bigger assignment. There's a thesis in both long-form plus a slide-lecture version. Competitveness to get year #2's scholarships means getting stuff published while in the first year, too.

Since I'd be a commuting student 4 days a week, and bouncing around to various non-school libraries and bookstores on Fri.-Sat.-Sun... this literally means carrying the laptop around 6 or 7 days a week. (With a big cheap monitor on my desk in school, and another one on my desk at home.) The program has a part-time IT advisor, but supplies no hardware. Ever.

If I have any downtime or worse, disputes about which company has to fix anything, then I'll fall behind competitively, and then won't be able to win the set of big scholarships and grants essential to study there for the 2nd year.

The work pace is -- run, run, run! Using the computer for writing and research - all day, every day.

I plan to use the computer for 5-6 years, to the end of the 2nd battery. If I overpay by $500. or even twice that amount for big enough and durable enough (SSD) memory... what's that compared with (if this is the case) increasing the odds of downtime or repair disputes...... which could lose me over $20k in grants and turn the whole grad school undertaking into a financial trainwreck?

So, nobody's going to let me use their computer if mine breaks. My laptop must work reliably -- first for a year of preparatory work, and then if I win a big enough grant package to get into the school -- starting 9/2011 I'll need the computer to work every single day for the next 21 months, without fail.

If Apple's SSD's are now the fast kind, then the only attraction of other sources is -- having 256gb on an Air ....... or if the Air's skimpiness and update-stalling forces me to go with the 13" MBP + wear a backpack every day, the attraction would be avoiding Apple's price-gouging on 256gb... or maybe even being able to afford 512?

Sounds like you have your mind made up. That's cool. But don't be under the impression that a MLC hard drive will last 5 or 6 years if you're writing to it heavily. One of the big problems with the Apple Ssd is uneven wear leveling.

I get the appeal of not being responsible for a broken drive, though. And I also get the commute. I take my motorcycle to class, so weight is a huge concern.
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
What's "MLC"?

Is there any memory option that can realistically last for -- as long as a first battery and the replacment battery?

I was able to get a few minutes with the program's IT advisor. She said -1-everyone there has Macs, -2- nobody has an Air, but -3- a new Air will suffice (this, before the faster Toshiba SSD arrived) and -4- for sure make it the biggest-SSD version. And -5- the school & publishers accept nothing but Word; so get Office 4 Mac, no need for full Windows. (If iWork's so close to a refresh I may wait for that.)

Since I'm reading of at least misc. little things being better on the 2.13 Air, I've dropped consideration of the $1349 refurb one.

I've read about "writing and rewriting" to an SSD. I don't know if I'll do much deleting & writing over... at least not consciously. What goes into my archive stays there... though if I go w/ the 2.13, to live with that 128gb SSD capacity I may have some older archival text + pix material that exists only in the mirrored g-tech/hitachi? backup unit seen @ B&H Photo, not in the notebook. (Reading about "mirroring" in backups, it seemed essential. True?)

I need whatever amount of storage it takes for scanning my existing books & many article clippings ... plus new material... in my field I tend to need a few pages of each of the the many new books being published; buying so many books is impossible $ and spacewise. I've been using my phone's sharp-enough camera for book/mag pages that I may need to quote or use as research leads, later. Esp. for that daily essay requirement! Apple salespeople say that if I tag all that stuff enough, it's searchable, with no outside software.

Thank you for bearing with all this... but where you could perhaps advise me is, the last thing in my previous post. Now that the Air HAS the faster type Toshiba SSD (and I searched last nite: apparently the current BTO MBPs have it too), is there an Apple-Certified warranty-preserving SSD vendor-installer who can boost an Air to 256gb , or boost a 13" MBP to 256/beyond at a big savings over Apple's prices?

And then to be safe, I don't get a replacement battery, but get a new laptop every time the battery's finished? Or does the mirrored backup mean I CAN push my luck (and value economics) with using that 2nd battery as long as it lasts?

Thanks for your advice :eek:
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
What's "MLC"?

Is there any memory option that can realistically last for -- as long as a first battery and the replacment battery?

I was able to get a few minutes with the program's IT advisor. She said -1-everyone there has Macs, -2- nobody has an Air, but -3- a new Air will suffice (this, before the faster Toshiba SSD arrived) and -4- for sure make it the biggest-SSD version. And -5- the school & publishers accept nothing but Word; so get Office 4 Mac, no need for full Windows. (If iWork's so close to a refresh I may wait for that.)

Since I'm reading of at least misc. little things being better on the 2.13 Air, I've dropped consideration of the $1349 refurb one.

I've read about "writing and rewriting" to an SSD. I don't know if I'll do much deleting & writing over... at least not consciously. What goes into my archive stays there... though if I go w/ the 2.13, to live with that 128gb SSD capacity I may have some older archival text + pix material that exists only in the mirrored g-tech/hitachi? backup unit seen @ B&H Photo, not in the notebook. (Reading about "mirroring" in backups, it seemed essential. True?)

I need whatever amount of storage it takes for scanning my existing books & many article clippings ... plus new material... in my field I tend to need a few pages of each of the the many new books being published; buying so many books is impossible $ and spacewise. I've been using my phone's sharp-enough camera for book/mag pages that I may need to quote or use as research leads, later. Esp. for that daily essay requirement! Apple salespeople say that if I tag all that stuff enough, it's searchable, with no outside software.

Thank you for bearing with all this... but where you could perhaps advise me is, the last thing in my previous post. Now that the Air HAS the faster type Toshiba SSD (and I searched last nite: apparently the current BTO MBPs have it too), is there an Apple-Certified warranty-preserving SSD vendor-installer who can boost an Air to 256gb , or boost a 13" MBP to 256/beyond at a big savings over Apple's prices?

And then to be safe, I don't get a replacement battery, but get a new laptop every time the battery's finished? Or does the mirrored backup mean I CAN push my luck (and value economics) with using that 2nd battery as long as it lasts?

Thanks for your advice :eek:
 
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