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Macbook suddenly malfunctioning: black screen

OP:

Do you have a brick-n-mortar Apple Store anywhere nearby?
If so, I suggest you make an appointment for the genius bar and let them have a look at it.

I seem to recall reading that at least -some- Macs are having problems with Catalina updates, in which the "update" (possibly a failed firmware update) makes the Mac unbootable.

If that's the case with yours, I don't think there's anything YOU can do to get it running again.

It will be worth the trouble to "have it looked at"...
 
ApfelKuchen said:
Definitely try to connect it to an external display.

If you see nothing when you boot to Internet Recovery (Option + Command + R), then it's not an issue with the internal hard drive, since Internet Recovery doesn't use the internal hard drive.

Resetting NVRAM will make sure it isn't a problem with video settings - https://support.apple.com/HT204063

This is very possibly a display failure of some sort. Since the Apple logo does light up eventually, the display backlight seems to be working. If an external display works, then it's likely related to the internal display module. If an external display also doesn't work, then the main logic board starts to become suspect... but I'd leave that kind of troubleshooting to a qualified repair shop.
Click to expand...


I like your assessment of the situation. Based on the evidence I bet it is the main logic Board. Is this a fixable thing?
 
Jacob Brown said:
I like your assessment of the situation. Based on the evidence I bet it is the main logic Board. Is this a fixable thing?
Click to expand...

It's fixable, but it can be expensive.

This is not something I would "bet" on. Bring it in to a qualified Apple shop, where they can do a proper diagnosis.

As to the evidence... since the display is dark AND an external display doesn't work, things do point in the direction of the main logic board, but there are enough instances of external displays not working due to bad cables, incompatibility, etc., that, again, I wouldn't bet on that diagnosis - it may be false evidence.

In the end, this is why people go to doctors... they may have a "knowledgable" friend or friends, they may read something about it on the internet, but there's still no substitute for the expertise of a trained professional who can actually examine and test the "patient."
 
I'm going to ask you to reread my reply #26 to you again.

If you have an Apple Store anywhere close, take it to them and let them look at it.
They won't charge you anything "for the look"...
 
You may also try one more thing. Just shut off WiFi or remove any cables attached to the computer and start again. See if that helps to at least get it to boot.

Also, the fastest way for you is to get it into an Apple Store and get it looked into.
 
I took my mac into a certified mac dealer. The manager opened up my laptop and showed me that there was water damage on the main logic board. I asked him how much it costs to fix that and he said the part by itself was between 6-800 dollars. I decided to keep the hard drive and donate the mac to the store. He said they are not allowed to make money by parting out broken laptops. He said the laptops are donated to a charity which builds computers for needy people.

As I was leaving I wondered if I made a mistake though. Is it normal for logic boards to cost that much? Is it possible to get logic boards somewhere for a fraction of the price? If I had a logic board is this something I could fix without soldering?

-Jacob
 
Jacob Brown said:
I took my mac into a certified mac dealer. The manager opened up my laptop and showed me that there was water damage on the main logic board. I asked him how much it costs to fix that and he said the part by itself was between 6-800 dollars. I decided to keep the hard drive and donate the mac to the store. He said they are not allowed to make money by parting out broken laptops. He said the laptops are donated to a charity which builds computers for needy people.

As I was leaving I wondered if I made a mistake though. Is it normal for logic boards to cost that much? Is it possible to get logic boards somewhere for a fraction of the price? If I had a logic board is this something I could fix without soldering?

-Jacob
Click to expand...
I have personally fixed a few liquid-damaged boards by completely tearing down the MacBook, examining all parts for any signs of corrosion, cleaning all affected areas with pure isopropyl alcohol, letting all parts dry thoroughly, reconnecting everything except the battery, trackpad, and keyboard, attaching a charger, and seeing if the MacBook boots on its own.

Screens, even used, are worth a few bucks. Same for the trackpad, Wi-Fi card, and casing. Are you able to get it back?

Where was the liquid damage on the board?
 
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Audit13 said:
I have personally fixed a few liquid-damaged boards by completely tearing down the MacBook, examining all parts for any signs of corrosion, cleaning all affected areas with pure isopropyl alcohol, letting all parts dry thoroughly, reconnecting everything except the battery, trackpad, and keyboard, attaching a charger, and seeing if the MacBook boots on its own.

Screens, even used, are worth a few bucks. Same for the trackpad, Wi-Fi card, and casing. Are you able to get it back?

Where was the liquid damage on the board?
Click to expand...
Thanks for revealing the tips for cleaning the Mobo and what to connect to test. I just got through transferring the internals from a dead MBP 2012 to a used one. Micro Center sells the 2012 non-retina unit now for $430!!! It ain't a 2014 Retina, but a lot less to buy used. The good part is that 16GB of RAM is under $100, and the DVD can be replaced with a SATA HDD or SSD. It's very versatile and has decent speed with an SSD (used for Adobe PS and LR Classic), but it doesn't compare to the NVMe drives in the 2014 units, or the tiny size. The other bad part is that those used Macs are available for in-store purchases at MicroCenter.
 
naerct said:
Thanks for revealing the tips for cleaning the Mobo and what to connect to test. I just got through transferring the internals from a dead MBP 2012 to a used one. Micro Center sells the 2012 non-retina unit now for $430!!! It ain't a 2014 Retina, but a lot less to buy used. The good part is that 16GB of RAM is under $100, and the DVD can be replaced with a SATA HDD or SSD. It's very versatile and has decent speed with an SSD (used for Adobe PS and LR Classic), but it doesn't compare to the NVMe drives in the 2014 units, or the tiny size. The other bad part is that those used Macs are available for in-store purchases at MicroCenter.
Click to expand...
The mid-2012 is built like a tank, has USB 3.0, and nothing is glued in place which is nice. My nephew and niece have one and both MacBooks survived 4 years of univerisity and then some. In total, they've had them for over 7 years.
 
Audit13 said:
The mid-2012 is built like a tank, has USB 3.0, and nothing is glued in place which is nice. My nephew and niece have one and both MacBooks survived 4 years of univerisity and then some. In total, they've had them for over 7 years.
Click to expand...
Changing the SSD is a bit more difficult than on the 2014 (from viewing the '14 MBP video), and RAM is easy. Pulling out the DVD SuperDrive is a bit more tedious. The screws are tiny and other parts must be moved to get to the screws and wires must be reseated after the screws are replaced (see the OWC video). Also, it's $20 but the OWC Data Doubler bracket is much better than other units. A Vantec unit that I used for a friend used only 1 screw to hold itself instead of 3... It was fine, but perhaps not for rough play. It's been in in use for a couple years without issue.
 
naerct said:
Changing the SSD is a bit more difficult than on the 2014 (from viewing the '14 MBP video), and RAM is easy. Pulling out the DVD SuperDrive is a bit more tedious. The screws are tiny and other parts must be moved to get to the screws and wires must be reseated after the screws are replaced (see the OWC video). Also, it's $20 but the OWC Data Doubler bracket is much better than other units. A Vantec unit that I used for a friend used only 1 screw to hold itself instead of 3... It was fine, but perhaps not for rough play. It's been in in use for a couple years without issue.
Click to expand...
I used about 10 of the cheap dvd caddies from Amazon in pcs and Macs. These have been running well for years as well.
 
Audit13 said:
I used about 10 of the cheap dvd caddies from Amazon in pcs and Macs. These have been running well for years as well.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your informed replies. I think my next pursuit will be the progress with getting my 12-core to get past Mojave. There was some good news, but the thread kind of stopped once Catalina was introduced. I still know at least a half dozen people in my area that are using cMPs 5,1. It still seems like the best machine for the job for photography. There's no question that the new MPs are far more powerful, but at what cost when you're not editing uncompressed 4K video. Three overclocked video cards are not essential for photography. The new MP can't hold anymore spindle drives than the trashcan, zero. Even though the six SATA bays are only SATA2, my five drive RAID5 gives me 16TB of storage with reads of 450MB/s as well as a one drive redundancy. My NVMe card adds 2 blades for reads of 2.8GB/s in the pCI bay along with cards with eSATA 3 and USB 3.1 gen2, but can only boot USB from the USB2 chassis slots (unfortunately). For fast external boots (when needed), I must use the eSATA 6gb slot with added USB power, but get reads near 500MB/s from a SATA SSD.
 
Hello
I don’t know if it helps but I have the same problem with my 2012 15 retina.
The only difference is that I’ve managed to turn the screen up a few times.
I hoped this was a software or ssd problem, but your case with the water damage reminded me that few drops of water were spilled on the keyboard 2 months ago. I’d turned it off immediately, turned it upside down, shaked it, dried it with kitchen paper etc.
Worked fine for 2 months. Then the black screen started to happen a week after upgrading to Catalina.

do you think it can be saved? Or is the damage permanent?
 
LoopDotDrifter said:
Hello
I don’t know if it helps but I have the same problem with my 2012 15 retina.
The only difference is that I’ve managed to turn the screen up a few times.
I hoped this was a software or ssd problem, but your case with the water damage reminded me that few drops of water were spilled on the keyboard 2 months ago. I’d turned it off immediately, turned it upside down, shaked it, dried it with kitchen paper etc.
Worked fine for 2 months. Then the black screen started to happen a week after upgrading to Catalina.

do you think it can be saved? Or is the damage permanent?
Click to expand...
The problem with liquid damage is that problems can appear much later.

When the liquid dries, it can leave behind residue which slowly corrodes the components and connections on the logic board.

I recommend disassembling the Macbook and cleaning any areas that have signs of corrosion with pure isopropyl alcohol. Don't use lower percentage alcohol because, in addition to alcohol, there may be other liquid compounds which are not good for logic boards.

With any luck, cleaning and drying the corroded areas will allow the MacBook to return to normal.
 
Audit13 said:
The problem with liquid damage is that problems can appear much later.

When the liquid dries, it can leave behind residue which slowly corrodes the components and connections on the logic board.

I recommend disassembling the Macbook and cleaning any areas that have signs of corrosion with pure isopropyl alcohol. Don't use lower percentage alcohol because, in addition to alcohol, there may be other liquid compounds which are not good for logic boards.

With any luck, cleaning and drying the corroded areas will allow the MacBook to return to normal.
Click to expand...

thanks for the advice
That Catalina upgrade through me off.
I’ve probably done 100 restarts over the last three days!

I guess it’s time for my first mac laptop tear down.
 
LoopDotDrifter said:
Hello
I don’t know if it helps but I have the same problem with my 2012 15 retina.
The only difference is that I’ve managed to turn the screen up a few times.
I hoped this was a software or ssd problem, but your case with the water damage reminded me that few drops of water were spilled on the keyboard 2 months ago. I’d turned it off immediately, turned it upside down, shaked it, dried it with kitchen paper etc.
Worked fine for 2 months. Then the black screen started to happen a week after upgrading to Catalina.

do you think it can be saved? Or is the damage permanent?
Click to expand...
If something starts happening a week after a software update, chances are the software update has nothing to do with the issue. It's just extraneous information that clouds analysis. "I stubbed my toe on Wednesday, then crashed my car on Saturday." Unless you hurt your toe so badly that it interfered with your use of the brake pedal and improper operation of the brake pedal contributed to the crash, then the toe has nothing to do with the crash.

Similarly, there are so many things that can cause a display/startup issue that there's no sure way of knowing whether that accidental spill is the cause without hands-on troubleshooting by a skilled diagnostician. Certainly, a spill can be a ticking time bomb that leads to a failure long after the incident occurred, but it may also be just as much of a coincidence as that stubbed toe. I would not do a disassembly/inspection/cleaning job of that magnitude without prior inspection/troubleshooting. Now, if the failure happened right after the spill and the thing is wet inside when the case is opened... then we have a more direct cause/effect relationship.

The bottom line is, why are you guessing at all? Software, SSD, water... If you're not familiar with the standard techniques for isolating/narrowing down the cause, perhaps it's time to bring the Mac to someone who is.
 
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