MP 7,1 Minimum most-upgradable 7,1 configuration

[dermeister]

I'm trying to figure out which MacPro7,1 to get, and my thinking is to get the cheapest one that isn't architecturally limited.

With the MacPro5,1, if you picked a single-core you got a different CPU tray that could only ever accept one CPU and one set of RAM. It also took slower RAM.

I'm wondering whether the same thing is at play with these new MacPro7,1 -- if you take the base option, can it later be upgraded to same spec as a fully-decked out one? Or is there a minimum CPU config to take to get the version that is architecturally the same as the best one?

 

[MisterAndrew]

I think the only thing that cannot be easily upgraded is the proprietary storage, so if you're going to upgrade anything at purchase do that. The RAM, CPU, and GPUs can be upgraded later.

 

[bsbeamer]

RAM and GPUs are clearly allowed to be upgraded, Apple released instructions on doing so.

CPU is likely “at your risk” and wouldn’t suggest anyone touches that if they’re looking for an Apple replacement/service in the warranty period. After that, it’s your machine out of warranty and do what you wish. The prices of higher end CURRENTLY available CPUs will drop in time, eventually.

Main “built in” storage is a bit of a question. Personally would suggest getting at least the 1TB upgrade now and be done with it. Everything else for storage can be added via NVMe or whatever SSD by PCIe or TB3 or USB3.

 

[M3Jedi77]

Just ordered a base version, curious to see what everyone here thinks.

I need 4TB of the fastest possible internal storage, am I not going to be able to upgrade my 256ssd to 4TB? WTF.

 

[MisterAndrew]

We'll have to see if there are tampering screws or anything on the CPU that could result in a voided warranty if removed. If there's not then it should be fine to put in any compatible CPU you want. Just make sure you put the original CPU back in the machine before requesting warranty service.

 

[minifridge1138]

Just ordered a base version, curious to see what everyone here thinks.

I need 4TB of the fastest possible internal storage, am I not going to be able to upgrade my 256ssd to 4TB? WTF.

I don’t think you’ll be able to, but we won’t know for sure until people have a 7,1 in their possession.

It seems the internal storage isn’t actually an SSD. The controller is in the T2 card and the actual storages is separate modules. It’s a proprietary Apple setup just like the iMac Pro.
See
https://everymac.com/systems/apple/...c-pro-how-to-upgrade-replace-ssd-storage.html

 

[AidenShaw]

am I not going to be able to upgrade my 256ssd to 4TB? WTF.

No, you will not be able to upgrade the standard drive to anything else.

There is no standard format SSD slot in the 7,1. No SATA slots, no M.2 PCIe slots. The standard 'drive' is really split between the SSD controller logic in the T2 chip, and one or two NAND blades.

Best option is to get a PCIe card that supports M.2 SSD blades. It may take some time before anyone knows what *should* work in the 7,1 and which cards/blades actually do work.

 

[MisterAndrew]

It may be possible that Apple or an authorized service center can upgrade the internal storage at a later date, because the support page says they can remove or replace them. You'd need to check with Apple to make sure.

 

[deconstruct60]

Just ordered a base version, curious to see what everyone here thinks.

I need 4TB of the fastest possible internal storage, am I not going to be able to upgrade my 256ssd to 4TB? WTF.

If you need to have the fastest possible internal storage then you dont want the x4 PCI-e SSD stuck to the PCH I/O support chip . You’d want a x16PCI-e 4 slot M.2 card and populate that . Or some kind of Optane drive if looking for absolutely best latencies ( kind of fast ). Can also put that in an open slot.

The T2 drive is fast but it has nothing to do with trying to be the absolute fastest possible. It is meant to be a more than fast enough for almost everyone boot drive. Not everything for everybody.

 

[philipma1957]

Okay so apple is finally selling something I can use. the base model with bare minimum cpu and ram is fine for me. And it is 360 to upgrade to 1tb internal storage. I have veterans discount so I would pay 5759 plus 7% tax or 6162.13. This would be the most expensive pc I ever purchased.

My specs would be as follows

Customize your Mac Pro.

• 3.5GHz 8‑core Intel Xeon W processor, Turbo Boost up to 4.0GHz
• 32GB (4x8GB) of DDR4 ECC memory
• Radeon Pro 580X with 8GB of GDDR5 memory
• 1TB SSD storage
• Stainless steel frame with feet
• Magic Mouse 2
• Magic Keyboard with Numeric Keypad - US English

None of the above would go outdated for me for years to come. Still it is pricey.

Hmmm coming soon.

Coming soon:

• 8TB SSD storage
• Coming soon:
  • Radeon Pro W5700X with 16GB of GDDR6 memory
  • Two Radeon Pro W5700X with 16GB of GDDR6 memory each

I will keep my eyes on this gear.

Maybe I can upgrade cpu and storage via OWC

 

[estherau]

I need to clarify. What happens if the internal drive of a new mac pro fails? Can I swap it out with a new drive that I cloned my old drive onto before the orginal drive failed?
Every drive eventually dies, and some die quite quickly.

 

[bsbeamer]

I need to clarify. What happens if the internal drive of a new mac pro fails? Can I swap it out with a new drive that I cloned my old drive onto before the orginal drive failed?
Every drive eventually dies, and some die quite quickly.

If you use Carbon Copy Cloner, you'll get a message like this:



You need to enable external booting in recovery. That's it.

 

[minifridge1138]

I need to clarify. What happens if the internal drive of a new mac pro fails? Can I swap it out with a new drive that I cloned my old drive onto before the orginal drive failed?
Every drive eventually dies, and some die quite quickly.

No, you won’t be able to swap it. You could have an Authorized repair shop do it. Or you could install a different SSD either in a Sata connection or pcie card and boot off of that. But you won’t be able to remove the apple modules and install different ones (unless they’re also apple’s proprietary modules and even that may not work if the t2 chip somehow “blessed” the originals).

Edit for clarification: I take “swap” as remove the old apple modules and replace them with 3rd party. Might work if swapping Apple for Apple. It would be the same as what options an imac pro user has.

 

[CrysisDeu]

No, you will not be able to upgrade the standard drive to anything else.

There is no standard format SSD slot in the 7,1. No SATA slots, no M.2 PCIe slots. The standard 'drive' is really split between the SSD controller logic in the T2 chip, and one or two NAND blades.

Best option is to get a PCIe card that supports M.2 SSD blades. It may take some time before anyone knows what *should* work in the 7,1 and which cards/blades actually do work.

There is sata, if you can bear sata speeds

 

[estherau]

I;m worried that if my main internal drive fails, that i will be without myconmputer for a long time whilst it get sent to apple etc.

 

[bsbeamer]

I;m worried that if my main internal drive fails, that i will be without myconmputer for a long time whilst it get sent to apple etc.

Do what was suggested above, or don’t purchase. No Apple computer from 2018/2019 has system boot drive that is immediately user replaceable. Work within the limitation or look elsewhere.

 

[estherau]

Yeah I know bsbeamre, I'm just seeing what ideas other people have. eg I could keep, rather than sell, my imac pro. But then the internal drive will only be 4TB and my new one will be 8TB.

 

[deconstruct60]

I;m worried that if my main internal drive fails, that i will be without myconmputer for a long time whilst it get sent to apple etc.

if highly freaked out about this then just get the 256GB drive and simply ignore it. You'll have to boot initially and put a "maintenance administer" account on the macOS instance there. But can get another internal drive and simply boot off of that for production. If it fails then swap in a replacement. If concerned that it has to be at the closest corner parts store drive and use one of those.

If you need to send you Mac Pro in for major maintenance then just pull you production drive out of the box and send it in. Boot that drive from some other Mac that is compatible with that version of macOS while it is gone.


[ Can partition the T2 internal drive to have room for previous macOS installers and other maintenance tools/data and just boot into that periodically to update the data and/or that macOS instance. It would also be useful in having a "clean" macOS that didn't have some hodgepodge of 3rd party drivers and potential interaction bugs to test system if production OS starts acting quirky. ]

 

[estherau]

Do you think my applications would work faster if I keep them on my main drive eg adobe after effects?

 

[dermeister]

It occurs to me that there is a difference between:

1) The SSD is soldered on.
2) The SSD is proprietary, removable, but functionally "linked" via T2.
3) The SSD is proprietary, removable, and therefore replaceable.

Do we know which one it is as of now? Because if it's 3) I'd go ahead and order 1 TB right now.

As for the CPU -- do we know if picking the 8-core, there is no difference in MOBO/socket with the 28-core and it could therefore be upgraded in the future?

I don't want a MacPro5,1 situation where if you got the single CPU option, your CPU/RAM card/tray is physically different and your machine can never be upgraded to dual-CPU short of replacing the entire CPU/RAM card/tray.

Another interesting question -- apparently if you pick the built-in wheels, you can never go to feet. But if you get the feet, you can get a wheel kit. It's not clear why the built-in wheels are considered irreversible but the kit is.

 

[fiatlux]

It may take some time before anyone knows what *should* work in the 7,1 and which cards/blades actually do work.

MPX modules appear to plug in PCIe slots, power connectors and Displayport relay ports (presumably to feed video signal to built-in TB3 ports) concurently but the

PCIe slots appear standard so, hopefully, whatever works in the Mac Pro 5,1 should work here as well.​

What is less clear is if there are classical 8-pins power connectors available that would allow to use off-the-shelf graphic cards.

There appears to be 2 SATA connectors on the motherboard (labeled 1 and 2 on the picture on Apple's site). but there as well it is unclear whether there would be suitable power feed. Without any support frame for 2.5" SSDs or, God forbids, 3,5" HDDs, internal storage extension is better achieved through M.2/SSD PCIe cards.

 

[bsbeamer]

What is less clear is if there are classical 8-pins power connectors available that would allow to use off-the-shelf graphic cards.

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/HMUJ2ZM/A/belkin-aux-power-cable-kit-for-mac-pro

 

[anshuvorty]

On the PC and consumer side of things, Intel required a new motherboard and chipset if you wanted to upgrade your CPU. In other words, the CPUs from 1 generation wasn't compatible with the motherboard and chipset from another generation. Every subsequent generation (at least from Skylake onwards) required a new motherboard and chipset.

I don't know if this is the case with the Xeon line of CPUs, but based on past history, I am fairly confident this is the case with Xeon CPUs as well.

 

[vailr]

if highly freaked out about this then just get the 256GB drive and simply ignore it. You'll have to boot initially and put a "maintenance administer" account on the macOS instance there. But can get another internal drive and simply boot off of that for production. If it fails then swap in a replacement. If concerned that it has to be at the closest corner parts store drive and use one of those.

An external bootable SSD may also be an option, unless system security works to prevent it. Whether connected via an adapter cable to USB-C/Thunderbolt or USB 3.0 port, an external SSD (either SATA or NVMe) should work as a bootable drive. It's known to work on a normal Windows machine as a "Windows to Go" drive, and should/may also work with the 2019 Mac Pro.

Have there been any Youtube videos of someone installing & running Windows 10 on the new Mac Pro?

 

[danwells]

At least on the (equally recent) MBP 16", it's not only "known to work", it's officially supported - you have to turn off the T2 security by booting into restore mode, but Apple tells you how to do it and confirms it's an option.

My T2 security is already off in case I ever need this capability, because I'm more concerned about being able to external-boot if I ever need to grab data off a balky internal SSD than I am about someone stealing my Mac.