MP 7,1 Minimum most-upgradable 7,1 configuration

[fiatlux]

On the PC and consumer side of things, Intel required a new motherboard and chipset if you wanted to upgrade your CPU. In other words, the CPUs from 1 generation wasn't compatible with the motherboard and chipset from another generation. Every subsequent generation (at least from Skylake onwards) required a new motherboard and chipset.

Not necessarily, no. The motherboard in my kids' PC has an 8th gen Core i3 processor in a FCLGA1151 socket. Flashed with latest firmware it will support any 9th generation Core processor. And I would not be surprised if this support was extended to 10th generation desktop processors when they are released.

Similarly, flashing the MP4,1 with a 5,1 firmware allows one to use the later hex core processors.

Now, even if there was no upgrade path to newer generation CPUs, it could still be interesting to do a mid life upgrade of a machine with a higher-end but used CPU.

 

[SneakyTLoD]

We'll have to see if there are tampering screws or anything on the CPU that could result in a voided warranty if removed. If there's not then it should be fine to put in any compatible CPU you want. Just make sure you put the original CPU back in the machine before requesting warranty service.

This is no longer legal in many states in the US so I doubt they would bother. Technically it's not been legally federally since 1975 (Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975) but most people wouldn't sue due to the lower cost of the items and most states didn't have right to repair legislation to help force manufactures to do the right thing. There are also right to repair laws on the table in the EU but they have yet to pass. Either way, Apple hasn't really done this in the past with replaceable cpu's so I would highly doubt they would start now. Hopefully the new proposed legislation will help with getting 1st party parts such as the proprietary ssd's in the future.

 

[anshuvorty]

Not necessarily, no. The motherboard in my kids' PC has an 8th gen Core i3 processor in a FCLGA1151 socket. Flashed with latest firmware it will support any 9th generation Core processor. And I would not be surprised if this support was extended to 10th generation desktop processors when they are released.

Similarly, flashing the MP4,1 with a 5,1 firmware allows one to use the later hex core processors.

Now, even if there was no upgrade path to newer generation CPUs, it could still be interesting to do a mid life upgrade of a machine with a higher-end but used CPU.

With how quick the consumer CPU space changes, I'm not surprised Intel reversed course with the 8th and 9th generation CPUs, especially with Ryzen gaining in popularity and overtaking Intel.

I do recall that after Skylake, the CPUs required a new motherboard and the Tech Youtube community and other reviewers kept criticizing Intel for this.

 

[jasonmvp]

Now, even if there was no upgrade path to newer generation CPUs, it could still be interesting to do a mid life upgrade of a machine with a higher-end but used CPU.

I think there are other interesting upgrades that could actually be considered with a new Mac Pro, assuming the money and acceptance of risk. There are presently two sets of the Xeon W processors at play here:

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/series/125035/intel-xeon-w-processor.html

For the 28 and 24-core Mac Pros, Apple chose the "M" version of the chips, which allows them to scale to 2TB of RAM. Those... are stupidly expensive chips, MSRP. For instance, the 28-core 3275 has a price tag of ~$4500 for the 1TB version and $7450 for the 2TB. Obviously, both are pretty pricey, but if you want the 28 cores and don't ever expect to exceed 1TB... perhaps the non-M version is acceptable.

The 24-core chip is similar. $3350 for the 1TB version and $6350 for the 2TB. In each case, Intel is suggesting about a $3K difference between the two chips. So, some money might be saved on the upgrade since Apple isn't offering the non-Ms for either of those.

Maybe.

 

[thisisnotmyname]

I think there are other interesting upgrades that could actually be considered with a new Mac Pro, assuming the money and acceptance of risk. There are presently two sets of the Xeon W processors at play here:

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/series/125035/intel-xeon-w-processor.html

For the 28 and 24-core Mac Pros, Apple chose the "M" version of the chips, which allows them to scale to 2TB of RAM. Those... are stupidly expensive chips, MSRP. For instance, the 28-core 3275 has a price tag of ~$4500 for the 1TB version and $7450 for the 2TB. Obviously, both are pretty pricey, but if you want the 28 cores and don't ever expect to exceed 1TB... perhaps the non-M version is acceptable.

The 24-core chip is similar. $3350 for the 1TB version and $6350 for the 2TB. In each case, Intel is suggesting about a $3K difference between the two chips. So, some money might be saved on the upgrade since Apple isn't offering the non-Ms for either of those.

Maybe.

iFixit got a base model Mac Pro and is doing a tear down video very soon, then we'll learn more about how the CPU is in there. I'm 99.9999% sure you'll be able to easily physically replace it but whether there's a security mounting that may void warranty is yet to be seen. If not, should be trivial to take out an 8-core and put in a W3265 or W3275 (non-M variants) for those who want a lot of cores and don't want to pay for the big RAM capability. There's a tiny chance that Apple will have somehow banned the non-M variants but that would shock me. Buy from a vendor with a generous return policy (e.g. low restock fee) in case it doesn't work.

 

[TTD]

I've ordered one with the base 590x , plan on swapping that later on and adding more ram once it arrives.

One (stupid) question, I've currently got 2 of the LG 5ks to use with it, I know the base GPU will support two 5Ks at 60Hz, but can I just plug them straight into the thunderbolt 3 ports on the back? Or do I need dongles to connect them to the HDMI on the back of the MPX with the 590x card?

 

[thisisnotmyname]

I've ordered one with the base 590x , plan on swapping that later on and adding more ram once it arrives.

One (stupid) question, I've currently got 2 of the LG 5ks to use with it, I know the base GPU will support two 5Ks at 60Hz, but can I just plug them straight into the thunderbolt 3 ports on the back? Or do I need dongles to connect them to the HDMI on the back of the MPX with the 590x card?

Straight to the ports. Check out the Apple support article about which ports to use with each card though so you split them across multiple busses.

 

[TTD]

Thanks thisisnotmyname! I hadn’t seen that article, so one connected via the rear and one on top.

One other question about upgrading, with the base GPU, if you install a VEGA later on, do you just take the 570x out? Or is there any benefit/option to leaving that in the other MPX position?

 

[thisisnotmyname]

Thanks thisisnotmyname! I hadn’t seen that article, so one connected via the rear and one on top.

One other question about upgrading, with the base GPU, if you install a VEGA later on, do you just take the 570x out? Or is there any benefit/option to leaving that in the other MPX position?

It's an extra graphics card, it can still do work, really up to you if you want it there (maybe you want space for another MPX module or other double wide cards).

 

[hvfsl]

On the PC and consumer side of things, Intel required a new motherboard and chipset if you wanted to upgrade your CPU. In other words, the CPUs from 1 generation wasn't compatible with the motherboard and chipset from another generation. Every subsequent generation (at least from Skylake onwards) required a new motherboard and chipset.

I don't know if this is the case with the Xeon line of CPUs, but based on past history, I am fairly confident this is the case with Xeon CPUs as well.

The same Intel motherboard will normally support 2 gens of cpus (although will sometimes require a firmware update to support the latter generation). But then even if Apple did provide a firmware update in future, they might not release it to the public (newer machines with a newer gen of cpus might have the same hardware, but come with newer firmware).

So in the server space, you had for example:
Socket 2011 (which trash can Mac Pro has) supports Sandy Bridge-E and Ivy Bridge-E
Socket 2011v2 which supports Haswell-E and Broadwell-E

However, the great thing about using server chips is that in 5 years time, when companies replace all their old servers, you should be able to get some good deals on faster chips on eBay.

 

[thisisnotmyname]

The same Intel motherboard will normally support 2 gens of cpus (although will sometimes require a firmware update to support the latter generation). But then even if Apple did provide a firmware update in future, they might not release it to the public (newer machines with a newer gen of cpus might have the same hardware, but come with newer firmware).

So in the server space, you had for example:
Socket 2011 (which trash can Mac Pro has) supports Sandy Bridge-E and Ivy Bridge-E
Socket 2011v2 which supports Haswell-E and Broadwell-E

However, the great thing about using server chips is that in 5 years time, when companies replace all their old servers, you should be able to get some good deals on faster chips on eBay.

Future CPUs are a moot point, next gen Intel has already announced they are using a new socket.

 

[dermeister]

I ordered as follows:

• Base +
• 12-core +
• 4 TB SSD

Rationale is: 12-core gives faster ram. RAM can be bought cheaper. Radeon 580 is good enough for me. SSD seems replaceable but difficult with T2, rather have 4 TB boot drive which should be good for the life of the machine (10 years IMO -- unless Apple moves to ARM or removes OS support for no good reason). CPU seems it can be updated but Apple wants no part in that, which is fair.

Future CPUs are a moot point, next gen Intel has already announced they are using a new socket.

So the new Mac Pro won't get new CPUs? Pretty damn annoying.

 

[AidenShaw]

So the new Mac Pro won't get new CPUs? Pretty damn annoying.

No, it's life.

Do you want a new CPU to have more memory channels, faster memory, more PCIe lanes, faster PCIe, and faster embedded NICs?

Or do you want it to fit into a two year old socket?

Intel is going for the former.