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analogkid

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2003
109
0
Savannah
I wish Apple waited for Sandy Bridge, otherwise it's either C2D + 320M or iX + Intel IGP. Sandy Bridge's IGP is big improvement so it should be fine as GPU. To be honest, I couldn't care less about the CPU and GPU, the current ones are just fine for me. I would like to see 4GB RAM and better battery plus SSD in all models, then I'm fine. Price cut would be nice too.

If this rumor is true, I'm guessing C2D + 320M combo because that's what 13"ers have. Then early 2011 update with iX

Hi!
I'm not sure how you can be certain it won't be Sandy Bridge- the only release date I've seen is Q4 '10 and if this is announced the end of Sept and maybe not even shipping right away it could very well be one, after all Apple has had some early cpu samples in the Air before.

I think the British Bloke is being a little too adamant about Apple's direction, though he very well may be right, but still, the thought that apple wouldn't gimp on the graphics has me scratching my head, especially if it was in order to advance the CPU by a wide margin. For instance, the Macbook took a step back from the 9200 to go with Intel's 950. And report's of greater mass production might favor a single chip solution.

With this release speculation should be kept open. There are a few ways this could play out, for better or worse.
 

Hellhammer

Moderator emeritus
Dec 10, 2008
22,164
582
Finland
Hi!
I'm not sure how you can be certain it won't be Sandy Bridge- the only release date I've seen is Q4 '10 and if this is announced the end of Sept and maybe not even shipping right away it could very well be one, after all Apple has had some early cpu samples in the Air before.

I think the British Bloke is being a little too adamant about Apple's direction, though he very well may be right, but still, the thought that apple wouldn't gimp on the graphics has me scratching my head, especially if it was in order to advance the CPU by a wide margin. For instance, the Macbook took a step back from the 9200 to go with Intel's 950. And report's of greater mass production might favor a single chip solution.

With this release speculation should be kept open. There are a few ways this could play out, for better or worse.

It was Q1 2011 before but Intel made it earlier but I doubt it will be early Q4 2010 but who knows. We don't know what chips Intel will release in the beginning, might be just mainstream CPUs i.e. no chips suitable for MBA. Sandy Bridge is not impossible and I certainly hope that Apple uses it but we still lack information about SB. Good point that Apple may announce it in Sep and then say it will ship e.g. late October.

There are just too many options :p
 

analogkid

macrumors regular
Jun 9, 2003
109
0
Savannah
Not an informed guess, but I'd like to speculate that with the broadening of the line Apple is gearing these for more penetration into the future of a optical'less world. I think this might actually be a big launch for Apple, so they would want the platform to be as close to future models going forward as possible.
Let me guess, Sandy Bridge w/integrated graphics and nothing else, which would be their preferred architecture for a notebook slated for eventual mass adoption. They may skim the margin a little at the beginning to get them off to a good start, so maybe starting at a grand and working up. All models will be SSD only, perhaps, but hopefully not, be chips on the mobo. They may go with Corning's "gorilla" glass for the screen cover. I wouldn't be surprised to see 3g onboard, and maybe one extra port- perhaps a sd slot or ethernet?
Oh, and I think all models will only be available in limeberry polka dot style.

These are the facts.
 

iMacmatician

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2008
4,249
55
I think they will bring prices down by using the Core i3/i5/i7 ULV processors, not the usual notebook CPU's.
Possible but there will be a large frequency drop, at least with both cores enabled.

It was Q1 2011 before but Intel made it earlier but I doubt it will be early Q4 2010 but who knows. We don't know what chips Intel will release in the beginning, might be just mainstream CPUs i.e. no chips suitable for MBA. Sandy Bridge is not impossible and I certainly hope that Apple uses it but we still lack information about SB. Good point that Apple may announce it in Sep and then say it will ship e.g. late October.

There are just too many options :p
There's some leaked information lately but they are all desktop CPUs so far. Doesn't mean we won't see mobile CPUs released at the same or a similar time though.
 

Zulu1

macrumors member
Apr 28, 2010
30
0
Based on what has been said here, my question would be: If they are only going to bump specs with the C2D, why wait so long, why not just release it with the other PC's already released?
 

Yinmay

macrumors regular
Apr 19, 2010
159
8
Since we're all speculating about the next MBA, what are the odds of an AMD/ATI combo instead of i3+Intel HD or C2D+320m?
 

Joel Horn

macrumors newbie
May 23, 2010
15
1
Add 3G to make it a true take-everywhere machine.

More ram is essential, and more battery life, but if they would add 3G that we could use on our AT&T account then this becomes truly take anywhere, no more running around looking for a hotel lobby or a starbucks to connected.
 

macbook123

macrumors 68000
Original poster
Feb 11, 2006
1,869
85
Based on what has been said here, my question would be: If they are only going to bump specs with the C2D, why wait so long, why not just release it with the other PC's already released?

Great point.

I'm hopeful the design will be changed: better display with more pixels (either higher density or larger display or smaller bezel or all of the above), hopefully keep the tapering though.

I'm wondering if by dropping the HDD option and going all SSD they can make the thing thinner (and lighter) overall, assuming the HDD was the thickest component...
 

TheBritishBloke

macrumors 68030
Jul 21, 2009
2,532
0
United Kingdom
Great point.

I'm hopeful the design will be changed: better display with more pixels (either higher density or larger display or smaller bezel or all of the above), hopefully keep the tapering though.

I'm wondering if by dropping the HDD option and going all SSD they can make the thing thinner (and lighter) overall, assuming the HDD was the thickest component...

I could see them trying to make the bezel smaller to save weight. I think it would also look nicer. Not sure about extra pixels because that does mean more power. Maybe same as MBP 13".

The HDD and SSD are the same size (1.8") so it doesn't make a difference in size.

I doubt they'd use AMD chips, they have too big a relationship with Intel, but I guess its possible.
 

iMacmatician

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2008
4,249
55
Since we're all speculating about the next MBA, what are the odds of an AMD/ATI combo instead of i3+Intel HD or C2D+320m?
I'd say there's a decent chance of Llano in the next next MacBook Air, if only from Apple's increased emphasis on graphics lately.

Out of all the Macs I think the MBA has the highest chance of using an AMD processor.
 

Burnincoco

macrumors regular
May 6, 2007
132
133
I3 and 320M isn't possible, sorry to sink your boat.

Apple won't use an i3 in the MBA for the same reason they didn't use one in the 13" MBP. If you want integrated graphics with a core i3 you HAVE to use the Intel HD Graphics, which suck. Apple wouldn't do that, it would leave them with a machine worse than this rev.

I guess maybe a 2.13 C2D low end and 2.26 high end. 4Gb ram in high end. 320M graphics In both.

Oh. And $1400 ? All I can say is... Hahahahaha. You have more luck winning the lottery this weekend ;)

I Say What! What! In the Butt!


Intel, FTC Tentatively Settle Antitrust Dispute

Agreement resolves charges that chip maker illegally impeded competition, frames future competitive behavior.

http://www.itchannelplanet.com/business_news/article.php/3897166/Intel,+FTC+Tentatively+Settle+Antitrust+Dispute
 

TheBritishBloke

macrumors 68030
Jul 21, 2009
2,532
0
United Kingdom
I Say What! What! In the Butt!


Intel, FTC Tentatively Settle Antitrust Dispute

Agreement resolves charges that chip maker illegally impeded competition, frames future competitive behavior.

http://www.itchannelplanet.com/business_news/article.php/3897166/Intel,+FTC+Tentatively+Settle+Antitrust+Dispute

Well thanks for posting this. Good to know that it's finally over with. I'm probably going to buy the MBP next year if they get rid of the stupid intel graphics.
 

Hellhammer

Moderator emeritus
Dec 10, 2008
22,164
582
Finland
Well thanks for posting this. Good to know that it's finally over with. I'm probably going to buy the MBP next year if they get rid of the stupid intel graphics.

I can't see Apple putting THREE GPUs in MBP: Intel IGP, NVIDIA IGP and discrete NVIDIA. It would be ridiculous. I'm looking forward on Sandy Bridge's IGP, it's said to be a significant bump over Westmere's. Plus, the current IGP is about as fast as 9400M in benchmarks so I wouldn't be surprised if it's a driver issue, not hardware issue
 

mangrove

macrumors 6502
Jul 10, 2010
440
0
FL, USA
You guys all forgot more about chips than I ever will know.

So this newbie throws in the towel--could Apple put in a proprietary chip like they did in the iPad, but only bigger and better?
 

iMacmatician

macrumors 601
Jul 20, 2008
4,249
55
I can't see Apple putting THREE GPUs in MBP: Intel IGP, NVIDIA IGP and discrete NVIDIA.
I agree. (Although the Intel IGP is on-package (to be on-die), therefore not taking up extra space, that still means 3 GPUs isn't really "Apple-like.")

Plus, the current IGP is about as fast as 9400M in benchmarks so I wouldn't be surprised if it's a driver issue, not hardware issue
According to Bright Side of News, the drivers are the real problem (although the hardware isn't exactly great).

Problem with those drivers is the fact that "GMA500 suffers from utterly crappy drivers. Intel didn't buy any drivers from Imagination Technologies for the SGX, but hired Tungsten Graphics to write the drivers for it. Despite the repeated protest from the side of Imagination Technologies to Intel, Tungsten drivers DO NOT use the onboard firmware of the chip, forcing the chip to resort to software vertex processing." There you have it folks, the reason why "Intel graphics sux" is not exactly hardware, but rather doubtful political decisions to have a VMware subsidiary writing drivers that are forcing CPU to do the work.
That looks to be for Windows but I'd be surprised if it was any better for Mac OS X.

You guys all forgot more about chips than I ever will know.

So this newbie throws in the towel--could Apple put in a proprietary chip like they did in the iPad, but only bigger and better?
I think it would be possible, but since the iPad's CPU is ARM-based instead of x86-based (Intel and AMD), software would have to be modified to run on the ARM chip, or emulation would have to be used (which is slow).

The most we could realistically get is slightly higher clocks than the normal highest-end chip or a release slightly earlier than the normal release date. (Original MBA was an exception.)
 

DannoTheManno

macrumors newbie
Aug 3, 2010
20
0
I Say What! What! In the Butt!


Intel, FTC Tentatively Settle Antitrust Dispute

Agreement resolves charges that chip maker illegally impeded competition, frames future competitive behavior.

http://www.itchannelplanet.com/business_news/article.php/3897166/Intel,+FTC+Tentatively+Settle+Antitrust+Dispute

Does this mean there will be new MBP's with chips and not using Intels graphics? If you had to hazard a guess, when?

Are you of the opinion that the MBA refresh will be rocking an i3 with separate graphics?


I'm not computer by any means so trying to work this all out as I'm going to buy a 13" MBP before the start of uni but unsure as whether to wait for the Air release to see if it has a 8hour battery 4gig of ram as then it would be a contender for my cash.
 

Joel Horn

macrumors newbie
May 23, 2010
15
1
3G capable MBA?

I also do not know 1% of what you guys know but is a 3G capable MBA even possible and if so is it feasible? I travel a lot and carry a MBP 15" and it is too heavy and too big. I keep thinking about the MBA 13" and will probably get that soon if the MBA is not upgraded. But I spend a lot of time trying to find a wireless hotspot, and even though it is getting easier it is not great for trains, buses, cabs, etc, so the idea of being able to connect the MBA with 3G seems perfect. What do you all think? Thanks.
 

SamTheeGeek

macrumors 6502a
Jan 12, 2010
569
51
United Kingdom
well ... all i can say it gotta be worth it in spec's and i cant wait to see it :D maybe some cosmetic change too ?

so yea lets see what apple got for us :)
 

dudulang

macrumors member
Jan 18, 2010
68
0
I also do not know 1% of what you guys know but is a 3G capable MBA even possible and if so is it feasible? I travel a lot and carry a MBP 15" and it is too heavy and too big. I keep thinking about the MBA 13" and will probably get that soon if the MBA is not upgraded. But I spend a lot of time trying to find a wireless hotspot, and even though it is getting easier it is not great for trains, buses, cabs, etc, so the idea of being able to connect the MBA with 3G seems perfect. What do you all think? Thanks.

I agree, I deeply hope a MBA with 3G, but it seems impossible. Because that would reduce the sales of iPads. Now Apple is focusing on introducing its new product and making it popular, it would not let any other product competing with iPad.
 

thinkdesign

macrumors 6502
May 12, 2010
341
0
"model spacing theory" so easily runs amok...

There surely must be a limit to how many products Apple is willing to offer at once, and how "close" different models will be allowed to get. But for us to speculate on this and try to project it into the future, seems to be the most foundation-less kind of projecting we do.

The Kahney book shows how the returning Jobs cut the bloated computer line down to 4. But obviously that number of products has been climbing back up ever since. In the same vein, I happened to see a documentary on McDonald's before Ray Krok bought it, how simple the menu was. And how integral that simplicity was to the business plan. Compare that with the current stores with a long menu and the menu being shown on big video screens jammed in side by side. It gives a rather fuzzy image to read from afar, but I guess those screens allow instant change.

Back on topic. To say that the MacBook Air will never get 3G, because that would encroach on sales of the iPad.... aaaaggghhhhh.

When they express recent trends in their sales, in this language, was it we've become "a mobility company", the smallest possible interpretation would be -- that COULD be nothing more than a vague euphemism for "we've become a company making over half of its profits from iOS & app/music/book selling thru iOS". But I think that taking "a mobility company" at face value is an interpretation that resonates with an Apple facing the facts of current trends in the real world and in the marketplace. Specifically, other laptop makers aren't offering the option of cellular modems, for nothing.

Some other trends favoring cell modems integrated into the macbook line some day: 1.) the dream of Wi-Fi hotspots all over, all gloriously unlocked, has died. I happen to live in a city that promised to build a free Wi-Fi system as part of revivifying the downtown Main Street area, which has been withering on the vine as malls and big box / category-killer stores suck the money out. Reality: the free Wi-Fi never got installed, and all the home Wi-Fi's are de facto locked, even if the list of Wi-Fi systems your computer/etc. finds, initially seems to show that some are locked and some are unlocked. 2.) Here's another trend: Geographic dispersion. As housing prices climbed in the last 25 years, people went farther from centers of employment to buy houses. They decided to put up with longer commutes, as the tradeoff. Heck, by the end of the 1980's already there were people employed in Manhattan, commuting daily from the eastern end of Pennsylvania! The horrifically long commutes of more than an hour each way, were no longer just an L.A. thing. If you're on a commuter train, or bus, or in a carpool where you aren't the driver, what do you do with that 1-1/2 or 2 or 2-1/2 hour ride? And for sure, that burb in the boonies doesn't have any free Wi-Fi.

My route to optimism on 3G goes like this: The recent manifestations of design growth and design leadership at Apple have been: The iPhone (had wi-fi, when plenty of competitors didn't... had relatively good battery life and now it's even better... and got a big effort on the Retina display which leapfrogs over the whole market even when the market wasn't demanding it), and the iPad (great screen too... big battery-life in tune with real-world needs... AND A CELLULAR MODEM OPTION). All of these things I've listed in parenthesis, seem to indicate a historic THAW in Jobs's earlier negative thinking as expressed in his exaggerated statement "Design is about saying 'No'."

Of course Apple has some products that are gathering moss from being too skimpy to begin with, and being updated not enough. But look at where the growth is in Job's on-the-job education and maturation as the decision-maker that the designers report to. Look at the growth in profits which percentage-wise too is shifting towards the products with less stinginess and more leadership in their designs.

If this recent design approach of "let's lead" spreads just one rung up the product ladder (weightwise, which would be logical if your direction is to be "a mobility company"), that rung IS the Air. Sooner or later, if Apple is smart, the revised Air or a new post-Air ultralight, could make a great leap forward. Could.

What mobile worker wants a laptop with no handle or grip-ability features of any kind, which is so heavy that if you drop it, it'll break a bone in your foot? :eek: I lifted a 17" MBp the other day, and the weight was actually frightening. Drop that anvil on your foot, and you'll break more than one.
 

Joel Horn

macrumors newbie
May 23, 2010
15
1
If you guys want 3G in your computer, don't be lazy, carry a MiFi or 3G USB modem.

It is not about lazy, it is about trying to carry as few items as possible. I have to already carry an extra pouch for: an extra battery, a projector connector, an airplane plug, a car power adaptor, iphone headphones, a card reader, a cord to connect my iphone to my MBP, the list goes on. IF the MBA gets a more powerful battery and 3G then I can at least eliminate the airplane power cord and maybe the car charger. So I am looking to minimize what I have to carry not add. And I travel alot sometimes 5 meetings a day that I unpack and pack and then run for the airport. So, not lazy just trying to be efficient, fast, and hopefully help keep more work coming in.
 

stevemoore

macrumors newbie
Nov 3, 2008
25
0
less stuff

Joel has it exactly right - the whole point (especially with the MBA) is to travel light. STUFF TIES YOU DOWN. I love being able to scoot about with one very slim bag or case.

I carry the MBA itself, a trimmed down VGA adaptor (I cut away the chunky plastic surround), a metal remote, a 3G USB dongle, a postage-stamp sized USB-dock connector (robbed from an old car charger), a set of earbuds, some business cards and a pen. EVERYTHING fits into a slim portfolio (I just cut some slits into the padding inside which everything slides neatly into).

http://www.knomobags.com/uk/men/laptop-sleeves/13-inch/leather-sleeve.html/

I can put the AC adaptor in my jeans pocket if I need it and I have a flash-drive on my keychain and THAT IS IT.

If I can avoid EVER having to carry my Plantronics headset for doing podcasts or Skype calls (Skype on iPhone with iOS4 has helped) that'd be great. Having a mic input on the mini-jack like the MBPs would do that.

Getting shot of the 3G USB dongle would be great too (tethering just kills battery). An in-built microsim would achieve this.

... and a better battery would help me dump the AC adaptor - I already have spares or a LED Cinema Display most places I go, but right now I'm on a 3-hour train journey with no power. That's about the upper limit if I use the 3G dongle with WiFi off and brightness right down.

----

So, are these things I need? No, not really, but they'll make me buy it. What I _need_ I guess are a larger SSD (I'll never go back to a spinning disc) and a bit more RAM. I hate the glass-covered display too. I don't think I've used the DVD drive more than once a year.

----

And what is ESSENTIAL? Better hinges. If they can't last for my 18-month typical use of a laptop, it is really crap. And they can't. They've failed on both my MBAs, and my friends' too.
 

Joel Horn

macrumors newbie
May 23, 2010
15
1
Joel has it exactly right - the whole point (especially with the MBA) is to travel light. STUFF TIES YOU DOWN. I love being able to scoot about with one very slim bag or case...

http://www.knomobags.com/uk/men/laptop-sleeves/13-inch/leather-sleeve.html/

Getting shot of the 3G USB dongle would be great too (tethering just kills battery). An in-built microsim would achieve this.... and a better battery would help me dump the AC adaptor ...
----

Wow, someone who really gets it. I do wonder if Apple is thinking about us. I do not know if there are enough of us to worry about but I plan to borrow some of your ideas (thanks), I don't need a larger SSD but more ram, more battery power and a built-in 3G would help a lot. An ios/osx combo would actually help as well.
 
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