Notch on a Pro Laptop - A Modern Day Disaster

[ascender]

I'd like to try it first to see how it works in practice tbh. The fact you're not really losing any screen estate because of it bodes well, as does the fact its in a natural "dead spot" (relatively speaking) of macOS.

At least the multiple daily threads and polls about the notch will make a nice change from the "do you like the TouchBar" ones which will be sadly missed.

I wonder if these notch-related polls will last 5 years like the TouchBar ones did? I'm already looking forward to the "will you miss the notch" ones which I guess we can expect in 3-5 years time.

 

[KennyJr]

Run a strip of black electrician's tape across the top of the screen - just enough to cover the notch - and you'll be fine .. or .. don't tape it - appreciate the extra screen real estate - and thank the notch for not taking up the full width of the screen.

 

[zakarhino]

The only two camps I can identify are people that think:

1) the notch is eating into my real estate! this sucks!
2) the previous top bezel area surrounding the camera has been reclaimed to house the menu bar! awesome!

I think camp no. 1 is the wrong way to think about it, it's pessimistic and unrealistic. The camera had to go somewhere. If you want a higher res camera that can let in more light, you need a sufficiently large area to house it. If you want ultra thin top bezels you can have a very s***** camera that looks like garbage, you can't have both. I feel like the only reason people are upset about it in this particular instance is because they looked at too many unrealistic renders of a completely bezel-free display and forgot that Apple, despite their impressive hardware, are not magicians.

Apple could have gone the route of a notch-free garbage camera design but all of you would then be complaining about "Why does a pro device have such a terrible camera especially when all of us are working from home on zoom calls!!!" There's no winning with a crowd that fails to see the merits of the entire package under a realistic lens.

Camp no. 2 are in the right. The reclaiming of the upper bezel to house the menu bar is a huge win for those of us that wanted as much real estate as possible for our windows but previously had to hide the menu bar to accomplish that. If I had the option I would want the menu bar visible without feeling like I'm sacrificing usable desktop space (everything under the notch is usable desk space, the same 16:10 area as the previous 16" would have with the menu bar hidden). From a software perspective they handle the notch very well by virtually reducing what 'full screen' means to unoptimized apps such that they don't expand above the bottom of the notch). The notch accomplishes the goal of maximum real estate without hiding the menu bar, it is the perfect solution and it's literally the only solution I would ever want.

Yes, you heard me correctly. I would choose having the notch over a bezel-free design even if there were no compromises on camera quality and under-display FaceID/camera tech has been perfected. Why? Because I want to be able to put a sticker over the camera. The notch lets me do that, I'm just covering up a lens and some glass. An under display camera means I would have to cover up the actual display.

Apple, keep the notch around on these Macs forever to facilitate the vast number of people that want minimal wasted bezel space at the same time as flexibility to cover the camera. Or at the very least give us a hardware switch to disconnect the camera module completely.

 

[Ethosik]

The only two camps I can identify are people that think:

1) the notch is eating into my real estate! this sucks!
2) the previous top bezel area surrounding the camera has been reclaimed to house the menu bar! awesome!

I think camp no. 1 is the wrong way to think about it, it's pessimistic and unrealistic. The camera had to go somewhere. If you want a higher res camera that can let in more light, you need a sufficiently large area to house it. If you want ultra thin top bezels you can have a very s***** camera that looks like garbage, you can't have both. I feel like the only reason people are upset about it in this particular instance is because they looked at too many unrealistic renders of a completely bezel-free display and forgot that Apple, despite their impressive hardware, are not magicians.

Apple could have gone the route of a notch-free garbage camera design but all of you would then be complaining about "Why does a pro device have such a terrible camera especially when all of us are working from home on zoom calls!!!" There's no winning with a crowd that fails to see the merits of the entire package under a realistic lens.

Camp no. 2 are in the right. The reclaiming of the upper bezel to house the menu bar is a huge win for those of us that wanted as much real estate as possible for our windows but previously had to hide the menu bar to accomplish that. If I had the option I would want the menu bar visible without feeling like I'm sacrificing usable desktop space (everything under the notch is usable desk space, the same 16:10 area as the previous 16" would have with the menu bar hidden). From a software perspective they handle the notch very well by virtually reducing what 'full screen' means to unoptimized apps such that they don't expand above the bottom of the notch). The notch accomplishes the goal of maximum real estate without hiding the menu bar, it is the perfect solution and it's literally the only solution I would ever want.

Yes, you heard me correctly. I would choose having the notch over a bezel-free design even if there were no compromises on camera quality and under-display FaceID/camera tech has been perfected. Why? Because I want to be able to put a sticker over the camera. The notch lets me do that, I'm just covering up a lens and some glass. An under display camera means I would have to cover up the actual display.

Apple, keep the notch around on these Macs forever to facilitate the vast number of people that want minimal wasted bezel space at the same time as flexibility to cover the camera. Or at the very least give us a hardware switch to disconnect the camera module completely.

Really? #1 is pessimistic and unrealistic? I guess you only use the basic software. I have software that has drop downs that go further than where the notch is so it is a legitimate concern. How in the world is it "unrealistic"?

 

[zakarhino]

Really? #1 is pessimistic and unrealistic? I guess you only use the basic software. I have software that has drop downs that go further than where the notch is so it is a legitimate concern. How in the world is it "unrealistic"?

What are you talking about? "I have software that has drop downs that go further than where the notch is" what does that even mean? The OS has been modified to prevent ANY content from being obscured by the notch. The screen area directly to the left and right of the notch is not used for anything except the menu bar and apps that OPT IN to using it. You need to read the info Apple have released on how the notch is managed in the OS. That or wait for people to get them next week to see if what you think is a problem actually is or not.

Doesn't matter if you're using "basic software" or the world's most complicated app suite, you'll never run into a situation where the notch is a workflow-disrupting problem.

 

[aeternitas]

Same here. I was in the market for a new MBP. I think I'll pass for now. I'll push my late 2016 for 2 more years and see if Apple finally gets rid of the notch.

Still... asking this on MacRumors. It's all Apple fanboys and apologist here, they will all say they are fine with the notch.

 

[Ethosik]

What are you talking about? "I have software that has drop downs that go further than where the notch is" what does that even mean? The OS has been modified to prevent ANY content from being obscured by the notch. The screen area directly to the left and right of the notch is not used for anything except the menu bar and apps that OPT IN to using it. You need to read the info Apple have released on how the notch is managed in the OS. That or wait for people to get them next week to see if what you think is a problem actually is or not.

Doesn't matter if you're using "basic software" or the world's most complicated app suite, you'll never run into a situation where the notch is a workflow-disrupting problem.

What is to the left of the notch? Dropdown menus of the currently selected software. I have some software that has a dozen drop downs and they go further to the right than the vertical center of the screen (right where the notch would be). So yes, the notch would obstruct those drop down menus. How that works, I don't know. Would there be a scroll bar for accessing the remaining drop downs? Will the extra drop downs suddenly shift to the right of the notch and leading into the notification/icon area too?

Basic software = maybe 2 or 3 drop down menus?
Worlds most complicated app suite = dozen or more drop down menus.

 

[zakarhino]

What is to the left of the notch? Dropdown menus of the currently selected software. I have some software that has a dozen drop downs and they go further to the right than the vertical center of the screen (right where the notch would be). So yes, the notch would obstruct those drop down menus. How that works, I don't know. Would there be a scroll bar for accessing the remaining drop downs? Will the extra drop downs suddenly shift to the right of the notch and leading into the notification/icon area too?

Basic software = maybe 2 or 3 drop down menus?
Worlds most complicated app suite = dozen or more drop down menus.

But the top of the dropdown menu is always the bottom of the menu bar; the bottom of the menu bar here is also the bottom of the notch. So there's never going to be a scenario where the top of your menu dropdown goes above the bottom of the notch. If for some reason there is I don't think it would take Apple very long to push an update.

 

[Ethosik]

Same here. I was in the market for a new MBP. I think I'll pass for now. I'll push my late 2016 for 2 more years and see if Apple finally gets rid of the notch.

Still... asking this on MacRumors. It's all Apple fanboys and apologist here, they will all say they are fine with the notch.

Yep. I have $3,500 to spend and can even go up to $4,000 if I wanted. The hardware is good and it would be an instant buy if the notch was not there. However, I will now be waiting for reviews for more complex software that has a lot of dropdowns in the menu bar to see how it works.

 

[Ethosik]

But the top of the dropdown menu is always the bottom of the menu bar; the bottom of the menu bar here is also the bottom of the notch. So there's never going to be a scenario where the top of your menu dropdown goes above the bottom of the notch. If for some reason there is I don't think it would take Apple very long to push an update.

I think you are confusing what the menu bar is. What is to the left of the notch? Drop downs like Edit, View, Help and more.

Now, out of the screen shot I provided, the left of the notch is "Facetime, Edit, Video, Window and Help". I have software that has dozen of these dropdowns. Which goes well passed the center of the screen where the notch is. THIS is the concerning part. Will there be a scroll bar now to see these extra dropdowns? Will it suddenly shift to the right of the notch which leads into my Creative Cloud, Dropbox, OneDrive, and other status icons?

Here is one from Apple's site that shows Photoshop. I have software that has a couple more dropdowns than Photoshop and right now Photoshop is right at the notch.

 

[ninethirty]

"Modern day disaster," good lord, people aren't satisfied these days unless they're outraged 24/7 about the most trivial things.

 

[zakarhino]

I think you are confusing what the menu bar is. What is to the left of the notch? Drop downs like Edit, View, Help and more.

View attachment 1871703

Now, out of the screen shot I provided, the left of the notch is "Facetime, Edit, Video, Window and Help". I have software that has dozen of these dropdowns. Which goes well passed the center of the screen where the notch is. THIS is the concerning part. Will there be a scroll bar now to see these extra dropdowns? Will it suddenly shift to the right of the notch which leads into my Creative Cloud, Dropbox, OneDrive, and other status icons?

Here is one from Apple's site that shows Photoshop. I have software that has a couple more dropdowns than Photoshop and right now Photoshop is right at the notch.

View attachment 1871706

Ohhhh! Now I see what you mean. I thought you meant the actual dropdown menus themselves, not the menu bar buttons that activate the dropdown like "File" "Edit" etc.. My apologies for the misinterpretation.

I'm not sure how they'll solve it but I'm sure they have a solution. I get the same issue on my non-notch MBP for some software so clearly our shared problem existed pre-notch. Sometimes the menu bar options actually cut into the widgets on the right hand side of the display which makes the widgets disappear entirely and I can't use them unless I move to a bigger external display.

Maybe the area on both sides becomes scrollable or there's a button to show additional menu options that don't fit on the left side of the notch. I'm hoping they give us an option for either one.

 

[Ethosik]

Ohhhh! Now I see what you mean. I thought you meant the actual dropdown menus themselves, not the menu bar buttons that activate the dropdown like "File" "Edit" etc.. My apologies for the misinterpretation.

I'm not sure how they'll solve it but I'm sure they have a solution. I get the same issue on my non-notch MBP for some software so clearly our shared problem existed pre-notch. Sometimes the menu bar options actually cut into the widgets on the right hand side of the display which makes the widgets disappear entirely and I can't use them unless I move to a bigger external display.

Maybe the area on both sides becomes scrollable or there's a button to show additional menu options that don't fit on the left side of the notch. I'm hoping they give us an option for either one.

Yes but the notch suddenly added even MORE restrictions to the menu bar when its not necessary. Which might lead to even MORE software interfering with the status icons than before if the extra drop downs get pushed to the right of the notch.

 

[Voxis]

I dont approve because it really disturbs me, It just grabs my attention, I cant stop looking at it, look away knowing it is there, look back, it gets my attention again. the more I look at it, the more I dislike it.

I probably still buy it, put it in docking mode permanently.

Edit: and it is expensive, and if apple decides to remove it in the next refresh, im screwed lol

 

[Marty80]

I hate to say this but why would you overlook this beast of a machine for a notch.

The notch is not even in the viewing area, but located on the menu bar. If you spend most of your time looking at the menu bar you seriously need help.

This may be Apples biggest update in ten years. As it goes we don’t see much big updates from Apple, why dismiss it for a notch!

My guess is there are many windows trolls coming out of the woodwork, or are those that are nitpicking all the nook and cranny’s of the machine.

 

[Saturn007]

LOL! It really seemed that The Onion or SNL had taken over the Apple Spaceship.

I read a bunch of the stories and comments yesterday, then woke up this morning thinking it had all been an early April Fool's joke!

It reminds of that hilarious video spoof/interview with a supposed Apple engineer about dongles — and Apple figuring it could cash in, create laughable misery, and their customers would not only buy them, they'd buy into it.

No matter the excuses or post hoc rationalizations, the notch is glaringly poor design. I'm not a Steve Jobs fan boy — he presided over many a debacle — but I’m quite confident he would never have OK'd this aesthetically. He would have told the engineering team, “You have six weeks to fit a better camera into a thin bezel or you better start looking for a job elsewhere!” He would have mocked — or, rather, derided — the developers and promoters of the notch. And, the engineering team would have worked 24-7 and delivered a notchless Mac and notchless iPhone.

This is another case of Group Think. Once the notch was approved by certain executives and became acceptable in the iPhone, it starting taking over Apple design and was treated — not as a problem — but as a “feature”. The iPad will be next. And, then the MacBook Air. Yech!

Apple design has further lost its way — way off into the thicket and deep woods — and it had already gone off track with much of the work by Jonny Ive.

The Romans were right:

De gustibus non est disputandum.​

 

[Macalway]

I love this. Not 'A disaster' (which it isn't btw), but a "Modern day disaster".

Like this is the result of illness or something. Maybe we should defund Apple?

"Supply chain woes leads to disastrous Notch"

 

[Wreckus]

I think you guys worried about the notch covering up menu bar drop downs to wait until the MBP comes out and see what the comments are. I’m sure Apple thought about this and have a solution for this and relayed this to developers so they can update their apps.

nothing to stress over IMO.

 

[Ethosik]

I think you guys worried about the notch covering up menu bar drop downs to wait until the MBP comes out and see what the comments are. I’m sure Apple thought about this and have a solution for this and relayed this to developers so they can update their apps.

nothing to stress over IMO.

Well that is what we are saying. I have a ceiling of $4,000 I can spend on the new laptops, it would be an INSTANT BUY but its not JUST due to the notch. Now I need to wait (like you said) for reviews/others with the laptop before making my decision. If they just didn't have the notch, my order would already be placed.

 

[Wando64]

I have a Macbook Pro and I definitely won’t be ‘upgrading’ to this awful looking thing.

Clearly you don’t need an upgrade.
The notch is by the by.
If you’d need the processing power or the ram you’d put up with the notch.

 

[TiggrToo]

This is ridiculous, what on Earth were they thinking?

I have a Macbook Pro and I definitely won’t be ‘upgrading’ to this awful looking thing. There is no need for any fancy cameras or even face id on a pro macbook.

Regardless if the notch area goes black in fullscreen mode, it will still cause massive problems. People often have 2/3 windows open at the same time and that huge notch will massively interfere.

Has Apple forgotten why people buy the Macbook Pro? It’s like the Mac Pro all over again, Apple started screwing with bin designs until they realised all Pro users wanted was a powerful computer so they could do their work.

I can’t be the only one feeling this way, as someone who owns multiple apple products.

 

[The Other One]

Man, you whippersnappers with your excellent eyesight doing work directly on a laptop screen. Mine'll have the lid closed with a 48" OLED display attached to it 99.5% of the time. It's the only way I can get any work done without feeling utterly claustrophobic. Or squinting a lot. LOL

 

[Mr. Dee]

Most people got use to the notch on the iPhone, I have been using my M1 MacBook Pro for nearly year now with the Touchbar; and even though there is no major benefit, there is no disadvantage either. I will have go to the Apple store next week and play with it before I write it off. I wrote off the iPhone 13 and Cinematic mode, but when you actually use it, its a big deal.

 

[Ahboyd]

I love the notch.

Love the notch too. It didn't bother me since iPhone X. On MBP14, the narrow bezel will give an immersive effect.

 

[You’re not me]

I guess the notch is going to become a regular thing on more and more of their displays. They’re going to have to own it and somehow spin it as a feature only Apple has. I personally think it’s fugly.