Palm’s phone sales plummet; stock hammered

[gkarris]

Pride comes before the fall...

Wasn't the CEO of Palm saying that they have the best phone and it's going to cost?

Aren't they charging $400 for it, and they have the new more inexpensive one, but they cost more than the $99 iPhone and I've seen Android phones for $49 (or free) subsidized...

Oh well. Their last ditch effort would be to give the phones for FREE on Sprint and Verizon and that may save them...

EDIT: looked it up, I guess the Pixi is $49 and the Pre is $149 - still, need to be FREE at this point...

 

[LethalWolfe]

What reviewers? WebOS was reviewed very well by sites like Brighthand, Engadget, and Gizmodo, etc

As I have been told a number of times in the past few days (by relative newbs none the less), this is an Apple-centric site so it is everyone must love all that is Apple and make negative statements about any company that competes w/Apple in anyway. If you want to be objective go someplace else.

Apparently some people think MacRumors should only be populated by fanboys.

More on topic, almsot every review I saw of the Pre gave very good reviews to WebOS but gave disappointing reviews to the hardware.


Lethal

 

[roadbloc]

Apparently some people think MacRumors should only be populated by fanboys.

Now that is a shame. We call know it's just the odd couple that ruin it for everyone. But I somehow agree, because the few fanboys here have a nasty habit of getting EVERYWHERE on the forums.

They must, live, see, breathe and eat thinking about how good Apple is all the time. Since they turned mac, the air is sweeter, the world is more friendly, hell, even their car is more fuel efficient.

^ The mind of a fanboy.

 

[benzslrpee]

fan boys or not, Pre was something they should have released back when the 700p was the successor of the 650. or after the 700w. or maybe when the first iPhone came out. or when...

this will be another classic b-school example in a few years of how a CEO just couldn't see far enough and steer the company correctly. Rubenstein did what he could but let's face it:

- Palm didn't have the bankroll Google, Apple and Microsoft has
- Palm didn't have the marketing team that those three have
- Palm completely mis-read just how important multitasking and a physical keyboard was for actual consumers, not folks who hang out on tech forums or write for tech blogs...if you're going to use that as a plan of attack, make sure enough people actually care
- more than likely, Palm just didn't know who they were trying to attract
- Sprint
- Droid, Nexus One, Windows Phone 7
- Ed Colligan simply screwed Palm too deep into the ground

and voila.

 

[kdarling]

Some of Palm's main mistakes were:

1) Going Sprint exclusive at first, thus letting Android get a huge foothold.

2) Wimpy advertising.

3) Trying to control app distribution like Apple at first.

 

[LethalWolfe]

- Palm didn't have the bankroll Google, Apple and Microsoft has
- Palm didn't have the marketing team that those three have
- Palm completely mis-read just how important multitasking and a physical keyboard was for actual consumers, not folks who hang out on tech forums or write for tech blogs...if you're going to use that as a plan of attack, make sure enough people actually care
- more than likely, Palm just didn't know who they were trying to attract
- Sprint
- Droid, Nexus One, Windows Phone 7
- Ed Colligan simply screwed Palm too deep into the ground

and voila.

I think point number 3 has a lot more to do w/point number 2 than with anything else. Apple says consumers don't need multitasking so consumers believe they don't need multitasking... until Apple says consumers do need multitasking and then Apple features their version of it prominently in their ads (ex. Luke Wilson showing off how you can talk on the phone *and* use the internet at the same time). That's just Apple's MO. If Apple doesn't offer it they say you don't need. Once Apple starts offering it they tout it as a must have.

Going Sprint first, IMO, was a deal w/the devil that Palm didn't think they could avoid given their situation. Even Palm's CEO admits that launching after Droid hurt them, but their hands were tied. Sprint promised a big marketing push in exchange for a window of exclusivity.


Lethal

 

[kdarling]

ATT officially getting WebOS

Even though it's been rumored for a while, Palm just officially announced that the Pre and Pixi will be coming to ATT:

http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=5680

I'll add this: besides WebOS being fun and easy, the optional Touchstone charger is the best thing since sliced bread. It feels quite luxurious just to lay the phone on the charger and not worry about wires or jack covers.

My wife's Pixi sits on its Touchstone charger in the kitchen and we hear a chime when a new email or text comes. It's so easy just to swipe up and see what the notification is about, or swipe sideways and dismiss it. It's becoming like a tiny kitchen computer to us.

The Touchstone is something you'd have expected Apple to sell first.

 

[maflynn]

Here's another article about how poorly palm and why

ars technica

 

[kdarling]

Here's another article about how poorly palm and why

Not aimed at you, but it's amazing how all the industry pundits are piling on, in a frenzy of too late I-told-you-so's.

Nothing quite as noble as kicking someone when they're down

Palm needs some bold ads like the Droid. And/or to put WebOS on a bigger chassis akin to an HD2 or Nexus or Droid. And do it quickly.

 

[maflynn]

Palm needs some bold ads like the Droid. And/or to put WebOS on a bigger chassis akin to an HD2 or Nexus or Droid. And do it quickly.

I'm not sure ads are going to help palm. As the ars article indicated and from other places, the quality of the phone is rather poor. The design of the phone,i.e., cramped keyboard, is rather poor and palm as usual is quite slow in updating the OS. They need a sexy device that competes with android based phones and the iPhone. They better release one sooner rather then later since they're getting quite low on cash.

What's going to continue to hurt them is their perceived weakness, less and less developers are going to dedicate any resources to develop apps, which is going to send them into a vicious circle, less apps = less sales = less developers = less apps, etc.

I agree with you on the piling on comment though. The pundits do see a once mighty player on verge of elimination and they're heaping it own. To be fair to the pundits, palm deserves this, and they used these same pundits to proclaim that the palm pre is going to slaughter the iphone - what comes around goes around.

 

[Consultant]

I think point number 3 has a lot more to do w/point number 2 than with anything else. Apple says consumers don't need multitasking so consumers believe they don't need multitasking... until Apple says consumers do need multitasking and then Apple features their version of it prominently in their ads (ex. Luke Wilson showing off how you can talk on the phone *and* use the internet at the same time). That's just Apple's MO. If Apple doesn't offer it they say you don't need. Once Apple starts offering it they tout it as a must have.

For some reason Microsoft is following Apple's 2007 iPhone footsteps?

Must be because "Apple says."

 

[LethalWolfe]

For some reason Microsoft is following Apple's 2007 iPhone footsteps?

Must be because "Apple says."

Isn't the consensus of typical Apple fans that MS can't come up w/anything original to save it's life? Or are you trying to use MS as a way to validate Apple?

Anyway, it doesn't change the fact that Apple has been prominently featuring the ability to multitask, under limited circumstances of course, in the recent iPhone ads.

No one reads anymore... until Apple revealed the iPad.
No one wants to watch video on a tiny MP3 player's screen... until Apple revealed the iPod Video.
No one wants to use a flash memory MP3 player... Until Apple revealed the iPod Shuffle.

That's just Apple's MO. It's neither here nor there, IMO, it just is.

Lethal

 

[SkyBell]

Even though it's been rumored for a while, Palm just officially announced that the Pre and Pixi will be coming to ATT:

http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=5680

Finally. Maybe once I sell my iPhone I can pick up a Pixi Plus.

 

[kdarling]

More news today:

China Telecom gets the Palm Pre in July.

Don't count out Palm yet. They keep finding carriers and word of mouth is good.

--

In case it's not obvious, I'm surprised at how much I like WebOS. I had given my son-in-law and my daughter a Pre and Pixi and they love them. But I'd always just diddled with theirs for only a few minutes and thought "ho-hum".

Recently, I was going to give my non-techie wife a Pixi, but decided to take a few days to set it up first with nice apps, bookmarks, etc.

That meant I had to actually use it and learn its nuances. That's when I fell in love with the little critter. Once you get used to it, your fingers can fly both on the screen and the keyboard. (I have non-fat fingers.) And boy is it fun to flip app cards away when you're done <grin>

I even wrote up a custom app for my family to use, with the grandkid's picture as the splash screen. Everyone sideloaded it for free. Pretty sweet.

Sigh. I wish there was one phone with all the features I love from all phones.

 

[Consultant]

Anyway, it doesn't change the fact that Apple has been prominently featuring the ability to multitask, under limited circumstances of course, in the recent iPhone ads.

Let's see, that doesn't change the fact that actual consumers and business users like the overall more usefulness of iPhone.
https://www.macrumors.com/iphone/20...nd-business-smartphone-satisfaction-rankings/

More news today:

China Telecom gets the Palm Pre in July.

Don't count out Palm yet. They keep finding carriers and word of mouth is good.

Wait a second, so what exactly do you think Apple does well that brings you to an Apple forum? Since you are always promoting non-Apple products.

 

[LethalWolfe]

Let's see, that doesn't change the fact that actual consumers and business users like the overall more usefulness of iPhone.
https://www.macrumors.com/iphone/20...nd-business-smartphone-satisfaction-rankings/

Did I ever say the Pre was, or should be, ranked higher than the iPhone? Nope, never even hinted at any such thing. All I did was agree that Palm doesn't have the marketing team or funds that its competition does, especially Apple, and expanded on that point.


Lethal

 

[gnasher729]

Palm is downgraded to $0 today by an analyst.

Market cap today around $600 million.

Apple Market cap is around $200 billion.

I can remember when PALM was $38bn and AAPL was around $6bn. And a quarter of that was their 5% share in Akamai.

 

[zap2]

Wait a second, so what exactly do you think Apple does well that brings you to an Apple forum? Since you are always promoting non-Apple products.

To be fair, MR is a pretty great forum, and if I ever did switch away from OS X, I'd likely still come to the forum.

That said, I agree that WebOS deserve the credit its given, and I was overjoyed that Palm has put "Pre Plus and Pixi Plus coming soon to AT&T" on their website.

I'll be picking up a Pixi for sure!

 

[Consultant]

Did I ever say the Pre was, or should be, ranked higher than the iPhone? Nope, never even hinted at any such thing. All I did was agree that Palm doesn't have the marketing team or funds that its competition does, especially Apple, and expanded on that point.


Lethal

Actually Palm did a pretty good advertising / PR job for the Pre. Before the Pre was released, it had pretty good "perceived" interest.

However the product did not match the Palm advertising.

To be fair, MR is a pretty great forum, and if I ever did switch away from OS X, I'd likely still come to the forum.

That said, I agree that WebOS deserve the credit its given, and I was overjoyed that Palm has put "Pre Plus and Pixi Plus coming soon to AT&T" on their website.

I'll be picking up a Pixi for sure!

Well agree MR is a great forum. But judging from someone's posting history, it is clear that certain people doesn't like Apple products at all.

 

[SkyBell]

Actually Palm did a pretty good advertising / PR job for the Pre. Before the Pre was released, it had pretty good "perceived" interest.

I think you may be hard pressed to find others who agree with you. Their advertising was definitely not good, some weird vague commercials and the like was about all they had in that area. And the hype they had built up slowly died well before they even released the Pre.

 

[Melrose]

^^ Their advertising for the Pre was very poorly done. It was vague and obtuse, not good for a new product. If you've got a old standby like Coke or Nike you can play around a bit - but new stuff stick with specifics and focus on what it brings to the table, versus the competition.

I was sad to see the Pre not catch on better. It really seemed like a good effort from a mobile veteran with some solid experience, not simply standing on stodgy standards they helped define (back in the day), but moving with the times and reinventing.

I didn't like the looks of it or the handset itself but it was a good, solid effort and seemed like a good, capable product.

 

[gkarris]

Even though it's been rumored for a while, Palm just officially announced that the Pre and Pixi will be coming to ATT:

http://www.phonescoop.com/news/item.php?n=5680

Nice to see they figured out that they need to put it on more than 1 carrier - the Pre still needs to be $49 (not the $149) and the Pixi Free (not $49) if they want to play catchup.

Interesting how Android and now Palm are now available across different providers where Apple is still getting away with AT&T Exclusivity...

 

[LethalWolfe]

Actually Palm did a pretty good advertising / PR job for the Pre. Before the Pre was released, it had pretty good "perceived" interest.

Aside from, say, CES there was not a lot Palm did and by the time release rolled around the buzz had long since faded. And I mean buzz around actual consumers, not folks who hang out on tech forums or write for tech blogs. IMO Palm did do a smart thing in launching the Pre close to the iPhone update as that created a lot of free marketing with reviewers comparing the two.

However the product did not match the Palm advertising.

Thankfully the Pre didn't match the creepy pale girl advertising. The ads generally got slammed while the Pre got positive reviews.

Nice to see they figured out that they need to put it on more than 1 carrier - the Pre still needs to be $49 (not the $149) and the Pixi Free (not $49) if they want to play catchup.

Being condescending fails when you are wrong. The Pre has been available on multiple carriers for most of it's time on the market (contrary to popular belief there is life outside of the United States).


Lethal

 

[ArrowSmith]

Now that is a shame. We call know it's just the odd couple that ruin it for everyone. But I somehow agree, because the few fanboys here have a nasty habit of getting EVERYWHERE on the forums.

They must, live, see, breathe and eat thinking about how good Apple is all the time. Since they turned mac, the air is sweeter, the world is more friendly, hell, even their car is more fuel efficient.

^ The mind of a fanboy.

You know if only Apple products could turn this world into a paradise. Alas, we're all still at each other's throats.