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Panel Question imac 20'' (2009)

I stand corrected on ifixit.

iamthedudeman said:
Secondly, AUO stating to me that they "don't use dithering in any of our 2009 panels' and that "all our 2009 panels use "millions of colors'. And we know that the model in question was a 2009 model.
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I already informed you that not all TN panels are 6-bit. This information is meaningless and does not have any bearing on whether or not the panel is TN.

Thirdly, AUO is switching all their models to "MVA (multi-domain vertical alignment) panels for all their panels.

Here is some info:

"There are several "next-generation" technologies based on MVA, including AU Optronics' P-MVA and A-MVA, as well as Chi Mei Optoelectronics' S-MVA."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TFT_LCD

and

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/content/panel_technologies_content.htm
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"Is switching" usually means in the near future. I guess you're arguing/hoping that M302EW02 is this next generation panel. It could very well simply be a custom panel manufactured in bulk for Apple and other vendors.

Lastly. If I look at a angle my 2009' 20. Standing directly from the side, If I peek between six inches and a foot I can see the screen clearly, which is about a 178 degree angle. If I look at my 2009 24 the angle is about the same.
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So you're saying that the tech specs on Apple's site is wrong. Somehow I find that difficult to believe given the huge uproar and lawsuit over Apple downgrading the panel in the 20" Alu iMac from the white 20" iMac. It's the first thing Apple would likely correct.

Finally, there's no conclusive evidence that the panel used in the 24" Alu iMac is in fact H-IPS, as nothing can be found on the manufacturer's site either. Really no different from what you're finding with in your search on AUO.
 
Well, go to Macintosh HD, library, colorsync,profiles, displays, click on your profile, now scroll down to the "mmod' make and model information.

Now I cannot say for sure but alot of other people are looking up the same thing and some are getting different numbers, so it might be a false positive, but it seems to me that different model numbers means different panels, or maybe not. I am not sure. Just conjecture.
 
JayLenochiniMac said:
I stand corrected on ifixit.



I already informed you that not all TN panels are 6-bit. This information is meaningless and does not have any bearing on whether or not the panel is TN.



"Is switching" usually means in the near future. I guess you're arguing/hoping that M302EW02 is this next generation panel. It could very well simply be a custom panel manufactured in bulk for Apple and other vendors.



So you're saying that the tech specs on Apple's site is wrong. Somehow I find that difficult to believe given the huge uproar and lawsuit over Apple downgrading the panel in the 20" Alu iMac from the white 20" iMac. It's the first thing Apple would likely correct.

Finally, there's no conclusive evidence that the panel used in the 24" Alu iMac is in fact H-IPS, as nothing can be found on the manufacturer's site either. Really no different from what you're finding with in your search on AUO.
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Well considering that AUO builds panels for many different manufactures and they use the same panel for all the same manufactures, go to their site and check out their products. The product listed for the 2008 model is on their site, if that was the case and they were specifically making panels just for Apple, the model would be anonymous and not a product listed on their site. Which isn't the case.

Apple signs a contract to many manufactures and some of those manufactures make panels for them, they sign a contract and usually Apple enjoys some 'exclusivity' for a short time as is the case with the 2008 model and is the case with the Nvidia 9400M as the specs were released by Apple before they were on Nvidia's site. And the specs on Apple's site were wrong, compared to Nvidia's site.


Apple tends to go light on the specs, this is nothing new. So yes their specs are wrong since they use more than one manufacturer for the panels other than AUO.

Personally I don't care if its a TN panel or not. I am not hoping for anything as I am already pleased with my 20 and 24 panels regardless. I am giving you my opinion, nothing more. Judging by the panel and owning the panel vs a 2008 model, which was a known TN panel, and judging by most TN panels use dithering, and by that AUO telling me themselves that none of their 2009 panels use dithering. Also the viewing angle is essintially the same, Apple is stating on their site a 178 degree angle, TN panels don't sport angles of 178, no matter how good the color is as far as I know, but since I don't know for sure, we will not know until they release the specs.
 
iamthedudeman said:
Apple tends to go light on the specs, this is nothing new. So yes their specs are wrong since they use more than one manufacturer for the panels other than AUO.
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So you're suggesting that some 2009 20" use TN (judging from the published specs of 160/160 viewing angles) and some 2009 20" use something better like MVA. Sorry, but my BS detector is going off.
 
I honestly don't get the obsession with color accuracy.
Unless you're a professional photographer or graphic designer it is not that important.

Most amateur/hobbyist works are viewed at the computer, uploaded to a site.
Not one screen is calibrated exactly the same, the light conditions in the room where the computer sits very much differ from user to user.
So even if your work is made on an iMac with a perfect calibrated, color accurate screen it is not very likely Ahmed from Saudi Arabia or Sven from Sweden will see exactly the same colors.

The poor viewing angle of 'only' 160 degrees?
Honestly, how many times are you NOT sitting in front the screen while working?
 
iamthedudeman said:
Well, go to Macintosh HD, library, colorsync,profiles, displays, click on your profile, now scroll down to the "mmod' make and model information.

Now I cannot say for sure but alot of other people are looking up the same thing and some are getting different numbers, so it might be a false positive, but it seems to me that different model numbers means different panels, or maybe not. I am not sure. Just conjecture.
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Can you give us a link to a post from one of these many people? You seem to be citing them as your sources.
 
Saw it today. Same screen as before for all intensive purposes. IT's a TN panel. It has a slight contrast shift from top to bottom. Don't get me wrong. It's a very good screen. Don't let the naysayers tell you it's not. It's just not the best screen. IT's not as good as the screen on the 24" imac. And remember the naysayers use the words "crap" or "terrible" for anything below the "best."
 
New panel info from C&T Magazine iMac Review

Hi all, there is a decent review of the 2009 iMacs in the April issue of the German magazine C&T (Computer & Technik). They had this to say about the panels (translations are mine):

20" panel: TN panel, somewhat reduced viewing angles compared to 24" panel, shows vibrant colors; contrast ratio: 897:1; minimum...maximum brightness: 53...313 cd/m2; response time: 22.6 ms (averaged)

24" panel:IPS panel, stable viewing angles, pleasant colour gamut; contrast ratio: 762:1; minimum...maximum brightness: 215...380 cd/m2; response time: 21.1 ms (averaged)

Here comes the interesting part - Power consumption comparisons:

20" model
power off: 0.7 W
standby: 1.3 W
idling at 100 cd/m2 brightness: 45,6 W
idling at max. brightness: 62.2 W

24" model
power off: 1.0W
standby: 1.7 W
idling at *215 cd/m2 brightness: 82.2 W
idling at max. brightness: 107.3 W
*Quote: "A considerable portion of the 82.2 W consumption is attributed to the display, as brightness cannot be lowered to below 215 cd/m2."

Here's the link to the online version of the article just to cite my sources. Keep in mind, the full article needs to be purchased, and it's in German. It does have a good table with CPU and GPU benchmarks though.
http://www.heise.de/ct/inhalt/2009/08/86/
 
Interesting that the 24" can't go below a certain brightness because man the brightness from this new refurb 24" iMac I got is kind of driving me crazy especially at night. Not sure I can take it. My old 20" was easier on my eyes in that respect and it wasn't exactly lacking for brightness either.

Also ...From Apple's site:

"iMac also decides which processor — CPU or GPU — is best suited to perform a task efficiently. That means when iMac is idle, it’s using as little power as possible."
 
trip1ex said:
Also ...From Apple's site:
"iMac also decides which processor — CPU or GPU — is best suited to perform a task efficiently. That means when iMac is idle, it’s using as little power as possible."
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This is a good thing. Energy prices in Europe are astronomical. Case in point: the price of gas. A litre of super unleaded was €1.27/l today. At today's exchange rate that's US $1.68/l. Edit: Electricity prices are also really high...but as an example, people probably relate to gas prices better.
 
for what it's worth,
I saw a 2008 iMac right next to a 2009 iMac at Best Buy and I maxed the brightness on both and the 2009 one was much brighter.

I too am thinking of the 20" iMac and was going to look into a refurb or clearance model, but the fact that the newer 20" panels are brighter made my choice more difficult.
 
agentmouthwash said:
for what it's worth,
I saw a 2008 iMac right next to a 2009 iMac at Best Buy and I maxed the brightness on both and the 2009 one was much brighter.

I too am thinking of the 20" iMac and was going to look into a refurb or clearance model, but the fact that the newer 20" panels are brighter made my choice more difficult.
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Brightness is not a problem on iMacs. If anything it's a flaw especially on the 24" model.
 
How about the 2007 screens?

I am thinking of buying one of the mid 2007 20" imac refurbs since they have the 2600 pro graphics which is better than the 9400m, and Apple is selling these for 849 now.

Are the 2007 20" screens the same as the 2008 20" screens?

Thanks for any info.
 
agentmouthwash said:
for what it's worth,
I saw a 2008 iMac right next to a 2009 iMac at Best Buy and I maxed the brightness on both and the 2009 one was much brighter.

I too am thinking of the 20" iMac and was going to look into a refurb or clearance model, but the fact that the newer 20" panels are brighter made my choice more difficult.
Click to expand...

I bought a 20" Refurb and the display is PLENTY bright. I have to turn it down a it or it starts to bother me. Much brighter than my old 22" Samsung 220BW LCD, which itself was a pretty decent monitor.

Unless you're accustomed to working on very high end monitors or the 24" models, which I hear are extremely bright, I doubt you'll have any qualms.
 
rjp said:
I am thinking of buying one of the mid 2007 20" imac refurbs since they have the 2600 pro graphics which is better than the 9400m, and Apple is selling these for 849 now.

Are the 2007 20" screens the same as the 2008 20" screens?

Thanks for any info.
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Why not just get the 2008 20"? It's not much more expensive, and it has a faster CPU and twice as much RAM.
 
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