Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
PHOTO: Face ID Infrared Dot Matrix
- Thread starter ardo111
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Yeah my cousin had a Kinect and he died of face cancer from gaming too much.
Y’all can joke about it all you like, but the fact remains, this is a focused laser hitting your eyes multiple times a day - it’s absolutely not the same thing as ambient IR. There are several studies into this kind of thing that are worth looking at before presenting off-the-top-of-your-head opinion as ‘fact’.
Got a link to any peer-reviewed scientific study saying that IR lasers of the intensity used in Face ID cause retinal damage?
Scattering, non-reflective hair, just like real hair.
Probably pretty similar. Hoping for another sample (now that the OP knows how to make it happen).
I can’t. There isn’t one. Get me a link to the study that says they don’t.
Why so close-minded about it?
I wonder if the Dot-Projector jacks up IR output in bright outdoor conditions to differentiate from outdoor IR from sun? It must be doing something to tell those dots apart.
Since this is the dot IR projection available via API to 3rd party apps, I think FACE ID would be a lot more detailed with finer dots. The quality of the image would be higher.
Unlike Touch ID, Face ID can be monitored closely and reverse engineered. A little worried about it's long term security.
Unlike Touch ID, Face ID can be monitored closely and reverse engineered. A little worried about it's long term security.
I was a bit surprised to see that there isn’t actually a pattern to the dots, it seems more randomly scattered than how it appeared in the promo shots/videos where it looked like a diagonal matrix.
I wonder if that “randomness” varies from device to device and affects how accurate it is
I wonder if that “randomness” varies from device to device and affects how accurate it is
Hi! First post on the forum.
I'm a photographer by trade and got my iPhone X today.
I used a 720nm infrared camera and my iPhone X 256GB (using Animoji to ensure continuous read of Face ID dot matrix projection) to capture the image on the right. The image on the left is just an iPhone X selfie for reference.
It really shows the layout, size and accuracy of the dots... I thought it was impressive!
Hope you enjoy!
View attachment 731829
This is awesome. Thanks for sharing
Very interesting thread, thank you.
Although I have to wonder, in all of Apples marketing, they consistently say ‘30,000 dots are projected’. This looks nowhere close to that number!
Although I have to wonder, in all of Apples marketing, they consistently say ‘30,000 dots are projected’. This looks nowhere close to that number!
unless there are quite a bit more dots outside the close cropping of the frame in the photo provided. or there are dots not picked up during the shutter open/close.
I wonder what the significance of the asymmetrical alignment of the dots is, if significant at all for Face ID.
I’d be more concerned with inhaling car fumes on your commute to work or the gas fumes as you refill the car. Don’t have a car and live in a city? Even more concerning.
Guess who's back!
Okay. To address a bunch of comments:
Okay. To address a bunch of comments:
- I'm stoked you guys like it! Glad to share!
- Health.. eyes.. who knows. We aren't gonna find a definitive answer in this thread.
- I don't know any black people that live nearby, but I do know that IR light reflects the same off skin, walls, clothing.... what we know as "colour" doesn't actually matter for IR light. Red, green, blue.. it doesn't matter. This is a different wavelength and behaves differently as a result. My guess is that dark-skinned individuals would appear the same.
- I calculated the width of the field of projection at about 1.5m at roughly 1m distance. This makes the Field of View (FOV) of the dot matrix projector 73.74º.
- This means at regular Face ID distance (50cm we'll say? that's probably high) the projected width of the Dot Matrix is about 75cm. Expect less the closer you move to the sensors.
- Random? Who said random? These are (now very clearly) patterned squares! Each with a differing intensity apparently. I would field that it's one patterned substrate duplicated through some sort of rectilinear (straight and gridded, rather than spherical) bug's-eye sort of lens.
- Camera on tripod, I used a known object to measure width on the wall.
- I stood in the photo and traced my body and face size.
- I then held the phone approx. 1m from the wall, roughly where it would be were I standing in front of the wall and holding my phone in front of my face.
- The projection seen here is the width on the wall (roughly 20cm further from the phone than your face is during use) so the projected size on your body is not *quite* this big. That said, this is pretty big. And explains why you can be somewhat beside your phone when it's laying on a table and it will still unlock.
The Secure Enclave? Oh that's where I live.
Their precise location has to be known in order to calculate their relative distance to the camera. If you don't know where something is supposed to be, you can't tell if it's moved. Same concept.
Additionally I presume the camera is trained to detect big shadow spots that would arise from large 3D objects (like my head and hair) and record them as a large change in depth. Right? The camera won't always be able to see all of the dots, and if it doesn't, it needs to extrapolate why and include that in its depth map.
Ah, excellent - at last we have an expert. Do tell us how you can be so sure, because you’re clearly about to regale us with a compelling package of scientific evidence...
There’re a few long threads on the subject. Here’s one. Do a search for more, but please don’t tangle up every thread on Face ID with the safety conversation.